Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Hi Charlie and gang, It is not that simple and I am a guilty party of early on dupes on 160 meters with K1N because of the following. Early on 160 meters the jamming was horrible so it was impossible to hear the confirmation. Early on K1N was responding so fast that they were beating my cw break in even though I have it just set so it does not drop out when sending my call to prevent weak dots (I have a lot of dots), and impossible to hear the front of my call so could not tell if they had it right. Early on sounded like they we using paddles going way too fast for conditions (and making sending mistakes) and/or had amp keying problems which made it sound like busted calls, and without clublog no way of knowing you were good in the log (not a busted call). I had discussions early on with the pilot station (first time in 38 years I had ever contacted a pilot station) about some of the above topics because I felt horrible that I was going to attempt another contact on 160 meters due to the above issues. Things have since improved and they are doing great. What I learned as a w1aw/9 op was that sending speed much above 26 to 28 wpm was not really much of a time saver, repeating a stations call twice often helped the other station know I had his call good, and sending the stations call twice also made the band go silent by others because they could hear exactly who I was responding because folks with longer calls or slower sending speeds would still be sending otherwise during my response to a station and they were clueless about my sending/response status. I again apologize for being a dupe in the K1N log (only on 160 meters), it was just due to perfect storm conditions mentioned above and the fact that my call is just so dang tough for folks to copy. Sorry and 73, Don (wd8dsb) On Saturday, February 7, 2015, Charlie Cunningham charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com wrote: And another more important point, Kevin in the case of such a massive need as K1N. Several of the operators were complaining about the number of dupes in the logs. That's caused by guys not knowing if they had a good QSO and just continuing to call. I Tune around in the CW pileups a LOT to find where the stations are calling that the DX is working and to find a slot where I can insert my call. I have personally heard a number of guys that were worked by K1N and went right on calling in the pile because they simply didn't know they had worked them!! What's wrong with that picture?? In those cases the operators just weren’t adept enough to enact the simple procedures that I outlined, and they just continued to add to the pandemonium in the pile-up and making things more difficult for everyone! That just adds to the QRM and slows everyone down!! 73.l Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com javascript:;] On Behalf Of kol...@rcn.com javascript:; Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 1:36 AM To: topband@contesting.com javascript:; Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Charlie, I don't think many here didn't know if they made a contact or not. The question was if K1N had lost their QSO from the computer log. No matter how sure you are you made the contact, if it's not in their computer log, for whatever reason, it can't be confirmed. Kevin K3OX - Original Message - From: Charlie Cunningham charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com javascript:; To: Eddy Swynar deswy...@xplornet.ca javascript:;, topband@contesting.com javascript:; Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 12:46:02 AM Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Well, we did survive just fine, Eddy and lots of folks mad the Honor Roll, 5BDXCC etc.. All this nonsense about the online logs is just so much Bull!!! Can all be avoided if folks would do the following:\ 1.0COPY your own call!!! No guesswork, no fragments, no bluffing etc. 2.0 Copy your report 3.0Reply with your call, followed by an acknowledgement of DX Station Report (TU or thanks) and Send report to DX station followed (or preceded) by Thanks or TU 4.0LISTEN for the DX operator to acknowledge your report 5.0 Thanks or TU -or even dit-dit Do those things completely and there won't be much guessing or wondering if you had a legitimate QSO that's logged!! We may have to have some patience and perseverance to work through the jammers, and QRM and the packet-rats tuning up on the DX QRG! It may be reassuring to see the online logs, but we should KNOW if we had a good contact or not! WITHOUT a computer to tell us we did!! I KNEW that my 7 QSOs with K1N were there BEFORE the logs came out! And NO DUPES or INSURANCE CONTACTS!Just my $0.02. 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com javascript:;] On Behalf Of Eddy Swynar Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 3:17 PM To: topband@contesting.com javascript:; Subject
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
