Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Álvaro Medina Ballester]

I think that with artwork documentation is enough.



El 28/11/2007, a las 23:48, Kenneth Wimer escribió:

> On Wednesday 28 November 2007 23:26:18 Cory K. wrote:
>> No. Im simply talking about a reference page with links to other  
>> docs.
>> Like Álvaro posted in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/ 
>> Documentation. Not
>> some mega doc we (kwwii) creates. ;)
>
> While such a "document" (I'd say book) would be helpful at times I  
> doubt that
> it will ever exist. Making one would take a while and I bet that by  
> the time
> you finished it you could turn around and start editing it to  
> include the new
> features not to mention the basic changes to the existing  
> infrastructure.
>
> --
> Kenneth
>
> -- 
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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Kenneth Wimer]

On Wednesday 28 November 2007 23:26:18 Cory K. wrote:
> No. Im simply talking about a reference page with links to other docs.
> Like Álvaro posted in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Documentation. Not
> some mega doc we (kwwii) creates. ;)

While such a "document" (I'd say book) would be helpful at times I doubt that 
it will ever exist. Making one would take a while and I bet that by the time 
you finished it you could turn around and start editing it to include the new 
features not to mention the basic changes to the existing infrastructure.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Cory K.]

No. Im simply talking about a reference page with links to other docs.
Like Álvaro posted in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Documentation. Not
some mega doc we (kwwii) creates. ;)

-Cory

Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen wrote:
> On 28/11/2007, *Cory K.* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > wrote:
>
> Álvaro Medina Ballester wrote:
> > Hope this time we're talking about the same thing ;)
>
> Unfortunately no.
>
> Something more akin to this:
> http://live.gnome.org/GnomeArt/Tutorials
> 
>
> How things are created and how they work.
>
>
> Cory, as much as I would like your idea about a reference doc on what
> can, and what can't, be done in a Gnome theme - and what requires
> changes to theme engines and/or metacity; I just don't think it can be
> done.
>
> The documentation for what can be done with a theme engine would 99%
> likely become so long and technical that no-one except die harders
> would read and understand it. And by die harders I mean people who
> would have no problem hacking up their own theme engine anyway.
>
> Besides the stuff that is possible in theory might not be feasible to
> implement for a LTS release like Hardy. Our theoretical documents
> would become even longer and more technical if this important
> information was added...
>
> Alternative: Put some docs on the wiki that tells you howto make
> mockups that makes it easy to spot impossible feats.
>
> Here's how: Take of in a screenshot of an actual theme. Each time you
> do a manual tweak add a red arrow and a little info-box saying
> "transparent toolbar here". This way it would be trivial to pinpoint
> places that might be of shady business.
>
> Cheers,
> Mikkel

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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen]

On 28/11/2007, Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Álvaro Medina Ballester wrote:
> > Hope this time we're talking about the same thing ;)
>
> Unfortunately no.
>
> Something more akin to this: http://live.gnome.org/GnomeArt/Tutorials
>
> How things are created and how they work.


Cory, as much as I would like your idea about a reference doc on what can,
and what can't, be done in a Gnome theme - and what requires changes to
theme engines and/or metacity; I just don't think it can be done.

The documentation for what can be done with a theme engine would 99% likely
become so long and technical that no-one except die harders would read and
understand it. And by die harders I mean people who would have no problem
hacking up their own theme engine anyway.

Besides the stuff that is possible in theory might not be feasible to
implement for a LTS release like Hardy. Our theoretical documents would
become even longer and more technical if this important information was
added...

Alternative: Put some docs on the wiki that tells you howto make mockups
that makes it easy to spot impossible feats.

Here's how: Take of in a screenshot of an actual theme. Each time you do a
manual tweak add a red arrow and a little info-box saying "transparent
toolbar here". This way it would be trivial to pinpoint places that might be
of shady business.

Cheers,
Mikkel
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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Álvaro Medina Ballester]

Cory, in the first link (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Documentation) you
have a Theming section that links to the the same place that you have
posted, live.gnome.com/GnomeArt
;)

2007/11/28, Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> Álvaro Medina Ballester wrote:
> > Hope this time we're talking about the same thing ;)
>
> Unfortunately no.
>
> Something more akin to this: http://live.gnome.org/GnomeArt/Tutorials
>
> How things are created and how they work.
>
> -Cory \m/
>
> --
> ubuntu-art mailing list
> ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
>



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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Cory K.]

Álvaro Medina Ballester wrote:
> Hope this time we're talking about the same thing ;)

Unfortunately no.

Something more akin to this: http://live.gnome.org/GnomeArt/Tutorials

How things are created and how they work.

-Cory \m/

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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Álvaro Medina Ballester]

Yes, I've read all the discussion. I thought that we moved to another thing,
but we don't. Here you have some interesting links:

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Documentation

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Official

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuTitle

Hope this time we're talking about the same thing ;)

2007/11/28, Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> Álvaro Medina Ballester wrote:
> >
> >
> > 2007/11/28, Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED] >:
> >
> > Please everyone don't take this off topic. Does anyone know some
> good
> > links to post to use as reference? Things that are possible within
> > GNOME
> > now?
> >
> >
> > If your asking for ideas, lyrae
> > <
> http://www.gnome-look.org/usermanager/search.php?username=lyrae&action=contents
> >
> > has a lot of great ideas.
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Álvaro.
>
> No. Read back to the start of the thread.
>
> --
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>



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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Kenneth Wimer]

Hi,

Before we go rushing off into a poll thought I might clear things up.

