Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
- Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/12/2005 11:41:30 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: I'm not sure what you are suggesting, Izzy. Does Satan not tempt non-LDS Christians? Or, are they just reluctant to admit such? cd: On yes we have temptations-but true Christians say no to Satan before is manifests into sin -Mormons (ie On this site and in person) on the other Hand not only dwell on their lust for the flesh but also speak what is in their hearts(ie: waiting with bated breath, tight leather, and if you want to discuss this off TT email me). Lustful wicked people quick to sin and lead other to do likewise as they are lead by the flesh and not the spirit.ShieldsFamily wrote: When we took a young mormon couple with us to a medical meeting a few years ago I was talking with the newlywed wife while we were shopping together. I was shocked when she told me that she struggled with temptation towards another man that she worked with. Her husband was a precious young man, and they were newlyweds! izzy -- ~~~ Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.langlitz.com ~~~ If you wish to receive things I find interesting, I maintain six email lists... JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS, STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
DAVEH: I'm not sure what you are suggesting, Izzy. Does Satan not tempt non-LDS Christians? Or, are they just reluctant to admit such? ShieldsFamily wrote: When we took a young mormon couple with us to a medical meeting a few years ago I was talking with the newlywed wife while we were shopping together. I was shocked when she told me that she struggled with temptation towards another man that she worked with. Her husband was a precious young man, and they were newlyweds! izzy -- ~~~ Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.langlitz.com ~~~ If you wish to receive things I find interesting, I maintain six email lists... JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS, STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
When we took a young mormon couple with us to a medical meeting a few years ago I was talking with the newlywed wife while we were shopping together. I was shocked when she told me that she struggled with temptation towards another man that she worked with. Her husband was a precious young man, and they were newlyweds! izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Monday, December 12, 2005 5:56 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/12/2005 12:43:42 AM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox In a message dated 12/11/2005 4:05:23 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: For instance??? Blainerb cd: Such as "depending on how tight the leather is"-and other sexual references-just showing your heart that is coming out of your mouth-the same as your prophet-defiled. Tch Tch, you were the one to draw a naughty conclusion, Dean, not me. Is this an example of the eye with the beam wanting to remove the mote? Let me see, weren't you also the guy who was certain women in the Mormon temples were getting all "oiled up.?" :>) cd: Actually that was Kevin who asked a high priests if he had put oil on any new brides lately-Case in point the Mormons get to put (with their hands) oil on the entire surface of the naked bodies on all young brides who get married in the temple. We tell them this is wrong. Correct me if I am wrong Kevin. Blaine is trying to find fault in me to cover his own sin of lusting after the flesh-usually Mormon things that I hate.
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
Please tell us your view of resting on the Saturday Sabbath. I hesitate to bring up the subject because of such stinking attitudes from some on TT. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Monday, December 12, 2005 5:44 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 3:42:17 PM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Then theres the stuff that stinks.. cd: How can searching the deeper things of God ever do such? Have the almost(s) and the anti(s) Christians on this site cryied so loudly that we now can only discuss baby food (ie milk) so as to not stir the pot? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 11:18 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 12:00:57 PM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox To let it lie there, I think. cd: But a pot of chile smells better when stirred-it releases wonder aroma into the air for all to enjoy. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 10:41 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 10:19:34 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox I think we got it resolvedbetter not stir the pot. iz cd: Chicken? What was the conclusion? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 8:07 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 8:43:36 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Yes, welcome back Brother Dean. (Where were you when I was getting all beat up for loving the Saturday Sabbath?) iz cd: Thanks izzy. Care to send me a posting of this subject and I will be happy to take it up-with the rational minded. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 4:57 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away". Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~Dave Hansen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.langlitz.com~~~If you wish to receivethings I find interesting,I maintain six email lists...JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
- Original Message - From: To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/12/2005 12:43:42 AM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox In a message dated 12/11/2005 4:05:23 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: For instance??? Blainerb cd: Such as "depending on how tight the leather is"-and other sexual references-just showing your heart that is coming out of your mouth-the same as your prophet-defiled. Tch Tch, you were the one to draw a naughty conclusion, Dean, not me. Is this an example of the eye with the beam wanting to remove the mote? Let me see, weren't you also the guy who was certain women in the Mormon temples were getting all "oiled up.?" :>) cd: Actually that was Kevin who asked a high priests if he had put oil on any new brides lately-Case in point the Mormons get to put (with their hands) oil on the entire surface of the naked bodies on all young brides who get married in the temple. We tell them this is wrong. Correct me if I am wrong Kevin. Blaine is trying to find fault in me to cover his own sin of lusting after the flesh-usually Mormon things that I hate.
