slightly OT: The art of writing documentation

[Mark Wieder via use-livecode]

Had to dig this up for someone else this afternoon, so I thought I'd 
spread it around a bit more.


Bob Reselman's lightning talk starts 30 minutes in.

--
 Mark Wieder
 ahsoftw...@gmail.com

___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: using tsNet external

[Terry Judd via use-livecode]

Thanks Charles – I’ll keep an eye out for the timeout stuff in the next release.

Best regards,

Terry...

On 2/06/2017 8:21 pm, "use-livecode on behalf of Charles Warwick via 
use-livecode"  wrote:

Hi Terry,

On 24/05/2017 11:55 AM, Terry Judd via use-livecode wrote:
> Couple of questions about the tsNet external...
>
> # if I’m just using get or post url (i.e. no special tsNet commands) do I 
still need to call tsNetInit?
No.  tsNetInit is automatically called on startup as part of libUrl 
initialisation.

> # what is the default timeout for a synchronous get or post url call, and 
how do I change it?
tsNet has a number of different settings related to determining if a 
connection has timed out.  At the moment, these cannot be changed.

Having said that, I am in the process of adding the ability to change 
these values for the next release.

Cheers,

Charles
> TIA,
>
> Terry...
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your 
subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode


___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your 
subscription preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode


___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: tsNet licensing error using the business version of LC server

[Ralf Bitter via use-livecode]

Sure, tested the tsNet Indy version (using LC server Indy) too,
there is no “external: unlicensed (tsNet)” error.

Copied the .so file to the externals folder, all .lc files are in
/var/www/html/.


Ralf 


> On 2. Jun 2017, at 23:01, Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Ralf,
> 
> did you try the tsNet external for Indy, also? 
> 
> Btw: How did you install tsNet  external. Where did you place the .so and the 
> .livecodescriptfile?
> 
> Regards,
> Matthias
> 
> Matthias Rebbe
> +49 5741 31
> ‌matthiasrebbe.eu   >‌
> 
>> Am 29.05.2017 um 18:29 schrieb Ralf Bitter via use-livecode 
>> >:
>> 
>> LC server yields an error on Ubuntu 16.04 Lts using any
>> LC server business version and the associated tsNet version:
>> 
>> “external: unlicensed (tsNet)”
>> 
>> This is strange as there is no licensing issue with the Indy version.
>> Seems the business license being valid needs to be approved
>> somehow, but how do I accomplish this?
>> 
>> 
>> Ralf


___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: HTML5 deployment: progress comes into sight

[hh via use-livecode]

Simply a creative contribution to this thread:

Here are direct links. Worth waiting for loading, it's faster than you
expect. (Also loading times has been essentially improved with my tests).

[EU] http://hyperhh.org/html5/LCImageToolboxHTML5-9.0.0-dp-4hhX.html
[US] http://hh.on-rev.com/html5/LCImageToolboxHTML5-9.0.0-dp-4hhX.html

The timing you see are the LC-times, not the screen update of the browsers
which is of course slower while a browser is caching large imageData.

Latest Safari and Chrome Canary (but not yet Chrome) are fastest with
the screen updates. Also tested to be OK here with latest Firefox and
latest Opera. As always: doesn't run in IE/Edge.

(It was tedious to work around the missing javascriptHandler in HTML5
deployment, we look forward to that feature Mark!)

___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: tsNet licensing error using the business version of LC server

[Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode]

Hi Ralf,

did you try the tsNet external for Indy, also? 

Btw: How did you install tsNet  external. Where did you place the .so and the 
.livecodescriptfile?

Regards,
Matthias

Matthias Rebbe
+49 5741 31
‌matthiasrebbe.eu ‌

> Am 29.05.2017 um 18:29 schrieb Ralf Bitter via use-livecode 
> >:
> 
> LC server yields an error on Ubuntu 16.04 Lts using any
> LC server business version and the associated tsNet version:
> 
> “external: unlicensed (tsNet)”
> 
> This is strange as there is no licensing issue with the Indy version.
> Seems the business license being valid needs to be approved
> somehow, but how do I accomplish this?
> 
> 
> Ralf
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com 
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
> preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: HTML5 deployment: progress comes into sight

[Mike Kerner via use-livecode]

Anyway, I really appreciate how easy it is to get at any of you and how
much you're paying attention to the pulse out here.  The sharing of
thinking/philosophy is really important because that flavor matters when we
are planning to build something.

