Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
I have some heartburn with the words optional and purely below. To me, it is like saying that Daniel Webster was just a door-to-door encyclopedia salesman. U2 data dictionaries are key tool. Why would someone climb on to a Rocket... to explore the UniVerse... without a map... of the data? --Bill -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Hona, David Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 8:40 PM To: U2 Users List Subject: Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse) Regardless of the toolset, the first hurdle would be to normalise your database to look like a relational one. Which is likely to be the greatest hurdle. Data dictionaries in U2/PICK are optional are a purely for reporting purposes - they can have duplicates and these can be conflicting. Even worse (as if you thought it could be) - data dictionaries can be incomplete or wrong. This added to the lack of enforcement of data integrity and constraints usually causes these toolsets to fail (indeed, even the UV/ODBC driver fails too!)... so good luck! Rocket released U2 Metadata Manager to assist in this respect and is designed to allow forward and backwards capability. Although, support for this in UV is limited to the latest official release... so your alternative is UV/ODBC... For UV/ODBC users - I have always recommended a separate UV account and data dictionary that is spotless. For some this is the best option - why go against the flow - when you create your own stream... -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Lynette LeDoux Sent: Tuesday, 16 July 2013 5:45 AM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse) Hello all. The call has come to locate possible data modelling tools (UML) that could potentially would connect to our UniVerse system. Ideas? L2 (Lynette LeDoux) -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of u2-users-requ...@listserver.u2ug.org Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 2:00 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: U2-Users Digest, Vol 51, Issue 13 Send U2-Users mailing list submissions to u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to u2-users-requ...@listserver.u2ug.org You can reach the person managing the list at u2-users-ow...@listserver.u2ug.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of U2-Users digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: Mobile phones (Symeon Breen) 2. Re: [ANN] FOSS4MV - Free Open Source Software for the MVDB world (Daniel McGrath) 3. SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 4. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Anthonys Lists) 5. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Don Robinson) 6. Re: Mobile phones (Bill Haskett) 7. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 8. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Bill Haskett) 9. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Wols Lists) 10. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 11. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Wols Lists) 12. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 13. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Wols Lists) -- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 13:20:14 +0100 From: Symeon Breen syme...@gmail.com To: 'U2 Users List' u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] Mobile phones Message-ID: 004d01ce8155$a9f67e30$fde37a90$@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thanks everyone for your information. -- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 14:25:42 + From: Daniel McGrath dmcgr...@rocketsoftware.com To: U2 Users List u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] [ANN] FOSS4MV - Free Open Source Software for the MVDB world Message-ID: 61ef3a8534e14d709dffdc5bd2f27...@den-vm-mbx3.rocketsoftware.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Thanks Tony Kevin! Unhappy to see we both ended up on different platforms (GitHub BitBucket) which means people would need to learn 2 different sites, but ecstatic to see we both ended up using Git which means people really only need to learn 1 tool chain to be able to work with both. Cheers, Dan McGrath Managing Director, U2 Servers Lab Rocket Software 4600 South Ulster Street? ?? Suite 1100? ??? Denver, CO 80237 ?? USA T: +1 720 475 8098 ? E: dmcgr...@rocketsoftware.com ? W: u2.rocketsoftware.com -Original Message- From
Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
I can understand the desire to reshape the world that is, but I prefer a tool that uses the world as already defined. That way you can be assured that changes do not upset it, since it's already coded to allow whatever woolley thing it encounters to be properly understood. Paying people to clean up your dictionaries just so you can map them, seems backward to me. Better to write a tool that can use the dictionaries as they are, and figure out how to map the data from that. I would suggest that any link that is not already defined clearly in the dictionary is probably unimportant at any rate. And by the way, just to throw a wrench, data mapping is really not the fix to anything, without a clear mapping of the processes that create that data, rework it, and destroy it. Mapping the dictionaries doesn't tell you one thing about those. -Original Message- From: Bill Brutzman bi...