And another more important point, Kevin in the case of such a massive need as K1N. Several of the operators were complaining about the number of dupes in the logs. That's caused by guys not knowing if they had a good QSO and just continuing to call. I Tune around in the CW pileups a LOT to find where the stations are calling that the DX is working and to find a slot where I can insert my call. I have personally heard a number of guys that were worked by K1N and went right on calling in the pile because they simply didn't know they had worked them!! What's wrong with that picture?? In those cases the operators just weren’t adept enough to enact the simple procedures that I outlined, and they just continued to add to the pandemonium in the pile-up and making things more difficult for everyone! That just adds to the QRM and slows everyone down!! 73.l Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of kol...@rcn.com Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 1:36 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Charlie, I don't think many here didn't know if they made a contact or not. The question was if K1N had lost their QSO from the computer log. No matter how sure you are you made the contact, if it's not in their computer log, for whatever reason, it can't be confirmed. Kevin K3OX - Original Message - From: Charlie Cunningham charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com To: Eddy Swynar deswy...@xplornet.ca, topband@contesting.com Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 12:46:02 AM Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Well, we did survive just fine, Eddy and lots of folks mad the Honor Roll, 5BDXCC etc.. All this nonsense about the online logs is just so much Bull!!! Can all be avoided if folks would do the following:\ 1.0COPY your own call!!! No guesswork, no fragments, no bluffing etc. 2.0 Copy your report 3.0Reply with your call, followed by an acknowledgement of DX Station Report (TU or thanks) and Send report to DX station followed (or preceded) by Thanks or TU 4.0LISTEN for the DX operator to acknowledge your report 5.0 Thanks or TU -or even dit-dit Do those things completely and there won't be much guessing or wondering if you had a legitimate QSO that's logged!! We may have to have some patience and perseverance to work through the jammers, and QRM and the packet-rats tuning up on the DX QRG! It may be reassuring to see the online logs, but we should KNOW if we had a good contact or not! WITHOUT a computer to tell us we did!! I KNEW that my 7 QSOs with K1N were there BEFORE the logs came out! And NO DUPES or INSURANCE CONTACTS!Just my $0.02. 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Eddy Swynar Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 3:17 PM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log How did we EVER collectively survive the dark ages of hardcopy QSL cards, s.a.s.e.'s, QSL bureaus, DX news sheets, and I.R.C.s, I wonder...? Is everyone that impatient while attempting to WORK a rare station, too...? All this angst and trepidation being displayed here...! I thought DX'ing, Ham radio, Topband were all supposed to be FUN, and not a hand-wringing exercise in anger worry management... ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
The only thing that was temporarily lost was the information on Clublog. That was done intentionally by the team to fix an issue with 10 MHz RTTY QSO's not being sent correctly to Clublog. The team cleared out Clublog, and then re-uploaded all of the QSO's to Clublog with the correct band/mode. There was never any danger of losing the actual log, which is being stored in multiple different formats and media on the island. The overreaction here on Topband was unbelievable. Very sad for a bunch of folks I used to think had some intelligence. 73, Steve, N2IC On 02/07/2015 12:51 AM, Charlie Cunningham wrote: By the way, Kevin it's one thing, if, as happened with K1N, that QSOs appeared in the log and then disappeared! - THAT's DATA-LOSS! But an awful lot of guys were waiting anxiously to see if they had a good QSO that never appeared in the online logs! That's another matter entirely, that depends on the operator. That's the one I had intended to address! 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of kol...@rcn.com Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 1:36 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Charlie, I don't think many here didn't know if they made a contact or not. The question was if K1N had lost their QSO from the computer log. No matter how sure you are you made the contact, if it's not in their computer log, for whatever reason, it can't be confirmed. Kevin K3OX - Original Message - From: Charlie Cunningham charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com To: Eddy Swynar deswy...@xplornet.ca, topband@contesting.com Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 12:46:02 AM Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Well, we did survive just fine, Eddy and lots of folks mad the Honor Roll, 5BDXCC etc.. All this nonsense about the online logs is just so much Bull!!! Can all be avoided if folks would do the following:\ 1.0COPY your own call!!! No guesswork, no fragments, no bluffing etc. 2.0 Copy your report 3.0Reply with your call, followed by an acknowledgement of DX Station Report (TU or thanks) and Send report to DX station followed (or preceded) by Thanks or TU 4.0LISTEN for the DX operator to acknowledge your report 5.0 Thanks or TU -or even dit-dit Do those things completely and there won't be much guessing or wondering if you had a legitimate QSO that's logged!! We may have to have some patience and perseverance to work through the jammers, and QRM and the packet-rats tuning up on the DX QRG! It may be reassuring to see the online logs, but we should KNOW if we had a good contact or not! WITHOUT a computer to tell us we did!! I KNEW that my 7 QSOs with K1N were there BEFORE the logs came out! And NO DUPES or INSURANCE CONTACTS!Just my $0.02. 