Topband: CG3CUI
Good Day All, In case anyone was wondering who in the world that CG3CUI station was that you worked during the SP event out of grid square FN03, here's the explanation: in honour of the Diamond Jubilee of Queen Elizabeth II's reign as monarch, we otherwise lowly VE types were granted the privilege by our Industry Canada authority to use the prefix CG---but only for 29th and 30th December (VA-types could use CF, VO VY stations were authorized the use of CH CI, respectively). I thought there would have been more Canadians using the special prefix(Esc), but it appeared to me that I was the SOLE Canuck to have taken advantage of the opportunity---at least on the occasion of the SP, anyway...so if anyone worked me, congrats: you snagged yourself a rare one! Hi Hi So, there you have it: CG3CUI was just plain ol' VE3CUI, bedecked in seasonal garb reflective of the festive season...! (Sorry for any resultant confusion.) ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th.
Re: Topband: Fw: Short Bogs
The very act of laying an insulated conductor on the earth lowers its velocity factor. I forget how much, but the reduction in VF for a BOG is significant. This has been discussed at length here; you might find some helpful info in the list archives. 73, Mike www.w0btu.com ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th.
Re: Topband: Fw: Short Bogs
If youre building a Beverage/BOG as the thread title indicates, resonance does not matter, it is a nonresonant slow wave antenna. For a resonant antenna up in the air and used for transmitting the insulation adds 3-5% to the electrical length. Carl KM1H - Original Message - From: Bruce k...@myfairpoint.net To: topband@contesting.com Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2012 1:15 PM Subject: Topband: Fw: Short Bogs . If we want to make an antenna electrically longer through cable velocity factor, it can't be done by the insulation slowing the wave inside the shield. 73 Tom In my experience, external insulation (through synthetic covering or frost) lowers the resonant frequency of wire antennas of a given length and height above ground. For example, I typically use 453/F as a starter length for insulated wire dipoles...it's higher for bare wire of the same AWG diameter. It may not be due to velocity factor (not sure of the reason), but it is observable and repeatable. 73, Gary NL7Y I also have had insulated wires of the same AWG diameter resonate lower in frequency than bare ones of the same length. Think we need multiple people experiment: Put up an antenna with covered wire. Measure the frequency, then cut the insulation away (of this same piece), and re-measure the frequency. If we get different results from different people, then we can start looking at the insulation. Is it economy grade made for 60 cycles (600 volts), or is it the good stuff ??? 1. If it is low grade insulation with resistance at 1.8, 3.5 MHZ, then it may be making the wire appear to be fatter. If true, then that would be valid reason. 2. If the insulation is high quality at HF radio frequencies, and IF the frequency changes, then we need to look further 73 Bruce-K1FZ www.qsl.net/k1fz/ ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1430 / Virus Database: 2637/5497 - Release Date: 12/30/12 ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th.
Re: Topband: Fw: Short Bogs
Well. it's not really the quality of the insulation -it's its relative permittivity - relative to the permittivity of free-space (or a vacuum) The dielectric loading of having a layer of higher permittivity material surrounding the wire causes waves propagating down the wire to travel a bit more slowly, thereby increasing its electrical length. Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2012 1:15 PM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Topband: Fw: Short Bogs . If we want to make an antenna electrically longer through cable velocity factor, it can't be done by the insulation slowing the wave inside the shield. 73 Tom In my experience, external insulation (through synthetic covering or frost) lowers the resonant frequency of wire antennas of a given length and height above ground. For example, I typically use 453/F as a starter length for insulated wire dipoles...it's higher for bare wire of the same AWG diameter. It may not be due to velocity factor (not sure of the reason), but it is observable and repeatable. 73, Gary NL7Y I also have had insulated wires of the same AWG diameter resonate lower in frequency than bare ones of the same length. Think we need multiple people experiment: Put up an antenna with covered wire. Measure the frequency, then cut the insulation away (of this same piece), and re-measure the frequency. If we get different results from different people, then we can start looking at the insulation. Is it economy grade made for 60 cycles (600 volts), or is it the good stuff ??? 1. If it is low grade insulation with resistance at 1.8, 3.5 MHZ, then it may be making the wire appear to be fatter. If true, then that would be valid reason. 2. If the insulation is high quality at HF radio frequencies, and IF the frequency changes, then we need to look further 73 Bruce-K1FZ www.qsl.net/k1fz/ ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th. ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th.
Topband: Stew Preliminary Results
Once again - the real time scores as the checking process unfolds can be found on the Stew Perry web page. http://www.kkn.net/stew 73 Tree N6TR ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th.