@hkmetalcraft.com To: 'U2 Users List' u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Sent: Tue, Jul 16, 2013 11:05 am Subject: Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse) I have some heartburn with the words optional and purely below. To me, it is like saying that Daniel Webster was just a door-to-door encyclopedia salesman. U2 data dictionaries are key tool. Why would someone climb on to a Rocket... to explore the UniVerse... without a map... of the data? --Bill -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Hona, David Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 8:40 PM To: U2 Users List Subject: Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse) Regardless of the toolset, the first hurdle would be to normalise your database to look like a relational one. Which is likely to be the greatest hurdle. Data dictionaries in U2/PICK are optional are a purely for reporting purposes - they can have duplicates and these can be conflicting. Even worse (as if you thought it could be) - data dictionaries can be incomplete or wrong. This added to the lack of enforcement of data integrity and constraints usually causes these toolsets to fail (indeed, even the UV/ODBC driver fails too!)... so good luck! Rocket released U2 Metadata Manager to assist in this respect and is designed to allow forward and backwards capability. Although, support for this in UV is limited to the latest official release... so your alternative is UV/ODBC... For UV/ODBC users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
Not so, not so We do not put dict names on our files that reference any kind of credit card information. So if someone is List dicts, it won't jump out at them, there could be information worth taking a look at. What we have been doing, is we have a Word Template, and keep our file layouts that way (full layouts). -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Wjhonson Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2013 2:12 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse) I would suggest that any link that is not already defined clearly in the dictionary is probably unimportant at any ra ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
Not data... links. IMHO, the main force of a data modeling tool, isn't to show you the data in each table, it's to show you how the tables link to each other. So what I was saying in the below snip, is that any missing links, probably aren't important, and the tool should just map what it sees, ignore what it doesn't see. You can then have exceptions. To me that's a lot easier than createing an entirely other structure and the need to keep that in sync with the base structure -Original Message- From: George Gallen ggal...@wyanokegroup.com To: U2 Users List u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Sent: Tue, Jul 16, 2013 11:23 am Subject: Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse) Not so, not so We do not put dict names on our files that reference any kind of credit card information. So if someone is List dicts, it won't jump out at them, there could be information worth taking a look at. What we have been doing, is we have a Word Template, and keep our file layouts that way (full layouts). -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Wjhonson Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2013 2:12 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse) I would suggest that any link that is not already defined clearly in the dictionary is probably unimportant at any ra ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
On 16/07/13 01:39, Hona, David wrote: Regardless of the toolset, the first hurdle would be to normalise your database to look like a relational one. Which is likely to be the greatest hurdle. Data dictionaries in U2/PICK are optional are a purely for reporting purposes - they can have duplicates and these can be conflicting. Even worse (as if you thought it could be) - data dictionaries can be incomplete or wrong. This added to the lack of enforcement of data integrity and constraints usually causes these toolsets to fail (indeed, even the UV/ODBC driver fails too!)... so good luck! Rocket released U2 Metadata Manager to assist in this respect and is designed to allow forward and backwards capability. Although, support for this in UV is limited to the latest official release... so your alternative is UV/ODBC... For UV/ODBC users - I have always recommended a separate UV account and data dictionary that is spotless. For some this is the best option - why go against the flow - when you create your own stream... And look on Pickwiki - there are a few tools there meant to clean up dictionaries ready for ODBC export. The problem is when there's loads of data of the wrong type in your field ... :-) What do you do when you need to clean the data file, as well as the dict ... Cheers, Wol ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
[U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
