Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
poke Jacob Mansfield Programmer CyberKing Solutions www.cyberkingsolutions.co.uk On 13 February 2011 23:02, Alan Bell wrote: > On 13/02/11 19:17, Jacob Mansfield wrote: >> >> the CDs and flyers would be useful for my meeting as well, could I get a >> copy > > Yes. The loco team has an allocation of CDs each release and I happen to > have a stash from the recent show. This is exactly the kind of thing that > they are for. If anyone is going to do any advocacy to local schools/ local > government etc. then yes, you can have real CDs > http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=746 Add a line for > your activity to http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/2011plan in brackets put the > number of CDs you want and poke the person with the CDs to send you some > (currently me) > > Alan. > > -- > ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ > -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 13/02/11 19:17, Jacob Mansfield wrote: the CDs and flyers would be useful for my meeting as well, could I get a copy Yes. The loco team has an allocation of CDs each release and I happen to have a stash from the recent show. This is exactly the kind of thing that they are for. If anyone is going to do any advocacy to local schools/ local government etc. then yes, you can have real CDs http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=746 Add a line for your activity to http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/2011plan in brackets put the number of CDs you want and poke the person with the CDs to send you some (currently me) Alan. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
CyberKing Solutions www.cyberkingsolutions.co.uk the above site gives a database error paul -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
can we put a link on the ubuntu-uk website, it may not be specific for ubuntu but its a good way to introduce open source via windows software. paul -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
O n Sun, 2011-02-13 at 20:37 +, Rob Beard wrote: > > Sarah > > > > > > > > Sarah, are you using the updated menu system on there (I believe it's > the one where everything is compiled into one file), or is it the > original OpenDisc CD Menu which had individual HTML files? > > Ta, > > Rob > Rob One of our lug members has done the work on the custom opendisc but I believe it has seperate html files Sarah -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 13/02/11 20:15, Sarah Chard wrote: On Sun, 2011-02-13 at 20:04 +, Paul Sutton wrote: On 13/02/11 19:17, Jacob Mansfield wrote: the CDs and flyers would be useful for my meeting as well, could I get a copy Jacob Mansfield Programmer CyberKing Solutions www.cyberkingsolutions.co.uk i downloaded the iso file then made a basic press-it lable this is the best way to go really, you need dvd's rather than cds. paul that's why we made a custom disc so it would fit a cd and be cheaper to reproduce and therefor available for more people to use Jacob - the iso we have for the new cd is still a test version and the menu has hlug branding but if you are interested I can email you a link Sarah Sarah, are you using the updated menu system on there (I believe it's the one where everything is compiled into one file), or is it the original OpenDisc CD Menu which had individual HTML files? Ta, Rob -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
go for the link anyway, I'll figure out how to get rid of the branding somehow Jacob Mansfield Programmer CyberKing Solutions www.cyberkingsolutions.co.uk On 13 February 2011 20:24, Rob Beard wrote: > On 13/02/11 20:04, Paul Sutton wrote: >> >> On 13/02/11 19:17, Jacob Mansfield wrote: >>> >>> the CDs and flyers would be useful for my meeting as well, could I get >>> a copy >>> Jacob Mansfield >>> Programmer >>> CyberKing Solutions >>> www.cyberkingsolutions.co.uk >>> >>> >> i downloaded the iso file then made a basic press-it lable this is the >> best way to go really, you need dvd's rather than cds. >> >> paul >> > > If if you customise it you can get it down to CD size. > > Rob > > -- > ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ > -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 13/02/11 20:04, Paul Sutton wrote: On 13/02/11 19:17, Jacob Mansfield wrote: the CDs and flyers would be useful for my meeting as well, could I get a copy Jacob Mansfield Programmer CyberKing Solutions www.cyberkingsolutions.co.uk i downloaded the iso file then made a basic press-it lable this is the best way to go really, you need dvd's rather than cds. paul If if you customise it you can get it down to CD size. Rob -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On Sun, 2011-02-13 at 20:04 +, Paul Sutton wrote: > On 13/02/11 19:17, Jacob Mansfield wrote: > > the CDs and flyers would be useful for my meeting as well, could I get a > > copy > > Jacob Mansfield > > Programmer > > CyberKing Solutions > > www.cyberkingsolutions.co.uk > > > > > i downloaded the iso file then made a basic press-it lable this is the > best way to go really, you need dvd's rather than cds. > > paul that's why we made a custom disc so it would fit a cd and be cheaper to reproduce and therefor available for more people to use Jacob - the iso we have for the new cd is still a test version and the menu has hlug branding but if you are interested I can email you a link Sarah -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 13/02/11 19:17, Jacob Mansfield wrote: the CDs and flyers would be useful for my meeting as well, could I get a copy Jacob Mansfield Programmer CyberKing Solutions www.cyberkingsolutions.co.uk i downloaded the iso file then made a basic press-it lable this is the best way to go really, you need dvd's rather than cds. paul On 13 February 