Re: Topband: Fw: Short Bogs
The characteristics of #12 THHN and such vary all over the map. It is not being made for use at RF. The insulation not only changes the velocity factor, but it also adds loss. This too varies all over the map. Wireman has various wires with UV resistant black PE insulation. That stuff seems to be predictable and stable. I personally don't know of any THHN with PE insulation. YMMV, of course. Neither of the guys at Home Depot and Lowes have any idea what I'm talking about if I mention PE insulation. Apparently plastic is plastic :). 73, Guy On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 4:55 PM, Charlie Cunningham charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com wrote: Well. it's not really the quality of the insulation -it's its relative permittivity - relative to the permittivity of free-space (or a vacuum) The dielectric loading of having a layer of higher permittivity material surrounding the wire causes waves propagating down the wire to travel a bit more slowly, thereby increasing its electrical length. Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2012 1:15 PM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Topband: Fw: Short Bogs . If we want to make an antenna electrically longer through cable velocity factor, it can't be done by the insulation slowing the wave inside the shield. 73 Tom In my experience, external insulation (through synthetic covering or frost) lowers the resonant frequency of wire antennas of a given length and height above ground. For example, I typically use 453/F as a starter length for insulated wire dipoles...it's higher for bare wire of the same AWG diameter. It may not be due to velocity factor (not sure of the reason), but it is observable and repeatable. 73, Gary NL7Y I also have had insulated wires of the same AWG diameter resonate lower in frequency than bare ones of the same length. Think we need multiple people experiment: Put up an antenna with covered wire. Measure the frequency, then cut the insulation away (of this same piece), and re-measure the frequency. If we get different results from different people, then we can start looking at the insulation. Is it economy grade made for 60 cycles (600 volts), or is it the good stuff ??? 1. If it is low grade insulation with resistance at 1.8, 3.5 MHZ, then it may be making the wire appear to be fatter. If true, then that would be valid reason. 2. If the insulation is high quality at HF radio frequencies, and IF the frequency changes, then we need to look further 73 Bruce-K1FZ www.qsl.net/k1fz/ ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th. ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th. ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th.
Topband: Short Bogs
BOG antenna, BOG wire. Yes right on. Not only are there many variables with the earth, but different wire dielectrics are a big factor. I have sold many BOG transformers, and received a lot of feedback. There are many different results, all but one was able to get a positive out come. That one insisted on using a TV antenna pre-amplifier. I gained a lot of insight. One un-named customer was running his BOG across a highway late many nights. One night a car came, out of nowhere, at high speed just before he got the wire secured. It ripped the transformer wire out of his hand. He found it about 200 yards down the road. He never found the termination, thought to be attached to the car. Someone must have found it and wondered, What is this? Now that is real determination to work 160 meter DX. Anyway, I do not disagree with anyone with different BOG results. There are way too many variables. 73 Bruce-K1FZ - Original Message - From: Guy Olinger K2AV To: Charlie Cunningham Cc: Bruce ; topband@contesting.com Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2012 5:53 PM Subject: Re: Topband: Fw: Short Bogs The characteristics of #12 THHN and such vary all over the map. It is not being made for use at RF. The insulation not only changes the velocity factor, but it also adds loss. This too varies all over the map. Wireman has various wires with UV resistant black PE insulation. That stuff seems to be predictable and stable. I personally don't know of any THHN with PE insulation. YMMV, of course. Neither of the guys at Home Depot and Lowes have any idea what I'm talking about if I mention PE insulation. Apparently plastic is plastic :). 73, Guy ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th.
Re: Topband: Fw: Short Bogs
On Sun, 2012-12-30 at 20:53 -0500, Guy Olinger K2AV wrote: The characteristics of #12 THHN and such vary all over the map. It is not being made for use at RF. The insulation not only changes the velocity factor, but it also adds loss. This too varies all over the map. Wireman has various wires with UV resistant black PE insulation. That stuff seems to be predictable and stable. I personally don't know of any THHN with PE insulation. YMMV, of course. Neither of the guys at Home Depot and Lowes have any idea what I'm talking about if I mention PE insulation. Apparently plastic is plastic :). 73, Guy I got my THHN at the depot and the guys in there told me I can't have grey wire. Grey wire is not on the agenda for wiring appliances. I hope they don't come here to investigate THHN abuse! I um... didn't use in an appliance. Now lets see about this wireman guy. I'll try Google first. 73, Bill KU8H ___ Stew Perry Topband Distance Challenge coming on December 29th.