Re: [Tutor] I think I've broken my Python

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Mon, Nov 12, 2018 at 3:31 PM Mats Wichmann  wrote:
>
> Reconstruct the virtualenv you want maybe? Their whole concept is that
> they're cheap and easy and can just be thrown away.  Of course, you then
> have to remember what you did to create it in order to make a new one...

It's been 3 years, I'm clueless as to how I created it. Also I'm a
noob when it comes to Linux which makes this even more confusing for
me. The 3 years I've been absent from Programming I went back to
Windows.

> Since you're on a Linux platform, use "which" to see how the names you
> are typing are resolving
>
> which python
> which python3

The "command" gives this output:

(website) matthew@linux-oq68:~/Documents/mywork/web/website/blogsite>
which python
/usr/bin/python
(website) matthew@linux-oq68:~/Documents/mywork/web/website/blogsite>
which python3
/usr/bin/python3

> Usually if the virtualenv has been broken by external factors, it won't
> even activate. Are you sure you remembered to try to activate it?
>
Yep, I double checked to make sure I remembered to try to activate it.
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[Tutor] I think I've broken my Python

[Matthew Ngaha]

I haven't coded in about 3 years and I used to use Python3.4 on
openSUSE13.1. I had a virtual environment with this Python for a
development Django website. Before I stopped coding, I upgraded to
Python3.5, but everything still worked if I remember correctly. But
now I'm back to coding I tried to load up my Django website but I get
the error:
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "manage.py", line 8, in 
from django.core.management import execute_from_command_line
ImportError: No module named django.core.management

What happens is Django's manage.py can't be found so the line:
"from django.core.management import execute_from_command_line"
throws the error. In the virtual environment when I type python in the
command line, it opens Python2.7 and when I type Python3, it opens
Python3.5. So it seems my Python3.4 is lost. I thought the virtual
environment only loaded up the Python version it was installed for, in
my case Python3.4 when I type python or python3 in the command line,
had I known this wasn't the case I would have never upgraded Python.
Is there anything I can do?
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Re: [Tutor] When do you know you're ready to start applying for jobs?

[Matthew Ngaha]

Thank you all for replying, I really appreciate it. It's all I've been
thinking about lately and your responses have really cleared up a lot
of things for me.

On Tue, Dec 12, 2017 at 11:37 PM, Alan Gauld via Tutor  wrote:
>
> But there are things you can learn now that won't ever change.
> And that includes the principles of design - an aspect all too
> often ignored by people learning "programming" But you can't
> build a significant system of any kind without an underlying
> design. And you can't build big systems without understanding architecture.
>

Thanks Alan you gave a really profound reply and I've been digesting
it slowly but surely. Can you give me any tips on how I can improve on
this (where I quoted you). And are there any books or tutorials you
can recommend for me.

> Hopefully you see where I'm going - you never stop learning
> and you can waste a lot of time becoming an expert in things
> that will be of no use in a few years, or you can focus on
> principles that are the very basis of system design and
> construction.
>

Yes I see where you're going. I just need a push in the right
direction on where I can learn about the principles of system design.
Also why isn't this taught in beginner tutorials, or is it an advanced
concept?

Thanks again for your response. I remember years ago your website was
one of the 1st tutorials I read on python. Recently I needed a
refresher on the os module and I recalled you covered it extensively,
but sadly I found it's no longer on your site. It says under
construction. Any ideas of when that will be finished?

Thanks again.
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[Tutor] When do you know you're ready to start applying for jobs?

[Matthew Ngaha]

Hi all. I took 2-3 years off in 2012 to teach myself programming. I
learnt basic Javascript & Python with some Django. I don't have a
Computer Science (CS) degree so I never applied for a job because I
always thought I still had lots to learn and most jobs say a CS degree
is required. In 2015 I had to stop my learning to find a real minimum
wage job as I needed to support myself. I will never know now if I
would have got a python job had I applied. It's now december 2017, so
I haven't touched programming in 2 years. I've forgotten most of what
I learnt now. :( I'm now financially secure to give programming
another go but I don't know how I feel about relearning everything I
forgot. Is it's worth it? What are your thoughts?

Can I get a junior programming job without a CS degree?
When do you know you're ready to start applying for jobs? How can a
self learner ever know?
should I have applied for some jobs back in 2015 when I was still studying?
What are your opinions on my situation? Is learning Python all over
again worth it without a CS degree? would I be wasting my time?
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Re: [Tutor] Python programming for the absolute beginner

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Fri, Sep 29, 2017 at 7:20 PM, Alan Gauld via Tutor  wrote:

> If you want to follow the book use the version the book
> uses - probably 2.6 or something close?
>
I think the book uses either Python 3.0 or 3.1. It's been a while
since I read it but it doesn't use Python 2. The 2nd edition written
in 2010 used Python 3 but the 1st edition used Python 2.
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Re: [Tutor] GUI development with Python 3.4.1

[Matthew Ngaha]

PyQt or PySide offers QtDesigner. Which is a drag and drop builder.
They are both quite complex GUI toolkits so you will need some basic
knowledge on them first, but I Imagine there are good guides on using
QtDesigner if it's your last option.

On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 2:14 PM, Juan Christian
juan0christ...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 10:12 AM, Joel Goldstick joel.goldst...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 I've not used it but Tkinter seems to be well used.

 I'm not sure what a C#/Java-ish thing is, but python isn't that.


 C#/Java-ish in terms of GUI Builder, drag and drop, like Glade and gui2py.

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[Tutor] python ssl error

[Matthew Ngaha]

Hi this might not be the correct place to ask this. I am using the
google api and as soon as I use the build function:

service = build('books', 'v1', developerKey=api_key)

I get an SSL error. I'm not sure what build() does but it triggers an
SSL error. Here's the error message:

 ssl.SSLError: [Errno 185090050] _ssl.c:357: error:0B084002:x509
certificate routines:X509_load_cert_crl_file:system lib

I googled this error but I don't understand the solution. It seems
specific to httplib2:

   https://github.com/kennethreitz/requests/issues/557


Here is the full trace back. Any ideas?

http://bpaste.net/show/isukkSeo08a0rx23ziBD/
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Re: [Tutor] python ssl error

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Sun, Aug 17, 2014 at 11:26 PM, Danny Yoo d...@hashcollision.org wrote:

 I would recommend checking whether the 'cacerts.txt' file in that
 subdirectory is user-readable or not.  Make sure it's readable.  If it
 isn't, chmod it and try again: that will probably fix it.


Thanks ever so much for your efforts! I'm glad to say your suggestion
above fixed the problem.
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Re: [Tutor] Python Socket Error: Connection refused

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 12:55 PM, Dave Angel da...@davea.name wrote:

 You will want to configure your DOS Box to make it easier to cut
  and paste.

How is this done? I'm not on windows atm to test it.
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Re: [Tutor] python sockets

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 5:28 PM, Jon Engle jon.en...@gmail.com wrote:

 startingPort=input(\nPlease enter starting port: )
 startingPort=int(startingPort)

 def setup(PORT):
  PORT = startingPort#arbitrary port not currently in use

There's a conflict with this PORT variable.
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[Tutor] Question about scraping

[Matthew Ngaha]

Hey all. I've been meaning to get into web scraping and was pointed to
the directions of lxml (library) and scrapy (framework). Can I ask in
terms of web scraping, what's the difference between a library and a
framework? Surely everyone should use a framework but I get the idea
more people use the available libraries like lxml over scrapy. Any
advantages or disadvantages for each? And which do you use out of the
2?

I also have another question due to reading this: [Tutor] HTML
Parsing . It seems some experienced coders don't find scraping as
useful since web sites offer apis for their data. Is the idea/concept
here the same as scraping? And is there any use of scraping anymore
when sites are now offering their data?
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Re: [Tutor] Question about scraping

[Matthew Ngaha]

Thanks for the response Alan. I forgot to reply to tutor on my 2nd
comment. Just incase someone might want to see it, here it is:

Okay I think learning how to scrap (library or framework) is not
worth the trouble. Especially if some people consider it illegal.
Thanks for the input.
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Re: [Tutor] Recommendation For A Complete Noob

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Hi,

 I'm completely new to programming in general and everything I have read so 
 far has pointed me to Python. I was just hoping to get some input as to where 
 I might start.


Start with Python programming for the absolute beginner Great
author. The book gives you lots of exercises at the end of each
chapter to make sure you understood everything up to that point.
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[Tutor] Windows Install Issue

[Matthew Ngaha]

Hi I'm trying to install pyqt5.2 for Windows Vista (Python3.3). 1st i
need to install sip but i run into this issue.

after ./configure, a MAKEFILE is created. I'm supposed to do 'make'
and 'make install', but i get this cmd error:

C:\pathmake
'make' is not recognized as an internal or external command,
operable program or batch file.

