Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Let's take the first paragraph of your response below: tell me how youcan read my article, with an honest heart, and conclude that it is written with aview of prersenting humanism as opposed to a God-centered faith? I say that such is IMPOSSIBLE. JD-Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 12:49:46 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thanks for asking, JD. To me humanism is the religion worshipping humans. Putting humans and humanistic thinking ahead of God and thinking according to God?s Word. I have no idea how DM would define it. I also don?t appreciate your insinuation that I get my ideas from DM. Regarding your post, it sounded ?nice? and all. But a religion that spends time promoting ?Community? is off-base IMO. The true Church is not about promoting the community of humans, but is all about lifting up Jesus Christ as Lord of Lords and King of Kings. The true community which springs from that as a byproduct is truly wonderful, as you seem to understand. Izzy PS Here is how a Humanist defines Humanism: http://www.jcn.com/humanism.html. (Is it NOT Christianity.) From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 10:18 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Well, it most certainly is not humanism, Linda. Or maybe I should ask what you think humanism is before going any further. David M accused me of the same thing -- perhaps this is where you got the idea. He too, left off giving me a definition. What was written below is a first draft attempt at continuing the task of understanding, on my part. It could not be more God centered -- so how is it humanism. What is you defintion? Jd -Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 09:47:48 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each other?s fellowship. It?s a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN -- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropr iate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ]nb sp; His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature
Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
"be fruitful and multiply" is something you disagree with? Absolutely nothing humanistic about it. Try something else or maybe you do not understand what "humanism" actually means when realted to a theological discussion. Jd -Original Message-From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sun, 5 Jun 2005 13:08:15 -0700 (PDT)Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Let's take the first paragraph of your response below: tell me how youcan read my article, with an honest heart, and conclude that it is written with aview of prersenting humanism as opposed to a God-centered faith? I say that such is IMPOSSIBLE. JD-Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 12:49:46 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thanks for asking, JD. To me humanism is the religion worshipping humans. Putting humans and humanistic thinking ahead of God and thinking according to God?s Word. I have no idea how DM would define it. I also don?t appreciate your insinuation that I get my ideas from DM. Regarding your post, it sounded ?nice? and all. But a religion that spends time promoting ?Community? is off-base IMO. The true Church is not about promoting the community of humans, but is all about lifting up Jesus Christ as Lord of Lords and King of Kings. The true community which springs from that as a byproduct is truly wonderful, as you seem to understand. Izzy PS Here is how a Humanist defines Humanism: http://www.jcn.com/humanism.html. (Is it NOT Christianity.) From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 10:18 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Well, it most certainly is not humanism, Linda. Or maybe I should ask what you think humanism is before going any further. David M accused me of the same thing -- perhaps this is where you got the idea. He too, left off giving me a definition. What was written below is a first draft attempt at continuing the task of understanding, on my part. It could not be more God centered -- so how is it humanism. What is you defintion? Jd -Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 09:47:48 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each other?s fellowship. It?s a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN -- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own cours
Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
This is just how far out in lala land you are, Kevin. Those on both sides of the divide are scratching their heads (except, perhaps, Izzy), wondering just exactly what your point is in all this. I feel a little silly reminding you that "be fruitful and multipy" come from Gen 1:28. amazingly weird. Jd -Original Message-From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sun, 5 Jun 2005 13:35:16 -0700 (PDT)Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD says "be fruitful and multiply" is something you disagree with? When God destroyed every living soul on the Face of the Earth except for the 8 that got in the Ark, was he disagreeing with: "be fruitful and multiply"?