2011 18:40, Paul Sutton wrote: On 13/02/11 18:13, Sarah Chard wrote: O n Sun, 2011-02-13 at 17:38 +, alan c wrote: Hi Sarah Would you find a FOSS leaflet (double sided A4) based on the OpenDIsc useful? If so can I email it to you? -- alan cocks Ubuntu user yes please - we are trying to put together as much info as possible for the event - we have adapted the Open Disc so it's our custom version - but having things people have already written to hand saves an immense amount of work - please email it through Sara yes please i have a few cds here i made so a good flyer would be useful paul -- Paul Sutton Cert SLPS (Open) http://www.zleap.net 17th September 2011 - Software freedom day -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- Paul Sutton Cert SLPS (Open) http://www.zleap.net 17th September 2011 - Software freedom day -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
the CDs and flyers would be useful for my meeting as well, could I get a copy Jacob Mansfield Programmer CyberKing Solutions www.cyberkingsolutions.co.uk On 13 February 2011 18:40, Paul Sutton wrote: > On 13/02/11 18:13, Sarah Chard wrote: >> >> O >> n Sun, 2011-02-13 at 17:38 +, alan c wrote: >> >>> Hi Sarah >>> Would you find a FOSS leaflet (double sided A4) based on the >>> OpenDIsc useful? >>> If so can I email it to you? >>> >>> -- >>> alan cocks >>> Ubuntu user >> >> yes please - we are trying to put together as much info as possible for >> the event - we have adapted the Open Disc so it's our custom version - >> but having things people have already written to hand saves an immense >> amount of work - >> please email it through >> >> Sara >> > > yes please i have a few cds here i made so a good flyer would be useful > > paul > > > -- > Paul Sutton Cert SLPS (Open) > http://www.zleap.net > > > 17th September 2011 - Software freedom day > > > > -- > ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ > -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 13/02/11 18:13, Sarah Chard wrote: O n Sun, 2011-02-13 at 17:38 +, alan c wrote: Hi Sarah Would you find a FOSS leaflet (double sided A4) based on the OpenDIsc useful? If so can I email it to you? -- alan cocks Ubuntu user yes please - we are trying to put together as much info as possible for the event - we have adapted the Open Disc so it's our custom version - but having things people have already written to hand saves an immense amount of work - please email it through Sara yes please i have a few cds here i made so a good flyer would be useful paul -- Paul Sutton Cert SLPS (Open) http://www.zleap.net 17th September 2011 - Software freedom day -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
O n Sun, 2011-02-13 at 17:38 +, alan c wrote: > > Hi Sarah > Would you find a FOSS leaflet (double sided A4) based on the > OpenDIsc useful? > If so can I email it to you? > > -- > alan cocks > Ubuntu user yes please - we are trying to put together as much info as possible for the event - we have adapted the Open Disc so it's our custom version - but having things people have already written to hand saves an immense amount of work - please email it through Sarah -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 13/02/11 12:55, bod...@googlemail.com wrote: At the council where I work, vendor lock in is not a concern at all, quite the opposite. One of the merits is that everything is likely to integrate without an issue. Sharepoint, exchange, ms office, ms sql all work together to deliver the service. You can't just replace MS office with LibreOffice and get the same service. I believe that the easiest solution to implement and see savings from are servers. My place for example has 5 DC's all doing 1 or 2 roles. Replacing these with Linux based DHCP and DNS servers would save over £1000 in licensing fees The problem with trying to replace ms office is that many organisations will have a 5 year enterprise site license which they have paid for, so there is no cost to keep deploying and upgrading the office suite and therefore there is no reason to move to a free alternative. Bodsda Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device Mmm. It probably takes 5 years to migrate anyway? -- alan cocks Ubuntu user -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 13/02/11 11:28, Sarah Chard wrote: O n Sat, 2011-02-12 at 19:46 +, alan c wrote: the IT department and found that Bracknell use an overwhelming amount of Suse Enterprise server, and are carefully aware of the non linux apps they still depend upon, and plan for a future with thin clients. I think they have been noted in the press as doing well etc generally, but it does not hit local news, nor, apparently, the Councillors awareness. Armed with my new knowledge I am recently in touch with my Councillor to help make them aware that there is no real reason why they need to stay with a paid-for OS on their corporate laptop. It may take a bit more time of course. Local and national govt are very slow to change - there is pressure building up but we need to keep pushing the case for linux& open source. Our hlug Open Source day on March 26 is all about this and the need for govt to support Open Document Standards. We have sent invites out to all the Herefordshire councillors - the cabinet member for ICT says he will attend& following pre -publicity about the day published in the local paper we were approached by the council ict dept and told that they were in the process of moving the council web platform over to 'mostly open source' and they too would like to send a rep and talk to us. The underlying structure may change to Open Source, the council may start using Linux Servers but the majority of their employees will probably still be using proprietary office software We want the council to consider putting Libre Office on their desktops as a