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Eddy Swynar Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 3:17 PM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log How did we EVER collectively survive the dark ages of hardcopy QSL cards, s.a.s.e.'s, QSL bureaus, DX news sheets, and I.R.C.s, I wonder...? Is everyone that impatient while attempting to WORK a rare station, too...? All this angst and trepidation being displayed here...! I thought DX'ing, Ham radio, Topband were all supposed to be FUN, and not a hand-wringing exercise in anger worry management... ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband . _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Charlie, that's my point. The people who keep calling in the pile are AWARE that they may not have a QSO, that's why they keep calling. With all the intentional QRM on K1N, it's possible they were never even aware that K1N returned to them! And that can lead to accidental dupes not the fault of K1N or the calling station. But the original subject (see subject line in header) was people thinking they had to re-work them because they were not or at least no longer in the Clublog ummm... errr... log. Personally, I took it on faith that if the pilots said the log on the island was fine and never in jeopardy and it was just a Clublog issue, I need not worry and I certainly didn't rework them. Some didn't feel as confident and decided upon safety contacts. But from what I saw here, no one questioned whether their contact was good in the first place, just whether it was still in the K1N log. BTW, with all due respect, the simple procedures you mentioned below are fine for casual DXing, but in DXpedition pileups, its: (K1N): K3OX 5NN (K3OX): 5NN (K1N): TU You would make mucho people (including possibly the op on the Dxpedition) very unhappy if everyone went: (K1N): K3OX 5NN (K3OX): K1N DE K3OX TU 5NN BK (K1N): K3OX QSL TU DE K1N UP (K3OX): TU Dit Dit It's a trade off between absolute certainty and speed, getting more calls in the log. Maybe an unacceptable trade-off to you, but I suspect not to the majority of ops in Contest/DXpedition scenarios. Best, Kevin K3OX - Original Message - From: Charlie Cunningham charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com To: kol...@rcn.com, topband@contesting.com Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 3:06:46 AM Subject: RE: Topband: K1N On Line Log And another more important point, Kevin in the case of such a massive need as K1N. Several of the operators were complaining about the number of dupes in the logs. That's caused by guys not knowing if they had a good QSO and just continuing to call. I Tune around in the CW pileups a LOT to find where the stations are calling that the DX is working and to find a slot where I can insert my call. I have personally heard a number of guys that were worked by K1N and went right on calling in the pile because they simply didn't know they had worked them!! What's wrong with that picture?? In those cases the operators just weren’t adept enough to enact the simple procedures that I outlined, and they just continued to add to the pandemonium in the pile-up and making things more difficult for everyone! That just adds to the QRM and slows everyone down!! 73.l Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of kol...@rcn.com Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 1:36 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Charlie, I don't think many here didn't know if they made a contact or not. The question was if K1N had lost their QSO from the computer log. No matter how sure you are you made the contact, if it's not in their computer log, for whatever reason, it can't be confirmed. Kevin K3OX - Original Message - From: Charlie Cunningham charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com To: Eddy Swynar deswy...@xplornet.ca, topband@contesting.com Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 12:46:02 AM Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Well, we did survive just fine, Eddy and lots of folks mad the Honor Roll, 5BDXCC etc.. All this nonsense about the online logs is just so much Bull!!! Can all be avoided if folks would do the following:\ 1.0 COPY your own call!!! No guesswork, no fragments, no bluffing etc. 2.0 Copy your report 3.0 Reply with your call, followed by an acknowledgement of DX Station Report (TU or thanks) and Send report to DX station followed (or preceded) by Thanks or TU 4.0 LISTEN for the DX operator to acknowledge your report 5.0 Thanks or TU -or even dit-dit Do those things completely and there won't be much guessing or wondering if you had a legitimate QSO that's logged!! We may have to have some patience and perseverance to work through the jammers, and QRM and the packet-rats tuning up on the DX QRG! It may be reassuring to see the online logs, but we should KNOW if we had a good contact or not! WITHOUT a computer to tell us we did!! I KNEW that my 7 QSOs with K1N were there BEFORE the logs came out! And NO DUPES or INSURANCE CONTACTS! Just my $0.02. 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Eddy Swynar Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 3:17 PM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log How did we EVER collectively survive the dark ages of hardcopy QSL cards, s.a.s.e.'s, QSL bureaus, DX news sheets, and I.R.C.s, I wonder...? Is everyone that impatient while attempting to WORK a rare station, too...? All