[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: "be fruitful and multiply" is something you disagree with? Absolutely nothing humanistic about it. Try something else or maybe you do not understand what "humanism" actually means when realted to a theological discussion. Jd -Original Message-From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sun, 5 Jun 2005 13:08:15 -0700 (PDT)Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Let's take the first paragraph of your response below: tell me how youcan read my article, with an honest heart, and conclude that it is written with aview of prersenting humanism as opposed to a God-centered faith? I say that such is IMPOSSIBLE. JD-Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 12:49:46 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thanks for asking, JD. To me humanism is the religion worshipping humans. Putting humans and humanistic thinking ahead of God and thinking according to God?s Word. I have no idea how DM would define it. I also don?t appreciate your insinuation that I get my ideas from DM. Regarding your post, it sounded ?nice? and all. But a religion that spends time promoting ?Community? is off-base IMO. The true Church is not about promoting the community of humans, but is all about lifting up Jesus Christ as Lord of Lords and King of Kings. The true community which springs from that as a byproduct is truly wonderful, as you seem to understand. Izzy PS Here is how a Humanist defines Humanism: http://www.jcn.com/humanism.html. (Is it NOT Christianity.) From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 10:18 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Well, it most certainly is not humanism, Linda. Or maybe I should ask what you think humanism is before going any further. David M accused me of the same thing -- perhaps this is where you got the idea. He too, left off giving me a definition. What was written below is a first draft attempt at continuing the task of understanding, on my part. It could not be more God centered -- so how is it humanism. What is you defintion? Jd -Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 09:47:48 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each other?s fellowship. It?s a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the
Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things < /SPAN>-- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropriate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ] His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature? is at the centre of our very being. It is such because and only because we have been created in that image and for that purpose. Community is not only the image of creative endeavor, it is the very purpose for our existence. Our identity as persons, our true identity is manifest in freedom (the perfect law of liberty), in presence (ye who are spiritual help those who are weak; pour yourselves out for the hunger, give yourselves to the afflicted and see your light shine as the noonday sun), in love (the whole law is fulfilled in this, love God and love your neighbor as you love yourself), and in communion (the fellowship of the saints and the indwelling of God, Himself, in our lives). The grand truth of the Christian faith is our participation in His personal existence as opposed to His nature ?. For it God at work in us to will and accomplish. If we understand that intrinsic to His existence is this thing we call community, we, then, understand just how important it is to be a beneficial part of the larger community. John says it this wise: No one has seen God at anytime but if we love one another, God abides in us and His love is perfected in us ???. He has given us His Spirit. Perhaps this is where the "kingdom" comes into play. If we understand that the kingdom of God is the sovereign rule and authority of God, then Christ?s words ?the kingdom is within,? and ?my kingdom is not of this world? can have real and precise meaning. If ?kingdom? in the New Covenant age is the reality and rule of God, Himself, on any level given vision, whether ?thy kingdom come,? ?you are near to the kingdom, ? ?my father has granted me kingdom [not ?a? kingdom], the kingdom is not eating and drinking,? ?heirs of the kingdom of promise,? then, perhaps we are on our way to understanding ?kingdom rule.? Kingdom is tied irrevocably to the communion of God in man;that is what I have come to believe. When we speak of sovereign rule and authority, we do the idea great injustice if we separate that rule fromits inward throne --- the heart and soul of man. Kingdom rule, at whatever level, always includes His ?subjects? That is the illusion -- kingdom = a king and His people. And that is His kingdom. His influence in the people of God.< SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> Paul says it this way: The kingdom of God is not eating and drinking but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. Reject the notion of community and you cannot understand the Godhead, the fellowship of the saints, the purpose of creation, the nature of God, the effect of the cross, the vitality and importance of the church, the indwelling spirit and kingdom rule. The heuristic circumstance that best pictures all these things is the consideration of community as the image of God. All of the above
Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN-- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropriate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ] His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature? is at the centre of our very being. It is such because and only because we have been created in that image and for that purpose. Community is not only the image of creative endeavor, it is the very purpose for our existence. Our identity as persons, our true identity is manifest in freedom (the perfect law of liberty), in presence (ye who are spiritual help those who are weak; pour yourselves out for the hunger, give yourselves to the afflicted and see your light shine as the noonday sun), in love (the whole law is fulfilled in this, love God and love your neighbor as you love yourself), and in communion (the fellowship of the saints and the indwelling of God, Himself, in our lives). The grand truth of the Christian faith is our participation in His personal existence as opposed to His nature ?. For it God at work in us to will and accomplish. If we understand that intrinsic to His existence is this thing we call community, we, then, understand just how important it is to be a beneficial part of the larger community. John says it this wise: No one has seen God at anytime but if we love one another, God abides