Re: [ubuntu-uk] MS-DOS not being added to GRUB menu (Lubuntu 12.04)

[Piskie]

On 17/03/12 01:47, Liam Proven wrote:

I asked this on the other list, possibly by mistake.

I have installed beta 1 of Lubuntu 12.04 on an old PC I'm planning to give away.

The only thing that is not flawless about it is that GRUB2 has not
picked up that the primary partition on hard disk 0 contains MS-DOS -
7.1, specifically, from a Windows 98SE recovery floppy. It's a small
install - just the core utils in a \DOS directory - but when I run
`update-grub` it appears not to notice it at all.

Is there any way of manually adding an OS to GRUB2?

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Yes - you need to edit /etc/grub.d/40_custom and add the stanza there.

Something like


menuentry "msdos622 on sda1" {
insmod chain
insmod fat
set root=(hd0,1)
chainloader +1
}


Change the partition numbering to suit you.

Then you need to run sudo update-grub.

Hope that helps

Kev

http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=10275310&postcount=3

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[ubuntu-uk] MS-DOS not being added to GRUB menu (Lubuntu 12.04)

[Liam Proven]

I asked this on the other list, possibly by mistake.

I have installed beta 1 of Lubuntu 12.04 on an old PC I'm planning to give away.

The only thing that is not flawless about it is that GRUB2 has not
picked up that the primary partition on hard disk 0 contains MS-DOS -
7.1, specifically, from a Windows 98SE recovery floppy. It's a small
install - just the core utils in a \DOS directory - but when I run
`update-grub` it appears not to notice it at all.

Is there any way of manually adding an OS to GRUB2?

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] dig out your old computers...

[Liam Proven]

On 16 March 2012 20:49, alan c  wrote:
> On 16/03/12 17:52, Liam Proven wrote:
>> I let Brasero do a checksum & it said no errors - but I didn't
>> download the separate MD5sum or whatever it's called, no.
>
> with old machines and old CD drives, a CD self check (from the boot
> menu) has the advantage of also implicitly checking the drive condition.

Ooh, good point. I'll try that later.

It's running very sweetly now though, installed from the alt-CD. I
left it running BOINC flat out for 4 hours and it's fine. CPU
scheduling is noticeably better than on 11.10, when it kept
oscillating between full load down to idle and back with a cycle time
of ~2sec on both CPUs. With 12.04 it just keeps both CPUs pegged, flat
out.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] dig out your old computers...

[alan c]

On 16/03/12 17:52, Liam Proven wrote:
> I let Brasero do a checksum & it said no errors - but I didn't
> download the separate MD5sum or whatever it's called, no.

with old machines and old CD drives, a CD self check (from the boot
menu) has the advantage of also implicitly checking the drive condition.
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Re: [ubuntu-uk] dig out your old computers...

[Phill Whiteside]

Hi Liam,

The non-startup sound was following a discussion of getting rid of anything
not really required :)

Glad you're enjoying it.

Regards,

Phill.

On 16 March 2012 19:19, Liam Proven  wrote:

> Working beautifully now. Fast, smooth, looks good.
>
> First reboot with kernel 3.2.0-18 caused it to reset but it's worked
> fine since then.
>
> All updates installed fine, as did lubuntu-restricted-extras -
> although with much whinging about libavcodecs53 being removed. A whole
> ton of packages were reported missing at the final, "building package
> database" stage, but they are all ones that I would not expect to be
> there - e.g. bits of KDE - and there were no problems.
>
> Final installed image is only about 2.1GB with the old kernel removed
> and the APT cache emptied.
>
> I am impressed so far!
>
> I've added gnome-system-monitor, the IcedTea JVM, AdBlock+ to Chromium
> and xterm. It's tiny, well, tiny for 2012, fast and slick. It looks
> great too.
>
> There is no startup sound, although sound is working fine, e.g. in
> Youtube. That seems a little odd.
>
> Also, I have one trivial problem, which I will report separately.
>
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Re: [ubuntu-uk] dig out your old computers...

[Liam Proven]

Working beautifully now. Fast, smooth, looks good.

First reboot with kernel 3.2.0-18 caused it to reset but it's worked
fine since then.

All updates installed fine, as did lubuntu-restricted-extras -
although with much whinging about libavcodecs53 being removed. A whole
ton of packages were reported missing at the final, "building package
database" stage, but they are all ones that I would not expect to be
there - e.g. bits of KDE - and there were no problems.

