Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
I apologize if this is too obvious, but just in case ... Taking this one step further, you might also want to consider some flexibility in HOW you implement this by establishing a simple MAP that allows you to vary which information is presented in which tag area for each trading partner --> this can put you in a good trading position, as you can easily "customize" the documentation sent to each trading partner so that it is consumed by their system The same philosophy for accepting incoming transactions will ease your pain on each side of the interface Ross Ferris Stamina Software Visage > Better by Design! -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Tony Gravagno Sent: Saturday, 11 February 2012 10:48 AM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments George, EDI is more people-oriented than technical. The X12 documents provide a structure, and trading partners can discuss the content used to populate those structures to achieve their business goals. There are few details about the 850, 856, 820, 997, 810, etc that can't be negotiated to accommodate specific business practices. Every discussion with a different partner will yield different results, though your inquiry here may give you more ideas to bring to the table, and can help to establish standards among partners. It's been my experience that more time is spent on the phone, in emails, and in the conference room than in code when it comes to EDI. Getting the agreements documented up front saves huge amounts of coding and retrofitting on the back-end. So I encourage you to take the feedback you get here and bring it to your trading partners to see if it works for them - and ask them if they have ideas about how they have already done this or how they see it happening. That partnership toward a common goal (again, very people-oriented) will really help to make this technical initiative work for everyone. HTH T Tony Gravagno Nebula Research and Development TG@ remove.pleaseNebula-RnD.com remove.pleaseNebula-RnD.com/blog Visit http://PickWiki.com! Contribute! http://Twitter.com/TonyGravagno NEW! http://groups.google.com/group/mvdbms/about > From:George Gallen > For those EDIers on the list. > > Do any of you process drop shipments using EDI for 850's? > What method do you use? ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
George, May I suggest that you also post this question to the EDI-L group at: ed...@yahoogroups.com? They are all EDI specialists, much like most of us are U2/multivalue specialists. I'll look for your question on the EDI-L list and I look forward to the responses you get. Best regards, Dave Taylor Sysmark Information Systems, Inc. www.sysmarkinfo.com On 10.02.2012 17:55, George Gallen wrote: Tony, I can't agree more, as I've always said, EDI standards are the most non-standard things I've ever seen. Problem is I hadn't ever worked with drop shipments in EDI, and the trading partner we are trying to do this with has never done using EDI either, and I probably know more about EDI than they do, and I barely have scratched the surface of it, so as you said, we will need to bring to the table the ideas and come to an agreement. Seems that my thought patten for how to address the drop shipment in the transactions seems to be on target with the responses have been, so that's a good sign. But since I'm doing custom software that more depends on what the other side is sending, and what the other side needs, it's really difficult when the other side doesn't know what they need! Yes, we could just come up with a protocol that is good for us, but I really wanted to make sure what we come up with is workable for other partners without much tweeking. George Gallen Senior Programmer/Analyst Accounting/Data Division ggal...@wyanokegroup.com ph:856.848.9005 Ext 220 The Wyanoke Group http://www.wyanokegroup.com From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Tony Gravagno [3xk547...@sneakemail.com] Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 6:47 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments It's been my experience that more time is spent on the phone, in emails, and in the conference room than in code when it comes to EDI. Getting the agreements documented up front saves huge amounts of coding and retrofitting on the back-end. So I encourage you to take the feedback you get here and bring it to your trading partners to see if it works for them - and ask them if they have ideas about how they have already done this or how they see it happening. That partnership toward a common goal (again, very people-oriented) will really help to make this technical initiative work for everyone. HTH T ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