starting point which is why we will be talking about long term strategy to get out of lock-ins and issues around open formats. We also want to let more ordinary people know about and use open source and that's why we give away our custom open source disc - The Linux Emporium have just kindly agreed to sponsor 100 more discs for the day which is fantastic as we do everything with zero funds - we will replace open office with Libre Office on this version. Once people switch to using cross platform open source software and become familiar with it then moving over to a full Linux OS becomes far less intimidating. The more people out there who use linux and open source software the more pressure will be on govt local and national to use open formats we can all read. It will also become easier for councils& national govt to change the OS used by their employees to Ubuntu or another flavour as they will have less resistance to deal with. It does take time but the boulder is moving - we just need to keep on pushing it. Sarah Hi Sarah Would you find a FOSS leaflet (double sided A4) based on the OpenDIsc useful? If so can I email it to you? -- alan cocks Ubuntu user -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 12/02/11 23:34, Rob Beard wrote: Good Lick ;-) Reminds me of the Policeman in "allo allo" but some of his other franglais comments probably won't work too well by email... Al -- The Open Learning Centre http://www.theopenlearningcentre.com -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
At the council where I work, vendor lock in is not a concern at all, quite the opposite. One of the merits is that everything is likely to integrate without an issue. Sharepoint, exchange, ms office, ms sql all work together to deliver the service. You can't just replace MS office with LibreOffice and get the same service. I believe that the easiest solution to implement and see savings from are servers. My place for example has 5 DC's all doing 1 or 2 roles. Replacing these with Linux based DHCP and DNS servers would save over £1000 in licensing fees The problem with trying to replace ms office is that many organisations will have a 5 year enterprise site license which they have paid for, so there is no cost to keep deploying and upgrading the office suite and therefore there is no reason to move to a free alternative. Bodsda Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device -Original Message- From: Sarah Chard Sender: ubuntu-uk-boun...@lists.ubuntu.com Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2011 12:15:39 To: UK Ubuntu Talk Reply-To: ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com Subject: Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council On Sun, 2011-02-13 at 11:51 +, Sean Miller wrote: > So I think that the argument that Councils will automatically "save > money" through moving to FOSS is one that doesn't always stand up to > scrutiny. > > Ultimately we should be promoting Linux on its merits, rather than on > costs. The argument about moving to FOSS for Councils is about avoiding lock-in and having software that can be adapted by the councils for their use and shared with other councils because it is open source. It's the long term value of FOSS that matters. And yes absolutely we should promote linux and open source generally on it's merits - that's why we launched our county HOSS awards for organisations and individuals who have been promoting and using Open source in Herefordshire -( and we may have a nomination from the council itself ) - it's all about promoting Open Source as positive so that others will be encouraged to take it seriously and realise how many organisations/businesses/individuals actually already use it. Sarah -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 13/02/11 11:51, Sean Miller wrote: [...] When it actually came to costings, including support, there really wasn't ANY difference at all in the total cost of ownership.In fact, a supported JBOSS worked out to be FAR from the cheapest, as other vendors offered free support alongside the "licences". The opportunity that JBOSS did offer, of course, was that we could have an unlimited number of installations - development, test, acceptance and live servers, and clients on however many PCs we chose. [...] Hi, Sean. Presumably, your unlimited number of client PC's were running M$ Windoze, and this was not factored into your TCO... I'm not for one moment disputing that Linux should be promoted on merit. However, TCO calculations can be misleading and 'supported' software, FLOSS or proprietary, may require the customer IT support team to have a lot more involvement than the management anticipate because the IT team know about application of the product to the specific customer's requirements. In that respect, it seems more reasonable to endorse the idea of zero-cost software of either type and compare the level of service provided by different vendors: In your scenario, the "licence" fee (your quotes) implies, as I would expect, that licenced versions of the software are well supported. In fact, TCO calculations typically do not take into account the existing expertise of that the IT team and, in the case of FLOSS, that might be an important economic factor. In my experience, managers think they can solve problems by buying a 'solution' - hardware or software, but everyone else knows that it is people who solve problems and they are the most important factor. So, what 'solution' did you opt for? Bye, Tony. -- Dr. A.J.Travis, University of Aberdeen, Rowett Institute of Nutrition and Health, Greenburn Road, Bucksburn, Aberdeen AB21 9SB, Scotland, UK tel +44(0)1224 712751, fax +44(0)1224 716687, http://www.rowett.ac.uk mailto:a.tra...