Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation[Scanned]
On 01/02/07, Daniel Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Andy wrote: Software DRM works only on the assumption that one can not determine how the authorised program works. You can do that just as easily on Linux, just compile the code, yes it can be reverse engineered but you could never hide it anyway, the CPU needs to be able to understand it. I disagree. Software DRM works only on the assumption that if either you break it or you take advantage of you having broken it, you can be sued for breaking it. The companies who build this defect into their product do it knowing that it doesn't stop people using it, it stop people using it 'legally'. I'm not sure that's right. A license will stop you using it legally, you don't need DRM for that. You use DRM to enforce the license. Hwyl, Neil. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation[Scanned]
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Neil Greenwood wrote: I'm not sure that's right. A license will stop you using it legally, you don't need DRM for that. You use DRM to enforce the license. In the grand scheme of things, DRM as it currently exists is too pathetic to be considered much of a technological hurdle. Indeed, if DRM is such a big deal, why are we still able to decode DVDs using libdvdcss which must have been written yonks ago? If it weren't simply a case of legal manouevering, there would have been a mass recall of DVD players and new encoding would have been used. Or why is it that DRM for the two next-gen media formats has already been broken? I don't disagree with you, but DRM is there to force you to _do_ something in order to use unlicensed media, so you can't just throw your hands up when accused and look innocent. Dan -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.3 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFFw1jL3arasOikFPYRAvNKAKDEH+xSt+mvcbHOyB3F4if5k106PwCeIh3v Lrxjc4Yy8jwd6inU/bYffi4= =Tgz4 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation[Scanned]
Filled it in but after reading a bit more it looks like the trust is saying that the BBC have to provide something for Linux and mac. But they're also saying that the content can be kept for no more then 30 days(not the 13weeks that the BBC proposed)..that means the BBC will have to come up with some sort of DRM for Linux if we want to use the service. Scrase, Eddie wrote: The BBC are running a consultation about introducing on-demand services (for example, replaying shows over the internet). Question 5 of the consultation asks How important is it that the proposed seven-day catch-up service over the internet is available to consumers who are not using Microsoft software? I have filled in the questionnaire (obviously stating my opinion that the BBC should support Linux), and would like to suggest that others do the same: http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbctrust/consult/open-consultations/ondemand_services.html -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation
The BBC are running a consultation about introducing on-demand services (for example, replaying shows over the internet). Question 5 of the consultation asks How important is it that the proposed seven-day catch-up service over the internet is available to consumers who are not using Microsoft software? I have filled in the questionnaire (obviously stating my opinion that the BBC should support Linux), and would like to suggest that others do the same: Offering Windows-only downloads makes as much sense as only broadcasting programs that can be watch on Panasonic TVs! Olly -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation[Scanned]
On 01/02/07, Paul Brunt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: that means the BBC will have to come up with some sort of DRM for Linux if we want to use the service. Well they don't need to come up with a secure DRM scheme as they don't have one of those for Windows either, (one could argue that a secure software based DRM scheme can not exist). So we can accept that it will be breakable. Its not hard to make a DRM scheme for Linux, why does the OS even matter? C/C++/Java/Python code is portable, or do they want to use .NET or something? Software DRM works only on the assumption that one can not determine how the authorised program works. You can do that just as easily on Linux, just compile the code, yes it can be reverse engineered but you could never hide it anyway, the CPU needs to be able to understand it. I could probably write a DRM program in Bash, if I knew more about shell scripting and had a clue about awk and sed and what not. _ Andy -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation[Scanned]
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Andy wrote: Its not hard to make a DRM scheme for Linux, why does the OS even matter? C/C++/Java/Python code is portable, or do they want to use .NET or something? Even then there's Mono, so it wouldn't be entirely impossible. Software DRM works only on the assumption that one can not determine how the authorised program works. You can do that just as easily on Linux, just compile the code, yes it can be reverse engineered but you could never hide it anyway, the CPU needs to be able to understand it. I disagree. Software DRM works only on the assumption that if either you break it or you take advantage of you having broken it, you can be sued for breaking it. The companies who build this defect into their product do it knowing that it doesn't stop people using it, it stop people using it 'legally'. Dan -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.3 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFFwido3arasOikFPYRAvdtAJ9HXBTuRUyJ/ITETIDPSj7Okmg4FgCfUlm4 FN5v7MLnexJRR6OS84AMVZs= =yGxR -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation
On 31/01/07, Scrase, Eddie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The BBC are running a consultation about introducing on-demand services (for example, replaying shows over the internet). Noticed this as well, was half way through writing an email about it when yours arrived in my Inbox, great minds think alike? At least the trust is kind of on our side: The Trust also recommends that the BBC adopts a more platform-agnostic approach to the digital rights management framework which protects the programmes offered for download. The DRM framework currently relies on Microsoft technology but, the Trust says, the BBC must develop a more platform-agnostic approach within a reasonable framework which takes account of other technology, such as Apple and Linux. From http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6317389.stm My view on non MS platform support: Extremely important. Not only do non Microsoft users still have to pay the license fee if they own a T.V. but the BBC was also created to cater for those who other commercial entities didn't, so if anything it is more important to make it available on non MS platforms than on MS platforms. Does Canonical plan to make a formal response to this? They are based on the Isle of Man aren't they? All I can say is that I will be extremely disappointed if the BBC make it Windows only. I have a Dual Boot and my Windows usage is dwindling, I have found nothing on Windows that I want to use (forced to use PowerPoint, but never want to). I think the BBC giving people a reason not to use Linux or Open Source/Free Software is surely interfering with commercial markets is it not? If its too much work to make a player for Linux, then release all the documentation, APIs and Specs, you never know someone may be kind enough to develop the application for you. It worries me also that the BBC was allowed to spend money on developing this program for Windows systems when it could have simply provided the server side bit and let other people create the clients, saving the BBC money. Also a good quote from an analyst about the need for players for every different download service harming adoption. Consumers will have a computer littered with applications that take up space and memory. It would be like having to have separate set-top boxes to watch content from competing broadcasters, If only we had a standard for data transfer or video encoding. Andy -- -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation
On Wed, 2007-01-31 at 11:34 -0500, Scrase, Eddie wrote: http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbctrust/consult/open-consultations/ondemand_services.html Well I've replied very damningly. -- Help me get to Venezuela! http://tibsplace.co.uk/venezuela -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation
On 31/01/07, Toby Smithe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, 2007-01-31 at 11:34 -0500, Scrase, Eddie wrote: http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbctrust/consult/open-consultations/ondemand_services.html Well I've replied very damningly. So have I. Even the Apple Mac fan base will be unhappy about this one - it won't just be us. Someone has told me that they have the same issue with the archive of the Finnish state broadcasting company YLE. Caroline -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] BBC Consultation
On 31/01/07, Scrase, Eddie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The BBC are running a consultation about introducing on-demand services (for example, replaying shows over the internet). Question 5 of the consultation asks How important is it that the proposed seven-day catch-up service over the internet is available to consumers who are not using Microsoft software? I have filled in the questionnaire (obviously stating my opinion that the BBC should support Linux), and would like to suggest that others do the same: http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbctrust/consult/open-consultations/ondemand_services.html Have just done it thanks for flagging it up, Caroline -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/ -- --- London School of Puppetry www.londonschoolofpuppetry.com -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
