RE: the Unicode range and code page range bits in the TrueType OS/2 table
Microsoft applications use both of these to try to determine if a font is likely to support a certain range. Some fonts do not properly set those values but most do, especially common ones. Chris Pratley Group Program Manager Microsoft Office Sent with OfficeXP on WindowsXP -Original Message- From: Yung-Fong Tang [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: February 7, 2002 6:45 PM To: Brian Stell; Deborah Goldsmith; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: the Unicode range and code page range bits in the TrueType OS/2 table Dear i18n folks in Unicode.org Do we know ANY application on ANY platform use the Unicode range or code rage field in the TrueType OS/2 table to support different langeuags ? Does Microsoft applications depend on that ? Deborah: How about MacOS and Mac OS Apps Any Linux application use that ? Ken: Do you know any Adobe software depend on that? I heard a rumer said that those bits are usually unset and keep as 0. But I found that some of the font are set if I use ttfdump to look at them. Thanks
RE: the Unicode range and code page range bits in the TrueType OS/2 table
At 00:19 2/8/2002, Chris Pratley wrote: Microsoft applications use both of these to try to determine if a font is likely to support a certain range. Some fonts do not properly set those values but most do, especially common ones. Chris, how do you define a 'properly set' Unicode range in the OS/2 table? Correct codepage support is self-evident: a font should indicate codepage support only if it's cmap table includes *all* the characters in that codepage. Our current production tool (FontLab 4.0) indicates support for a Unicode range if *any* of the characters in that range are supported. This seems to me, on analysis, to be the best approach, since few fonts will support all the characters in a Unicode range, the definition of a Unicode range may change over time as new characters are added, and arbitrarily insisting on a certain percentage of the characters in a Unicode range is, well, arbitrary. I seem to recall that this approach is approved by your colleagues in the MS type group, but would be interested to know if your opinion, as an MS app developer, differed. John Hudson Tiro Typeworks www.tiro.com Vancouver, BC [EMAIL PROTECTED] ... es ist ein unwiederbringliches Bild der Vergangenheit, das mit jeder Gegenwart zu verschwinden droht, die sich nicht in ihm gemeint erkannte. ... every image of the past that is not recognized by the present as one of its own concerns threatens to disappear irretrievably. Walter Benjamin
RE: the Unicode range and code page range bits in the TrueType OS/2 table
On 02/08/2002 03:01:31 AM John Hudson wrote: Chris, how do you define a 'properly set' Unicode range in the OS/2 table? Correct codepage support is self-evident: a font should indicate codepage support only if it's cmap table includes *all* the characters in that codepage. Well, there are some gray areas. There are fonts out there that have the bit for cp1252 set but that don't have the euro or the upper/lower z-caron. And, I will confess, there are fonts out there that really stretch their claims to supporting cp X. For example, when we were completing our Yi font a couple of years ago, we wanted it to work in Word 97 and Word 2000. There was a problem in that Word 2000 had a bunch of font-linking things going on to try to keep the user from seeing boxes, but the algorithms were completely unaware of Yi. I ended up having to set codepage bits for Japanese and (I think) Central European (some Latin codepage other than cp1252) in order to make Word 2000 actually use the font -- if I didn't, then Word would quietly substitute Times New Roman or a Far East font for characters that the font really did support, including about half the Yi range. The claims of supporting those two codepages was very tenuous: there were many of the cp1250 characters not supported by the font, and I think there was exactly one character from cp932 that we actually supported -- 30FB. I'm sure we're not the only ones who have ever stretched things like this. - Peter --- Peter Constable Non-Roman Script Initiative, SIL International 7500 W. Camp Wisdom Rd., Dallas, TX 75236, USA Tel: +1 972 708 7485 E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: the Unicode range and code page range bits in the TrueType OS/2 table
ok. Let me ask again since my origional question is not good enough Do font vendor set teh the ulCharRange bits in OS/2range ?Does Application or OS depend on ulCharRange for what purpose? Ken Lunde wrote: Frank, You wrote: Ken: Do you know any Adobe software depend on that? I heard a rumer said that those bits are usually unset and keep as 0. But I found that some of the font are set ifI use ttfdump to look at them. Our OpenType fonts include 'OS/2' tables, and we populate these fields with meaningful information. To what extent our applications actually make use of it, I don't know. Regards... -- Ken
Re: the Unicode range and code page range bits in the TrueType OS/2 table
On Thursday, February 7, 2002, at 07:44 PM, Yung-Fong Tang wrote: Deborah: How about MacOS and Mac OS Apps No. Apple doesn't use anything in the OS/2 table except the embedding permission field. == John H. Jenkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://homepage.mac.com/jenkins/