Tony, I can't agree more, as I've always said, EDI standards are the most non-standard things I've ever seen. Problem is I hadn't ever worked with drop shipments in EDI, and the trading partner we are trying to do this with has never done using EDI either, and I probably know more about EDI than they do, and I barely have scratched the surface of it, so as you said, we will need to bring to the table the ideas and come to an agreement. Seems that my thought patten for how to address the drop shipment in the transactions seems to be on target with the responses have been, so that's a good sign. But since I'm doing custom software that more depends on what the other side is sending, and what the other side needs, it's really difficult when the other side doesn't know what they need! Yes, we could just come up with a protocol that is good for us, but I really wanted to make sure what we come up with is workable for other partners without much tweeking. George Gallen Senior Programmer/Analyst Accounting/Data Division ggal...@wyanokegroup.com ph:856.848.9005 Ext 220 The Wyanoke Group http://www.wyanokegroup.com From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Tony Gravagno [3xk547...@sneakemail.com] Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 6:47 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments It's been my experience that more time is spent on the phone, in emails, and in the conference room than in code when it comes to EDI. Getting the agreements documented up front saves huge amounts of coding and retrofitting on the back-end. So I encourage you to take the feedback you get here and bring it to your trading partners to see if it works for them - and ask them if they have ideas about how they have already done this or how they see it happening. That partnership toward a common goal (again, very people-oriented) will really help to make this technical initiative work for everyone. HTH T ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
George, EDI is more people-oriented than technical. The X12 documents provide a structure, and trading partners can discuss the content used to populate those structures to achieve their business goals. There are few details about the 850, 856, 820, 997, 810, etc that can't be negotiated to accommodate specific business practices. Every discussion with a different partner will yield different results, though your inquiry here may give you more ideas to bring to the table, and can help to establish standards among partners. It's been my experience that more time is spent on the phone, in emails, and in the conference room than in code when it comes to EDI. Getting the agreements documented up front saves huge amounts of coding and retrofitting on the back-end. So I encourage you to take the feedback you get here and bring it to your trading partners to see if it works for them - and ask them if they have ideas about how they have already done this or how they see it happening. That partnership toward a common goal (again, very people-oriented) will really help to make this technical initiative work for everyone. HTH T Tony Gravagno Nebula Research and Development TG@ remove.pleaseNebula-RnD.com remove.pleaseNebula-RnD.com/blog Visit http://PickWiki.com! Contribute! http://Twitter.com/TonyGravagno NEW! http://groups.google.com/group/mvdbms/about > From:George Gallen > For those EDIers on the list. > > Do any of you process drop shipments using EDI for 850's? > What method do you use? ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
Without seeing your approach to handling your data, and more importantly how you're feeding this data into your sales order system, I'm not real sure what you're asking for. The only thing I really see in your original question is about recognizing what the data in the N1 loop is. That's what the BT and ST are for. Your approach of how you keep track of the data inside your program is going to be based on the way you think. Myself, I like more descriptive variables like BILLTO.ID and SHIPTO.NAME kind of things. Don't know if I'm clearing the water or stomping in the mud but I hope it helps. Good luck. BobW -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of George Gallen Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 1:51 PM To: U2 Users List Subject: Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments Aside from phone#, the other thought was just a straight text "DROPSHIP", other than That, I wouldn't be relating the phone number to anything, other than a piece of data Isolating the loops isn't a problem. I have a subroutine that converts the EDI To a dynamic array, and it knows that N1 is a loop, and will create separate Them by @VM's N1<1,x> will go with N2<1,x> where x is the loop number. Were using customized programming, so it's not a problem to do unique things Based on the partners ID, or the a specific SAN. Thanks -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Woodward, Bob Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 4:43 PM To: U2 Users List Subject: Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments Are you setting up specifications or do you