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
I am surprised no one has replied. Maybe they are all in shock with disbelief. No, the very sad thing is that someone would publically post such a condescending remark about his fellow amateurs, calling them all stupid. Doug -Original Message- The overreaction here on Topband was unbelievable. Very sad for a bunch of folks I used to think had some intelligence. 73, Steve, N2IC --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
On Sat,2/7/2015 11:01 AM, Doug Renwick wrote: No, the very sad thing is that someone would publically post such a condescending remark about his fellow amateurs, calling them all stupid. Steve's comments are right on. Jim, K9YC _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Well scratch tomorow's 5AM alarm for an insurance QSO, my Feb 04 contact just showed up. Check yours now.Also, is the 10m CW operation an addition to their posted plan? WFWL Sure sounds legit to me (sorry, not topband related..ignore)Great operation! CheersJeff VE3CV _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
How did we EVER collectively survive the dark ages of hardcopy QSL cards, s.a.s.e.'s, QSL bureaus, DX news sheets, and I.R.C.s, I wonder...? Is everyone that impatient while attempting to WORK a rare station, too...? All this angst and trepidation being displayed here...! I thought DX'ing, Ham radio, Topband were all supposed to be FUN, and not a hand-wringing exercise in anger worry management... ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Well, we did survive just fine, Eddy and lots of folks mad the Honor Roll, 5BDXCC etc.. All this nonsense about the online logs is just so much Bull!!! Can all be avoided if folks would do the following:\ 1.0 COPY your own call!!! No guesswork, no fragments, no bluffing etc. 2.0 Copy your report 3.0 Reply with your call, followed by an acknowledgement of DX Station Report (TU or thanks) and Send report to DX station followed (or preceded) by Thanks or TU 4.0 LISTEN for the DX operator to acknowledge your report 5.0 Thanks or TU -or even dit-dit Do those things completely and there won't be much guessing or wondering if you had a legitimate QSO that's logged!! We may have to have some patience and perseverance to work through the jammers, and QRM and the packet-rats tuning up on the DX QRG! It may be reassuring to see the online logs, but we should KNOW if we had a good contact or not! WITHOUT a computer to tell us we did!! I KNEW that my 7 QSOs with K1N were there BEFORE the logs came out! And NO DUPES or INSURANCE CONTACTS!Just my $0.02. 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Eddy Swynar Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 3:17 PM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log How did we EVER collectively survive the dark ages of hardcopy QSL cards, s.a.s.e.'s, QSL bureaus, DX news sheets, and I.R.C.s, I wonder...? Is everyone that impatient while attempting to WORK a rare station, too...? All this angst and trepidation being displayed here...! I thought DX'ing, Ham radio, Topband were all supposed to be FUN, and not a hand-wringing exercise in anger worry management... ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
I had an unambiguous 160M QSO a few nights ago that isn't in the log. I'll work them again but just mentioning it here to let others know they aren't crazy if their QSO also disappeared. 73, Barry N1EU On Fri, Feb 6, 2015 at 6:32 AM, Charlie Cunningham charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com wrote: Hi, Jim Well, it was a bit of a wait, but all 6 of my QSOs are back online now, including 160. I also got 'em on 80 and 160 - but - wonder of wonders - I wkd 'em on 160 fairly quickly on 160 with my 80m GP that, at the moment has only one radial! I've been off the air for a while struggling with a bout of MS - that's better now. My antennas are a mess and need some work and my beat-up old antenna tuner needs some repairs also. So, I'm a happy camper and glad that Navassa is close and the path loss is not so bad! Glad the logs are back on line! With the zoo of packet-rat tuners and the deliberate jammers, it's nice to get log confirmation online - but of course we didn't have that in the old days of hunt pounce and paper logs! Glad your Qa are back online! 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Jim Brown Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 12:41 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log On Thu,2/5/2015 8:24 PM, Tom Haavisto wrote: The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. Chiil -- there were some Qs that got logged on the wrong band, so they started from scratch, reloading to ClubLog. My 160 and 40 Q went away, now all six are there. 73, Jim K9YC _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