@abdn.ac.uk, http://bioinformatics.rri.sari.ac.uk -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On Sun, 2011-02-13 at 11:51 +, Sean Miller wrote: > So I think that the argument that Councils will automatically "save > money" through moving to FOSS is one that doesn't always stand up to > scrutiny. > > Ultimately we should be promoting Linux on its merits, rather than on > costs. The argument about moving to FOSS for Councils is about avoiding lock-in and having software that can be adapted by the councils for their use and shared with other councils because it is open source. It's the long term value of FOSS that matters. And yes absolutely we should promote linux and open source generally on it's merits - that's why we launched our county HOSS awards for organisations and individuals who have been promoting and using Open source in Herefordshire -( and we may have a nomination from the council itself ) - it's all about promoting Open Source as positive so that others will be encouraged to take it seriously and realise how many organisations/businesses/individuals actually already use it. Sarah -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
On 12 February 2011 19:46, alan c wrote: > Armed with my new knowledge I am recently in touch with my Councillor to > help make them aware that there is no real reason why they need to stay with > a paid-for OS on their corporate laptop. It may take a bit more time of > course. > I think that "paid for" is irrelevant, to be honest. When I was working for Cornhill I was on what was called the e-aag (the e-application architecture group) and one of the desires of the Cornhill management was to move towards J2EE. The terms of reference were fixed, in that we had to have however many desktops with the IDE on it, so many servers with the J2EE server and so on... We evaluated several products on the market, including (I recall) BEA Weblogic, IBM Websphere, the Oracle JDeveloper suite and JBOSS, a FOSS product as most will no doubt be aware. When it actually came to costings, including support, there really wasn't ANY difference at all in the total cost of ownership.In fact, a supported JBOSS worked out to be FAR from the cheapest, as other vendors offered free support alongside the "licences". The opportunity that JBOSS did offer, of course, was that we could have an unlimited number of installations - development, test, acceptance and live servers, and clients on however many PCs we chose. But, working on the terms of reference, it wasn't always cheaper. So I think that the argument that Councils will automatically "save money" through moving to FOSS is one that doesn't always stand up to scrutiny. Ultimately we should be promoting Linux on its merits, rather than on costs. Because, as well, people do tend to think "if it's free there's something inferior about it"... and to make them change their minds we have to stop spouting this "free free free" thing. Sean -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] local council
O n Sat, 2011-02-12 at 19:46 +, alan c wrote: > the IT department and found that Bracknell use an overwhelming amount > of Suse Enterprise server, and are carefully aware of the non linux > apps they still depend upon, and plan for a future with thin clients. > I think they have been noted in the press as doing well etc > generally, but it does not hit local news, nor, apparently, the > Councillors awareness. > > Armed with my new knowledge I am recently in touch with my Councillor > to help make them aware that there is no real reason why they need to > stay with a paid-for OS on their corporate laptop. It may take a bit > more time of course. Local and national govt are very slow to change - there is pressure building up but we need to keep pushing the case for linux & open source. Our hlug Open Source day on March 26 is all about this and the need for govt to support Open Document Standards. We have sent invites out to all the Herefordshire councillors - the cabinet member for ICT says he will attend & following pre -publicity about the day published in the local paper we were approached by the council ict dept and told that they were in the process of moving the council web platform over to 'mostly open source' and they too would like to send a rep and talk to us. The underlying structure may change to Open Source, the council may start using Linux Servers but the majority of their employees will probably still be using proprietary office software We want the council to consider putting Libre Office on their desktops as a starting point which is why we will be talking about long term strategy to get out of lock-ins and issues around open formats. We also want to let more ordinary people know about and use open source and that's why we give away our custom open source disc - The Linux Emporium have just kindly agreed to sponsor 100 more discs for the day which is fantastic as we do everything with zero funds - we will replace open office with Libre Office on this version. Once people switch to using cross platform open source software and become familiar with it then moving over to a full Linux OS becomes far less intimidating. The more people out there who use linux and open source software the more pressure will be on govt local and national to use open formats we can all read. It will also become easier for councils & national govt to change the OS used by their employees to Ubuntu or another flavour as they will have less resistance to deal with. It does take time but the boulder is moving - we just need to keep on pushing it. Sarah -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Click ....
Oh dear... "if you want to earn your Geek Badge of Honour"? Exactly what I DON'T want to hear. "when running off the CD the operating system will be incredibly slow..." Yeah, that's going to go down well. Sean -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