I'm not really sure what i should do?
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Re: [Tutor] Windows Install Issue

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Sat, Jan 11, 2014 at 2:55 PM, Mark Lawrence breamore...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:

 On Windows finding a binary installer is always the first thing to do,
 makefiles indeed.  Go here
 http://www.riverbankcomputing.co.uk/software/pyqt/download5, find the
 section Binary Packages and this gives Windows 32 and 64 bit installers.

sorry i forgot to explain. i cant get the binary:
http://www.riverbankcomputing.co.uk/software/pyqt/download5

Unfortunately it is not possible to use both the PyQt4 and PyQt5
installers at the same time. If you wish to have both PyQt4 and PyQt5
installed at the same time you will need to build them yourself from
the source packages.

after seeing this i thought it was better not to try it and maybe
currupt my files
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Re: [Tutor] Windows Install Issue

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Sun, Jan 12, 2014 at 1:13 AM, eryksun eryk...@gmail.com wrote:

 The pre-built versions of PyQt4 and PyQt5 don't use the same version
 of SIP. If you don't have a build system (e.g. Visual Studio 2010, the
 Windows 7 SDK, or MinGW), then using a virtual environment should work
 around the problem.

 http://docs.python.org/3/library/venv.html

 Install PyQt4, and then copy the following files and directories to a
 separate environment:

Problem solved. Thanks so much:)
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[Tutor] ubuntu hassles.

[Matthew Ngaha]

Hi i wrote about a week ago about the problems i had with importing
sqlite3 on python 3.3 on ubuntu 12.04. Due to this ive tried to revert
back to python 3.2 which is the default installation along wit 2.7.
I've run into 2 problems.

1) I'm new to ubuntu and someone helped me install python3.3 from
source. I've tried 'make uninstall' from the dir containing the source
package but it seems there is no way to get this version off my
computer.

2) I really need to use virtualenv for python3.2. The problem is
python3.3 seems to be the default and overrides every virtualenv thing
i try doing. whether it is pyvenv or virtualenv, the 3.3 version takes
priority. It is located in /usr/local/bin  ... I have no idea where my
3.2 virtualenv is located although i know i definately installed it
with :
  sudo apt-get install python-virtualenv

if i can achieve 1) or 2) im sure the rest would be straightforward.
any ideas? I know this isn't really a python issue but it's a last
resort as the ubuntu guys are unsure of how to solve this. If i can't
resolve it, not to worry, i'll just upgrade my ubuntu to a more recent
version.

Thanks
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Re: [Tutor] ubuntu hassles.

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 12:40 AM, eryksun eryk...@gmail.com wrote:


 virtualenv allows you to specify the target Python:

 virtualenv --python=/usr/bin/python3.3 myenv

 Refer to `man virtualenv` for more options.

 Or use synaptic if you prefer a GUI interface.


 Ubuntu has a Python 3.3 package. Installation should be simple:

 $ sudo apt-get update
 $ sudo apt-get install python3.3

 If you're building from source, or need to uninstall after a previous
 `make install`, use checkinstall to build a package.


I'm currently studying/coding on windows but thanks so so much for
this detailed response. I will try again tomorrow, but im now very
confident! thanks again:)
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Re: [Tutor] python problems on android

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Sat, Jan 4, 2014 at 11:24 AM,  blech...@fireflyuk.net wrote:

 I havent included the script as it seems to be the use ' input'  on my phone
 that now wont work.


Even if the error is with 'input', it is still an odd error and no one
will be able to debug your program or have a clue what's going wrong
if you don't provide us any code. It will save a lot of time also.
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Re: [Tutor] sqlite3 import problem

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Fri, Jan 3, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Alan Gauld alan.ga...@btinternet.com wrote:
 On 03/01/14 02:17, Matthew Ngaha wrote:

 im having problems importing sqlite3 on ubuntu python3.

File /usr/local/lib/python3.3/sqlite3/__init__.py, line 23, in
 module
  from sqlite3.dbapi2 import *
File /usr/local/lib/python3.3/sqlite3/dbapi2.py, line 26, in module
  from _sqlite3 import *
 ImportError: No module named '_sqlite3'


 As a matter of interest why do you have the underscore in front of sqlite3?
 Is that deliberate?

 I normally import it with just

 import sqlite3
 or
 from sqlite3 import ...

Hi Alan. The code in the traceback is being done internally. my code
has import sqlite3. Python finds it in this directory:

/usr/local/lib/python3.3/sqlite3/

and runs the code from the traceback. I have no idea why it's using _sqlite3:(

On Fri, Jan 3, 2014 at 6:12 AM, Kushal Kumaran
kushal.kumaran+pyt...@gmail.com wrote:
 The /usr/local heirarchy is not used by official debian/ubuntu packages,
 so other people will not have the same contents in there as you.  You
 must have a locally built python in /usr/local.  Check the build logs if
 it has complained about not being able to build the sqlite3 module.  If
 so, you can install all build dependencies for the offical python3
 package by running this command:

 # apt-get build-dep python3

 And then rebuilding your local python3 installation.


On Fri, Jan 3, 2014 at 3:00 AM, Danny Yoo d...@hashcollision.org wrote:
 This might be an Ubuntu bug or deficiency.

Hi, Danny  Kushal.
Originally i only had python 2.7 and 3.2 as default for Ubuntu. Kushal
you're right my 3.2 has a different path to sqlite3 than

/usr/local/lib/python3.3/sqlite3/

Infact i haven't been able to find its location. 3.2 imports sqlite3
with no errors. I'm currently not on ubuntu to try your instruction.
Will the build logs be inside the python3.3 directory? I'm still new
to linux so sorry for newbie questions. it took me a very long time to
get it right when building python3.3. When you say rebuild, is there a
command for doing that or do you mean simply uninstall python then
build it again?

On Fri, Jan 3, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Alan Gauld alan.ga...@btinternet.com wrote:
 On 03/01/14 02:17, Matthew Ngaha wrote:

 im having problems importing sqlite3 on ubuntu python3.

File /usr/local/lib/python3.3/sqlite3/__init__.py, line 23, in
 module
  from sqlite3.dbapi2 import *
File /usr/local/lib/python3.3/sqlite3/dbapi2.py, line 26, in module
  from _sqlite3 import *
 ImportError: No module named '_sqlite3'


 As a matter of interest why do you have the underscore in front of sqlite3?
 Is that deliberate?

 I normally import it with just

 import sqlite3
 or
 from sqlite3 import ...



 --
 Alan G
 Author of the Learn to Program web site
 http://www.alan-g.me.uk/
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/alangauldphotos

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[Tutor] sqlite3 import problem

[Matthew Ngaha]

im having problems importing sqlite3 on ubuntu python3.

  File /usr/local/lib/python3.3/sqlite3/__init__.py, line 23, in module
from sqlite3.dbapi2 import *
  File /usr/local/lib/python3.3/sqlite3/dbapi2.py, line 26, in module
from _sqlite3 import *
ImportError: No module named '_sqlite3'

i have that path and file (dbapi2.py). the problem is an import
statement for _sqlite3. i don't see this file but shouldn't python3.3
be able to import sqlite without errors? any suggestions? does anyone
have _sqlite3.py in their   /usr/local/lib/python3.3/sqlite3/
directory?
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[Tutor] certain packages won't install

[Matthew Ngaha]

hey i've tried installing a few packages with pip that failed. i'm on
windows and python3.3. I have tried 'pip install pycurl' and 'pip
install flup' which is something i need for django. I tried flup today
and what bothers me is even though it failed, it's making some temp
folders in places i never look at.

here's the error:

  File appdata\local\temp\pip-build-happylions\flup\setup.py
, line 2, in module

from ez_setup import use_setuptools

  File .\ez_setup.py, line 98

except pkg_resources.VersionConflict, e:

^

SyntaxError: invalid syntax

pycurl is in the same location if you replace \flup\ with \pycurl\ in
that path above. It has a full directory with even a Makefile in it,
yet the pip install failed. I'm a bit confused that these directories
have been in these hard to find places and i haven't known. But it
also makes me question if i did something wrong? directories usually
won't be created if the install fails. Is there another way to install
these packages? especially flup?
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Re: [Tutor] certain packages won't install

[Matthew Ngaha]

oh i think it might be the 2nd case of having the wrong version of
pip. I do have pip for Python 2 also but both are not on my path so
cmd doesn't recognise 'pip' unless used in their python folders. I'll
try reinstalling pip. i got it via easy_install so i may have the
wrong one there also:(

On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 11:21 PM, Steven D'Aprano st...@pearwood.info wrote:
 On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 11:10:13PM +, Matthew Ngaha wrote:
 hey i've tried installing a few packages with pip that failed. i'm on
 windows and python3.3.

 You're trying to use Python 3.3, but somehow your version of pip is
 written for Python 2, which is why you're getting syntax errors.

 This could happen if you have two versions of pip installed, and Windows
 is getting confused about which version goes with which version of
 Python. Or possibly you only have one version of pip, but the wrong one.
 I don't know.

 You might try reinstalling pip, making sure you get a Python 3
 compatible version.



 --
 Steven
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[Tutor] more html/css question than python

[Matthew Ngaha]

hey guys ive got the very basics of django down. i was able to design
a very basic dynamite site and interacted with django. It's basic 
limited in every way, with the little it does, and the plain ugly
design. This won't be good enough to put up anywhere but on localhost.

