Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
On Mon, 2008-05-12 at 02:17 +0200, Vincenzo Ciancia wrote: > Il giorno dom, 11/05/2008 alle 17.32 -0400, Mackenzie Morgan ha scritto: > > On Sun, 2008-05-11 at 10:40 +0200, Vincenzo Ciancia wrote > > I wish I could configure what it considers "low." > > You can: just launch gconf-editor and take a look at > apps/gnome-power-manager/thresholds. It claims it hibernates when 2 minutes remain. It lies. -- Mackenzie Morgan http://ubuntulinuxtipstricks.blogspot.com apt-get moo signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
Il giorno dom, 11/05/2008 alle 17.32 -0400, Mackenzie Morgan ha scritto: > On Sun, 2008-05-11 at 10:40 +0200, Vincenzo Ciancia wrote > I wish I could configure what it considers "low." You can: just launch gconf-editor and take a look at apps/gnome-power-manager/thresholds. Vincenzo -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubiquity - setting a separate /home by default
David Prieto wrote: > Some time ago, I posted this idea on Ubuntu Brainstorm, about the > possibility to use a separate /home folder by default on systems where, > depending on free disk space, it is considered advisable. The main reason for a separate home seems to be so that you can do a clean install without loosing your documents. Ubiquity can now install onto a partition that has an existing home directory without deleting it. It just removes the system directories. A separate home adds the hassle of filling up one partition, but have lots of space on another. Sam -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
On Sun, 2008-05-11 at 10:40 +0200, Vincenzo Ciancia wrote: > Il giorno dom, 11/05/2008 alle 00.07 -0400, Mackenzie Morgan ha scritto: > > Some people simply don't bother hibernate/suspend. > > If you forget your laptop unplugged (and this can happen to every human > being) having proper suspend is the only way to be sure not to lose > data. You can set it to shut down when the battery gets low as well. Mine is set to hibernate, but I wish I could configure what it considers "low." You see, by the time it's halfway done hibernating, it just completely turns off. Hibernate *should* store everything and not need battery for when you run out, except it takes so long to take effect that it's totally useless. If hibernation takes 30 seconds to complete, why is it only kicked in 10 seconds before power off? I always have to fsck after an emergency-hibernate anyway then, and that's not how it should work. -- Mackenzie Morgan http://ubuntulinuxtipstricks.blogspot.com apt-get moo signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: The new firefox start page looks a bit tricky when searching google
Il giorno dom, 11/05/2008 alle 15.11 -0400, Blaise Alleyne ha scritto: > > I tend to agree. I can see the point of a start page with more > information about Ubuntu and such, there's an argument for it... but > even so, do we really need a custom search on that start page? What's > the point of having a search bar on that page anyways? Looking at http://www.google.com/coop/cse/ and at the increased number of banners I think canonical is making money out of that - if this is the case, it should be stated on the web page above the search (something like "search google with this form and make ubuntu earn money"), just to show everybody that ubuntu is not the usual business company. Especially considered that an option that google offers to non-profit organizations is to have a custom search _without_ ads. Your mileage may vary, I understand that :) Vincenzo -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Ubiquity - setting a separate /home by default
Some time ago, I posted this idea on Ubuntu Brainstorm, about the possibility to use a separate /home folder by default on systems where, depending on free disk space, it is considered advisable. http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/5390/ It has grown very popular, to the point of ranking #10 in popularity -there are over 8,000 ideas in the page-. I really do think it's a good idea so I'm bringing it here for discussion. Here are some mockups of how the Ubiquity dialogue should look. As you see, it does not even add an additional step to the installer, nor does it require any interaction or decision taking from the user, although it still allows him to. http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/7958/firstinstallaro2.png http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/9034/secondinstalliq1.png What do devs think of it? Would it be possible to see something like this in Intrepid? Regards, David Prieto. PS I'm not subscribed to the list, so if you reply to this message please CC me. Thanks in advance. -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: The new firefox start page looks a bit tricky when searching google
Milan Bouchet-Valat wrote: > Le samedi 10 mai 2008 à 16:01 +0200, Vincenzo Ciancia a écrit : > >> And, to get back on the issue, perhaps the page could just be made >> local. >> > Why do we need a special Ubuntu homepage anyway? The first thing I do > when creating an account is changing my homepage to google.com. This > practice mades me think of Internet Explorer defaulting to msn.com - > well, much less ugly since our page is not full of ads and is using a > "real" search engine. > > Wouldn't it be better to provide a page with help and informations about > Ubuntu and some links like: "Set your homepage to google.com"/"to > yahoo.com"/"to a custom page" ? > We should keep in mind that people install an OS not to think about this > OS but to work or surf; let's not be intrusive but help them to find > easily what they want. > > What do you think? > > I tend to agree. I can see the point of a start page with more information about Ubuntu and such, there's an argument for it... but even so, do we really need a custom search on that start page? What's the point of having a search bar on that page anyways? -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