On Wednesday 28 November 2007 19:46:09 julian wrote:
> regardless, that will only take us toward a slightly more practical place
> than we're at now: we still have to decide on what theme we work toward and
> i don't see consolidated agreement on that happening on this list in the
> near future.
>
> for this reason i'd like to see a 7-day public poll on ~10 mockups selected
> this list, looking beyond the scope of Ubuntu-art.

Feel free to have any polls you want for the community based artwork.

However, the default artwork in the distribution will be based strictly on a 
well defined art direction which will be ready by the end of next week 
sometime.

--
Ken



> advertise the poll on ubuntu-user related lists, digg it etc. at least
> then we'd have some real basis for determining what people that already
> use Ubuntu (and perhaps a few of those that don't) really want in a
> theme. i think we should open up this process.
>
> for instance this theme got over a thousand diggs by Ubuntu fans
> recently:
>
>   http://blog.slyon.de/?p=154
>
> we should listen to this stuff i think.
>
> perhaps Mark S. can select the mockups to be voted on from a page we
> provide him?
>
> cheers,
>
> julian
>
> --
> julian oliver
> http://julianoliver.com
> http://selectparks.net
>
> > On 11/28/07, Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > Is it just me or does it seem that some people don't know the technical
> > > limitations in dealing with GNOME and such?
> > >
> > > I love some of the concepts don't get me wrong, but I just feel we need
> > > to let people know a little more what can and can't be currently done.
> > > I would hate to see someone put so much effort into something that can
> > > be done.
> > >
> > > Maybe we should have a page with technical links?
> > >
> > > -Cory \m/
> > >
> > > --
> > > ubuntu-art mailing list
> > > ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com
> > > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
> >
> > --
> > Iacopo Masi
> >
> > --
> > ubuntu-art mailing list
> > ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com
> > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art

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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Cory K.]

Álvaro Medina Ballester wrote:
>
>
> 2007/11/28, Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED] >:
>
> Please everyone don't take this off topic. Does anyone know some good
> links to post to use as reference? Things that are possible within
> GNOME
> now?
>
>
> If your asking for ideas, lyrae
> 
> has a lot of great ideas. 
>
>  
>
> -- 
> Álvaro.

No. Read back to the start of the thread.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Álvaro Medina Ballester]

2007/11/28, Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> Please everyone don't take this off topic. Does anyone know some good
> links to post to use as reference? Things that are possible within GNOME
> now?


If your asking for ideas,
lyraehas
a lot of great ideas.



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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Cory K.]

Please everyone don't take this off topic. Does anyone know some good
links to post to use as reference? Things that are possible within GNOME
now?

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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[julian]

..on Wed, Nov 28, 2007 at 07:16:11PM +0100, Iacopo Masi wrote:
> Well said!
> Well said!
> Stop mockup!
> Let's code.

code towards what? 

if you have ideas and would rather demonstrate them with actual working
themes then that is of course great. make it and take a screenshot and/or 
upload the theme. 

regardless, that will only take us toward a slightly more practical place than 
we're at now: we still have to decide on what theme we work toward and i don't 
see consolidated agreement on that happening on this list in the near future. 

for this reason i'd like to see a 7-day public poll on ~10 mockups selected 
this list, looking beyond the scope of Ubuntu-art. 

advertise the poll on ubuntu-user related lists, digg it etc. at least 
then we'd have some real basis for determining what people that already
use Ubuntu (and perhaps a few of those that don't) really want in a 
theme. i think we should open up this process.

for instance this theme got over a thousand diggs by Ubuntu fans
recently:

http://blog.slyon.de/?p=154

we should listen to this stuff i think.

perhaps Mark S. can select the mockups to be voted on from a page we 
provide him?

cheers,

julian

-- 
julian oliver
http://julianoliver.com
http://selectparks.net

> On 11/28/07, Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Is it just me or does it seem that some people don't know the technical
> > limitations in dealing with GNOME and such?
> >
> > I love some of the concepts don't get me wrong, but I just feel we need
> > to let people know a little more what can and can't be currently done. I
> > would hate to see someone put so much effort into something that can be
> > done.
> >
> > Maybe we should have a page with technical links?
> >
> > -Cory \m/
> >
> > --
> > ubuntu-art mailing list
> > ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com
> > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
> >
> 
> 
> -- 
> Iacopo Masi
> 
> -- 
> ubuntu-art mailing list
> ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art


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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Iacopo Masi]

Well said!
Well said!
Stop mockup!
Let's code.

On 11/28/07, Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Is it just me or does it seem that some people don't know the technical
> limitations in dealing with GNOME and such?
>
> I love some of the concepts don't get me wrong, but I just feel we need
> to let people know a little more what can and can't be currently done. I
> would hate to see someone put so much effort into something that can be
> done.
>
> Maybe we should have a page with technical links?
>
> -Cory \m/
>
> --
> ubuntu-art mailing list
> ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
>


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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[xl cheese]

Good idea, but I would not want to put a cap on thinking outside of the box.
 
We can update engines to do what we want, but the engines are limited by gnome. 
 Otherwise we need to put pressure on gnome to create/modify features.



> Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 11:46:40 -0500> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: 
> ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com> Subject: Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality 
> based concept art.> > Correction.> > Cory K. wrote:> > I> > would hate to see 
> someone put so much effort into something that *can't* be> > done.> > > > -- 
> > ubuntu-art mailing list> ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com> 
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
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Re: [ubuntu-art] Technical reality based concept art.

[Cory K.]

Correction.

Cory K. wrote:
> I
> would hate to see someone put so much effort into something that *can't* be
> done.
>   

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