in us and His love is perfected in us ???. He has given us His Spirit. Perhaps this is where the "kingdom" comes into play. If we understand that the kingdom of God is the sovereign rule and authority of God, then Christ?s words ?the kingdom is within,? and ?my kingdom is not of this world? can have real and precise meaning. If ?kingdom? in the New Covenant age is the reality and rule of God, Himself, on any level given vision, whether ?thy kingdom come,? ?you are near to the kingdom, ? ?my father has granted me kingdom [not ?a? kingdom], the kingdom is not eating and drinking,? ?heirs of the kingdom of promise,? then, perhaps we are on our way to understanding ?kingdom rule.? Kingdom is tied irrevocably to the communion of God in man;that is what I have come to believe. When we speak of sovereign rule and authority, we do the idea great injustice if we separate that rule fromits inward throne --- the heart and soul of man. Kingdom rule, at whatever level, always includes His ?subjects? That is the illusion -- kingdom = a king and His people. And that is His kingdom. His influence in the people of God. SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes" Paul says it this way: The kingdom of God is not eating and drinking but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. Reject the notion of community and you cannot understand the Godhead, the fellowship of the saints, the purpose of creation, the nature of God, the effect of the cross, the vitality and importance of the church, the indwelling spirit and kingdom rule. The heuristic circumstance that best pictures all these things is
Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
Pretty much rigth on, Florida Man. And I do not know what happened when I sent this thing -- all the queston marks. ... most of them occur in the place of my ( " ") . I wrote this in Word and copied it over. I think I have done this before without this kind of problem -- sorry folks. Jd-Original Message-From: Terry Clifton [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 04 Jun 2005 07:26:06 -0500Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons.. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN-- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropriate the revealed word of the d ay [?ye shall not surely die ] His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature? is at the centre of our very being. It is such because and only because we have been created in that image and for that purpose. Community is not only the image of creative endeavor, it is the very purpose for our existence. Our identity as persons, our true identity is manifest in freedom (the perfect law of liberty), in presence (ye who are spiritual help tho se who are weak; pour yourselves out for the hunger, give yourselves to the afflicted and see your light shine as the noonday sun), in love (the whole law is fulfilled in this, love God and love your neighbor as you love yourself), and in communion (the fellowship of the saints and the indwelling of God, Himself, in our lives). The grand truth of the Christian faith is our participation in His personal existence as opposed to His nature ?. For it God at work in us to will and accomplish. If we understand that intrinsic to His existence is this thing we call community, we, then, understand just how important it is to be a beneficial part of the larger community. John says it this wise: No one has seen God at anytime but if we love one another, God abides in us and His love is perfected in us ???. He has given us His Spirit. Perhaps this is where the "kingdom" comes into play. If we understand that the kingdom of God is the sovereign rule and authority of God, then Christ?s words ?the kingdom is within,? and ?my kingdom is not of this world? can have real and precise meaning. If ?kingdom? in the New Covenant age is the reality and rule of God, Himself, on any level given vision, whether ?thy kingdom come,? ?you are near to the kingdom, ? ?my father has granted me kingdom [not ?a? kingdom], the kingdom is not eating and drinking,? ?heirs of the kingdom of promise,? then, p erhaps we are on our way to understanding ?kingdom rule.? Kingdom is tied irrevocably to the communion of God in man;that is what I have come to believe. When we speak of sovereign rule and authority, we do the idea great injustice if we separate that rule fromits inward throne --- the heart and soul of man. Kingdom rule, at whatever level, always includes His ?subjects? That is the illusion -- kingdom = a king and His people. And that is His kingdom. His influence in the people of God. SPAN style=&quo
RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each others fellowship. Its a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN -- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropriate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ] His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature? is at the centre of our very being. It is such because and only because we have been created in that image and for that purpose. Community is not only the image of creative endeavor, it is the very purpose for our existence. Our identity as persons, our true identity is manifest in freedom (the perfect law of liberty), in presence (ye who are spiritual help those who are weak; pour yourselves out for the hunger, give yourselves to the afflicted and see your light shine as the noonday sun), in love (the whole law is fulfilled in this, love God and love your neighbor as you love yourself), and in communion (the fellowship of the saints and the indwelling of God, Himself, in our lives). The grand truth of the Christian faith is our participation in His personal existence as opposed to His nature ?. For it God at work in us to will and accomplish. If we understand that intrinsic to His existence is this thing we call community, we, then, understand just how important it is to be a beneficial part of