Il giorno dom, 11/05/2008 alle 12.20 -0400, ffm ha scritto: > > > Or you could just set your laptop to power-down on critical battery. This won't save me from loosing what I didn't save (hopefully, I will use only editors with good autosave capabilities but I don't know the general situation) > Or > just remember to turn it off. > I just provided what I consider the strongest argument in favour of suspend-to-disk. Sometimes when I am traveling I forget to check the battery because I am under pressure and I have to work until the last bit of battery. Seeing the laptop suddenly die is a pity. I understand that there is a general mood to consider suspend-to-disk an unnecessary toy (at least this seems to be reflected by the status of suspend-to-disk in many linux distributions - on ubuntu we don't even have the text progress bar of suspend-to-disk, and nobody that I asked to knows why). However, there are good reason to consider it useful on laptops. I am nowadays using an old laptop that has no longer a battery, because mine is broken. On this model suspend-to-disk works like a charm. When I have to move the laptop from an office to the other, it's so helpful to be able to just suspend it and not closing all applications, you likely can't even imagine. And by the way, ubuntu is the perfect software for an older laptop, and works fast and pretty :) Vincenzo -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
Vincenzo Ciancia wrote: Il giorno dom, 11/05/2008 alle 00.07 -0400, Mackenzie Morgan ha scritto: Some people simply don't bother hibernate/suspend. If you forget your laptop unplugged (and this can happen to every human being) having proper suspend is the only way to be sure not to lose data. Or you could just set your laptop to power-down on critical battery. Or just remember to turn it off. -FFM signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
On Sat, May 10, 2008 at 12:43 PM, Sam Tygier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Intrepid seems to me like a good time to include the prefetching work that > was done in 2007 summer of code. and maybe preload as well (more for > application load time than boot time), if the two can work together. > Quoting one of the last comments from the brainstorm idea: " Hello everyone. I am the author of Google Summer of Code 2007 prefetching for Ubuntu. I did not get any feedback on prefetch project mailing list (or any other way), so I thought it is not used, and did not have motivation to further work on it. And then I have come across this site :) I will soon be working on adapting my prefetching solution to K/Ubuntu 8.10, so I need as much information about performance, problems, regressions, etc. as possible. Please send comments about prefetching to mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] (no subscription necessary, just send e-mail) or report bugs on Launchpad project (https://launchpad.net/prefetch/). TIA Krzysztof Lichota " -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
On Sat, 2008-05-10 at 12:53 -0700, Bryce Harrington wrote: > It's curious Fedora 9 showed such poor results compared with Ubuntu (and > compared with Fedora 8), given that they are listing fast Xorg boot as a > feature. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/OneSecondX I wouldn't say it is surprising compared to Ubuntu - if you look at the Fedora chart ( the dates link to charts like https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BootCharting?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=SitsofeWheeler-fedora-9-beta.png ) you can see the machine is massively CPU bound throughout and peak I/O throughput isn't that great (at least compared to distros with some sort of preload/readahead although one would need test the benefit of that versus the time it takes to do). Additionally some of its boot services seem to do a fair amount of writing to the disk causing kjournald to use up IO. Now Fedora are well known for including huge amounts of debugging in their kernels while the distro is in alpha/beta testing so perhaps this isn't yet representative of the true final speed. Compared to Fedora 8... something funny seems to be happening around udevsettle though (9s seconds versus 14s) and the time it takes for kernel to start appears to be longer in the F9 chart. Further the new gdm just isn't as fast at starting autologin as the old gdm (but you can't see that on the chart). Unlike the chart for Hardy though, there is only one small gap of no CPU/IO usage once userland has started so the long times don't seem to be predominantly due to a slow X (although Xorg is started twice so X speed will matter more in Fedora than Ubuntu). Rather, Fedora just seems to start and do a huge amount. It's definitely a distro for higher spec machines capable of crunching through stuff at a better. Looking at the services it starts it seems geared towards more traditional *nix corporate desktops / servers. > I'll be interested to see if the fast Xorg boot stuff in the upcoming > Xorg 1.5 will boost our boot numbers, or if the Xorg boot time just gets > lost in the noise. I should think it would help (at least in the time to the clock test rather than to gdm) as GNOME tasks should be kicked off sooner. However fake gains could be made by allowing GNOME to be responsive even when the clock (which is often the last applet to load) hasn't finished loading. However if more GNOME utilities need to be started any gains will be washed away in the autologin case. Some more boot comparisons can be seen on http://www.harald-hoyer.de/linux/boot-time-distro-comparison . -- Sitsofe | http://sucs.org/~sits/ -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