My question is, How do you guys or designers in general go about
creating a site. do you guys find designing a site from scratch with
html/css fun... or is it so tedious that you just go with an existing
template? I was told people don't design sites with manual  html/css
anymore as they use many tools that can generate web pages without
having to type all that code. i'm wondering if its worth learning
html5/css3 beyond a basic level in conjunction with django, or are
there easier better options.
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Re: [Tutor] more html/css question than python

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Sat, Dec 21, 2013 at 5:56 PM, Alan Gauld alan.ga...@btinternet.com wrote:

 You really need to know html and css if you are building
 modern web UIs. That's because most good modern web sites
 use a lot of client side(browser) scripting, usually using
 JQuery. JQuery requires that you really understand how
 html tags and css styles work. So you may get out of
 creating the bulk of the code but you still need to
 understand the detail of what the tool produces. More
 so today that, say, 10 years ago. Finally, I'd really
 aim for xhtml rather than html since it's easier to
 parse and not too much extra work to produce. (htmltidy
 can convert to xhtml for you if you prefer)

so xhtml even over html5? isn't html5 the new thing these days? I know
basic javascript, so it's definately  better to also learn jquery?
I've always pushed it to the side :(
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Re: [Tutor] Reading CSV files in Pandas

[Matthew Ngaha]

Does pandas do the same thing numpy does? I've never used them and
unsure of what they are about.
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[Tutor] global variables

[Matthew Ngaha]

I'm always told to avoid using them. I read discussions on the python
irc channel about them but honestly i feel there are some times where
i can't avoid using them. Like where i want to keep track of a state
variable in many different functions that may or may not alter its
value and also not wanting any of the functions to return it to the
caller.

My question is how many global variables did your last decent sized
program have? Also please share any insight you have about them. I do
try to avoid them, but is this always possible?
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Re: [Tutor] global variables

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 1:40 PM, Chris Down ch...@chrisdown.name wrote:

 It sounds like you want to use a class.
 Why would you not just use a class if you want to store state?

I don't feel my program needs a class. Also i have been told to stop
using classes by some very experienced Python programmers on irc even
though i don't see why. It's confusing being told different things.
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Re: [Tutor] global variables

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:52 PM, Chris Down ch...@chrisdown.name wrote:
I would doubt that anyone has told you don't ever use classes, because
 that's nonsense; you've probably misread a dissuasion from that path in a
 single instance as applying more broadly than was intended.

I am being totally honest here. I was very confused at the time and i
said i didn't agree because it's what i had put so much effort into
learning. They went on to say at some well known Python talks speakers
have stated why using OOP (especially inheritance, but not excluding
any others) is very bad design and the same thing can always be
achieved without it. To be clear they said every use case OOP is the
worst option. I asked what about GUIs which their design is strongly
based around OOP? and they sad GUIs are badly designed to begin with
so it proves the point about OOP.
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Re: [Tutor] global variables

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 3:04 PM, Alan Gauld alan.ga...@btinternet.com wrote:
 On 22/08/13 13:36, Matthew Ngaha wrote:

 Global variables  in themselves are not the problem.
 It's how they tend to get used that causes problems.

 Globals that are only changed via a set of
 dedicated functions are not topo much of a
 problem - although they should probably be
 bundled as a class (or module)

 Usually that should be in a class. A class represents
 a set of operations using common data. Therefore shared
 state would naturally fit in a class along with the
 operations which depend on/modify that state.

Oh this makes a lot of sense. Sorry about disagreeing with Chris i now
see that perhaps a class is definately the best choice for keeping a
state variable.

 Thats more problematic and usually a sign of a bad design.
 Even if using global variables you should modify them
 explicitly via return values of functions rather than
 as hidden side-effects inside other functions.

 mystate = changestate(mystate, some, other, args)

Yeah i have to agree about the bad design now i think about it. I
didn't see the issues before reading this

 It is possible but only by playing silly games with
 semantics such as:

 class MyProgram
global1 = 0
global2 = True


 [Or alternatively you can hide them inside a database.]

 Now technically there are no globals but in fact we are
 just moving them inside the meaningless class and have
 all the same potential issues with global side effects
 etc.

About the class variables, i have used them a lot without realising
they had all the same side effects as global variables. Something i
now have to try a different approach with.

 In my experience there are usually a few globals required
 for any meaningful program. It's not avoiding globals
 completely that's important, it's being careful to use
 them sensibly and with good adherence to the principles
 of coupling and cohesion in the design.

Thanks  alot! This is definately a lot of food for choice and will
help in my future decisions. I'm happy i asked this question as i can
honestly say i had been developing some bad habbits. The responses
have definately been helpful about program design and not just global
variables.
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Re: [Tutor] global variables

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 4:35 PM, Steven D'Aprano st...@pearwood.info wrote:

 Good question! And one that needs a long answer.

Hey i just checked mail again... A big thank you for your responses, i
will read all of them now.. im pretty my programs/designs will be much
cleaner by the time i done. And yes i was talking about freenode:)
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[Tutor] Fwd: QT Python: How to re-use the return value of fileDialog.openFileName() ?

[Matthew Ngaha]

Sorry for the forward, i forgot to reply to tutor

On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 3:53 AM, Sunitha Misra sunith...@gmail.com wrote:

 self.fileDialog = QtGui.QFileDialog()

 QtCore.QObject.connect(self.toolButton,
 QtCore.SIGNAL(_fromUtf8(clicked())), self.fileDialog.getOpenFileName)


i think the way youre doing it won't allow you to get the filename as
you are calling it through a signal.

Things you can do:

1) dont use self.fileDialog.getOpenFileName as a slot like you are
doing. Create a function and call it when the toolbar's button is
clicked, then in that function assign the filename to the return value
of self.fileDialog.getOpenFileName.

2) if the only thing your self.fileDialog is doing is responding to
the toolbar's button, don't create it at all. do what i said in #1 and
assign a filename variable to the full method of the dialog. What im
saying is there might be no need to create the self.fileDialog
instance variable at all.
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Re: [Tutor] Fwd: QT Python: How to re-use the return value of fileDialog.openFileName() ?

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 2:14 PM, SM sunith...@gmail.com wrote:

But then I also had to use self.fileDialog from within the function. Not
 sure how I could avoid using fileDialog.

 Thanks.

No problem. to do it without the instance variable, you access its
method directly. so replace:

path = self.fileDialog.getOpenFileName()

with

path = QFileDialog.getOpenFileName(self)

which is basically the same thing except you're going to the method
directly instead of creating a class instance. The self argument may
or may not be needed, its been a while since ive used Qt.
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Re: [Tutor] Difference between types

[Matthew Ngaha]

wait for someone more knowledgeable to answer, but from what i know,
Yes it does have a profound meaning.  Strings consist of character
sets. Something that was here way before Python

Like i said my experience is limited so i too would like to hear some reponses
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Re: [Tutor] challenge-chapter 2

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 6:02 AM, Andrew Triplett andrew139...@yahoo.com wrote:
 I am on chapter two for Python Programming working on the challenges and the
 question is:

 1. Create a list of legal and illegal variable names. Describe why each is
 either legal or illegal. Next, create a list of good and bad legal
 variable names. Describe why each is either a good or bad choice for a
 variable name.


The title is a bit ambigious. Just incase anyone likes the sound of
the challenge, the book is:
Python Programming For The Absolute Beginner
i also used it and would recommend it to anyone trying to learn Python
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Re: [Tutor] model methods in Django

[Matthew Ngaha]

Thanks guys i had no idea about these  method attributes and also
these underlying oop  __objects__

@ eryksun
i understand your explanation, im still having trouble figuring out
how django is being used in the tutorial.

class Poll(models.Model):
# ...
def was_published_recently(self):
return self.pub_date = timezone.now() - datetime.timedelta(days=1)
was_published_recently.admin_order_field = 'pub_date'
was_published_recently.boolean = True
was_published_recently.short_description = 'Published recently?'
list_filter = ['pub_date']
search_fields = ['question']
date_hierarchy = 'pub_date'


if you look at the diagram under that function, why is the value of
was_published_recently.short_description the title of that field?
replacing the old title? is a short_desccription attribute set
somewhere in django being inactive, but once you make use of this
attribute(or keyword), whatever the value is automatically becomes the
field title? is it the same for boolean being the value of the field
with the checked or unchecked symbol?
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Re: [Tutor] model methods in Django

[Matthew Ngaha]

 The default description is the name with underscores removed, unless
 you set a custom description in the function's short_description
 attribute. I'm not experienced with Django, so I can't ramble off lots
 of examples, but hopefully you get the gist.

Thanks that does clear it up. Also thats a huge script you linked, can
i ask which framework you're coming from, and why you have decided to
try out django? When i asked around, people's opinions of it weren't
good and i was recommended to try flask but as i only use Python 3, i
won't be able to use Flask.
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Re: [Tutor] model methods in Django

[Matthew Ngaha]

 class Poll(models.Model):

 question = models.CharField(max_length=200)
 pub_date = models.DateTimeField('date published')



 def was_published_recently(self):
 return self.pub_date = timezone.now() - datetime.timedelta(days=1)

 #


 was_published_recently.admin_order_field = 'pub_date'
 was_published_recently.boolean = True
 was_published_recently.short_description = 'Published recently?'


 Source:
 https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/intro/tutorial01/
 https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/intro/tutorial02/


 I find the Django (and this fragment) very elegant UP TO the comment.

is the dislike after the comment more to do with the python code
rather than django itself?
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Re: [Tutor] model methods in Django

[Matthew Ngaha]

  options.py is the biggest module in the admin package. The link I
 posted is to the get_actions method of ModelAdmin. In the tutorial,
 PollAdmin extends this class.

oh ok thanks, yes i will definately look through it

 I'm not coming from any framework. My knowledge of web development is
 scattered from bits learned here and there, out of curiosity rather
 than necessity. With Python 3 you're a bit limited, but you still have
 options. Obviously there's Django -- arguably the most popular,
 batteries-included framework. Pyramid is a leaner alternative. Bottle
 and CherryPy (also a WSGI server) are micro frameworks. There's also
 Tornado if you want an asynchronous framework based on callbacks and
 coroutines.