From my experience including being part of dxpeditions, several things can happen. I have had cases where I clearly worked the station only to get a NIL. And that included P5. If the contact is for a new band then I make sure I am in the log. With a good on line log it isn't necessary to doubt the contact or make a duplicate. Some dxpeditions even have real time on line logs. As far as making a second contact in 10 minutes, I can see some reasons. The first contact was iffy. Did he actually send my call sign, or I wasn't able to copy clearly due to QRM or QRN. Propagation has improved and I have a better copy. The dxpedition was sending cw so fast my brain couldn't copy. There are cases that I call 'once in a life time propagation'. Propagation to far away places on 160m that one will never witness it again. Like working EY8MM from VE5. On the dxpedition side mistakes will happen. The on the air contact is made but something gets screwed up and the contact doesn't get logged or gets accidentally deleted from the log. I remember a case where my qso didn't appear in the on line log after the dxpedition was over. I emailed the qsl manager. They checked and found that they had forgot to unload that log. So I have my reasons, not excuses, for my operating practices, based on my experience. Doug I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could. -Original Message- The 160 operator last night was complaining about all of the dupes. He thought he had at least 50 dupe QSOs in the evening (this was about 9:30 EST). Some people will just do dupes. In XV there were many that I worked that called me again in maybe 10 minutes (I was posting to LoTW and eQSL within 24 hours). 73, Larry W6NWS --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
None of Feb 4th TB QSO are in online log, must be about 1000. So we start our insurance QSO as encouraged on K1N page: If you don't see your Qs by this time tomorrow, it's probably best to work us again I have only that QSO and 0 in online log so there is no mixed band issues there. I hope they will find that part of log till tomorow opening.. 73 Arunas LY2IJ The 160 operator last night was complaining about all of the dupes. He thought he had at least 50 dupe QSOs in the evening (this was about 9:30 EST). Some people will just do dupes. In XV there were many that I worked that called me again in maybe 10 minutes (I was posting to LoTW and eQSL within 24 hours). 73, Larry W6NWS -Original Message- From: Larry Gauthier (K8UT) Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 7:43 AM To: j...@audiosystemsgroup.com ; topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Jim, Just a minor adjustment to your statement - some might misinterpret the term got logged. ...some Qs that got logged on the wrong band Your Qs are in the log correctly - on the right bands. The problem involved the ClubLog extract/upload. -larry (K8UT) -Original Message- From: Jim Brown Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 12:40 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log On Thu,2/5/2015 8:24 PM, Tom Haavisto wrote: The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. Chiil -- there were some Qs that got logged on the wrong band, so they started from scratch, reloading to ClubLog. My 160 and 40 Q went away, now all six are there. 73, Jim K9YC _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Thanx for the input guys – I too worked them on 160 easy; my other 2 band qsos showed up but 160 still among the missing. Hope it wasn’t a pirate on 160 – they were LOUD in NY on 2/4. Let’s hope they get the logs squared away soon – it sure does cut down on the QRM. 73- Jay NY2NY _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
I just checked the updated on line log and my first Q's on 80 and 160 (both clearly made) are still missing. So working them again was a good decision. From their website If you don't see your Q's by this time tomorrow, it's probably best to work us again. Doug -Original Message- From my experience including being part of dxpeditions, several things can happen. I have had cases where I clearly worked the station only to get a NIL. And that included P5. If the contact is for a new band then I make sure I am in the log. With a good on line log it isn't necessary to doubt the contact or make a duplicate. Some dxpeditions even have real time on line logs. As far as making a second contact in 10 minutes, I can see some reasons. The first contact was iffy. Did he actually send my call sign, or I wasn't able to copy clearly due to QRM or QRN. Propagation has improved and I have a better copy. The dxpedition was sending cw so fast my brain couldn't copy. There are cases that I call 'once in a life time propagation'. Propagation to far away places on 160m that one will never witness it again. Like working EY8MM from VE5. On the dxpedition side mistakes will happen. The on the air contact is made but something gets screwed up and the contact doesn't get logged or gets accidentally deleted from the log. I remember a case where my qso didn't appear in the on line log after the dxpedition was over. I emailed the qsl manager. They checked and found that they had forgot to unload that log. So I have my reasons, not excuses, for my operating practices, based on my experience. Doug I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
The 160 operator last night was complaining about all of the dupes. He thought he had at least 50 dupe QSOs in the evening (this was about 9:30 EST). Some people will just do dupes. In XV there were many that I worked that called me again in maybe 10 minutes (I was posting to LoTW and eQSL within 24 hours). 73, Larry W6NWS When the first on-line logs showed, it correctly showed my 160 80 contact. A couple days later it showed my other Q's including RTTY SSB. I noticed I was given credit for a band I hadn't worked and my RTTY was listed as SSB. I checked the next day to see if things got straightened out and all were removed with a note saying they were correcting errors but that all data was secure on the island. The next time all was posted correctly except my 160 was missing. So last night I worked them on 160 again and within an hour the 160 Q showed up again in the log. Which 160, the original or the 2nd one last night? I don't know but I wouldn't be surprised that others made an insurance Q after seeing their earlier Q went MIA. Congratulations to the ops there, they've been doing a fantastic job. Watching the pileup on the P3 is most telling, this DXpedetion has their work cut out for them. Don, N5LZ in Utah made an interesting video of K1N working JA's on 24MHz posted this to the Elecraft reflector. https://vimeo.com/118876333 73, Gary KA1J --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
I certainly agree with your final point, Mike! Amen! 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Michael Walker Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 10:35 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log I agree that online logs are more of a problem than they are worth. The overhead on the DXpedition is just one more thing they need to worry about and staff for. This is a great example of how it increases the q rate for them and allowing others not to make a contact. If they must, then they shouldn't post the logs until they know they are 100% accurate as it does cause even more confusion. I also know I made a 160 contact with them and my entry is not in the log (yet). But, I am not going to try to work them again as I am confident of my contact and it only prevents others from making a contact. This is ham radio and we need to ensure that it was a quality contact on the air, not backing it up online. my 2 cents mike va3mw On Fri, Feb 6, 2015 at 10:26 AM, W3AW via Topband topband@contesting.com wrote: Agree, thanks for not making multiple contacts. Working K1N on 160 with my Index Labs Qrp Plus is a challenge. Kirk W3AW -- Original message-- From: Tom Haavisto Date: Thu, Feb 5, 2015 10:24 PM To: Doug Renwick; Cc: TopBand List; Subject:Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. There is still lots of time, so it might be best to wait for a day or two before looking for insurance Q's while Clublog gets sorted out. For me, I would really, really hate to have an insurance Q end up costing someone else their one any only chance at putting K1N in the log. Tom - VE3CX On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 11:10 PM, Doug Renwick wrote: Tonight the K1N on line log came back on. For me I lost a bunch of Qs that were there before, and some Qs I had made previously still didn't show. So I decided to work them again on 80 and 160 just to make sure. I am not sure what the problem is but a lot of folks are unhappy. In time it will be sorted out but in the meantime it does not cast a good light on an excellent operation. Doug There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual or lawyer could believe them. - George Orwell, 1984 --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
It's good to know that I'm not crazy either. My 160 contact from Monday night hasn't showed up yet though all the others following have. I remember the contact distinctly as it was ridiculously easy to work them and they were S9+20. But like you I'll just work them again! Les, N1SV Sent from my iPhone On Feb 6, 2015, at 6:57 AM, Barry N1EU barry.n...@gmail.com wrote: I had an unambiguous 160M QSO a few nights ago that isn't in the log. I'll work them again but just mentioning it here to let others know they aren't crazy if their QSO also disappeared. 73, Barry N1EU On Fri, Feb 6, 2015 at 6:32 AM, Charlie Cunningham charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com wrote: Hi, Jim Well, it was a bit of a wait, but all 6 of my QSOs are back online now, including 160. I also got 'em on 80 and 160 - but - wonder of wonders - I wkd 'em on 160 fairly quickly on 160 with my 80m GP that, at the moment has only one radial! I've been off the air for a while struggling with a bout of MS - that's better now. My antennas are a mess and need some work and my beat-up old antenna tuner needs some repairs also. So, I'm a happy camper and glad that Navassa is close and the path loss is not so bad! Glad the logs are back on line! With the zoo of packet-rat tuners and the deliberate jammers, it's nice to get log confirmation online - but of course we didn't have that in the old days of hunt pounce and paper logs! Glad your Qa are back online! 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Jim Brown Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 12:41 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log On Thu,2/5/2015 8:24 PM, Tom Haavisto wrote: The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. Chiil -- there were some Qs that got logged on the wrong band, so they started from scratch, reloading to ClubLog. My 160 and 40 Q went away, now all six are there. 73, Jim K9YC _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