the larger community. John says it this wise: No one has seen God at anytime but if we love one another, God abides in us and His love is perfected in us ???. He has given us His Spirit. Perhaps this is where the kingdom comes into play. If we understand that the kingdom of God is the sovereign rule and authority of God, then Christ?s words ?the kingdom is within,? and ?my kingdom is not of this world? can have real and precise meaning. If ?kingdom? in the New Covenant age is the reality and rule of God, Himself, on any level given vision, whether ?thy kingdom come,? ?you are near to the kingdom, ? ?my father has granted me kingdom [not ?a? kingdom], the kingdom is not eating and drinking,? ?heirs of the kingdom of promise,? then, perhaps we are on our way to understanding ?kingdom rule.? Kingdom is tied irrevocably to the communion of God in man; that is what I have come to believe. When we speak of sovereign rule and authority, we do the idea great injustice if we separate that rule from its inward throne --- the heart and soul of man. Kingdom rule, at whatever level, always includes His ?subjects? That is the illusion -- kingdom = a king and His people. And that is His kingdom. His influence in the people of God. SPAN style=mso-spacerun
Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
A little like you leaving your neighborhood to reach your neighborhood? A I get it. - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: June 04, 2005 10:47 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each others fellowship. Its a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN -- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropriate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ] His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature? is at the centre of our very being. It is such because and only because we have been created in that image and for that purpose. Community is not only the image of creative endeavor, it is the very purpose for our existence. Our identity as persons, our true identity is manifest in freedom (the perfect law of liberty), in presence (ye who are spiritual help those who are weak; pour yourselves out for the hunger, give yourselves to the afflicted and see your light shine as the noonday sun), in love (the whole law is fulfilled in this, love God and love your neighbor as you love yourself), and in communion (the fellowship of the saints and the indwelling of God, Himself, in our lives). The grand truth of the Christian faith is our participation in His personal existence as opposed to His nature ?. For it God at work in us to will and accomplish. If we understand that intrinsic to His existence is this thing we call community, we, then, understand just how important it is to be a beneficial part of the larger community. John says it this wise: No one has seen God at anytime but if we love one another, God abides in us and His love is perfected in us ???. He has given us His Spirit. Perhaps this is where the "kingdom" comes into play. If we understand that the kingdom of God is the sovereign rule and authority of God, then Christ?s words ?the kingdom is within,? and ?my kingdom is not of this world? can have real and precise meaning. If ?kingdom? in the New Covenant age is the reality and rule of God, Himself, on any level given vision, whether ?thy kingdom come,? ?you are near to the kingdom, ? ?my father has granted me kingdom [not ?a? kingdom], the kingdom is not eating and drinking,? ?heirs of the kingdom of promise,? then, perhaps we are
RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
Ask my neighbors. Dont ask the sodomite whore-church. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 8:57 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God A little like you leaving your neighborhood to reach your neighborhood? A I get it. - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: June 04, 2005 10:47 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each others fellowship. Its a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN -- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropriate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ] His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature? is at the centre of our very being. It is such because and only because we have been created in that image and for that purpose. Community is not only the image of creative endeavor, it is the very purpose for our existence. Our identity as persons, our true identity is manifest in freedom (the perfect law of liberty), in presence (ye who are spiritual help those who are weak; pour yourselves out for the hunger, give yourselves to the afflicted and see your light shine as the noonday sun), in love (the whole law is fulfilled in this, love God and love your neighbor as you love yourself), and in communion (the fellowship of the saints and the indwelling of God, Himself, in our lives). The grand truth of the Christian faith is our participation in His personal existence as opposed to His nature ?. For it God at work in us to will and accomplish. If we understand that intrinsic to His existence is this thing we call community, we, then, understand just how important it is to be a beneficial part of the larger community. John says it this wise: No one has seen God at anytime but if we love one another, God abides in us and His love is perfected in us ???. He has given us His Spirit. Perhaps this is where the kingdom comes into play. If we understand that the kingdom of God is the sovereign rule and authority of God, then Christ?s words ?the kingdom is within,? and ?my kingdom is not of this world? can have real and precise meaning. If ?kingdom? in the New Covenant age is the reality and rule of God, Himself, on any level given vision, whether ?thy kingdom come,? ?you are near to the kingdom, ? ?my father has granted me kingdom [not ?a? kingdom], the kingdom is not eating and drinking
Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
Well, it most certainly is not humanism, Linda. Or maybe I should ask what you think humanism is before going any further. David M accused me of the same thing -- perhaps this is where you got the idea. He too, left off giving me a definition. What was written below is a first draft attempt at continuing the task of understanding, on my part. It could not be more God centered -- so how is it humanism. What is you defintion? Jd-Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 09:47:48 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each other?s fellowship. It?s a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN -- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropriate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ] sp; His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature? is at the centre of our very being. It is such because and only because we have been created in that image and for that purpose. Community is not only the image of creative endeavor, it is the very purpose for our existence. Our identity as persons, our true identity is manifest in freedom (the perfect law of liberty), in presence (ye who are spiritual help those who are weak; pour yourselves out for the hunger, give yourselves to the afflicted and see your light shine as the noonday sun), in love (the whole law is fulfilled in this, love God and love your neighbor as you love yourself), and in communion (the fellowship of the saints and the indwelling of God, Himself, in our lives). The grand truth of the Christian faith is our participation in His personal existence as opposed to His nature ?. For it God at work in us to will and accomplish. If we understand that intrinsic to His existence is this thing we call community, we, then, understand just how important it is to be a beneficial part of the larger community. John says it this wise: sp; No one has seen God at anytime but if we love one another, God abides in us and His love is perfected in us ???. He has given us His Spirit. Perhaps this is where the "kingdom" comes into play. If we understand that the kingdom of God is the sovereign rule and authority of God, then Christ?s words ?the kingdom is within,? and ?my kingdom is not of this world? can have real and precise meaning. If ?kingdom? in the New Covenant age is the reality and rule of God, Himself, on any level given vision, wh ether ?thy kingdom come,? ?you are near to the kingdom, ? ?my father has granted me kingdom [not ?a? kingdom], the kingdom is not eating an
RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
Thanks for asking, JD. To me humanism is the religion worshipping humans. Putting humans and humanistic thinking ahead of God and thinking according to Gods Word. I have no idea how DM would define it. I also dont appreciate your insinuation that I get my ideas from DM. Regarding your post, it sounded nice and all. But a religion that spends time promoting Community is off-base IMO. The true Church is not about promoting the community of humans, but is all about lifting up Jesus Christ as Lord of Lords and King of Kings. The true community which springs from that as a byproduct is truly wonderful, as you seem to understand. Izzy PS Here is how a Humanist defines Humanism: http://www.jcn.com/humanism.html. (Is it NOT Christianity.) From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 10:18 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Well, it most certainly is not humanism, Linda. Or maybe I should ask what you think humanism is before going any further. David M accused me of the same thing -- perhaps this is where you got the idea. He too, left off giving me a definition. What was written below is a first draft attempt at continuing the task of understanding, on my part. It could not be more God centered -- so how is it humanism. What is you defintion? Jd -Original Message- From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 09:47:48 -0500 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each other?s fellowship. It?s a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN -- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropriate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ]nb sp; His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature? is at the centre of our very being. It is such because and only because we have been created in that image and for that purpose. Community is not only the image of creative endeavor, it is the very purpose for our existence. Our identity as persons, our true identity is manifest in freedom (the perfect law of liberty), in presence (ye who are spiritual help those who are weak; pour yourselves out for the hunger, give yourselves to the afflicted and see your light shine as the noonday sun), in love (the whole law is fulfilled in this, love God and love your neighbor as you love yourself
Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
I say Amen and well put to what Izzy writes here and would also like to point out that the "definition of Kingdom" is much more than what it is not - which ismeat and drink. Jesus Himself said that when He cast out Satan with the finger of God - then you may know that the Kingdom of God is come upon you. It is "spiritual authority" - All of this community business reminds me of Hillary Clinton and her "it takes a village to raise a child" mindset. Also the way the trinity is conceptualized is bothers me a whole lot but I am not sure why; the Lord will reveal it to me. jt On Sat, 4 Jun 2005 12:49:46 -0500 "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Thanks for asking, JD. To me humanism is the religion worshipping humans. Putting humans and humanistic thinking ahead of God and thinking according to Gods Word. I have no idea how DM would define it. I also dont appreciate your insinuation that I get my ideas from DM. Regarding your post, it sounded nice and all. But a religion