As there are a lot more guides for Django i think i will stick with it
rather than Pyramid. Maybe after ive learnt it well i can pick up
Cherrypy as i like the sounds of a small framework with a server. But
Django will be my main focus. Thanks for detailing the options for
Python 3
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Re: [Tutor] model methods in Django

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Sun, May 19, 2013 at 3:34 PM, Steven D'Aprano st...@pearwood.info wrote:
 Matthew, who are you quoting? Your email program should automatically insert
 an attribution line, such as the one just below. Without that attribution
 line, it is hard to follow the conversation, as we can't tell who you are
 quoting.

 On 20/05/13 00:23, Matthew Ngaha wrote:

ok thanks i didnt think about that. I was quoting eryksun. I'll
includethat line from now on
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[Tutor] model methods in Django

[Matthew Ngaha]

 im following the official docs and after learning Python im sure of
how methods work, but the model example on the beginners guide has me
really confused.

The model definition is omitted but can anyone explain how this methed
(was_published_recently) is given these attributes:

class Poll(models.Model):
# ...
def was_published_recently(self):
return self.pub_date = timezone.now() - datetime.timedelta(days=1)
was_published_recently.admin_order_field = 'pub_date'
was_published_recently.boolean = True
was_published_recently.short_description = 'Published recently?'

are the names of the attributes already attached to these
functions/methods, or are they being created on the fly with whatever
name you want? As i am unable to comprehend what is going on, i dont
really have a clue as to what each definition is doing and how it
affects the model, even after reading this section of the docs over
and over again im still lost.
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Re: [Tutor] env var packages

[Matthew Ngaha]

Thank you Vasya and Eryksun. Sorry i didn't mention my OS i am on
windows. Thanks for the links and detailed explanations which after
following, i now have django up and running! thanks again
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Re: [Tutor] Python Programming for the Absolute Beginner

[Matthew Ngaha]

i completed this book and i did every exercise. are you asking for
help with the challenges, or have you completed them and want code to
compare yours too? im relunctant to share challenge code, incase you
havent done them. They are really good exercises to try doing.
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Re: [Tutor] Interested in learning Python

[Matthew Ngaha]

i recommend getting a copy of Python Programming for the absolute
beginner. It offers end of chapter exercises to make sure you
understand everything you are reading. It was a great read for me and
made my learning experience really fun. I garantee by the end you
would have gained a lot of confidence and will be able to pick up and
learn many new things
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[Tutor] env var packages

[Matthew Ngaha]

i have to install django and ive come across some weird instructions.
it says to set Django's  django-admin.py file to my environment
variable. I was instructed to get django via easy installer that was
located in my Python/Scripts folder. it installed django to a
different place in site-packages, where django-admin.py resides.But
now its telling me to add this file to my env variable and it should
also be located in Python/Scripts .. but as i've said, its clearly not
there, it is somewhere in a site-packages/django sub folder. so is
this an error? or do i go ahead and add Python/Scripts to the env
variable, even those the file points somewhere else?

My 2nd problem is it says after adding it i will get a python
interpreter and Django's djando-admin.py commad up and running. What
does this mean? both files open? it was specific about adding the path
to the env variable, but if i already have python added, why do i need
to add django? shouldnt it already be added? i will quote:

You should make sure djando-admin.py is in your PATH environment
variable so that it can be executed from the command-line (unless you
like calling interpreters by using full pathnames)

does this mean in a terminal, that i can be in
Python/myproject/script_one/ and be able to open a .py file in
Python/myproject/script_two/ by simpling typing its file name
without having to cd into its directory or typing its full path?
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Re: [Tutor] help regarding game code

[Matthew Ngaha]

 bWater.clicked.connect( water_clicked ) AttributeError: 'int

use a paste site like http://bpaste.net/+python to show us the code.

i am no expert @ programming myself but that error is telling you you
used an int and tried to access an int method called connect somewhere
in your code. ints do not have this method. However some PyQt objects
(mostly button widgets) do have this method, which is actually a
signal called clicked for when you mouse click on the widget(button).
So basically ints (integers) do not have signals, try and connect the
name(variable name) of what you are clicking to that method, instead
of the int object (bWater)

bWater.clicked.connect( water_clicked )  should become:

button_name.clicked.connect( water_clicked )
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[Tutor] urllib.urlretrieve ?

[Matthew Ngaha]

Im following a tutorial on what i believe is using Python 2 and i'm a
bit confused. I use Python 3 on windows vista. I believe
urlretrieve() is a python 2 function that isnt in 3, but why is the
tutorial using urllib instead of urllib2? Also when i run the program
on Python 3, it says:

AttributeError: 'module' object has no attribute 'urlretrieve'

so Python 3 doesnt recognize this function, i want to ask if there is
an equivalent function to 'urlretrieve' in Python 3? the program uses
this function to download a file as so:

urllib.urlretrieve(self._url, self._filename, reporthook)

the 3rd argument is a function that is called to track progress of the
current download status. i dont really need help with the program, i
understand its code, but i need to know if this function has one
similar in Python 3? or do you have any examples of how i could add
its functionality to Python 3.
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Re: [Tutor] urllib.urlretrieve ?

[Matthew Ngaha]

the whole program depends on the urlretrieve 3rd argument, the
function to be called.. is there no options to include a callback?

def _download(self):

def reporthook(pos, block, total):
if self.size != total:
self._size = total
self.on_size.emit()
self.progress = float(pos*block)/float(total)

urllib.urlretrieve(self._url, self._filename, reporthook)
##3rd arg calls inner function
self.running = False
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Re: [Tutor] urllib.urlretrieve ?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Look in the module docs for urlib.request.


Hi. Ive never used the urllib before unless it was typing in something
from an unrelated tutorial. I've also never done anything related to
web programming. I'm looking at the urllib.request page and i really
don't understand what i'm looking at. I'm confused as to what i should
be looking for.
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Re: [Tutor] urllib.urlretrieve ?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 You might want to look at requests module:
 http://docs.python-requests.org/en/latest/
 Many people think it is easier to use than the native python support.


are all of these modules related to web programming like clients and
(HTTP)servers? I've come across urllib a lot of times but only
followed along, maybe its best i just learn about HTTP and its
concepts etc so i can understand the request module better then come
back to my problem.. Thanks
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Re: [Tutor] urllib.urlretrieve ?

[Matthew Ngaha]

yeah, sadly urlretrieve doesnt exist on my version of python. i just
need a function to put in the same line that replaces this one with
the same arguments in order to see the results of my tutorial.

urllib.urlretrieve(self._url, self._filename, reporthook)

On Sun, Apr 7, 2013 at 7:10 PM, Alan Gauld alan.ga...@btinternet.com wrote:
 On 07/04/13 17:20, Matthew Ngaha wrote:

 Look in the module docs for urlib.request.


 Hi. Ive never used the urllib before


 In Python 3 urllib combines (the best) features of
 urllib and urllib2 from Python 2.


 web programming. I'm looking at the urllib.request page and i really
 don't understand what i'm looking at. I'm confused as to what i should
 be looking for.


 You were asking about urllib.urlretrieve.
 It's documented on that page.

 Now, beyond that, what else are you confused about?
 The more specific the question the more specific the answer.


 --
 Alan G
 Author of the Learn to Program web site
 http://www.alan-g.me.uk/

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Re: [Tutor] urllib.urlretrieve ?

[Matthew Ngaha]

org/2/library/urllib.html#urllib.urlretrieve
 or
 http://docs.python.org/3/library/urllib.request.html#urllib.request.urlretrieve
sorry about the top posting gmail has changed the way their messages
are done, it gave me a blank field i didnt realize i was writing above
the message.

i must have missed it but your 2nd link was exactly what i needed. ive
got the program to run without the module error. However i'm out of
luck as i now get this error:

urllib.error.HTTPError: HTTP Error 404: Not Found

i guess the tutorial is very old that the site doesnt exist anymore:(
Thanks for the help
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Re: [Tutor] urllib.urlretrieve ?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Unless you're looking for something specific from the URL that the
 tutorial uses, then you could use any address

 Bodsda

thanks i did that and to my suprise an extra file showed up in my
folder, of the page i just visited:) thanks
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[Tutor] break

[Matthew Ngaha]

i cant seem to break out of this loop. let me explain the variables you see:

Enemy.ships = [] #an Enemy class variable that contains enemy ships
self.missiles = [] an instance variable that appends how many Visible
missiles my ship has fired
Enemy.rects = [] an Enemy class variable that represents a rectangle
for every ship in Enemy.ships
Explosion() = a class where explosions occur
QPoint() = is a pyqt function that takes a point x, y position as arguments

im trying to destroy the ships if they hit a missile, even though i
use pyqt this is mainly python code

if Enemy.ships:
for missile in self.missiles:
for rect in Enemy.rects:
if QPoint(missile.x + 5, missile.y) in rect:
explosion = Explosion(rect.x(), rect.y())
self.explosions.append(explosion)
break

once the missile has hit 1 Enemy.rect i want to break and go to the
next missile so the missile is destroyed and doesnt hit another Enemy,
but for some reason the break i have isnt working and the same missile
sometimes is hitting 2 different rects on the same iteration. i have
done the same loop using a simple print statements on strings greater
than a certain length and it breaks correctly. anyone have any ideas
why the break isnt breaking out of the nested/inner loop but instead
continuing to loop through the Enemies?
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Re: [Tutor] break

[Matthew Ngaha]

  if Enemy.ships:
  for missile in self.missiles:

flag = False

  for rect in Enemy.rects:

assert(!flag)

  if QPoint(missile.x + 5, missile.y) in rect:
  explosion = Explosion(rect.x(), rect.y())
  self.explosions.append(explosion)

flag = True

  break

im about to try the suggestions. i on python 3 and this line is giving
me a syntax error assert(!flag).
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Re: [Tutor] break

[Matthew Ngaha]

 One good approach is to have a separate function or method with
 both loops:

 def attack(self, Enemy):

 for missile in self.missiles:
 for rect in Enemy.rects:
 if QPoint(missile.x + 5, missile.y) in rect:
 explosion = Explosion(rect.x(), rect.y())
 self.explosions.append(explosion)
 return

i altered this because once it returns the outer loop also stops and i
need it incase i have more than 1 missile to loop through. i made it
so i did the outer loop in the program and sent the inner loop to this
function, but for some reason the code seems to break my program.. no
errors are returned but it just freezes on inputs and missile
collision.