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
- Original Message - From: To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/12/2005 12:58:18 AM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox In a message dated 12/11/2005 1:42:13 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Then theres the stuff that stinks .. The more you stir it, the worse it stinks, too. Blainerb cd: See izzy point proven-should we be afraid to make the babys and the lost to cry out "this stinks".
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
- Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 3:42:17 PM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Then theres the stuff that stinks .. cd: How can searching the deeper things of God ever do such? Have the almost(s) and the anti(s) Christians on this site cryied so loudly that we now can only discuss baby food (ie milk) so as to not stir the pot? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 11:18 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 12:00:57 PM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox To let it lie there, I think. cd: But a pot of chile smells better when stirred-it releases wonder aroma into the air for all to enjoy. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 10:41 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 10:19:34 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox I think we got it resolvedbetter not stir the pot. iz cd: Chicken? What was the conclusion? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 8:07 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 8:43:36 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Yes, welcome back Brother Dean. (Where were you when I was getting all beat up for loving the Saturday Sabbath?) iz cd: Thanks izzy. Care to send me a posting of this subject and I will be happy to take it up-with the rational minded. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 4:57 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away".Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~Dave Hansen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.langlitz.com~~~If you wish to receivethings I find interesting,I maintain six email lists...JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
In a message dated 12/11/2005 1:42:13 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Then there’s the stuff that stinks….. The more you stir it, the worse it stinks, too. Blainerb
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
In a message dated 12/11/2005 4:05:23 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: For instance??? Blainerb cd: Such as "depending on how tight the leather is"-and other sexual references-just showing your heart that is coming out of your mouth-the same as your prophet-defiled. Tch Tch, you were the one to draw a naughty conclusion, Dean, not me. Is this an example of the eye with the beam wanting to remove the mote? Let me see, weren't you also the guy who was certain women in the Mormon temples were getting all "oiled up.?" :>)
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
cd: Such as "depending on how tight the leather is"-and other sexual references-just showing your heart that is coming out of your mouth-the same as your prophet-defiled. James 1:5 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.Dean Moore <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: - Original Message - From: To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 10:23:35 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox In a message dated 12/10/2005 7:49:35 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:\Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. For instance??? Blainerb cd: Such as "depending on how tight the leather is"-and other sexual references-just showing your heart that is coming out of your mouth-the same as your prophet-defiled.__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
Then there’s the stuff that stinks….. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 11:18 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 12:00:57 PM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox To let it lie there, I think. cd: But a pot of chile smells better when stirred-it releases wonder aroma into the air for all to enjoy. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 10:41 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 10:19:34 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox I think we got it resolvedbetter not stir the pot. iz cd: Chicken? What was the conclusion? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 8:07 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 8:43:36 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Yes, welcome back Brother Dean. (Where were you when I was getting all beat up for loving the Saturday Sabbath?) iz cd: Thanks izzy. Care to send me a posting of this subject and I will be happy to take it up-with the rational minded. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 4:57 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away". Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~Dave Hansen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.langlitz.com~~~If you wish to receivethings I find interesting,I maintain six email lists...JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
- Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 12:00:57 PM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox To let it lie there, I think. cd: But a pot of chile smells better when stirred-it releases wonder aroma into the air for all to enjoy. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 10:41 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 10:19:34 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox I think we got it resolvedbetter not stir the pot. iz cd: Chicken? What was the conclusion? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 8:07 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 8:43:36 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Yes, welcome back Brother Dean. (Where were you when I was getting all beat up for loving the Saturday Sabbath?) iz cd: Thanks izzy. Care to send me a posting of this subject and I will be happy to take it up-with the rational minded. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 4:57 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away".Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~Dave Hansen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.langlitz.com~~~If you wish to receivethings I find interesting,I maintain six email lists...JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
