Re: Topband: LDEs, witches and magicians

[Guy Olinger K2AV]

Some time in the last decade, out at NY4A in the CQ WW DX CW, on 40 meters,
I started hearing CW that I initially thought someone was sending over the
top of me, mocking me. I sent an FU. and got an FU back. Then the lights
went on in my fatigue-soddened brain. I sent a spastic random
twiddle-diddle of dots and dashes and got the exact same thing back.

Probably sending my usual 28 WPM, I would switch into RX hearing "A NY4A"
sending on top of me when I stopped after a CQ, or U NY4A after a Q, or NN
05 after sending the exchange.

The signal went on for nearly a half hour, and was 20 over 9 until it
suddenly diminished to nothing inside of a minute. At the next PVRC chapter
meeting, others reported something similar at the same time.

Have heard a lot of explanations for it, but honestly can neither dispute
nor lend support to any of them.

I only know for sure that every now and then it happens on a time of its
own picking.

73, Guy

On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Gary Smith  wrote:

> It has not been recently but in the past I
> have heard my signals, it was around the
> year 1990, I was on CW and I had been a
> ham about 10 years at the time. I remember
> hearing a faint mirror of everything I
> sent and very disconcerting to focusing on
> sending properly.
>
> I do not recall the band I was on but I do
> remember I was working EU at the time,
> most likely using a G5RV & I was in
> Missouri. I've never experienced this
> since.
>
> 73,
>
> Gary
> KA1J
> _
> Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
>
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Re: Topband: LDEs, witches and magicians

[Gary Smith]

It has not been recently but in the past I 
have heard my signals, it was around the 
year 1990, I was on CW and I had been a 
ham about 10 years at the time. I remember 
hearing a faint mirror of everything I 
sent and very disconcerting to focusing on 
sending properly. 

I do not recall the band I was on but I do 
remember I was working EU at the time, 
most likely using a G5RV & I was in 
Missouri. I've never experienced this 
since.

73,

Gary
KA1J
_
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Re: Topband: LDEs, witches and magicians

[Walter Miller, AJ6T]

Lee and the group,

Reports of LDEs have always fascinated me.  The only echos I have heard 
were probably round-the-world or auroral distortions on high power 20 
meter SSB stations.


I am trying to do an analysis of the reported LDEs on 160 and 80 meters 
with echo times in the hundreds of milliseconds.  Can you provide me 
with the following information on your experiences:


1. Callsign of transmitting station and TX power, frequency and mode.  
Also, was QSK in use?


2. Location (latitude and longitude or grid square of transmitting station).

3. UT Date and time of LDE

4. Callsign(s) and location(s) of receiving station(s).  Was the echo 
only heard by relatively nearby stations?


5. TX and RX antennas of all stations (N6TR's recent comment about 
stronger echos with a low dipole was very interesting)


6. Estimated time delay of the echo

7. Estimated duration of the time the LDE was heard (just once, minutes, 
hours, etc.)


8. Was there any frequency shift between the transmission and the echo?

9. Any other anecdotal information about the event.

Please reply to me privately in order not to clog up the reflector.  I 
will summarize the reports and make a posting back to the reflector later.


73,

Walt, AJ6T


On 2/8/2017 9:41 AM, Lee STRAHAN wrote:

Greetings All,
 I am afraid I have to take issue with you Wolf. And this may be a clue. I 
also have experienced echoes on 160 meters. Maybe it depends on longitude or 
latitude or something like that. N6TR not being too far away has also 
experienced them.  All that being said I am positive due to my observations 
that a short delay has occurred here twice. During the one event one station 
sent me a message asking what was wrong with my signal. Tests confirmed there 
was nothing wrong with the signal and the echoes slowly faded away. 
Unfortunately I did not have the presence of mind to determine directionality 
or make a recording. The echoes were quite strong and lasted for several 
minutes. Guessing would put them at less than 100 mSec separation. My first 
thought at the time was that my receiving array was failing in some strange 
mode but that was definitely not the case.
Lee  K7TJR  OR