 You could also set a flag and check it at the end of outer loop
 and have a second break statement when the flag is set.


im trying to figure out this technique with flags but i havent got it
yet.. what does a flag stand for?
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Re: [Tutor] break

[Matthew Ngaha]

thanks guys ive finally got it working. even though i didnt use the
flag due to invalid syntax i realized since i was getting no errors i
wasnt actually doing anything wrong. My mistake was i removed the
ememy ship but for some reason forgot to remove the missile so it was
still active on the next update/mainloop. im still interested in
finding out how to write this in python 3 assert(!flag).
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Re: [Tutor] following on

[Matthew Ngaha]

 understanding of how everything works.

 Use it., Experiment with it. Break it.
 Thats the best way. Read the source code its all available in
 Python or C.


Hey can you please tell me which source code youre referring too? The
initial files that come with Python? also the C code, where can i
locate this? is C something worth learning? why is Python code
available in C?


 like how can i make my own custom container and not have it
 subclass list(), and still act like a list()?

 That's a more sensible option especially if you make it a type of container
 that Python doesn't already have. Maybe a bag or a stack
 or even a circular list. But there is no shame in inheriting from
 list if that makes sense. That would be good software engineering - don't
 reinvent the wheel!
 When building  reusable code start from the perspective of the user. Write

yes i will try not to reinvent the wheel, a lot of tutorials ive read
seem to always point this out. Just out of curiousity what is a bag,
stack or circular list? what is needed to create something like this?
i sort of heard about a stack its a C/C++ thing i think?
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Re: [Tutor] following on

[Matthew Ngaha]

Hey, a Big thanks to everyone that has offered their input. I really
appreciate it. Also thanks for all the additional links, i will
definately start to read up on data structures , source code and
everything else that was suggested
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[Tutor] how can i use python 2 alongside 3?

[Matthew Ngaha]

hi guys i am a python 3.1.1. user but really need to use python 2 to
be able to use certain libraries and frameworks. i have installed
python 2.7 but they cant run together as all .py and .pyw files are
opened with python 3. i can open simple python 2 files by right
clicking and finding pythons 2's python.exe, but these only works for
simple files with no imports because the import i think seems to look
in the python 3 directory and can't find the packages.

i have checked stackoverflow for answers but i get lost in all the
terms and keywords they use to solve this. is there a simple
straightfoward way to fix this that is easy for someone like me to
understand or follow?

thanks. i use windows vista
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Re: [Tutor] how can i use python 2 alongside 3?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Python 3.3 for Windows comes with a launcher, which will approximate (for
 Python only) what Unix and Linux users have had for years for any scripting
 language.  You can get it separately, as Mark Lawrence has said, but maybe
 it's time to bring your 3.x current.

there was a lot of reading in the previous links, i got a bit lost as
i didnt recognize a lot of the words they were using. If i install
Pyhon 3.3 do i need to uninstall my current python 3.1 and reinstall
all the downloaded modules/packages i installed?
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Re: [Tutor] how can i use python 2 alongside 3?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 You don't have to uninstall 3.1 but you would have to install all the
 downloaded modules or packages that you have in your 3.1 site packages
 folder to the 3.3 site packages folder.  Maybe it's easier to simply grab
 the standalone pylauncher as I suggested earlier.  Only you know what is the
 path of least resistance.

yes the 2nd option (standalone pylauncher) sounds more convienient for
me. i just have to try and comprehend all the instructions given..
hopefully ill get there in the end
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Re: [Tutor] how can i use python 2 alongside 3?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 yes the 2nd option (standalone pylauncher) sounds more convienient for
 me. i just have to try and comprehend all the instructions given..
 hopefully ill get there in the end

i managed to install the laucher. on the site when i click the correct
launcher 32bit, i chose run and it automatically installed rather
than asking me or allowing me to install it in cmd like their
directions showed. my python 3 files still open but python 2 files
still return errors like: print string is invalid syntax which tells
me its still using python 3 to open these files. when i right click
.py files a new option has been added to open with which is open
with Python Launcher for Windows. Even when i do this my python 2
files won't open
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Re: [Tutor] how can i use python 2 alongside 3?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Have you added shebang lines to those scripts yet?

yes i added them. i think the problem is at the start where it asks me to:

You should ensure the launcher is on your PATH - depending on how it was
installed it may already be there, but check just in case it is not.

From a command-prompt, execute the following command:
py
You should find that the latest version of Python 2.x you have installed is
started ..

py is not recognized and and it said depending on how it was
installed. the problem is it didnt allow me to select a path when
installing. it just automatically did everything. i have searched my
PC for python launcher but it cant find it, so i dont know where its
location is. i see it in control panel to uninstall a program but
right clicking it doesnt give me an option to see its containing
folder
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Re: [Tutor] how can i use python 2 alongside 3?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 I'm not using it, since I'm not using Windows.  So these are guesses based
 on years stuck\b\b\b\b\b spent in the Windows environment.

 Clearly, the name of the program is py.exe, so that's what you should try
 searching for.  From the cmd prompt, try   dir /s  py.exe

 Or, you could just try searching under c:\windows  since that's where it's
 likely to be.

 To see your PATH, type  PATH   at the cmd prompt.

 To make temporary changes to your PATH (if py.exe is in an obscure place),
 just type
   set PATH=c:\mydir;%PATH%

 To make permanent changes to PATH, you have to change the environment
 variables in the Control Panel.  I've done it many times, but don't recall
 just where it is.  Such permanent changes will affect any new runs of CMD,
 as well as affect any other program subsequently started.

thanks Dave. the file was py.exe as you said and the temporary path is
able to open both version 2 and 3's  python.exe. There seems to be a
problem. python 2 seems to be the only version opening my files unless
i do a few things. So with the shebang set:

the python launcher, launches my python 3 files with the correct
version if i double click the file or run it from a console. But it
uses the wrong version if i run it from IDLE or if i right click the
file and open with the Python Launcher. i guess i can live with that,
but is there anyway around this?
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Re: [Tutor] how can i use python 2 alongside 3?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Did you find the control-panel-way to modify the PATH (assuming py.exe
 wasn't already in there) ?  Without it, I'd be surprised if right-click
 would work correctly.

 And as for IDLE, there are two different IDLEs, one in each directory. So
 run the one that corresponds to the python you'll be using.  How to do that?
 I dunno, since I don't use IDLE, but I'd find or make batch files called
 something like IDLE2.bat and IDLE3.bat that know how to find and run the
 appropriate IDLE.

i didnt use the control panel way but the right click is now working,
it was an error that in the script i had a txt.file open() and the
right click way said no such file but the other ways found the txt
file which is weird but right clicking works for other files without a
txt file. i can live with that. i think it wise for me to try to
permanently add the path with control panel.

Thanks for all the help, its such a relief to now be able to run python 2 files
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Re: [Tutor] how can i use python 2 alongside 3?

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 9:35 PM, eryksun eryk...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 1:56 PM, Matthew Ngaha chigga...@gmail.com wrote:

 py is not recognized and and it said depending on how it was
 installed. the problem is it didnt allow me to select a path when
 installing.

 The simpler installer is launchwin.msi, which installs to the Windows
 directory. This directory should already be on the PATH.

 In a cmd shell, check that 'assoc .py' is Python.File and that
 'ftype Python.File' points to py.exe in your Windows directory, e.g.
 C:\Windows\py.exe %1 %*'. If it's wrong, re-install. Or fix it
 manually using assoc and ftype in an elevated cmd shell, which updates
 the local machine registry keys in HKLM\Software\Classes.

 Also, Windows Explorer has an Open With dialog that configures
 per-user settings for multiple associations, including a default (i.e.
 the Always use... checkbox). These keys are stored in
 HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\FileExts\.py.
 Make sure that UserChoice is set to the Progid Python.File. You
 should be able to change this using the 'Open With-Choose Default
 Program...' dialog.

 You can customize pylauncher by editing its ini file in your profile.
 For example, run 'notepad %localappdata%\py.ini' to create/edit it.
 See the docs for the settings, such as changing the default
 interpreter and adding custom shebangs.

sorry i didnt see this message. I havent read it yet although it looks
complicated. Thanks ill report back if i need help
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Re: [Tutor] how can i use python 2 alongside 3?

