Re: SQL Server and Unicode
There is no way to add collations, no. You care limited to the existing collations (though there are quite a few of those!). There are other implementation details that were less than perfect, as befits a version 1 feature. I stress that in the article (and it is in fact the reason I decided to write it). The editors just shake their heads and print my stuff, these days (though on at least one occasion they were excited to finally find out what "Unicode" meant!). michka - Original Message - From: "Roozbeh Pournader" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Michael (michka) Kaplan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 1:19 PM Subject: Re: SQL Server and Unicode > > > On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Michael (michka) Kaplan wrote: > > > Oh well, the 3rd party (being me!) solution still works > > More than the real support, I'm interested in the customizablity thing. > Are there any docs available from Microsoft about the way to add one, > etc.? Have you reverse-engineered something for this? > > --roozbeh > > >
Re: SQL Server and Unicode
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Michael (michka) Kaplan wrote: > Oh well, the 3rd party (being me!) solution still works More than the real support, I'm interested in the customizablity thing. Are there any docs available from Microsoft about the way to add one, etc.? Have you reverse-engineered something for this? --roozbeh
Re: SQL Server and Unicode
Indeed, the choices are: Arabic_BIN Arabic_CI_AI Arabic_CI_AI_WS Arabic_CI_AI_KS Arabic_CI_AI_KS_WS Arabic_CI_AS Arabic_CI_AS_WS Arabic_CI_AS_KS Arabic_CI_AS_KS_WS Arabic_CS_AI Arabic_CS_AI_WS Arabic_CS_AI_KS Arabic_CS_AI_KS_WS Arabic_CS_AS Arabic_CS_AS_WS Arabic_CS_AS_KS Arabic_CS_AS_KS_WS And no Farsi in sight. :-( Oh well, the 3rd party (being me!) solution still works michka - Original Message - From: "Michael (michka) Kaplan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 9:12 AM Subject: Re: SQL Server and Unicode > It does indeed let them change the collation order to any that is on their > "supported" list. I have to go to a meeting, but I will take a look later on > the Persian (Farsi) question but I do not remember it on the list so I > suspect you are right. > > I have helped at least one client with utilities that create sort keys, > interestingly enough for Farsi in SQL Server 7.0. My solution will keep > working even if COLLATE cannot yet handle Farsi. :-) > > michka > > > - Original Message - > From: "Roozbeh Pournader" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Michael (michka) Kaplan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Cc: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 9:11 AM > Subject: Re: SQL Server and Unicode > > > > > > > > On Wed, 26 Jul 2000, Michael (michka) Kaplan wrote: > > > > > SQL Server 2000 supports a COLLATE keyword that allows you to specify a > > > collation at the database or field level and thus choose a different > > > language for such columns/indexes if you like (I discuss practical > details > > > and implications of this feature in an upcoming article in the Visual > Basic > > > Programmer's Journal, tentatively scheduled for November). > > > > Does is let the user choose the collation order? I've heard that it > > doesn't support Persian well enough, and it doesn't allow modifications of > > sorting order. So people are stuck to Arabic sortings for Persian. > > > > --roozbeh > > > > > > > >
Re: SQL Server and Unicode
It does indeed let them change the collation order to any that is on their "supported" list. I have to go to a meeting, but I will take a look later on the Persian (Farsi) question but I do not remember it on the list so I suspect you are right. I have helped at least one client with utilities that create sort keys, interestingly enough for Farsi in SQL Server 7.0. My solution will keep working even if COLLATE cannot yet handle Farsi. :-) michka - Original Message - From: "Roozbeh Pournader" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Michael (michka) Kaplan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 9:11 AM Subject: Re: SQL Server and Unicode > > > On Wed, 26 Jul 2000, Michael (michka) Kaplan wrote: > > > SQL Server 2000 supports a COLLATE keyword that allows you to specify a > > collation at the database or field level and thus choose a different > > language for such columns/indexes if you like (I discuss practical details > > and implications of this feature in an upcoming article in the Visual Basic > > Programmer's Journal, tentatively scheduled for November). > > Does is let the user choose the collation order? I've heard that it > doesn't support Persian well enough, and it doesn't allow modifications of > sorting order. So people are stuck to Arabic sortings for Persian. > > --roozbeh > > >