-Original Message-
From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Dr. Wolf 
Ostwald
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2017 10:15 PM
To: topband@contesting.com
Subject: Topband: LDEs, witches and magicians

hello reflectees,
i never ever experienced echoes on 160. And i do a lot of transmitting and have 
relatively sensitive rx systems.
Given the laws of field expansion and attenuation i consider it a hoax.
I have had round the globe echoes on 20m. But was using 6 el monobander with 
power and at the rite time, when we had greyline. Sometimes 2 to three rounds. 
That was physically explainable.
Anything else is from the land of Alice.


73 de wolf  df2py
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Re: Topband: LDEs, witches and magicians

[Lee STRAHAN]

Greetings All,
I am afraid I have to take issue with you Wolf. And this may be a clue. I 
also have experienced echoes on 160 meters. Maybe it depends on longitude or 
latitude or something like that. N6TR not being too far away has also 
experienced them.  All that being said I am positive due to my observations 
that a short delay has occurred here twice. During the one event one station 
sent me a message asking what was wrong with my signal. Tests confirmed there 
was nothing wrong with the signal and the echoes slowly faded away. 
Unfortunately I did not have the presence of mind to determine directionality 
or make a recording. The echoes were quite strong and lasted for several 
minutes. Guessing would put them at less than 100 mSec separation. My first 
thought at the time was that my receiving array was failing in some strange 
mode but that was definitely not the case.
   Lee  K7TJR  OR

-Original Message-
From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Dr. Wolf 
Ostwald
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2017 10:15 PM
To: topband@contesting.com
Subject: Topband: LDEs, witches and magicians

hello reflectees,
i never ever experienced echoes on 160. And i do a lot of transmitting and have 
relatively sensitive rx systems.
Given the laws of field expansion and attenuation i consider it a hoax.
I have had round the globe echoes on 20m. But was using 6 el monobander with 
power and at the rite time, when we had greyline. Sometimes 2 to three rounds. 
That was physically explainable.
Anything else is from the land of Alice.


73 de wolf  df2py
_
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
_
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Re: Topband: LDEs, witches and magicians

[Raoul Coetzee via Topband]

Dear Dr Ostwald,
 Even though I have not experienced any echoes on HF,I think I will keep an 
open mind.We cannot even explain a weak force like gravity completely, after 
many years of ongoing research.Who are we to say that  LDS  belong in  fairy 
tale?  :-)After all, we are receiving echoes of the big bang in the microwave 
background, so what is a few hours between friends on 160m ? :-)
Regards,Raoul ZS1C





  From: Dr. Wolf Ostwald <df...@t-online.de>
 To: topband@contesting.com 
 Sent: Wednesday, February 8, 2017 8:15 AM
 Subject: Topband: LDEs, witches and magicians
   
hello reflectees,
i never ever experienced echoes on 160. And i do a lot of transmitting 
and have relatively sensitive rx systems.
Given the laws of field expansion and attenuation i consider it a hoax.
I have had round the globe echoes on 20m. But was using 6 el monobander 
with power and at the rite time, when we had greyline. Sometimes 2 to 
three rounds. That was physically explainable.
Anything else is from the land of Alice.


73 de wolf  df2py
_
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband


   
_
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband

Topband: LDEs, witches and magicians

[Dr. Wolf Ostwald]

hello reflectees,
i never ever experienced echoes on 160. And i do a lot of transmitting 
and have relatively sensitive rx systems.

Given the laws of field expansion and attenuation i consider it a hoax.
I have had round the globe echoes on 20m. But was using 6 el monobander 
with power and at the rite time, when we had greyline. Sometimes 2 to 
three rounds. That was physically explainable.

Anything else is from the land of Alice.


73 de wolf  df2py
_
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband