Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Agenda for 2018-05-05
On Sun, 6 May 2018, Thomas Pfundt wrote: However, the most important consideration is that a majority of users find dark text on bright backgrounds easier to read. A bright background forces the eye to focus and makes edge recognition easier, some people even have serious trouble reading bright text on dark backgrounds, because they experience a glow effect, making the letters fade into each other. There are some studies on this somewhere, but I'm too lazy to look them up right now, they should be relatively easy to find, though. For the most part that is correct. The one glaring exception is terminals that use ansi colours. No one seems to have taken the time to theme every ansi colour to make sure it works against the BG. So in my romp through available themes I would get a light theme and my terminal (I am writing this in a terminal running alpine) the background would go light and the text dark. this is fine... though the letters seem thinner to my older eyes and harder to read, but it is acceptable. However, I then type "ls" at the command prompt and am lucky if I can read half the files in the directory because they are all coloured by type. Ansi colour is from the days of CRTs when VGA was king... but is still in very high use. The we come to graphic manipulation. For someone who is creating graphics colour is very important. Having a big white tool box sitting close to or on top of a graphic does make the colours one is using to paint with harder to visualize properly. A portait studio that uses their camera teathered to their computer would want a mostly dark screen that does not interfere or add colour to their subjects. So whatever the default theme, there needs to included alternatives to cover the workflows Studio includes. Someone doing publishig would probably agree that light bg was best. (though I think such applications tend to force their own theme anyway) In any case, the theme is something that needs testing with a variety of applications in a variety uses (I have had some themes that make it impossible to enter a password in firefox) -- Len Ovens www.ovenwerks.net -- ubuntu-studio-devel mailing list ubuntu-studio-devel@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-studio-devel
Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Agenda for 2018-05-05
>On May 5, 2018 8:33 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: >> On Sat, 5 May 2018 07:25:16 -0700, er...@ericheickmeyer.com wrote: >> > New theme (something with a dark variant)? >> >> Maintaining a theme that works good for all apps is very hard. I've >> never seen a dark theme that really worked and was well maintained. > >I'm not sure how relevant this still is, but I'd also highly advise against >using a dark theme as default. It's great if there's a dark variant available >for those that want to use it (like myself, using Blackbird currently), but >it's not the best choice to make it the standard. > >I've also had some trouble making the dark theme work everywhere, some >programs will display input fields dark and not change the text colour, giving >you black text on a dark grey background and other small issues like that. > >However, the most important consideration is that a majority of users find >dark text on bright backgrounds easier to read. A bright background forces the ye to focus and makes edge recognition easier, some people even have serious trouble reading bright text on dark backgrounds, because they experience a glow effect, making the letters fade into each other. There are some studies on this somewhere, but I'm too lazy to look them up right now, they should >be relatively easy to find, though. Hi Thomas! We missed you yesterday! I think the idea is /not/ to make a dark theme the default, but to have a dark /variant/ of the theme, meaning it has a dark version as well as a light version (which would be the default). I want to make sure everyone who reads this understands that a dark theme will likely not be the default, but an option. :) Erich pgpKRSVFJ9mqp.pgp Description: PGP signature -- ubuntu-studio-devel mailing list ubuntu-studio-devel@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-studio-devel
Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Agenda for 2018-05-05
On May 5, 2018 8:33 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Sat, 5 May 2018 07:25:16 -0700, er...@ericheickmeyer.com wrote: > > New theme (something with a dark variant)? > > Maintaining a theme that works good for all apps is very hard. I've > never seen a dark theme that really worked and was well maintained. I'm not sure how relevant this still is, but I'd also highly advise against using a dark theme as default. It's great if there's a dark variant available for those that want to use it (like myself, using Blackbird currently), but it's not the best choice to make it the standard. I've also had some trouble making the dark theme work everywhere, some programs will display input fields dark and not change the text colour, giving you black text on a dark grey background and other small issues like that. However, the most important consideration is that a majority of users find dark text on bright backgrounds easier to read. A bright background forces the eye to focus and makes edge recognition easier, some people even have serious trouble reading bright text on dark backgrounds, because they experience a glow effect, making the letters fade into each other. There are some studies on this somewhere, but I'm too lazy to look them up right now, they should be relatively easy to find, though. -- ubuntu-studio-devel mailing list ubuntu-studio-devel@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-studio-devel
Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Agenda for 2018-05-05/themes
On Sun, 06 May 2018 03:55:21 +, lukefro...@hushmail.com wrote: >You mentioned getting a dark theme to work well and keep working well. >My modded and ported version of the old UbuntuStudio theme works very >well for what I use it for (because I myself ensure it does), but last >time I tried the "refactoring" branch of Kdenlive a whole section did >not work even though it was in beta and the them normally works with >qt5ctl so long as the gtk2 compatability module is installed (had to >locally compile that a few times). Since we are musicians we sometimes need software that isn't available by official repositories. The Linux binary from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/ doesn't use qt5ct plugin, it requires to build it from source, since qt5ct at least for me was required to get rid of a font issue. The svn repository isn't updated, it's needed to use the source from the file section. Actually I experienced the Linux version as way to unstable and ended up installing the Windows version using wine, however, theoretically other and this Qt software not available by official repositories, could work with Linux and might be very useful for musician. -- ubuntu-studio-devel mailing list ubuntu-studio-devel@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-studio-devel
Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Agenda for 2018-05-05/themes
You mentioned getting a dark theme to work well and keep working well. My modded and ported version of the old UbuntuStudio theme works very well for what I use it for (because I myself ensure it does), but last time I tried the "refactoring" branch of Kdenlive a whole section did not work even though it was in beta and the them normally works with qt5ctl so long as the gtk2 compatability module is installed (had to locally compile that a few times). On 5/6/2018 at 12:41 AM, "Ralf Mardorf" wrote: > >On Sat, 05 May 2018 11:49:26 -0700, ikemons...@gmail.com wrote: >>On Saturday, May 5, 2018 11:33:49 AM PDT Ralf Mardorf wrote: >>> Maintaining a theme that works good for all apps is very hard. > >> >>That's why you try to pick something already in the repos. :) > >Apart from choosing a theme that's alright for GTK2 as well as GTK3 >apps, it might be important to find a theme, that is close to those >available by qt5ct. Some environments likely don't require qt5ct, >but >IIRC an uniform look of GTK and Qt apps always is tricky. > >-- >ubuntu-studio-devel mailing list >ubuntu-studio-devel@lists.ubuntu.com >Modify settings or unsubscribe at: >https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-studio-devel -- ubuntu-studio-devel mailing list ubuntu-studio-devel@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-studio-devel
Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Agenda for 2018-05-05
On Sat, 05 May 2018 11:49:26 -0700, ikemons...@gmail.com wrote: >On Saturday, May 5, 2018 11:33:49 AM PDT Ralf Mardorf wrote: >> Maintaining a theme that works good for all apps is very hard. > >That's why you try to pick something already in the repos. :) Apart from choosing a theme that's alright for GTK2 as well as GTK3 apps, it might be important to find a theme, that is close to those available by qt5ct. Some environments likely don't require qt5ct, but IIRC an uniform look of GTK and Qt apps always is tricky. -- ubuntu-studio-devel mailing list ubuntu-studio-devel@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-studio-devel
Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Agenda for 2018-05-05
On Saturday, May 5, 2018 11:33:49 AM PDT Ralf Mardorf wrote: > Maintaining a theme that works good for all apps is very hard. That's why you try to pick something already in the repos. :) Erich -- ubuntu-studio-devel mailing list ubuntu-studio-devel@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-studio-devel
Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Agenda for 2018-05-05
On Sat, 5 May 2018 07:25:16 -0700, er...@ericheickmeyer.com wrote:
>New theme (something with a dark variant)?
Maintaining a theme that works good for all apps is very hard. I've
never seen a dark theme that really worked and was well maintained.
Countless very good themes of all kinds were discontinued when all
that GNOME related stuff made the step from <= 3.18 to >= 3.20.
For Ubuntu I'm still on 16.04.4, so I'm still using
gtk-icon-theme-name = "Adwaita"
gtk-theme-name = "Adwaita"
On Arch Linux I needed to drop "Adwaita", since at least
gnome-themes-standard > 3.18.0 makes GTK2 apps look like shit.
I also dislike adwaita-icon-theme > 3.18.0, but it's not that worse as
gnome-themes-standard.
A common used replacement for the "Adwaita" theme is an edited "Arc"
theme, see https://github.com/horst3180/arc-theme/issues/406 .
So on Arch Linux I'm using
gtk-theme-name="Arc-RM-Cornflower"
my own custom-tailored "Arc" theme and FWIW a modern icon theme named
"Sardi-Mono-Papirus-Colora-Havelock" + additional self-made icons.
I strongly recommend to stand with a light theme either with
even the new "Adwaita" or a theme as close as possible to the old
"Adwaita", that is provided by an official Ubuntu repository.
A flashy light or dark theme gains nothing, if it isn't enthusiastic
maintained.
--
pacman -Q linux{,-rt{,-pussytoes,-securityink,-cornflower}}|cut -d\ -f2
4.16.7-1
4.16.7_rt1-1
4.14.34_rt27-1
4.14.29_rt25-1
4.14.28_rt23-1
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