Hello all. The call has come to locate possible data modelling tools (UML) that could potentially would connect to our UniVerse system. Ideas? L2 (Lynette LeDoux) -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of u2-users-requ...@listserver.u2ug.org Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 2:00 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: U2-Users Digest, Vol 51, Issue 13 Send U2-Users mailing list submissions to u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to u2-users-requ...@listserver.u2ug.org You can reach the person managing the list at u2-users-ow...@listserver.u2ug.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of U2-Users digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: Mobile phones (Symeon Breen) 2. Re: [ANN] FOSS4MV - Free Open Source Software for the MVDB world (Daniel McGrath) 3. SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 4. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Anthonys Lists) 5. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Don Robinson) 6. Re: Mobile phones (Bill Haskett) 7. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 8. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Bill Haskett) 9. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Wols Lists) 10. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 11. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Wols Lists) 12. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 13. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Wols Lists) -- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 13:20:14 +0100 From: Symeon Breen syme...@gmail.com To: 'U2 Users List' u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] Mobile phones Message-ID: 004d01ce8155$a9f67e30$fde37a90$@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thanks everyone for your information. -- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 14:25:42 + From: Daniel McGrath dmcgr...@rocketsoftware.com To: U2 Users List u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] [ANN] FOSS4MV - Free Open Source Software for the MVDB world Message-ID: 61ef3a8534e14d709dffdc5bd2f27...@den-vm-mbx3.rocketsoftware.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Thanks Tony Kevin! Unhappy to see we both ended up on different platforms (GitHub BitBucket) which means people would need to learn 2 different sites, but ecstatic to see we both ended up using Git which means people really only need to learn 1 tool chain to be able to work with both. Cheers, Dan McGrath Managing Director, U2 Servers Lab Rocket Software 4600 South Ulster Street? ?? Suite 1100? ??? Denver, CO 80237 ?? USA T: +1 720 475 8098 ? E: dmcgr...@rocketsoftware.com ? W: u2.rocketsoftware.com -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Tony Gravagno Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2013 5:47 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: [U2] [ANN] FOSS4MV - Free Open Source Software for the MVDB world Posted for Kevin Powick === Fellow developers, I'm happy to announce a new resource for MVDB developers. FOSS4MV! FOSS4MV is a community for people that use or develop Free and Open Source Software for MVDB platforms, such as D3, OpenQM, jBASE, U2, Reality, Cache, etc. As such, it has three major offerings to promote communication and collaboration. A Google+ Community, source code repositories at Bitbucket, and a Twitter account to keep you in-the-loop. Google+ is a surprisingly useful communications platform that makes it easy to share information with individuals, groups, or the public at large. Some G+ communities have memberships that number in the tens of thousands, and I know that many MV developers already have a G+ account. Bitbucket, from Atlassian, is a leading provider of source code repository hosting using today's two leading source code control platforms, Git and Mercurial (Hg). Not only does Bitbucket support the top two SCC platforms, but they also allow unlimited, free public and private** repositories. FOSS4MV is set up as a bitbucket Team allowing people to join the team and create repositories under the FOSS4MV banner, while still retaining complete control over the management of their repositories. However, there is no requirement to join the FOSS4MV team account to get your code on the site. If you're just looking for a good home to share your code, but do not wish to manage a repository, let us know via email (foss...@gmail.com) and
Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
There is MITS. (Assuming its still out there. Been a while since I've been in the U2-verse.) When I worked at Zaner-Bloser we looked at getting it as a 3D data mining tool for marketing. The thing that stopped us was the time it would take to build the data cubes. We estimated it would take over a month. That was some time ago. It might be better now. -- View this message in context: http://u2-universe-unidata.1073795.n5.nabble.com/UML-mapping-tool-for-MV-UniVerse-tp41216p41217.html Sent from the U2 - Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
Hi Lynette: Are looking for structural diagrams like a Class Diagram? This would involve reading through all of your code and developing the appropriate structure from the UniBasic code. We have been doing this internally for a couple of years at U2logic using our XLr8Editor Eclipse plug-in that reads and indexes all of your UniBasic code it knows about. Contact me off-line and we can discuss how to get this done for you. Regards, Doug www.u2logic.com/tools.html On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 1:44 PM, Lynette LeDoux lynette.led...@mouser.comwrote: Hello all. The call has come to locate possible data modelling tools (UML) that could potentially would connect to our UniVerse system. Ideas? L2 (Lynette LeDoux) ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