already have a set that you're working from? You should be able to isolate the N1 loops from each other within a dataset so that each loop is a functional subset. Then, based on the BT/ST code determine what kind of information you have and apply it accordingly to you generating sales order process. The issue you are going to struggle with is going to be the unknown code (phone number) to your system. You probably won't have a customer master records to link to. At least this is one of the issues we're struggling against currently in our efforts to do this. The direction we're going is our sales orders have the extra fields for an actual third-party name and address that is a manual entry on our screens. They are not tied to the customer master file. Our documents and labels that will need to use this third-party address will have to be set so if it exists, it uses it, otherwise it will use the normal ship-to information. For the drop ship orders, the ship-to will have to default to one of the partners normal ship-to's, just to be safe and ensure the shipment never gets lost. Oh, and there really isn't a way to do drop shipments using the SDQ segment unless you have a matching ID of each SDQ CODE/QTY pairing already in your customer master file. At least not without redefining industry standards of the EDI format. I guess/assume you're using the VICS standard. This is a big monster of a change so if you want to talk concepts, we could take this off-list. BobW ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
Aside from phone#, the other thought was just a straight text "DROPSHIP", other than That, I wouldn't be relating the phone number to anything, other than a piece of data Isolating the loops isn't a problem. I have a subroutine that converts the EDI To a dynamic array, and it knows that N1 is a loop, and will create separate Them by @VM's N1<1,x> will go with N2<1,x> where x is the loop number. Were using customized programming, so it's not a problem to do unique things Based on the partners ID, or the a specific SAN. Thanks -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Woodward, Bob Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 4:43 PM To: U2 Users List Subject: Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments Are you setting up specifications or do you already have a set that you're working from? You should be able to isolate the N1 loops from each other within a dataset so that each loop is a functional subset. Then, based on the BT/ST code determine what kind of information you have and apply it accordingly to you generating sales order process. The issue you are going to struggle with is going to be the unknown code (phone number) to your system. You probably won't have a customer master records to link to. At least this is one of the issues we're struggling against currently in our efforts to do this. The direction we're going is our sales orders have the extra fields for an actual third-party name and address that is a manual entry on our screens. They are not tied to the customer master file. Our documents and labels that will need to use this third-party address will have to be set so if it exists, it uses it, otherwise it will use the normal ship-to information. For the drop ship orders, the ship-to will have to default to one of the partners normal ship-to's, just to be safe and ensure the shipment never gets lost. Oh, and there really isn't a way to do drop shipments using the SDQ segment unless you have a matching ID of each SDQ CODE/QTY pairing already in your customer master file. At least not without redefining industry standards of the EDI format. I guess/assume you're using the VICS standard. This is a big monster of a change so if you want to talk concepts, we could take this off-list. BobW ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
Are you setting up specifications or do you already have a set that you're working from? You should be able to isolate the N1 loops from each other within a dataset so that each loop is a functional subset. Then, based on the BT/ST code determine what kind of information you have and apply it accordingly to you generating sales order process. The issue you are going to struggle with is going to be the unknown code (phone number) to your system. You probably won't have a customer master records to link to. At least this is one of the issues we're struggling against currently in our efforts to do this. The direction we're going is our sales orders have the extra fields for an actual third-party name and address that is a manual entry on our screens. They are not tied to the customer master file. Our documents and labels that will need to use this third-party address will have to be set so if it exists, it uses it, otherwise it will use the normal ship-to information. For the drop ship orders, the ship-to will have to default to one of the partners normal ship-to's, just to be safe and ensure the shipment