Final installed image is only about 2.1GB with the old kernel removed
and the APT cache emptied.

I am impressed so far!

I've added gnome-system-monitor, the IcedTea JVM, AdBlock+ to Chromium
and xterm. It's tiny, well, tiny for 2012, fast and slick. It looks
great too.

There is no startup sound, although sound is working fine, e.g. in
Youtube. That seems a little odd.

Also, I have one trivial problem, which I will report separately.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] dig out your old computers...

[Liam Proven]

On 16 March 2012 17:52, Liam Proven  wrote:
> On 16 March 2012 17:17, Colin Law  wrote:
>>
>> Did you do a check on the CD to make sure it was downloaded and burnt
>> correctly?  Last time I had crashes during install I burned a new CD
>> and it was ok.
>
> I let Brasero do a checksum & it said no errors - but I didn't
> download the separate MD5sum or whatever it's called, no.
>
> Quicker to do an alt-CD. It's approaching 90% now and seems fine so
> far. I'll try the other CD on my elderly PIII Thinkpad at some point
> soon.

Installed smoothly, running nicely so far. Graphics performance isn't
brilliant but it's only an ancient Matrox card & I'm not sure it has
any drivers or acceleration.

Currently doing an update, then I'll install the restricted extras & a
few things & give it a bit of a hammering.

System spec:

Dual Athlon MP @ 1666MHz
1GB DDR RAM
LSI Logic 64-bit PCI UltraSCSI 3 adaptor with 9GB Quantum boot disk,
Quantum 17GB /home disk and IBM 4GB for dedicated swap.
Matrox G550 AGP dual-head graphics card.
3Com 3c595 100Mb Ethernet card.


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] dig out your old computers...

[Liam Proven]

On 16 March 2012 17:17, Colin Law  wrote:
> On 16 March 2012 17:10, Liam Proven  wrote:
>> ...
>> Just FYI - I downloaded & burned Lubuntu 12.04 beta 1 x86-32 today. I
>> can't install it on my main Lubuntu box. Ubiquity crashes consistently
>> - 3 reboots, 3 times. It makes no odds if I choose an update, include
>> or exclude updates or restricted-extras.
>
> Did you do a check on the CD to make sure it was downloaded and burnt
> correctly?  Last time I had crashes during install I burned a new CD
> and it was ok.

I let Brasero do a checksum & it said no errors - but I didn't
download the separate MD5sum or whatever it's called, no.

Quicker to do an alt-CD. It's approaching 90% now and seems fine so
far. I'll try the other CD on my elderly PIII Thinkpad at some point
soon.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] dig out your old computers...

[Colin Law]

On 16 March 2012 17:10, Liam Proven  wrote:
> ...
> Just FYI - I downloaded & burned Lubuntu 12.04 beta 1 x86-32 today. I
> can't install it on my main Lubuntu box. Ubiquity crashes consistently
> - 3 reboots, 3 times. It makes no odds if I choose an update, include
> or exclude updates or restricted-extras.

Did you do a check on the CD to make sure it was downloaded and burnt
correctly?  Last time I had crashes during install I burned a new CD
and it was ok.

Colin

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] dig out your old computers...

[Liam Proven]

On 3 March 2012 22:51, Phill Whiteside  wrote:
> Hiyas,
>
> Yeah, for the testing of lubuntu [1] [2]
>
> We need some 128Mb RAM machines [2] . These are needed for non PAE chipsets
> as well. We need to know if the none PAE system install actually will work.
> We only have one with actual hardware as yet, the others are doing it via
> VM.
>
> We are also testing mac-ppc stuff, seems okay on G4 with quibbles, but an
> extra G3 equipped person would allow a bug to be confirmed as we only have
> one person.
>
> For the "new" Intel-Macs, again, we only have one - but that will only get a
> bug heat if we have a couple of testers: If you know of any one who could
> help on these, please join the lubuntu-qa team, so far it looks still
> possible.
>
> The beta 1's are at the usual
> place https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/TechnicalOverview/Beta1
>
> The dailies, as always are spilt between Desktop and alternate. If you need
> more information on testing but think you do not know how to do so, please
> do reply - Honest, we do not bite from any of the testing teams. It is
> frequently that the new comers say something is wrong & the rest of us go
> "Dho!, who did we miss that one?"
>
> Please do not see my request to UK list as any attempt to favour one flavour
> of *buntu over an other. Each flavour has an important section in our
> family.