To let it lie there, I think. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 10:41 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 10:19:34 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox I think we got it resolvedbetter not stir the pot. iz cd: Chicken? What was the conclusion? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 8:07 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 8:43:36 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Yes, welcome back Brother Dean. (Where were you when I was getting all beat up for loving the Saturday Sabbath?) iz cd: Thanks izzy. Care to send me a posting of this subject and I will be happy to take it up-with the rational minded. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 4:57 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away". Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~Dave Hansen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.langlitz.com~~~If you wish to receivethings I find interesting,I maintain six email lists...JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
- Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 10:19:34 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox I think we got it resolvedbetter not stir the pot. iz cd: Chicken? What was the conclusion? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 8:07 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 8:43:36 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Yes, welcome back Brother Dean. (Where were you when I was getting all beat up for loving the Saturday Sabbath?) iz cd: Thanks izzy. Care to send me a posting of this subject and I will be happy to take it up-with the rational minded. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 4:57 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away".Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~Dave Hansen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.langlitz.com~~~If you wish to receivethings I find interesting,I maintain six email lists...JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
I think we got it resolved—better not stir the pot. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 8:07 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 8:43:36 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Yes, welcome back Brother Dean. (Where were you when I was getting all beat up for loving the Saturday Sabbath?) iz cd: Thanks izzy. Care to send me a posting of this subject and I will be happy to take it up-with the rational minded. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 4:57 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away". Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~Dave Hansen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.langlitz.com~~~If you wish to receivethings I find interesting,I maintain six email lists...JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
- Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/11/2005 8:43:36 AM Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Yes, welcome back Brother Dean. (Where were you when I was getting all beat up for loving the Saturday Sabbath?) iz cd: Thanks izzy. Care to send me a posting of this subject and I will be happy to take it up-with the rational minded. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean MooreSent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 4:57 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away".Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~Dave Hansen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.langlitz.com~~~If you wish to receivethings I find interesting,I maintain six email lists...JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
Yes, welcome back Brother Dean. (Where were you when I was getting all beat up for loving the Saturday Sabbath?) iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Moore Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2005 4:57 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox - Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away". Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~Dave Hansen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.langlitz.com~~~If you wish to receivethings I find interesting,I maintain six email lists...JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
- Original Message - From: To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 10:23:35 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox In a message dated 12/10/2005 7:49:35 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. For instance??? Blainerb cd: Such as "depending on how tight the leather is"-and other sexual references-just showing your heart that is coming out of your mouth-the same as your prophet-defiled.
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
- Original Message - From: Dave Hansen To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/10/2005 6:32:21 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily cd: Taking you your anti-Christ bias in consideration I view your welcome as a spider speaking to a fly-He says:" Welcome to my dwelling place my friend ,nice to see you, come closer and sit by me and we will speak of older times and places far away".Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~ Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.langlitz.com ~~~ If you wish to receive things I find interesting, I maintain six email lists... JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS, STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