never gets lost. Oh, and there really isn't a way to do drop shipments using the SDQ segment unless you have a matching ID of each SDQ CODE/QTY pairing already in your customer master file. At least not without redefining industry standards of the EDI format. I guess/assume you're using the VICS standard. This is a big monster of a change so if you want to talk concepts, we could take this off-list. BobW -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of George Gallen Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 1:07 PM To: U2 Users Subject: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments For those EDIers on the list. Do any of you process drop shipments using EDI for 850's? What method do you use? We were thinking : First N1 loop - N1 segment contains the BT and use the SAN (15 code) Second N1 loop - N1 segment contains the ST but use phone# for identification (12 code) N2 segment for Drop Ship Name N3 Segment(s) for Drop Ship Address (2 lines per N3 segment) - maximum 2 N3's N4 Segment for Drop Ship City, State, Zip and Country Currently we do not process drop shipments using EDI, and neither does this partner with any of Their other suppliers... George ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
Didn't think about multiple destinationsI would hope that they separate their 850's on the drop ships So that each order is it's own destination. I don't think they want to get too complicated either, so I think we can agree on keeping it simple. Thanks George -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Barry Rogen Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 4:21 PM To: U2 Users List Subject: Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments If you are using one ship to (drop ship) destination then what you suggest below is fine. We often have a 'BT' (bill to) N1, N3 and N4 followed by a 'ST' (ship to) N1, N3 and N4. Footnote: If you are going to have multiple destination in one PO, you will need to look into the SDQ segment. Barry Rogen Senior Programmer/Analyst PNY Technologies, Inc. (973) 560-5327 bro...@pny.com ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
If you are using one ship to (drop ship) destination then what you suggest below is fine. We often have a 'BT' (bill to) N1, N3 and N4 followed by a 'ST' (ship to) N1, N3 and N4. Footnote: If you are going to have multiple destination in one PO, you will need to look into the SDQ segment. Barry Rogen Senior Programmer/Analyst PNY Technologies, Inc. (973) 560-5327 bro...@pny.com We are continually faced with great opportunities brilliantly disguised as insoluble problems. John W Gardner -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of George Gallen Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 4:07 PM To: U2 Users Subject: [U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments For those EDIers on the list. Do any of you process drop shipments using EDI for 850's? What method do you use? We were thinking : First N1 loop - N1 segment contains the BT and use the SAN (15 code) Second N1 loop - N1 segment contains the ST but use phone# for identification (12 code) N2 segment for Drop Ship Name N3 Segment(s) for Drop Ship Address (2 lines per N3 segment) - maximum 2 N3's N4 Segment for Drop Ship City, State, Zip and Country Currently we do not process drop shipments using EDI, and neither does this partner with any of Their other suppliers... George ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users NOT INTENDED AS A SUBSTITUTE FOR A WRITING NOTHING IN THIS E-MAIL, IN ANY E-MAIL THREAD OF WHICH IT MAY BE A PART, OR IN ANY ATTACHMENTS THERETO, SHALL CONSTITUTE A BINDING CONTRACT, OR ANY CONTRACTUAL OBLIGATION BY PNY, OR ANY INTENT TO ENTER INTO ANY BINDING OBLIGATIONS, NOTWITHSTANDING ANY ENACTMENT OF THE UNIFORM ELECTRONIC TRANSACTIONS ACT, THE FEDERAL E-SIGN ACT, OR ANY OTHER STATE OR FEDERAL LAW OF SIMILAR SUBSTANCE OR EFFECT. THIS EMAIL MESSAGE, ITS CONTENTS AND ATTACHMENTS ARE NOT INTENDED TO REPRESENT AN OFFER OR ACCEPTANCE OF AN OFFER TO ENTER INTO A CONTRACT. NOTHING IN THIS E-MAIL, IN ANY E-MAIL THREAD OF WHICH IT MAY BE A PART, OR IN ANY ATTACHMENTS THERETO SHALL ALTER THIS DISCLAIMER. This e-mail message from PNY Technologies, Inc. is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
[U2] [mildly ot] - EDI and drop shipments
For those EDIers on the list. Do any of you process drop shipments using EDI for 850's? What method do you use? We were thinking : First N1 loop - N1 segment contains the BT and use the SAN (15 code) Second N1 loop - N1 segment contains the ST but use phone# for identification (12 code) N2 segment for Drop Ship Name N3 Segment(s) for Drop Ship Address (2 lines per N3 segment) - maximum 2 N3's N4 Segment for Drop Ship City, State, Zip and Country Currently we do not process drop shipments using EDI, and neither does this partner with any of Their other suppliers... George ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