The 160 operator last night was complaining about all of the dupes. He thought he had at least 50 dupe QSOs in the evening (this was about 9:30 EST). Some people will just do dupes. In XV there were many that I worked that called me again in maybe 10 minutes (I was posting to LoTW and eQSL within 24 hours). 73, Larry W6NWS -Original Message- From: Larry Gauthier (K8UT) Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 7:43 AM To: j...@audiosystemsgroup.com ; topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log Jim, Just a minor adjustment to your statement - some might misinterpret the term got logged. ...some Qs that got logged on the wrong band Your Qs are in the log correctly - on the right bands. The problem involved the ClubLog extract/upload. -larry (K8UT) -Original Message- From: Jim Brown Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 12:40 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log On Thu,2/5/2015 8:24 PM, Tom Haavisto wrote: The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. Chiil -- there were some Qs that got logged on the wrong band, so they started from scratch, reloading to ClubLog. My 160 and 40 Q went away, now all six are there. 73, Jim K9YC _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Jim, Just a minor adjustment to your statement - some might misinterpret the term got logged. ...some Qs that got logged on the wrong band Your Qs are in the log correctly - on the right bands. The problem involved the ClubLog extract/upload. -larry (K8UT) -Original Message- From: Jim Brown Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 12:40 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log On Thu,2/5/2015 8:24 PM, Tom Haavisto wrote: The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. Chiil -- there were some Qs that got logged on the wrong band, so they started from scratch, reloading to ClubLog. My 160 and 40 Q went away, now all six are there. 73, Jim K9YC _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
I agree that online logs are more of a problem than they are worth. The overhead on the DXpedition is just one more thing they need to worry about and staff for. This is a great example of how it increases the q rate for them and allowing others not to make a contact. If they must, then they shouldn't post the logs until they know they are 100% accurate as it does cause even more confusion. I also know I made a 160 contact with them and my entry is not in the log (yet). But, I am not going to try to work them again as I am confident of my contact and it only prevents others from making a contact. This is ham radio and we need to ensure that it was a quality contact on the air, not backing it up online. my 2 cents mike va3mw On Fri, Feb 6, 2015 at 10:26 AM, W3AW via Topband topband@contesting.com wrote: Agree, thanks for not making multiple contacts. Working K1N on 160 with my Index Labs Qrp Plus is a challenge. Kirk W3AW -- Original message-- From: Tom Haavisto Date: Thu, Feb 5, 2015 10:24 PM To: Doug Renwick; Cc: TopBand List; Subject:Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. There is still lots of time, so it might be best to wait for a day or two before looking for insurance Q's while Clublog gets sorted out. For me, I would really, really hate to have an insurance Q end up costing someone else their one any only chance at putting K1N in the log. Tom - VE3CX On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 11:10 PM, Doug Renwick wrote: Tonight the K1N on line log came back on. For me I lost a bunch of Qs that were there before, and some Qs I had made previously still didn't show. So I decided to work them again on 80 and 160 just to make sure. I am not sure what the problem is but a lot of folks are unhappy. In time it will be sorted out but in the meantime it does not cast a good light on an excellent operation. Doug There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual or lawyer could believe them. - George Orwell, 1984 --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Agree, thanks for not making multiple contacts. Working K1N on 160 with my Index Labs Qrp Plus is a challenge. Kirk W3AW -- Original message-- From: Tom Haavisto Date: Thu, Feb 5, 2015 10:24 PM To: Doug Renwick; Cc: TopBand List; Subject:Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. There is still lots of time, so it might be best to wait for a day or two before looking for insurance Q's while Clublog gets sorted out. For me, I would really, really hate to have an insurance Q end up costing someone else their one any only chance at putting K1N in the log. Tom - VE3CX On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 11:10 PM, Doug Renwick wrote: Tonight the K1N on line log came back on. For me I lost a bunch of Qs that were there before, and some Qs I had made previously still didn't show. So I decided to work them again on 80 and 160 just to make sure. I am not sure what the problem is but a lot of folks are unhappy. In time it will be sorted out but in the meantime it does not cast a good light on an excellent operation. Doug There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual or lawyer could believe them. - George Orwell, 1984 --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