In a message dated 12/10/2005 7:49:35 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. For instance??? Blainerb
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
DAVEH: Welcome back, Dean! Despite your anti-Mormon bias, I am glad you have returnedeven if only temporarily Dean Moore wrote: \Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. -- ~~~ Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.langlitz.com ~~~ If you wish to receive things I find interesting, I maintain six email lists... JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS, STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
\Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. cd:True prophet ? What makes him true? If one speaks wrongly can that one still hold the title of true Prophet-or is he just another hell bound unrepenting Mormon lusting after other women? Your actions of late also remove you own credibility as a man of God-and show us how Mormons really are-Yes a credit to your church. __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad http://www.signaturebooks.com/leather.htm Early Mormonism and the Magic World ViewD. MICHAEL QUINNDue to repeated requests, Signature Books has issued a limited number of D. Michael Quinn's award winning tome (Mormon History Association Best Book Award) in a special leather edition. A former BYU professor now living and writing in California, Quinn is among the most respected historians of Mormonism today. He counts among his honors an American Historical Association Best Book Award. D. Michael Quinn is a former professor of history at Brigham Young University. His accolades include the Samuel F. Bemis, the George W. Egleston, and the Frederick W. Beinecke prizes; Best Book and Best Article awards from the Mormon History Association; "Outstanding Teacher" by vote of graduating BYU seniors; and invitations to lecture at the University of Paris's Fondation de la Maison des Sciences de l'Homme and other similar venues. He is the author of J. Reuben Clark: The Church Years; Early Mormonism and the Magic World View; The Mormon Hierarchy: Origins of Power; The Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power; and Same-Sex Dynamics Among Nineteenth-Century Americans: A Mormon Example. He is the editor of The New Mormon History: Revisionist Essays on the Past and a contributing author to American National Biography; Faithful History: Essays on Writing Mormon History; Fundamentalisms and Society: Reclaiming the Sciences, the Family, and Education; Reader's Encyclopedia of the American West; Under an Open Sky: Rethinking America's Western Past; and Women and Authority: Re-emerging Mormon Feminism. His research honorariums include grants from the American Academy of Arts and Sciences, the American Council of Learned Societies, the Henry E. Huntington Library, the National Endowment for the Humanities, the Mrs. Giles Whiting Foundation, Yale University, and others. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Is that what you think I said? You are joking. Or you are as usual trying to sidestep the issue; I am therefore assuming you have no answer to defend the hoax your were quoting. Blainerb: In a message dated 12/8/2005 5:53:30 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So there was NO Autumn Equinox in 1824? 1825? 1826? 1827? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Blainerb: Not only was your author wrong as to the ruler of Capricorn, he implies that the autumn equinox falls on the 22 of September every year of the four years Joseph Smith went to the hill to meet with the angel. This could not have been true, as the autumn equinox changes days according to several factors, mostly having to do with whether or not the year is a leap year. See table below for an example of this-- notice the time of day varies as well as the day.Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
Sidestep what issue? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinox The March equinox typically falls on either March 20 or 21 and the September equinox on September 22 or 23 There is NO Question about joe using these Pagan Occult dates! HISTORY of the Church Vol 1 First visit of Nephi later changed to Moroni see page 9 History of the Church At retiring to bed on the night of Sept 21 the account continues till page 14 where we are told the visitation continued till the rooster crowed, making it Sept 22! on Sept 22 'moroni' appears again tells joe come back every year at this time see page 16 Show me one LDS source that has complained about Quinns statement on Smith and his use of Occult dates for all important Mormon events. FARMS? Kerry Shirts? Shields? http://farms.byu.edu/results.php?st=1&q=magic And I would be real interested in your "feelings" on why Smith sacrificed a BLACK Sheep! http://www.religionfacts.com/mormonism/history/joseph_smith.htm He was directed to return to the site at each Autumn Equinox for four years, until 1827. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1820s_in_Mormonism 1823 September 21: Joseph Smith, Jr. claims to receive a visit from an angel in the upstairs room of the cabin in which he lived (note that this also occurred on the autumn equinox). The angel is originally named "Nephi," but the name is changed to "Moroni" to fall in line with the story told in the Book of Mormon. 1827 September 22: Joseph Smith, Jr. claims he acquired the Golden Plates on which The Book of Mormon is allegedly inscribed. September 22 holds special significance in pagan circles as it is the autumn equinox. According to some authors (Quinn 1987), Joseph Smith, Jr. retrieving the golden plates on the autumn equinox is not a coincidence but rather consciously timed to coincide with this important pagan day. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Is that what you think I said? You are joking. Or you are as usual trying to sidestep the issue; I am therefore assuming you have no answer to defend the hoax your were quoting. Blainerb: In a message dated 12/8/2005 5:53:30 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:So there was NO Autumn Equinox in 1824? 1825? 1826? 1827? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Blainerb: Not only was your author wrong as to the ruler of Capricorn, he implies that the autumn equinox falls on the 22 of September every year of the four years Joseph Smith went to the hill to meet with the angel. This could not have been true, as the autumn equinox changes days according to several factors, mostly having to do with whether or not the year is a leap year. See table below for an example of this-- notice the time of day varies as well as the day.Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