Re: SQL Server and Unicode
On Wed, 26 Jul 2000, Michael (michka) Kaplan wrote: > SQL Server 2000 supports a COLLATE keyword that allows you to specify a > collation at the database or field level and thus choose a different > language for such columns/indexes if you like (I discuss practical details > and implications of this feature in an upcoming article in the Visual Basic > Programmer's Journal, tentatively scheduled for November). Does is let the user choose the collation order? I've heard that it doesn't support Persian well enough, and it doesn't allow modifications of sorting order. So people are stuck to Arabic sortings for Persian. --roozbeh
Re: SQL Server and Unicode
The latest Microsoft JDBC/ODBC driver appears to work. I say appears because I haven't really used it for more than a quick test. Of course, this driver is a Windows-only phenomenon. Hope this helps. Addison === Addison P. PhillipsPrincipal Consultant Inter-Locale LLChttp://www.inter-locale.com Los Gatos, CA, USA mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] +1 408.210.3569 (mobile) +1 408.904.4762 (fax) === Globalization Engineering & Consulting Services On Wed, 26 Jul 2000, Michael (michka) Kaplan wrote: > Unfortunately, Java and especially JDBC is one of those places where I > cannot even maintain the illusion of "knowing everything". :-) > > >From colleagues of mine who work in the UNIX/Java sphere, the impression I > have gotten is that many/most of the JDBC stuff was done prior to SQL 7.0, > and thus had no Unicode fields to run against. This makes them always > convert using some code page (probably using the non-Unicode SQLS scheme > which is to base it off the collation choice of the server, which until 7.0 > was actually the ideal plan). > > I would hope that my (limited) knowledge is obsolete and that work has been > done to make things work in SQLS 7.0 and 2000 Unicode fields through JDBC. > Can someone confirm or deny this? > > michka > > > - Original Message - > From: "Tex Texin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Michael (michka) Kaplan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Cc: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2000 8:49 AM > Subject: Re: SQL Server and Unicode > > > > Michael, > > Do you know of JDBC drivers that support using > > queries and updates of UCS-2 (or UTF-16) text in the SQL Server database? > > > > I am having trouble confirming which ones support this and have confirmed, > > that > > even though Java is Unicode-based, some of the drivers only work provided > > the text is to be converted to some code page other than Unicode for > storage > > and retrieval on the database. > > > > tex > > > > > > "Michael (michka) Kaplan" wrote: > > > > > > SQL Server supports the datatypes NTEXT, NCHAR, and NVARCHAR, all of > which > > > are of type UCS-2. When such a column indexed, then the index is Unicode > (I > > > am not sure if this what you mean). > > > > > > SQL Server 7.0 only supports one language collation at the server > level > > > this choice affects the actual ordering of all such indexes. > > > > > > SQL Server 2000 supports a COLLATE keyword that allows you to specify a > > > collation at the database or field level and thus choose a different > > > language for such columns/indexes if you like (I discuss practical > details > > > and implications of this feature in an upcoming article in the Visual > Basic > > > Programmer's Journal, tentatively scheduled for November). > > > > > > In any case, you can certainly query and such field in either SQL 7.0 or > in > > > SQL 2000. > > > > > > Hopefully this answers your question; if not, let me know. :-) > > > > > > michka > > > > > > - Original Message - > > > From: "pierre vaures" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > To: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2000 1:23 AM > > > Subject: SQL Server and Unicode > > > > > > > To Whom It May Concern: > > > > > > > > > > > > SQL server is in the Unicode Products WebSite described as Unicode > > > enables. > > > > > > > > What we would like to know is : > > > > > > > > a - Does SQL Server allows to set as an index a field in Unicode > standard? > > > > b - Can you make SQL query on this particular field? > > > > > > > > If you have any information, or ideas, thanks for your help. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Pierre > > > > > > > > -- > > If practice makes perfect, and nobody's perfect, why practice? > > -- > -- > > Tex Texin Director, International Products > > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] +1-781-280-4271 Fax:+1-781-280-4655 > > Progress Software Corp.14 Oak Park, Bedford, MA 01730 > > > > http://www.progress.com#1 Embedded Database > > http://www.SonicMQ.com JMS Messaging- Best Middleware Award > > http://www.aspconnections.com #1 provider in the ASP marketplace > > http://www.NuSphere.comOpen Source software and services for MySQL > > > > Globalization Program > http://www.progress.com/partners/globalization.htm > > -- > --- > > Come to the Panel on Open Source Approaches to Unicode Libraries > > at the Sept. Unicode Conference http://www.unicode.org/iuc/iuc17 > > > >
Re: SQL Server and Unicode
Unfortunately, Java and especially JDBC is one of those places where I cannot even maintain the illusion of "knowing everything". :-) >From colleagues of mine who work in the UNIX/Java sphere, the impression I have gotten is that many/most of the JDBC stuff was done prior to SQL 7.0, and thus had no Unicode fields to run against. This makes them always convert using some code page (probably using the non-Unicode SQLS scheme which is to base it off the collation choice of the server, which until 7.0 was actually the ideal plan). I would hope that my (limited) knowledge is obsolete and that work has been done to make things work in SQLS 7.0 and 2000 Unicode fields through JDBC. Can someone confirm or deny this? michka - Original Message - From: "Tex Texin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Michael (michka) Kaplan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2000 8:49 AM Subject: Re: SQL Server and Unicode > Michael, > Do you know of JDBC drivers that support using > queries and updates of UCS-2 (or UTF-16) text in the SQL Server database? > > I am having trouble confirming which ones support this and have confirmed, > that > even though Java is Unicode-based, some of the drivers only work provided > the text is to be converted to some code page other than Unicode for storage > and retrieval on the database. > > tex > > > "Michael (michka) Kaplan" wrote: > > > > SQL Server supports the datatypes NTEXT, NCHAR, and NVARCHAR, all of which > > are of type UCS-2. When such a column indexed, then the index is Unicode (I > > am not sure if this what you mean). > > > > SQL Server 7.0 only supports one language collation at the server level > > this choice affects the actual ordering of all such indexes. > > > > SQL Server 2000 supports a COLLATE keyword that allows you to specify a > > collation at the database or field level and thus choose a different > > language for such columns/indexes if you like (I discuss practical details > > and implications of this feature in an upcoming article in the Visual Basic > > Programmer's Journal, tentatively scheduled for November). > > > > In any case, you can certainly query and such field in either SQL 7.0 or in > > SQL 2000. > > > > Hopefully this answers your question; if not, let me know. :-) > > > > michka > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "pierre vaures" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2000 1:23 AM > > Subject: SQL Server and Unicode > > > > > To Whom It May Concern: > > > > > > > > > SQL server is in the Unicode Products WebSite described as Unicode > > enables. > > > > > > What we would like to know is : > > > > > > a - Does SQL Server allows to set as an index a field in Unicode standard? > > > b - Can you make SQL query on this particular field? > > > > > > If you have any information, or ideas, thanks for your help. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Pierre > > > > > -- > If practice makes perfect, and nobody's perfect, why practice? > -- -- > Tex Texin Director, International Products > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] +1-781-280-4271 Fax:+1-781-280-4655 > Progress Software Corp.14 Oak Park, Bedford, MA 01730 > > http://www.progress.com#1 Embedded Database > http://www.SonicMQ.com JMS Messaging- Best Middleware Award > http://www.aspconnections.com #1 provider in the ASP marketplace > http://www.NuSphere.comOpen Source software and services for MySQL > > Globalization Program http://www.progress.com/partners/globalization.htm > -- --- > Come to the Panel on Open Source Approaches to Unicode Libraries > at the Sept. Unicode Conference http://www.unicode.org/iuc/iuc17 >