Just FYI - I downloaded & burned Lubuntu 12.04 beta 1 x86-32 today. I
can't install it on my main Lubuntu box. Ubiquity crashes consistently
- 3 reboots, 3 times. It makes no odds if I choose an update, include
or exclude updates or restricted-extras.

If I try to report it, it says it's already logged on the page open in
the web browser - then fails to open a page. >_<

I am currently burning the Alternate CD - I'll try that.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Hdmi output-- ubuntu

[Alan Pope]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 15/03/12 19:06, Barry Titterton wrote:
> Do you get both sound and vision over HDMI with Ubuntu, or just
> the vision?
> 

My PC is connected to a philips 234EL monitor via HDMI. Sound and
video both go over the cable. So if I want I can use the speakers
built into the screen. I happen to have a separate sound card
connected to decent speakers so I don't use this feature, but it works
out of the box on my machine.

Here's a picture of the sound setting thing. I have highlighted the
HDMI out and pressed test. It just works.

http://popey.com/~alan/hdmiout.png

Cheers,
- -- 
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Engineering Manager

Canonical - Product Strategy
+44 (0) 7973 620 164
alan.p...@canonical.com
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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Launcher applets

[Liam Proven]

On 16 March 2012 13:00, alan c  wrote:
>
> Hi Alan, I do see your point. However, when, a while ago I first used
> Unity and the dash, I poked around  looking for stuff and trying to
> make sense of (something) ...  But I remember that when I came across
> this alphabet big list, I felt relieved! Logical or not logical, it
> still felt ok.

That's fine. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, and it's
quite possible that new migrants to Ubuntu as of 12.04 will be fine
with it.

It's those coming across from 10.04 that I'm worried about. They -
like me - are used to menus you can browse, & I think most of them are
going to hate the Dash and the HUD.

I'd be very happy to be wrong about this - but it's my suspicion.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Launcher applets

[Liam Proven]

On 16 March 2012 08:44, Alan Bell  wrote:
>
> well the problem is that there is zero organisation of the apps, you can't
> drag them around onto different pages like you do on a smartphone to put
> them in an order that makes sense to you, and they are not pre-sorted in a
> way that makes sense to anyone. It just looks like this
> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/dash.jpg which isn't particularly helpful
> if you want to see related applications together. Alphabetical sorting of
> apps is not really a useful sort order for discovering them.

Yes! This!

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Launcher applets

[Liam Proven]

On 16 March 2012 08:24, alan c  wrote:
> On 15/03/12 22:44, Liam Proven wrote:
>> But I reckon that many of the new users flooding across once 12.04 is
>> the new LTS are going to want actual good old-fashioned menus. :¬/
>
> Are you sure about this? I am not. Most of the friends I help with
> Ubuntu are only interested in the apps they use. These are very non
> geeks. They have no interest whatsoever in all the other stuff, and
> this is most obvious when in a support conversation I state an app and
> its (menu) path in the menu structure. The menu path is an issue for
> them, and is treated with great reverence like some ritual. For
> myself, I  have fairly good knowledge of the content of the menus even
> though I do not use many of the apps.
>
> I believe that in future, all I need to do is tell them to type the
> app name, and then run it. If they want to be independent, what they
> will do is use the dash and then drill down, as I will. I do expect
> that there will be a way to drill down or display all installed apps
> whatever.
>
> I think that  most of the world's population (  =future Ubuntu users)
> will be happy  or even, happier, without menus.

No, I'm not sure, it's just a feeling.

I moved from Android to iOS this year and I miss even Android's
rudimentary menus.

I hate the phone-style big-mess-of-apps launcher screens. I find it
overwhelming and daunting.

Menus are browseable. That's how I learn what options I have. Sure,
then I use keystrokes to select the options I want - because I learned
to use PCs before the era of the mouse - but to learn what the options
*are* I like menus.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Launcher applets

[alan c]

On 16/03/12 08:44, Alan Bell wrote:
> On 16/03/12 08:24, alan c wrote:
>> On 15/03/12 22:44, Liam Proven wrote:
>>> But I reckon that many of the new users flooding across once 12.04 is
>>> the new LTS are going to want actual good old-fashioned menus. :¬/
>> Are you sure about this? I am not. Most of the friends I help with
>> Ubuntu are only interested in the apps they use. These are very non
>> geeks. They have no interest whatsoever in all the other stuff, and
>> this is most obvious when in a support conversation I state an app and
>> its (menu) path in the menu structure. The menu path is an issue for
>> them, and is treated with great reverence like some ritual. For
>> myself, I  have fairly good knowledge of the content of the menus even
>> though I do not use many of the apps.
>>
>> I believe that in future, all I need to do is tell them to type the
>> app name, and then run it. If they want to be independent, what they
>> will do is use the dash and then drill down, as I will. I do expect
>> that there will be a way to drill down or display all installed apps
>> whatever.
>>
>> I think that  most of the world's population (  =future Ubuntu users)
>> will be happy  or even, happier, without menus.