Blainerb: Sounds more like some of Joseph Smith's tom-foolery! He was famous for saying ridiculous things for a laugh! Once while the Nauvoo temple was being built, and the sunstone with the round-faced image of God carved on it was about to be put into place, someone asked if that was what God looked like. He replied that it was, except his nose was just a smidgeon wider! Both he and the man who asked the question got a good laugh! Where is your sense of humor, Kevin? In a message dated 12/7/2005 9:14:07 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Joe was an Occultist who sacrificed animalsKevin Deegan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The angel appeared on September 22 every year four years in a row. None of the other dates corresponded to Trumpets. It had more to do with being a observer of SIGNS in the heavens. Jo was an Astrologer who did all his "work" on days of Occult and Astrologic significance Pagans observe the "holy day" of the Autumn Equinox on the date in 1827 also. The "angel" of light had appeared on the night of the Autumnal equinox, between midnight and dawn--hours auspicious for a magical invocation In what follows most Mormons will not find a story with which they are familiar. Instead, they will discover that Joseph Smith evidently participated extensively in magical pursuits and that he shared with others of his contemporaries a magic world view of the world. For myself, I have found that the 'official version' of early Mormon history is sometimes incomplete in its presentation and evaluation of evidence, and therefore inaccurate in certain respects." (Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, Introduction, Quinn pages xx-xxi) In discussing the discovery of the Book of Mormon, Quinn notes that Smith prayed to be guided to the plates for three years in succession on the autumnal equinox. On September 21, 1823, for example, Smith prayed under the full moon on a Sunday night that was ruled by his own ruling planet, Jupiter. The hours of his prayer and vision were ruled by planets and the moon, making the time particularly propitious for the summoning of and communing with a good spirit. (Smith also owned a talisman which had the magic seal of Jupiter and the Latin words "Confirmo O Deus potentissimus" on one side, and the astrological symbol for Jupiter, Jupiter's magic number (136), and a magic table in Hebrew lettering that added up to 136 on the other side.) Review of Early Mormonism and the Magic World View D. MICHAEL QUINN http://www.signaturebooks.com/reviews/magic.htm Joseph Smith, jun. was born December 23, 1805 during the first Decan of Capricorn whose ruling planet is Jupiter, which is also the governing planet for the year 1805. Dr. Durham director of the LDS Institute of Religion at the University of Utah as well as president of the Mormon History Association "...The purpose of the Table of Jupiter is talismanic magic [sic] was to be able to call upon the celestial intelligences assigned to the particular talisman to assist one in all endeavors. The names of the deities... who could be invoked by the Table were always written on the tailsman or represented by various numbers; three such names were written on Joseph Smith's talisman... Abbah, Father; El Ab, Father is God; and Josiphiel, Johovah speaks for God... When properly invoked, with Jupiter being very powerful and ruling in the heavens, these intelligences by the power of ancient magic guaranteed to the possessor of this tailsman to gain of riches and favor and power and love and peace and to confirm honors and dignities and councils. Tailsmanic magic further declared that any one who worked skillfully with this Jupiter table would obtain the power of stimulating anyone to offer their love to the possessor of the talisman..." Dabbling in the occult, Smith apprenticed with a man described as "a peripatetic magician, conjurer and fortuneteller," from whom he learned the era's folk concepts of crystal gazing, divining rods, seer stones, and rituals associated with treasure hunting. He advised others in their pursuits, once instructing a neighbor he could locate buried money on his property by slitting the throat of a black sheep and leading it in a circle on the land. Increasingly ridiculed as a necromancer and money digger, Smith kept details of his continuing revelations to himself, confiding only in his parents, siblings, and, by early 1827, in young Emma Hale, with whom he had eloped. All the while he patiently awaited an order from the angel Moroni that it was time to retrieve the golden book. It was an auspicious night for
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
Is that what you think I said? You are joking. Or you are as usual trying to sidestep the issue; I am therefore assuming you have no answer to defend the hoax your were quoting. Blainerb: In a message dated 12/8/2005 5:53:30 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So there was NO Autumn Equinox in 1824? 1825? 1826? 1827? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Blainerb: Not only was your author wrong as to the ruler of Capricorn, he implies that the autumn equinox falls on the 22 of September every year of the four years Joseph Smith went to the hill to meet with the angel. This could not have been true, as the autumn equinox changes days according to several factors, mostly having to do with whether or not the year is a leap year. See table below for an example of this-- notice the time of day varies as well as the day.Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad.