On Thu,2/5/2015 8:24 PM, Tom Haavisto wrote: The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. Chiil -- there were some Qs that got logged on the wrong band, so they started from scratch, reloading to ClubLog. My 160 and 40 Q went away, now all six are there. 73, Jim K9YC _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Back in the day...we didnt have online logs...how did we possibly exist? That was really a long time ago..Like almost 5 years or more. I am dismayed that dxpeditions are now graded by the quality of their online logs and we demand perfection in every regard. But our own state of perfection is less than ideal. Funny that.. 73 DX Dale - N3BNA (this is a general comment, not meant to focus on any one person) _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Hi, Jim Well, it was a bit of a wait, but all 6 of my QSOs are back online now, including 160. I also got 'em on 80 and 160 - but - wonder of wonders - I wkd 'em on 160 fairly quickly on 160 with my 80m GP that, at the moment has only one radial! I've been off the air for a while struggling with a bout of MS - that's better now. My antennas are a mess and need some work and my beat-up old antenna tuner needs some repairs also. So, I'm a happy camper and glad that Navassa is close and the path loss is not so bad! Glad the logs are back on line! With the zoo of packet-rat tuners and the deliberate jammers, it's nice to get log confirmation online - but of course we didn't have that in the old days of hunt pounce and paper logs! Glad your Qa are back online! 73, Charlie, K4OTV -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Jim Brown Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 12:41 AM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log On Thu,2/5/2015 8:24 PM, Tom Haavisto wrote: The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. Chiil -- there were some Qs that got logged on the wrong band, so they started from scratch, reloading to ClubLog. My 160 and 40 Q went away, now all six are there. 73, Jim K9YC _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
Yeah, me too. I worked them on 80 meters the other night and it's showing no contacts with me. Been busting my hump on several bands to get through. Thought that 80 meter QSOS was a good one. Dang it. Jim Bennett / W6JHB Folsom, CA On Feb 5, 2015, at 8:10 PM, Doug Renwick ve...@sasktel.net wrote: Tonight the K1N on line log came back on. For me I lost a bunch of Qs that were there before, and some Qs I had made previously still didn't show. So I decided to work them again on 80 and 160 just to make sure. I am not sure what the problem is but a lot of folks are unhappy. In time it will be sorted out but in the meantime it does not cast a good light on an excellent operation. Doug There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual or lawyer could believe them. - George Orwell, 1984 --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log
The way I look at it, I got them on 80/160, so anything else is a bonus. There is still lots of time, so it might be best to wait for a day or two before looking for insurance Q's while Clublog gets sorted out. For me, I would really, really hate to have an insurance Q end up costing someone else their one any only chance at putting K1N in the log. Tom - VE3CX On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 11:10 PM, Doug Renwick ve...@sasktel.net wrote: Tonight the K1N on line log came back on. For me I lost a bunch of Qs that were there before, and some Qs I had made previously still didn't show. So I decided to work them again on 80 and 160 just to make sure. I am not sure what the problem is but a lot of folks are unhappy. In time it will be sorted out but in the meantime it does not cast a good light on an excellent operation. Doug There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual or lawyer could believe them. - George Orwell, 1984 --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Topband: K1N On Line Log
Tonight the K1N on line log came back on. For me I lost a bunch of Qs that were there before, and some Qs I had made previously still didn't show. So I decided to work them again on 80 and 160 just to make sure. I am not sure what the problem is but a lot of folks are unhappy. In time it will be sorted out but in the meantime it does not cast a good light on an excellent operation. Doug There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual or lawyer could believe them. - George Orwell, 1984 --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