[Matthew Ngaha]

 In a cmd shell, check that 'assoc .py' is Python.File and that
 'ftype Python.File' points to py.exe in your Windows directory, e.g.
 C:\Windows\py.exe %1 %*'. If it's wrong, re-install. Or fix it
 manually using assoc and ftype in an elevated cmd shell, which updates
 the local machine registry keys in HKLM\Software\Classes.

i think this is ok, i got these results.
D:\Data\Py\myworkassoc .py
.py=Python.File

D:\Data\Py\myworkftype Python.File
Python.File=D:\Data\Py2.7\python.exe %1 %*

 Also, Windows Explorer has an Open With dialog that configures
 per-user settings for multiple associations, including a default (i.e.
 the Always use... checkbox). These keys are stored in
 HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\FileExts\.py.
 Make sure that UserChoice is set to the Progid Python.File. You
 should be able to change this using the 'Open With-Choose Default
 Program...' dialog.


i dont quit understand when you say UserChoice is set to the Progid
Python.File? what is Progid? i cant seem to locate that path
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\FileExts\.py.
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Re: [Tutor] Traffic Light

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 10:56 PM, anthonym antho...@att.net wrote:
 Thanks again for the info Alan.  I am still passing the button process
 until I can get my rectangle and ovals on the canvass.  The program runs
 and produces a window with the radio buttons on top.  I would like them on
 the bottom but changes to the row field have no effect.

 Anybody have any ideas on why I don't see my shape on the canvass?

i doubt i can help, but it might help if you could paste the section
of the code in relation to what you're explaining and tell us what
it's doing? some people don't use tkinter so its a bit hard to
understand what you're saying.
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Re: [Tutor] Traffic Light

[Matthew Ngaha]

On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 12:05 AM, Matthew Ngaha chigga...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 11:29 PM, anthonym antho...@att.net wrote:
 Sure thing.  Here is the code.  And after that is the box I get with the
 radio buttons but no shapes.

 i might be way off as im struggling to understand how tkinter works,
 but i noticed a few things which hopefully might help. starting with
you wanting the buttons on the bottom of the window and not at the top
where they are showing.

 from tkinter import *  # Import tkinter

 class Trafficlight:
 def __init__(self):
 window = Tk()
 self.canvas = Canvas(window, width = 480, height = 480, bg =
 white)
 self.canvas.pack()

 # Add three radio buttons to frame1
 frame1 = Frame(window)
 frame1.pack()

 rbRed = Radiobutton(frame1, text = Red, bg = red,
 variable = self.v2,
 value = 1,
 command = self.processRadiobutton)
 rbYellow = Radiobutton(frame1, text = Yellow, bg = yellow,
 variable = self.v2, value = 2,
 command = self.processRadiobutton)
 rbGreen = Radiobutton(frame1, text = Green, bg = green,
 variable = self.v2, value = 3,
 command = self.processRadiobutton)

 rbRed.grid(row = 400, column = 1)
 rbYellow.grid(row = 400, column = 2)
 rbGreen.grid(row = 400, column = 3)


 row = 400 seems a bit odd? do you really have 399 occupied rows? you
 define the canvas with absolute positioning: Canvas(window, width =
 480, height = 480). where you trying to place the buttons with
 absolute positioning also? it seems they are appearing inside the
 frame in which you have put them in so why are you trying to move them
 again? im guessing you would have to reposition the Frame itself. also
 you are not using instance variables(self) for either the frame or the
 buttons, maybe they lose the reference to them once moved outside the
 frame.

 as for your shapes not appearing:

def displayRect(self):
self.canvas.create_rectangle(10, 10, 100, 100, tages = rect)

   # Display a Oval for the top light
def displayOval(self):
 self.canvas.create_oval(10, 10, 10, 10)
 # Display an Oval for the middle light
def displayOval(self):
 self.canvas.create_oval(20, 20, 20, 20)
 # Display an Oval for the bottom light
def displayOval(self):
 self.canvas.create_oval(30, 30, 30, 30)

 If that is the complete code you showed.. Your buttons are not doing
 anything. they are calling a method that does nothing:
 def processRadiobutton(self):
 pass

 also i dont see anywhere in your code where you are calling any of
 those methods that create the shapes. you have to fix your method that
 your buttons are calling, and have it call the correct method for your
 specific shape.
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[Tutor] unclear topic

[Matthew Ngaha]

hey guys, this is not really a Python question. When ever im doing a
tutorial, it could be pygame or some gui application, i usually find
everything straight forward until the demonstration involves drawing.
Then maths is applied and i can't follow along as easily. In the end
by commenting out certain lines of code, i understand what each line
is doing but the fact is im still faced with being very weak at
drawing and working out the logic behind it. I also can't imagine if
im designing a program and need to do drawings of my own how i would
work out the calculations and be able to think for myself. The help im
asking for is what do i need to study to be able to design my own
programs that involve drawing? do i need to go off and learn maths? if
so which type? some sort of geometry? or do i start studying some sort
of physics? or does the answer lie within some framework/library
python tutorial?

on amazon ive seen:

maths books
physics book
2d engine physics books(box2d etc)
game physics books -  http://www.amazon.co.uk/Game-Physics-/dp/147103397X/


my other problem is i don't want to over do it. do i need to buy a
game physics book, if all i want to do is understand how to implement
my own calculations for complex objects etc? then again maybe that's
not so bad. If you know your way around this stuff? what did you learn
that gave you these skills?
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Re: [Tutor] Python Programming for Absolute Beginners, 3rd Edition

[Matthew Ngaha]

 With the code not being on the page, I went to the directed website and got
 the downloads, yet I couldn't find the source code
 anywhere to be found. Am I missing something plainly obvious?

what exactly did you download? all the source code for every chapter
is included in the download
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Re: [Tutor] exercise

[Matthew Ngaha]

 return {e for (e, g) in self.sort_email.items()
 if g  groups_list}


guys i think ive got it. The  in that comprehension was really
confusing me, but i found out it means intersection, so i took the
sets manually and saw the results i got using intersection and it
became more clear from there. A Big Thanks if you took the time to
help solve my issues.
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Re: [Tutor] Proper useage of open

[Matthew Ngaha]

 I typed in to my script:
 a = open (dupli, r)
 and got an error stating that dupli is not deffined.

it needs the quotes around it. so try:

a = open (dupli, r)
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Re: [Tutor] help

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Traceback (most recent call last):
   File Match finder GUI.py, line 87, in ?
 app = Application(root)
   File \Match finder GUI.py, line 23, in __init__
 self.create_widgets()
   File Match finder GUI.py, line 61, in create_widgets
 self.submit_bttn = Button(self, text = Submit, command = self.reveal)
 AttributeError: Application instance has no attribute 'reveal'



i only know really basic tkinter, but i think the error is looking for
a method called reveal(). other than your __init__()  and
create_widgets() methods, i only see an update() method. I think your
update method should be named reveal?
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Re: [Tutor] help

[Matthew Ngaha]

It's asking a lot if you want people to read your whole code to try
 and spot the errors. Try to run it from the console and paste what the
 errors are here.
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[Tutor] need help

[Matthew Ngaha]

working through my tutorial ive been told to set up a simple webserver. i
can't even get started because the 1st line of code its asked me to do
fails with a syntax error. here's the code:

python3 -m http.server

any ideas what is going wrong? it asked me to make some simple .html files,
then in the same directory run that line of code. I havent any experience
with web servers, so i might not understand advanced instructions:(
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Re: [Tutor] need help

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Always, *always* include the *full* error message, otherwise we have to
 guess. Not fun.  Some other questions: What operating system are you using?
  What version of Python does your tutorial assume?  Do you in fact have
 Python 3 installed on your system?



maybe im running it from the wrong place.

on IDLE i get: SyntaxError: invalid syntax (pyshell#0, line 1)

and on cmd it says 'python3' is not recognized as an internal or external
command, operable program or batch file.
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Re: [Tutor] need help

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Works for me with 3.3:


 aclark@Alexs-MacBook-Pro:~/  python3.3 -m http.server
 Serving HTTP on 0.0.0.0 port 8000 ...



hey how do you start it or where do you run it from. did you type that
in the command line?
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Re: [Tutor] need help

[Matthew Ngaha]

 If you got an error, quote it in full in your message (using copy/paste,
 not by retyping or paraphrasing.  As it stands, we don't know if the
 error was in bash, in csh, in cmd, or in Python, and if it was in
 python, we don''t know what version.

  python3 -m http.server

 Where did you type that?  Was it in a shell, or the interpreter, or in
 IDLE, or someplace else complicated?



 You've already got one response showing it working with Python 3.3 on
 OSX.  it also works here, running Python 3.2 on Linux.  But you don't
 say what version, nor what OS.  I'd also ask what directory you're
 running it in.

 davea@think:~/temppython$ python3 -m http.server
 Serving HTTP on 0.0.0.0 port 8000 ...

i type it in both IDLE and CMD. in the directory where i made those .html
files, i held shift and right clicked to get the command line open. im on
windows vista. the i type that line in there. i use Python 3.1

also i made a .py file in that folder. opened it for editing, then pressed
F5 to run it., then type the code into IDLE's interactive interpreter.
which is where i got the invalid syntax error:

 SyntaxError: invalid syntax (pyshell#0, line 1)
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Re: [Tutor] need help

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Don't run it from inside IDLE.  You were right to run it from cmd.