that spends time promoting Community is off-base IMO. The true Church is not about promoting the community of humans, but is all about lifting up Jesus Christ as Lord of Lords and King of Kings. The true community which springs from that as a byproduct is truly wonderful, as you seem to understand. Izzy PS Here is how a Humanist defines Humanism: http://www.jcn.com/humanism.html. (Is it NOT Christianity.) From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Well, it most certainly is not humanism, Linda. Or maybe I should ask what you think humanism is before going any further. David M accused me of the same thing -- perhaps this is where you got the idea. He too, left off giving me a definition. What was written below is a first draft attempt at continuing the task of understanding, on my part. It could not be more God centered -- so how is it humanism. What is you defintion? Jd -Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 09:47:48 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each other?s fellowship. It?s a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN -- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropriate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ]nb sp; His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confuse
Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God
Let's take the first paragraph of your response below: tell me how youcan read my article, with an honest heart, and conclude that it is written with aview of prersenting humanism as opposed to a God-centered faith? I say that such is IMPOSSIBLE. JD-Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 12:49:46 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thanks for asking, JD. To me humanism is the religion worshipping humans. Putting humans and humanistic thinking ahead of God and thinking according to God?s Word. I have no idea how DM would define it. I also don?t appreciate your insinuation that I get my ideas from DM. Regarding your post, it sounded ?nice? and all. But a religion that spends time promoting ?Community? is off-base IMO. The true Church is not about promoting the community of humans, but is all about lifting up Jesus Christ as Lord of Lords and King of Kings. The true community which springs from that as a byproduct is truly wonderful, as you seem to understand. Izzy PS Here is how a Humanist defines Humanism: http://www.jcn.com/humanism.html. (Is it NOT Christianity.) From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 10:18 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Well, it most certainly is not humanism, Linda. Or maybe I should ask what you think humanism is before going any further. David M accused me of the same thing -- perhaps this is where you got the idea. He too, left off giving me a definition. What was written below is a first draft attempt at continuing the task of understanding, on my part. It could not be more God centered -- so how is it humanism. What is you defintion? Jd -Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 09:47:48 -0500Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God JD, all this talk of community above everything else just comes across to me as humanism. Lift us Jesus and all men will be drawn unto Him, and coincidentally to each other?s fellowship. It?s a priority thing. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:03 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] community and the Kingdom of God Thinking Out Loud (again). Some of these thoughts and wording comes from From Cells to Souls -- a section in that book written by Alan Torrance. The following is a combination of AT?s thinking and my understanding of the importance of his presentations. In search of a truly heuristic consequence, many have involved themselves in the recovery of the gospel story as realized in the triune God and the Sonship of Christ. ?Christians acknowledge that the complexity of the world is irreducible to anything other than the simplest explanation of all --- the God who has created persons in his image for personal communion with himself, with each other and, indeed, with all the other sentient beings which contribute o to the richness of the world we know. ? (p222). And there you have it -- ?the simplest explanation of all,? that mankind has been created in His very image. If there is another explanation for that image, certainly it must in clude the idea of ?community.? God loves the Son, the Son loves the Father and the Holy Spirit is the _expression_ of each in this world and in the lives of those who are a part of His creation after The Reconciliation (Col 1:17ff). That being true, the personal behavior of man is incomplete until expressed in the company of others (p210). Man was created for the expressed purpose of the expansion of community (ye shall be fruitful and multiply) ?.. God?s covenant with Abraham had everything to do with the blessing of an increasing community of persons. Israel was God manifest in national function. His Christ was all about the reconciliation of all things /SPAN -- a tearing down of the barriers erected in the garden, allowing the bridging of the divide created by man?s decision to chart his own course, to go his own way, to misappropr iate the revealed word of the day [?ye shall not surely die ]nb sp; His church is His bride, bearing the offspring of all that reveals His power and presence -- a community of believers that live to reveal God to a lost and confused world. He is the Father, we are his adoptive children. Community is written on every page and thought of God?s dealings with man. ?The relational dimens ion of human nature? is at the centre of our very being. It is such because and only because we have been created in that image and for that purpose. Community is not only the image of creative endeavor, it is the very purpose for our existence. Our identity as persons, our true identity is manifest in freedom