Il giorno dom, 11/05/2008 alle 00.07 -0400, Mackenzie Morgan ha scritto: > Some people simply don't bother hibernate/suspend. If you forget your laptop unplugged (and this can happen to every human being) having proper suspend is the only way to be sure not to lose data. Vincenzo -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
On Sun, 2008-05-11 at 08:28 +0100, Sitsofe Wheeler wrote: > On Sat, 2008-05-10 at 09:48 -0400, Mackenzie Morgan wrote: > > Issues with slow-loading GNOME popped up in Gutsy. There's been a lot > > of discussion on that bug. It seems the gnome-panel just hangs for a > > while opening and closing something. > > Do you have a link to the discussion? Were things suposed to be any > better in Hardy? Bug #128803 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-session/+bug/128803 Someone said they'd heard it was fixed in Hardy, but subscribers say that is far from the case. -- Mackenzie Morgan http://ubuntulinuxtipstricks.blogspot.com apt-get moo signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
On Sat, 2008-05-10 at 09:48 -0400, Mackenzie Morgan wrote: > Issues with slow-loading GNOME popped up in Gutsy. There's been a lot > of discussion on that bug. It seems the gnome-panel just hangs for a > while opening and closing something. Do you have a link to the discussion? Were things suposed to be any better in Hardy? -- Sitsofe | http://sucs.org/~sits/ -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Ubuntu boot speed fall in Hardy
On Sat, 2008-05-10 at 17:34 +0200, Markus Hitter wrote: > Am 10.05.2008 um 11:58 schrieb Sitsofe Wheeler: > > I've noticed that Ubuntu's boot speed seems to have taken a fall in > > Hardy. > > How would one notice? Is Hardys hibernating/standby still so flaky > one is forced to shut down the computer more than once a month? You notice if you ever start a live CD (although really that's a different case). I notice because suspend to ram has never worked on my machine (there's already a year old bug in launchpad about it) and I like to know that any problems I find aren't due to a bad resume. Then there are machines using the open source NVIDIA drivers can't resume after suspend to ram in X due to a lack of information - http://katzj.livejournal.com/407566.html?thread=350990#t350990 . There are also machines that are used for shared logins. While they might not be shutdown you are affected by the time it takes for your desktop to appear after GDM... > Maybe such questions appear not serious to some and maybe it even > looks like I want to disencourage you, but I'd be much more concerned > about standby stability as about boot times. Hey by all means fix my suspend to ram / resume issue - if you want to know more let me know. However there are always going to be times when you do a cold boot (e.g. after doing a kernel upgrade) and some people just prefer doing shutdowns. Ubuntu has focused on speedy boots in the past so it seems a shame to quietly erode that work. -- Sitsofe | http://sucs.org/~sits/ -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: I would just like to say...
On Sat, May 10, 2008 at 10:38 PM, Robert Azinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I do not know where to send a post like this so I hope this one email will > find its way in the sea of posts out there. [snip; full text at https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2008-May/004196.html] I have dutifully forwarded it on to Bug #1: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1 Glad to hear that *buntu helped make someone's life a little easier :-) Sincerely, Conrad Knauer (Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada) -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
I would just like to say...
This post is for all of you out there who have developed or contributed to Linux/Ubuntu projects and all of the open source coders who read this.I do not know where to send a post like this so I hope this one email will find its way in the sea of posts out there. I thank you to the point of tears. Earlier this week I installed Kubuntu on a refurbished AMD computer I purchased for $184 from a discount online vendor, it came with no OS. It now runs like a champ. We cant afford much and this was my 14 year old daughter's birthday present this past week. She is overjoyed. And she is already trying to tackle Adept Manager and exploring Linux; adding bling and her music, of course. I cant tell you how much I appreciate the work you all have done. Its a work of art. If I could thank each and every one of you I would. You have given her the world to learn and explore. So if you get frustrated or tired in your work for Open Source/Free Software, just remember that somewhere in Missouri there is a 14 year-old girl named Hope, an A-student who runs on the track team, who is now your biggest fan and one of the newest users of Linux/Ubuntu. Thanks most sincerely, R.B.A. Missouri - Robert. B. Azinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