 Pasting the error message you showed elsewhere:

 'python3' is not recognized as an internal or external
 command, operable program or batch file.

 That simply says that the PATH does not point to your PYTHON3.bat or
 PYTHON3.exe program.  When I was stuck on Windows, I used the ActivePython
 version, as it had many enhancements for Windows users over standard
 CPython.  One of those enhancements was a simpler install that set up
 associations and paths automatically.  Consequently, I don't have any idea
 how your Windows install tried to set up your PATH.  Look in a directory
 like  C:\Python3.1 to see if it's there at all.  And if it is, add it to
 your PATH.  That's a Windows thing, which you can do from the control
 panel.  But for testing, you can just manually add it to the path of your
 current cmd shell.

 In case you didn't know, PATH is an environment variable used by the cmd
 shell (and other programs) to search for .exe, .bat, and .cmd programs.


im really not any good with cmd or know how to set things to my python
path.  what do you mean when you say
Look in a directory like C:\Python3.1 to see if it's there at all? you mean
to see if the code works, or something else? i have my python installed not
in my C:drive but...

 D:\Data\Program Files Data\Py

in a folder named Py. i opened the cmd there and typed python3 and python
3.1 but got the same errors. i also ran the same code to start the server
but still got the same error.
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Re: [Tutor] need help

[Matthew Ngaha]

 The interpreter executable in Windows is always called python
 (console) or pythonw (no console). The 3.1 installer doesn't put the
 executable's directory on the system PATH. The option to add this was
 added to the 3.3 installer. Otherwise you'll have to add the directory
 manually. In IDLE check the result of the following:

  import sys
  sys.executable
 '/usr/bin/python3'

 For you it will probably display C:\Python31\pythonw.exe. That being
 the case; you have to append C:\Python31 to your PATH. You can do
 this temporarily using the cmd shell's set command (e.g. set
 PATH=%PATH%;C:\Python31), or permanently in the system registry by
 following instructions easily found online.


here were the results:

 import sys
 sys.executable
'D:\\Data\\Program Files Data\\Py\\pythonw.exe'
 '/usr/bin/python3'
'/usr/bin/python3'


i dont see Python31 .. is this Py that is supposed to be Python31?.. and do
i type this exactly like you did in cmd?

set PATH=%PATH%;C:\Python31  ?
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Re: [Tutor] need help

[Matthew Ngaha]

 No, in your case it's

 set PATH=%PATH%;D:\Data\Program Files Data\Py

 That's just a temporary modification for the current cmd process. It's
 easiest to show how to change it permanently with screen captures;
 search for vista set path.


i followed the instructions at
http://banagale.com/changing-your-system-path-in-windows-vista.htm

i added D:\Data\Program Files Data\Py to my variable value but i still
get the same error that Py is not recognized:(
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Re: [Tutor] need help

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Py is a directory.

 Once you've added the Python executable's directory to the path, you
 can start the http.server module as a script by running the following:

 python -m http.server

 Don't use pythonw in this case. The latter is associated with the
 .pyw file extension, used for scripts that run without a console. For
 example, IDLE is a GUI app that uses Tk widgets, so it doesn't need a
 console. That's why it runs with pythonw.exe.


wow i am so grateful.. i had given up hope just trying different things.
its finally working. thank you:)
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Re: [Tutor] help with homework

[Matthew Ngaha]

 In your original getNames do something like this.
 Initialise a counter to zero.
 Every time you get a valid name increment the count.
 If the count is three you're finished.

 hey i was looking at the question as im learning also. With the counter,
would you use a while loop instead of a for loop, with the condition being
something like, while count  3:  ? without len() the for loop option seems
difficult
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[Tutor] Which is better Practice and why

[Matthew Ngaha]

In many of the tutorial examples ive come across, the main code's program
is never at the top level, but always in a function of some sort. i
understand why but, there is always a different way used to access the main
code, i want to know which is the best.


main()
 main's code

#top level
main()

they call the main program by simply calling the main function. I've also
seen a more complcated:

if __name__ == '__main__':
main()

the 2nd one usually includes a lot more code then i showed. can you please
tell me why different methods are used to access the main code? is it just
preference or is one way actually better coding practice?
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Re: [Tutor] Which is better Practice and why

[Matthew Ngaha]

oh ok i understand it.. Thanks for the help guys
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Re: [Tutor] hasattr()

[Matthew Ngaha]

Thank you xDog and Steven. The whole assignment makes a lot of sense now
after your explanations of what hasattr is doing. Thanks
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[Tutor] hasattr()

[Matthew Ngaha]

im trying to understand this hasattr function. i am supposed to pass in an
object and an attribute name into its parametres... so im trying to get it
to return True. Here's a quick test

class Test:
def __init__(self):
   self.att = testing



 e = Test()
 hasattr(e, e.att)
False
 hasattr(e, testing)
False

what can i do to make this True? my e object has an attribute att but it
returns False. Any code showing it return True?

the task i have been set is very difficult but i don't want to ask for help
just yet, i think understanding how hasattr works might make everything
else clear.
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Re: [Tutor] need an explanation

[Matthew Ngaha]

Thanks for everyone that replied. I really gained a lot from all the
input. Also thanks to Dave and Prasad for explaining why i had errors
trying to run the program. I fully understand the code now and im able to
run it without errors.
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[Tutor] need an explanation

[Matthew Ngaha]

i need help on 2 topics.

1) can someone please tell me what sys is doing, and why its using weird
indexing?

if __name__ == __main__:
A_Class(*sys.argv[1:4]).A_Class_Method()

is sys able to call methods? if so why does it need indexing if it uses * .


--
2) also i need help with zipfiles. these 2 functions are related in the
same class.

def __init__(self):
self.zipping_directory = unzipped-{}.format(filename)

def _full_filename(self, filename):
return os.path.join(self.zipping_directory, filename)

def zip_files(self):
file = zipfile.ZipFile(self.filename, 'w')
for filename in os.listdir(self.zipping_directory):
file.write(self._full_filename(filename), filename)

the main thing i need help with is the last line. the zip file is writing
to a file but why does it use the same argument twice? the for loop above
that line returns the file from the zipping directory, which is the 2nd
argument on file.write? But the 1st argument is using that same file
because that is the file returned from the def _full_filename(self,
filename): method. so please can someone tell me why it uses the same file
argument twice in its write method?

thanks for your time
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Re: [Tutor] need an explanation

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Obviously a Monty Python fan as I see 3 methods :)

lol i dont know what i was looking at.. yes its 3 methods sorry:(



 def __init__(self):
  self.zipping_directory = unzipped-{}.format(filename)


 Where did filename appear from above?



sorry i didnt write everything. the init method also had...
self.filename = filename  ... i will paste the whole code



 I suggest that you show us some real code that will run with some print
 statements in appropriate places to show us what is happening.  That way
 you may well be able to answer your own questions and learn at the same
 time.



 sadly when i run the file i get an error so i dont know what to doto fix
it and be able to run

@ DAVE.. you said
sys is a module (presumably you have an import
somewhere above this line). In the module, there's a list argv.

the import statements are:

import sys
import os
import shutil
import zipfile

so im guessing [sys, os, shutil, zipfile]  these are the arguments being
passed? my mind tells me no, as these are more likely the arguments in the
A_Class init method?

here is he full code... i changed the names in the mail to make it clearer.
so the names in the code will be different. A_Class is actually ZipReplace
etc..

i cant test it because on start the program returns this error and i dont
know how to fix it:

ZipReplace(*sys.argv[1:4]).zip_find_replace()
TypeError: __init__() takes exactly 4 positional arguments (1 given)


full code:

import sys
import os
import shutil
import zipfile

class ZipReplace:
def __init__(self, filename, search_string, replace_string):
self.filename = filename
self.search_string = search_string
self.replace_string = replace_string
self.temp_directory = unzipped-{}.format(
filename)

   def _full_filename(self, filename):
return os.path.join(self.temp_directory, filename)

def zip_find_replace(self):
self.unzip_files()
self.find_replace()
self.zip_files()

   def unzip_files(self):
os.mkdir(self.temp_directory)
zip = zipfile.ZipFile(self.filename)
try:
zip.extractall(self.temp_directory)
finally:
zip.close()

def find_replace(self):
for filename in os.listdir(self.temp_directory):
with open(self._full_filename(filename)) as file:
contents = file.read()
contents = contents.replace(
self.search_string, self.replace_string)
with open(self._full_filename(filename), w) as file:
file.write(contents)

   def zip_files(self):
file = zipfile.ZipFile(self.filename, 'w')
for filename in os.listdir(self.temp_directory):
file.write(self._full_filename(filename), filename)
shutil.rmtree(self.temp_directory)

if __name__ == __main__:
ZipReplace(*sys.argv[1:4]).zip_find_replace()

is a bit too advanced for me but i now see what it does.. although i wish
it didnt return an error when run.

so the arguments being passed are...