Re: SQL Server and Unicode
Michael, Do you know of JDBC drivers that support using queries and updates of UCS-2 (or UTF-16) text in the SQL Server database? I am having trouble confirming which ones support this and have confirmed, that even though Java is Unicode-based, some of the drivers only work provided the text is to be converted to some code page other than Unicode for storage and retrieval on the database. tex "Michael (michka) Kaplan" wrote: > > SQL Server supports the datatypes NTEXT, NCHAR, and NVARCHAR, all of which > are of type UCS-2. When such a column indexed, then the index is Unicode (I > am not sure if this what you mean). > > SQL Server 7.0 only supports one language collation at the server level > this choice affects the actual ordering of all such indexes. > > SQL Server 2000 supports a COLLATE keyword that allows you to specify a > collation at the database or field level and thus choose a different > language for such columns/indexes if you like (I discuss practical details > and implications of this feature in an upcoming article in the Visual Basic > Programmer's Journal, tentatively scheduled for November). > > In any case, you can certainly query and such field in either SQL 7.0 or in > SQL 2000. > > Hopefully this answers your question; if not, let me know. :-) > > michka > > - Original Message - > From: "pierre vaures" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2000 1:23 AM > Subject: SQL Server and Unicode > > > To Whom It May Concern: > > > > > > SQL server is in the Unicode Products WebSite described as Unicode > enables. > > > > What we would like to know is : > > > > a - Does SQL Server allows to set as an index a field in Unicode standard? > > b - Can you make SQL query on this particular field? > > > > If you have any information, or ideas, thanks for your help. > > > > Regards, > > > > Pierre > > -- If practice makes perfect, and nobody's perfect, why practice? Tex Texin Director, International Products mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] +1-781-280-4271 Fax:+1-781-280-4655 Progress Software Corp.14 Oak Park, Bedford, MA 01730 http://www.progress.com#1 Embedded Database http://www.SonicMQ.com JMS Messaging- Best Middleware Award http://www.aspconnections.com #1 provider in the ASP marketplace http://www.NuSphere.comOpen Source software and services for MySQL Globalization Programhttp://www.progress.com/partners/globalization.htm - Come to the Panel on Open Source Approaches to Unicode Libraries at the Sept. Unicode Conference http://www.unicode.org/iuc/iuc17
Re: SQL Server and Unicode
SQL Server supports the datatypes NTEXT, NCHAR, and NVARCHAR, all of which are of type UCS-2. When such a column indexed, then the index is Unicode (I am not sure if this what you mean). SQL Server 7.0 only supports one language collation at the server level this choice affects the actual ordering of all such indexes. SQL Server 2000 supports a COLLATE keyword that allows you to specify a collation at the database or field level and thus choose a different language for such columns/indexes if you like (I discuss practical details and implications of this feature in an upcoming article in the Visual Basic Programmer's Journal, tentatively scheduled for November). In any case, you can certainly query and such field in either SQL 7.0 or in SQL 2000. Hopefully this answers your question; if not, let me know. :-) michka - Original Message - From: "pierre vaures" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Unicode List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2000 1:23 AM Subject: SQL Server and Unicode > To Whom It May Concern: > > > SQL server is in the Unicode Products WebSite described as Unicode enables. > > What we would like to know is : > > a - Does SQL Server allows to set as an index a field in Unicode standard? > b - Can you make SQL query on this particular field? > > If you have any information, or ideas, thanks for your help. > > Regards, > > Pierre >