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
So there was NO Autumn Equinox in 1824? 1825? 1826? 1827? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Blainerb: Not only was your author wrong as to the ruler of Capricorn, he implies that the autumn equinox falls on the 22 of September every year of the four years Joseph Smith went to the hill to meet with the angel. This could not have been true, as the autumn equinox changes days according to several factors, mostly having to do with whether or not the year is a leap year. See table below for an example of this-- notice the time of day varies as well as the day.Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. The Autumnal Equinox happens once a year. At this time, because of the motion of the Earth around the Sun and because the Earth is tilted, the Sun crosses over the Earth's equator on its way South.Table of Autumnal Equinoxes YearDateTime (GMT)200323 September10:46200422 September16:29200522 September22:22200623 September04:02200723 September09:50200822 September15:43200922 September21:18201023 September03:08 The Autumn Equinox is one of the Four Quarter Days of the year. It marks a major mid-point of two of the seasons - In a message dated 12/7/2005 9:14:07 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Joe was an Occultist who sacrificed animalsKevin Deegan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The angel appeared on September 22 every year four years in a row. None of the other dates corresponded to Trumpets. It had more to do with being a observer of SIGNS in the heavens. Jo was an Astrologer who did all his "work" on days of Occult and Astrologic significance Pagans observe the "holy day" of the Autumn Equinox on the date in 1827 also. The "angel" of light had appeared on the night of the Autumnal equinox, between midnight and dawn--hours auspicious for a magical invocation In what follows most Mormons will not find a story with which they are familiar. Instead, they will discover that Joseph Smith evidently participated extensively in magical pursuits and that he shared with others of his contemporaries a magic world view of the world. For myself, I have found that the 'official version' of early Mormon history is sometimes incomplete in its presentation and evaluation of evidence, and therefore inaccurate in certain respects." (Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, Introduction, Quinn pages xx-xxi)In discussing the discovery of the Book of Mormon, Quinn notes that Smith prayed to be guided to the plates for three years in succession on the autumnal equinox. On September 21, 1823, for example, Smith prayed under the full moon on a Sunday night that was ruled by his own ruling planet, Jupiter. The hours of his prayer and vision were ruled by planets and the moon, making the time particularly propitious for the summoning of and communing with a good spirit. (Smith also owned a talisman which had the magic seal of Jupiter and the Latin words "Confirmo O Deus potentissimus" on one side, and the astrological symbol for Jupiter, Jupiter's magic number (136), and a magic table in Hebrew lettering that added up to 136 on the other side.) Review of Early Mormonism and the Magic World View D. MICHAEL QUINN http://www.signaturebooks.com/reviews/magic.htm Joseph Smith, jun. was born December 23, 1805 during the first Decan of Capricorn whose ruling planet is Jupiter, which is also the governing planet for the year 1805. Dr. Durham director of the LDS Institute of Religion at the University of Utah as well as president of the Mormon History Association "...The purpose of the Table of Jupiter is talismanic magic [sic] was to be able to call upon the celestial intelligences assigned to the particular talisman to assist one in all endeavors. The names of the deities... who could be invoked by the Table were always written on the tailsman or represented by various numbers; three such names were written on Joseph Smith's talisman... Abbah, Father; El Ab, Father is God; and Josiphiel, Johovah speaks for God... When properly invoked, with Jupiter being very powerful and ruling in the heavens, these intelligences by the power of ancient magic guaranteed to the possessor of this tailsman to gain of riches and favor and power and love and peace and to confirm honors and dignities and councils. Tailsmanic magic further declared that any one who worked skillfully with this Jupiter table would obtain the power of stimulating anyone to offer their love to the possessor of the talisman..." Dabbling in the occult, Smith apprenticed with a man described as "a peripatetic magician, conjurer and fortuneteller," from whom he learned the era's folk concepts of crystal gazing, divining rods, seer stones, and rituals associated with treasure hunting. He advised others in their pursuits,
Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
Blainerb: Not only was your author wrong as to the ruler of Capricorn, he implies that the autumn equinox falls on the 22 of September every year of the four years Joseph Smith went to the hill to meet with the angel. This could not have been true, as the autumn equinox changes days according to several factors, mostly having to do with whether or not the year is a leap year. See table below for an example of this-- notice the time of day varies as well as the day.Your author is nothing more than a cheap put-down artist bent on making Joseph Smith the true prophet look bad. The Autumnal Equinox happens once a year. At this time, because of the motion of the Earth around the Sun and because the Earth is tilted, the Sun crosses over the Earth's equator on its way South. Table of Autumnal Equinoxes Year Date Time (GMT) 2003 23 September 10:46 2004 22 September 16:29 2005 22 September 22:22 2006 23 September 04:02 2007 23 September 09:50 2008 22 September 15:43 2009 22 September 21:18 2010 23 September 03:08 The Autumn Equinox is one of the Four Quarter Days of the year. It marks a major mid-point of two of the seasons - In a message dated 12/7/2005 9:14:07 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Joe was an Occultist who sacrificed animalsKevin Deegan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The angel appeared on September 22 every year four years in a row. None of the other dates corresponded to Trumpets. It had more to do with being a observer of SIGNS in the heavens. Jo was an Astrologer who did all his "work" on days of Occult and Astrologic significance Pagans observe the "holy day" of the Autumn Equinox on the date in 1827 also. The "angel" of light had appeared on the night of the Autumnal equinox, between midnight and dawn--hours auspicious for a magical invocation In what follows most Mormons will not find a story with which they are familiar. Instead, they will discover that Joseph Smith evidently participated extensively in magical pursuits and that he shared with others of his contemporaries a magic world view of the world. For myself, I have found that the 'official version' of early Mormon history is sometimes incomplete in its presentation and evaluation of evidence, and therefore inaccurate in certain respects." (Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, Introduction, Quinn pages xx-xxi) In discussing the discovery of the Book of Mormon, Quinn notes that Smith prayed to be guided to the plates for three years in succession on the autumnal equinox. On September 21, 1823, for example, Smith prayed under the full moon on a Sunday night that was ruled by his own ruling planet, Jupiter. The hours of his prayer and vision were ruled by planets and the moon, making the time particularly propitious for the summoning of and communing with a good spirit. (Smith also owned a talisman which had the magic seal of Jupiter and the Latin words "Confirmo O Deus potentissimus" on one side, and the astrological symbol for Jupiter, Jupiter's magic number (136), and a magic table in Hebrew lettering that added up to 136 on the other side.) Review of Early Mormonism and the Magic World View D. MICHAEL QUINN http://www.signaturebooks.com/reviews/magic.htm Joseph Smith, jun. was born December 23, 1805 during the first Decan of Capricorn whose ruling planet is Jupiter, which is also the governing planet for the year 1805. Dr. Durham director of the LDS Institute of Religion at the University of Utah as well as president of the Mormon History Association "...The purpose of the Table of Jupiter is talismanic magic [sic] was to be able to call upon the celestial intelligences assigned to the particular talisman to assist one in all endeavors. The names of the deities... who could be invoked by the Table were always written on the tailsman or represented by various numbers; three such names were written on Joseph Smith's talisman... Abbah, Father; El Ab, Father is God; and Josiphiel, Johovah speaks for God... When properly invoked, with Jupiter being very powerful and ruling in the heavens, these intelligences by the power of ancient magic guaranteed to the possessor of this tailsman to gain of riches and favor and power and love and peace and to confirm honors and dignities and councils. Tailsmanic magic further declared that any one who worked skillfully with this Jupiter table would obtain the power of stimulating anyone t
RE: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox
Joe was an Occultist who sacrificed animalsKevin Deegan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:The angel appeared on September 22 every year four years in a row. None of the other dates corresponded to Trumpets. It had more to do with being a observer of SIGNS in the heavens. Jo was an Astrologer who did all his "work" on days of Occult and Astrologic significance Pagans observe the "holy day" of the Autumn Equinox on the date in 1827 also. The "angel" of light had appeared on the night of the Autumnal equinox, between midnight and dawn--hours auspicious for a magical invocation In what follows most Mormons will not find a story with which they are familiar. Instead, they will discover that Joseph Smith evidently participated extensively in magical pursuits and that he shared with others of his contemporaries a magic world view of the world. For myself, I have found that the 'official version' of early Mormon history is sometimes incomplete in its presentation and evaluation of evidence, and therefore inaccurate in certain respects." (Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, Introduction, Quinn pages xx-xxi)In discussing the discovery of the Book of Mormon, Quinn notes that Smith prayed to be guided to the plates for three years in succession on the autumnal equinox. On September 21, 1823, for example, Smith prayed under the full moon on a Sunday night that was ruled by his own ruling planet, Jupiter. The hours of his prayer and vision were ruled by planets and the moon, making the time particularly propitious for the summoning of and communing with a good spirit. (Smith also owned a talisman which had the magic seal of Jupiter and the Latin words "Confirmo O Deus potentissimus" on one side, and the astrological symbol for Jupiter, Jupiter's magic number (136), and a magic table in Hebrew lettering that added up to 136 on the other side.) Review of Early Mormonism and the Magic World View D. MICHAEL QUINN http://www.signaturebooks.com/reviews/magic.htm Joseph Smith, jun. was born December 23, 1805 during the first Decan of Capricorn whose ruling planet is Jupiter, which is also the governing planet for the year 1805. Dr. Durham director of the LDS Institute of Religion at the University of Utah as well as president of the Mormon History Association "...The purpose of the Table of Jupiter is talismanic magic [sic] was to be able to call upon the celestial intelligences assigned to the particular talisman to assist one in all endeavors. The names of the deities... who could be invoked by the Table were always written on the tailsman or represented by various numbers; three such names were written on Joseph Smith's talisman... Abbah, Father; El Ab, Father is God; and Josiphiel, Johovah speaks for God... When properly invoked, with Jupiter being very powerful and ruling in the heavens, these intelligences by the power of ancient magic guaranteed to the possessor of this tailsman to gain of riches and favor and power and love and peace and to confirm honors and dignities and councils. Tailsmanic magic further declared that any one who worked skillfully with this Jupiter table would obtain the power of stimulating anyone to offer their love to the possessor of the talisman..." Dabbling in the occult, Smith apprenticed with a man described as "a peripatetic magician, conjurer and fortuneteller," from whom he learned the era's folk concepts of crystal gazing, divining rods, seer stones, and rituals associated with treasure hunting. He advised others in their pursuits, once instructing a neighbor he could locate buried money on his property by slitting the throat of a black sheep and leading it in a circle on the land. Increasingly ridiculed as a necromancer and money digger, Smith kept details of his continuing revelations to himself, confiding only in his parents, siblings, and, by early 1827, in young Emma Hale, with whom he had eloped. All the while he patiently awaited an order from the angel Moroni that it was time to retrieve the golden book. It was an auspicious night for communing with spirits, according to the astrological handbooks of the day. "Jews throughout the world celebrated the Feast of Trumpets, which initiates the Days of Awe," or Rosh Hashanah, academic journals later noted in an attempt to seek association between Smith and Judaism. Almanacs published near Smith's home reported the date was "both the autumnal equinox and a new moon, an excellent time to commence new projects." A publication in nearby Canandaigua reported "the moon was also in Libra, when one should 'Delve and Dig.' " The twenty-one-year-old Smith dressed himself in black, then borrowed a black horse and sleigh for the ride to the hill of Cumorah. He had been "commanded to go on the 22d day of September 1827 at 2 o'clock," Smith's sister later wrote.American Massacre: The Tragedy At Mountain Meadows, September 1857 Dentonhttp://www.northshire.com/siteinfo/bookinfo/0-375-72636-5/0/ NOTE The Greater Key