[os, shutil, zipfile] or [filename, search_string, return_string] ?
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Re: [Tutor] [Tkinter-discuss] whats Style()

[Matthew Ngaha]

sorry i sent the email directly by mistake. Just like to say thanks once
again for all the help
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Re: [Tutor] [Tkinter-discuss] whats Style()

[Matthew Ngaha]

 sorry i sent the email directly by mistake. Just like to say thanks once
 again for all the help

this email was a mistake, meant for anything mailing section.. please
ignore it
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Re: [Tutor] [Tkinter-discuss] displaying an image

[Matthew Ngaha]

 You need to install PIL to use the tutorial you are doing.

 http://www.pythonware.com/products/pil/

the site says

The current free version is PIL 1.1.7. This release supports Python
1.5.2 and newer, including 2.5 and 2.6. A version for 3.X will be
released later.


i have python 3. all the downloads below it only show python 2
versions. am i stuck?:(
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Re: [Tutor] simon game issues

[Matthew Ngaha]

 It would appear you're running some form of event loop, such as
 wxpython, tkinter, pygame, or whatever.  If so, you have to do your
 delays using the mechanism that system defines, not using sleep().  As
 you've discovered, sleep() stops the whole thread, and that's not what
 you want.  What you want is to set an event to fire at some measured
 time in the future, so the actual waiting is done inside the event loop.


hey i looked at the livewires documentation and pulled up the timer
information. im struggling to figure out how to use its explanation. i
need to use it at 2 different parts of the program. 1st when the game
starts i need to create my sprite objects so they appear before my
animation objects:

red = Sprite(colour = Colours.red, x = 250, y = 255)
games.screen.add(red)

#timer event delay goes here so the animations don't start as soon as
the game is opened, before the coloured sprites as they've been doing.

self.create_animations()
-


i also need a timer event when i display my sequence of animation
objects so they dont show on screen simultaneously. so:

#1st animation
red_animation = Animation(images = c_red, x = 250, y = 255,
 repeat_interval = 4, n_repeats = 1)
games.screen.add(red_ani)
red_sound.play()

#Timer event to go here, so next animation in sequence goes after the
timed pause.

#2nd animation
blue_animation = Animation(images = c_blue, x = 373, y = 255,
   repeat_interval = 4, n_repeats = 1)
games.screen.add(blue_ani)
blue_sound.play()

do you think you can offer any help how to implement the timer code or
function? i will provide the link to the page, but here's the relevant
code:


Timer
The Timer class is a class you can add to something which is also a
subclass of Object, to make an object that performs actions at regular
intervals. A class which is intended to be used with another class is
called a mix-in. For instance, if you wanted to make a new class of
your own which was a Circle and also a Timer, you would define the
class by saying class MyClass (games.Circle, games.Timer):
 • init_timer (interval)

interval is how often the tick method is called, measured in timer
ticks. How long a tick is depends on the fps argument you give to the
Screen‘s mainloop method. Setting fps to 50 means a tick is 1/50 of a
second.

You must call this method emph{after} you have called the init_ method
for the Object subclass you are using.

• stop ()

Stop the timer running. It continues to exist, but doesn’t count any more.

• start ()

Starts the timer again. A full interval will elapse before it ticks.

• get_interval ()

Gets the current interval.

• set_interval (interval)

Sets the current interval.

• tick ()

This method must be supplied by you, by subclassing the Timer class.

http://www.geon.wz.cz/livewires/w-livewires.html
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[Tutor] simon game issues

[Matthew Ngaha]

Hi guys. my Python tutorial set me a task to recreate a simon game
using livewires.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agUABjGAJww
this is quite long, i understand if you can't help right away

summary:
i create 4 squared shaped objects(red, blue, green, yellow) as
instances for a class derived from the Sprite class
i create 4 animation objects to represent the 4 colour shaped objects.
the animations get brighter in colour so the user can understand which
colour he has to follow
the animations also light up when the user presses the keyboard key
they are assigned too.
they are instances for a class derived from the Animation class.
i have also included 4 sound files, assigned to 1 animation object to
be played each time that animation lights up

My problems:
everytime i want to play a sequence for the user to follow. i run into
this problem. i create 1 animation say red, so the user can see the
1st colour he has to follow. then i put a timed delay time.sleep(1)
before i display the next animation, say blue. i have tried many other
timing methods to achieve this, but once there is some sort of timer,
the whole screen pauses for the duration of the timed delay (but the
sound files play simultaneously during that freeze) then after that,
the sequence is displayed at the same time. not 1 after the other. so
even though i put the timer after the creation of the 1st animation,
the timer for some reason happens before it. is there a way i can get
around this?

I also start the game/program by displaying the 4 square objects
(Sprite Class) before adding their animation. after the creation of
the sprites i play the animation sequence. The problem is they play as
soon as the game starts before the Sprites are even displayed, and
also simultaneously (not in a sequnce) making it confusng. so after
creating the sprites, i added a timer so the animations happens after
the sprites are shown. But again because of this timer, which is meant
to occur after the creation of the sprites, when i start the game, i
get a blank screen for the duration of the timer((but the sound files,
again play simultaneously during that time). After that i still don't
get the sprites, i get their animatons instead, then finally the
sprites are displayed. i dont understand, the Sprites are meant to be
the 1st things on the screen, is there a solution?

Getting user input:
the last problem i have is when the user presses a key to select a
colour. i have the script check for the key press, then return the
colour to a function/method called def result(self, color): that
determines if he got the right colour. if he does i increase score by
1. to check results i create 2 lists. one with all 4 colours:

self.animation = [Pressed.dict_red, Pressed.dict_blue,
Pressed.dict_green, Pressed.dict_yellow]
then i create an empty list to append the sequence in the order i
randomly played them, so i can check if the user got each colour:
self.get_animation = []  they append from the 1st list above and my
result function uses it to check colours

here's how it goes.
if keyboard for colour red is pressed:
create red animation:
send results back to result method: self.game.result(red)

my result method and its class:
self.stage = 3   ..#say if we were on stage 3. i would play 3
colours. stage 4 would be 4 colours

self.counter = -1 .#to correctly index list
def result(self, COLOUR):
self.counter += 1#count is now at 0
self.end_testing = self.stage..#this will count down from
the stages value. once it reaches 0, there is no more colours to check
for

if COLOUR in self.get_animation[self.counter]:
self.score.value += 1
self.end_testing -= 1

even though i am using a counter here to count down: self.end_testing
 i have used while and for loops also. My problem is none of these
work because a keypress from the user, even if tapped, registers as
multiple key presses, the self.score that i increment by 1 flies to
about 40 from 1 key press. as a result my counter i use to index the
list is way out of range. i tried to add a time.sleep(.03) as soon as
a key is pressed, so it would register once. it managed to limit it to
4 presses, so self.score would equal 4 after 1 press, 8 after 2.. in
that i started my counter at -4. then the code self.counter /= 4 would
give me 0. after the next 4 presses, my counter would be at 4, the
same code self.counter /= 4 would give me 1. after the next 4 presses,
my counter would be at 8, the same code self.counter /= 4 would give
me 2. this successfully fixed my indexing issue, but it needs A LOT of
if statements and it is getting to confusing. isnt there a way to make
1 key press mean 1? and not 40? other wise how can i keep track of the
score. any help? do i quit this exercise and blame it on the program
just not following my instructions?
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[Tutor] setting a timer

[Matthew Ngaha]

i have a way to set a timer for creating new objects copied from a
book but as i have started my next exercise in a very different way, i
want to avoid that math method/formula as it will cause me to
rearrange some classes totally...

i tried a simple method but its not working. any ideas? heres my code,
ill leave out the irrelevant code.

class Game(object):
interval = 0

def play(self):
Game.interval = 40
while Game.interval  0:
self.count_down()

def count_down(self):
Game.interval -= 1

so the play() method gives interval a value of 40. the while loop
should reduce interval by 1 everytime it calls the count_down()
method. The problem is this is happening instantly. i've even put the
Game.interval value as high as 5 and it reaches 0 instantly.
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Re: [Tutor] setting a timer

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Get a slower computer.

 I expect that if you find an old Commodore 64 from 1982, or perhaps
 an 1984 Apple Macintosh, it might be slow enough for your count down
 idea to work. But with modern computers, counting up to, or down from,
 5 is more or less instantaneous in human terms.

 A better way to pause for a moment is this:

 import time
 time.sleep(0.1)  # pause for 0.1 second
 time.sleep(60)  # pause for 1 minutes

hah do u think i could find one of those on ebay???

i wasnt aware of the time module! thanks a lot for your help:)
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Re: [Tutor] simon says

[Matthew Ngaha]

 Sounds as though what is wanted in a Pythonic version of an early electronic 
 game Simon that was marketed back in the late 70's.  It was roughly Frisbee 
 shaped although slightly larger.  The top was divided into four 
 quadrant-shaped paddles each of a different color.  The game consisted of 
 Simon generating longer and longer sequences of random color-sound flashes 
 (each element in the sequence consisted of a momentary sound accompanied by 
 the appropriate quadrant lighting up).  After Simon had generated a sequence, 
 the player had to duplicate it by pressing the paddles.  A successful 
 recreation of a sequence was rewarded by Simon generating a longer one, until 
 the player finally screwed up.  At that point Simon made an electronic rude 
 noise and the device was handed on to the next player if there were multiple 
 players.  The player who succeeded in matching the longest sequence was the 
 winner of that round.

 I'll bet ebay still has them for sale, and Google would get you a description 
 that would be better than mine.

 -Bill

Thanks Bill. I did some more searching and managed to find a few new
versions on youtube with altered gameplay i guess. Here's the closest
to what has been described here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agUABjGAJww

thanks to everyone
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