> well the problem is that there is zero organisation of the apps, you 
> can't drag them around onto different pages like you do on a smartphone 
> to put them in an order that makes sense to you, and they are not 
> pre-sorted in a way that makes sense to anyone. It just looks like this 
> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/dash.jpg which isn't particularly 
> helpful if you want to see related applications together. Alphabetical 
> sorting of apps is not really a useful sort order for discovering them.

Hi Alan, I do see your point. However, when, a while ago I first used
Unity and the dash, I poked around  looking for stuff and trying to
make sense of (something) ...  But I remember that when I came across
this alphabet big list, I felt relieved! Logical or not logical, it
still felt ok.  In retrospect, to me as only a very occasional user of
anything esoteric, an alphabetic sort is as good as anything. And if
an internet search (or dash search) would reveal an Ubuntu app name of
interest, then, again alphbetic would be fine. And beautifully simple
even for non geeks. Although, to most of the people I help I *am* a
geek, but I don't think so  :-)

The simplicity wins hands down for me, at a deep level of comfort.
With my novice geek hat on, there is hardly any benefit in me knowing
that one app  can be classed as graphics, or media or whatever. I will
almost certainly get to a desired function via a search facility -
dash search? Or certainly (google) internet search.

When I bought a microwave I used effort (!) to get one only with a
simple knob timer on the front. And this was not for myself, but
required by my highly tech literate daughter. It is what I would get
for myself too.

My android TMobile phone has alphabetic in the big list of apps, which
is ok. I use  the front page area for my several most used apps, which
I control by dragging in and out. But the front page could just as
well be my 'most used' list and created automatically. Although I
think I prefer the manual control method.
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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Launcher applets

[Alan Bell]

On 16/03/12 08:24, alan c wrote:

On 15/03/12 22:44, Liam Proven wrote:

But I reckon that many of the new users flooding across once 12.04 is
the new LTS are going to want actual good old-fashioned menus. :¬/

Are you sure about this? I am not. Most of the friends I help with
Ubuntu are only interested in the apps they use. These are very non
geeks. They have no interest whatsoever in all the other stuff, and
this is most obvious when in a support conversation I state an app and
its (menu) path in the menu structure. The menu path is an issue for
them, and is treated with great reverence like some ritual. For
myself, I  have fairly good knowledge of the content of the menus even
though I do not use many of the apps.

I believe that in future, all I need to do is tell them to type the
app name, and then run it. If they want to be independent, what they
will do is use the dash and then drill down, as I will. I do expect
that there will be a way to drill down or display all installed apps
whatever.

I think that  most of the world's population (  =future Ubuntu users)
will be happy  or even, happier, without menus.
well the problem is that there is zero organisation of the apps, you 
can't drag them around onto different pages like you do on a smartphone 
to put them in an order that makes sense to you, and they are not 
pre-sorted in a way that makes sense to anyone. It just looks like this 
http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/dash.jpg which isn't particularly 
helpful if you want to see related applications together. Alphabetical 
sorting of apps is not really a useful sort order for discovering them.


Alan.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Launcher applets

[alan c]

On 15/03/12 22:44, Liam Proven wrote:
> But I reckon that many of the new users flooding across once 12.04 is
> the new LTS are going to want actual good old-fashioned menus. :¬/

Are you sure about this? I am not. Most of the friends I help with
Ubuntu are only interested in the apps they use. These are very non
geeks. They have no interest whatsoever in all the other stuff, and
this is most obvious when in a support conversation I state an app and
its (menu) path in the menu structure. The menu path is an issue for
them, and is treated with great reverence like some ritual. For
myself, I  have fairly good knowledge of the content of the menus even
though I do not use many of the apps.

I believe that in future, all I need to do is tell them to type the
app name, and then run it. If they want to be independent, what they
will do is use the dash and then drill down, as I will. I do expect
that there will be a way to drill down or display all installed apps
whatever.

I think that  most of the world's population (  =future Ubuntu users)
will be happy  or even, happier, without menus.
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