Hi Lynette: Are looking for structural diagrams like a Class Diagram? This would involve reading through all of your code and developing the appropriate structure from the UniBasic code. We have been doing this internally for a couple of years at U2logic using our XLr8Editor Eclipse plug-in that reads and indexes all of your UniBasic code it knows about. Contact me off-line and we can discuss how to get this done for you. Regards, Doug www.u2logic.com/tools.html On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 1:44 PM, Lynette LeDoux lynette.led...@mouser.comwrote: Hello all. The call has come to locate possible data modelling tools (UML) that could potentially would connect to our UniVerse system. Ideas? L2 (Lynette LeDoux) ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse)
Regardless of the toolset, the first hurdle would be to normalise your database to look like a relational one. Which is likely to be the greatest hurdle. Data dictionaries in U2/PICK are optional are a purely for reporting purposes - they can have duplicates and these can be conflicting. Even worse (as if you thought it could be) - data dictionaries can be incomplete or wrong. This added to the lack of enforcement of data integrity and constraints usually causes these toolsets to fail (indeed, even the UV/ODBC driver fails too!)... so good luck! Rocket released U2 Metadata Manager to assist in this respect and is designed to allow forward and backwards capability. Although, support for this in UV is limited to the latest official release... so your alternative is UV/ODBC... For UV/ODBC users - I have always recommended a separate UV account and data dictionary that is spotless. For some this is the best option - why go against the flow - when you create your own stream... -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Lynette LeDoux Sent: Tuesday, 16 July 2013 5:45 AM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: [U2] UML mapping tool for MV (UniVerse) Hello all. The call has come to locate possible data modelling tools (UML) that could potentially would connect to our UniVerse system. Ideas? L2 (Lynette LeDoux) -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of u2-users-requ...@listserver.u2ug.org Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 2:00 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: U2-Users Digest, Vol 51, Issue 13 Send U2-Users mailing list submissions to u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to u2-users-requ...@listserver.u2ug.org You can reach the person managing the list at u2-users-ow...@listserver.u2ug.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of U2-Users digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: Mobile phones (Symeon Breen) 2. Re: [ANN] FOSS4MV - Free Open Source Software for the MVDB world (Daniel McGrath) 3. SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 4. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Anthonys Lists) 5. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Don Robinson) 6. Re: Mobile phones (Bill Haskett) 7. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 8. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Bill Haskett) 9. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Wols Lists) 10. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 11. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Wols Lists) 12. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (randyleesmith) 13. Re: SORT reports line length, change right margin? (Wols Lists) -- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 13:20:14 +0100 From: Symeon Breen syme...@gmail.com To: 'U2 Users List' u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] Mobile phones Message-ID: 004d01ce8155$a9f67e30$fde37a90$@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thanks everyone for your information. -- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 14:25:42 + From: Daniel McGrath dmcgr...@rocketsoftware.com To: U2 Users List u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] [ANN] FOSS4MV - Free Open Source Software for the MVDB world Message-ID: 61ef3a8534e14d709dffdc5bd2f27...@den-vm-mbx3.rocketsoftware.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Thanks Tony Kevin! Unhappy to see we both ended up on different platforms (GitHub BitBucket) which means people would need to learn 2 different sites, but ecstatic to see we both ended up using Git which means people really only need to learn 1 tool chain to be able to work with both. Cheers, Dan McGrath Managing Director, U2 Servers Lab Rocket Software 4600 South Ulster Street? ?? Suite 1100? ??? Denver, CO 80237 ?? USA T: +1 720 475 8098 ? E: dmcgr...@rocketsoftware.com ? W: u2.rocketsoftware.com -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Tony Gravagno Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2013 5:47 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: [U2] [ANN] FOSS4MV - Free Open Source Software for the MVDB world Posted for Kevin Powick === Fellow developers, I'm happy to announce a new resource for MVDB developers. FOSS4MV! FOSS4MV is a community for people that use or develop Free and Open Source Software for MVDB platforms, such as D3, OpenQM