On Fri, Jun 2, 2017 at 10:30 AM, Mike Kerner 
wrote:

> Clearly you need The Talk from The Unbearded One, because The Customer Is
> Always Right.
>
> On Fri, Jun 2, 2017 at 9:29 AM, Mark Waddingham via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>
>> Hehe - that works both ways Mike ;)
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> > On 2 Jun 2017, at 14:22, Mike Kerner via use-livecode <
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Mark,  and the rest of the team, having come from other development
>> tools,
>> > where the team is not part of the community, it's nice that you guys
>> are so
>> > actively engaged with the community, even when you're completely wrong
>> > because you disagree with me.
>> >
>> > On Fri, Jun 2, 2017 at 7:46 AM, hh via use-livecode <
>> > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> We really should start to split this thread into branches, for example
>> >>
>> >> [A] HTML5 deployment and "do as javascript" as already implemented
>> >> [B] HTML5 deployment and using widgets (not the browser widget)
>> >> [C] HTML5 in LC Builder (and the browser widget, javascript via FFI)
>> >> [D] LC Builder: Communication between widgets
>> >>
>> >> Yes, there are intersections. Just an idea to have more 'structure'.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ___
>> >> use-livecode mailing list
>> >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>> >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>> >> subscription preferences:
>> >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
>> > On the second day, God created the oceans.
>> > On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
>> >   and did a little diving.
>> > And God said, "This is good."
>> > ___
>> > use-livecode mailing list
>> > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>> > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>> subscription preferences:
>> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>
>>
>> ___
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>> subscription preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>
>
>
>
> --
> On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
> On the second day, God created the oceans.
> On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
>and did a little diving.
> And God said, "This is good."
>



-- 
On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
On the second day, God created the oceans.
On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
   and did a little diving.
And God said, "This is good."
___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: HTML5 deployment: progress comes into sight

[Mike Kerner via use-livecode]

Clearly you need The Talk from The Unbearded One, because The Customer Is
Always Right.

On Fri, Jun 2, 2017 at 9:29 AM, Mark Waddingham via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> Hehe - that works both ways Mike ;)
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On 2 Jun 2017, at 14:22, Mike Kerner via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> >
> > Mark,  and the rest of the team, having come from other development
> tools,
> > where the team is not part of the community, it's nice that you guys are
> so
> > actively engaged with the community, even when you're completely wrong
> > because you disagree with me.
> >
> > On Fri, Jun 2, 2017 at 7:46 AM, hh via use-livecode <
> > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> >
> >> We really should start to split this thread into branches, for example
> >>
> >> [A] HTML5 deployment and "do as javascript" as already implemented
> >> [B] HTML5 deployment and using widgets (not the browser widget)
> >> [C] HTML5 in LC Builder (and the browser widget, javascript via FFI)
> >> [D] LC Builder: Communication between widgets
> >>
> >> Yes, there are intersections. Just an idea to have more 'structure'.
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> use-livecode mailing list
> >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> >> subscription preferences:
> >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
> > On the second day, God created the oceans.
> > On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
> >   and did a little diving.
> > And God said, "This is good."
> > ___
> > use-livecode mailing list
> > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> subscription preferences:
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>
>
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>



-- 
On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
On the second day, God created the oceans.
On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
   and did a little diving.
And God said, "This is good."
___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: HTML5 deployment: progress comes into sight

[Mark Waddingham via use-livecode]

Hehe - that works both ways Mike ;)

Sent from my iPhone

> On 2 Jun 2017, at 14:22, Mike Kerner via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Mark,  and the rest of the team, having come from other development tools,
> where the team is not part of the community, it's nice that you guys are so
> actively engaged with the community, even when you're completely wrong
> because you disagree with me.
> 
> On Fri, Jun 2, 2017 at 7:46 AM, hh via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> 
>> We really should start to split this thread into branches, for example
>> 
>> [A] HTML5 deployment and "do as javascript" as already implemented
>> [B] HTML5 deployment and using widgets (not the browser widget)
>> [C] HTML5 in LC Builder (and the browser widget, javascript via FFI)
>> [D] LC Builder: Communication between widgets
>> 
>> Yes, there are intersections. Just an idea to have more 'structure'.
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>> subscription preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
> On the second day, God created the oceans.
> On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
>   and did a little diving.
> And God said, "This is good."
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
> preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode


___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: HTML5 deployment: progress comes into sight

[Mike Kerner via use-livecode]

Mark,  and the rest of the team, having come from other development tools,
where the team is not part of the community, it's nice that you guys are so
actively engaged with the community, even when you're completely wrong
because you disagree with me.

On Fri, Jun 2, 2017 at 7:46 AM, hh via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> We really should start to split this thread into branches, for example
>
> [A] HTML5 deployment and "do as javascript" as already implemented
> [B] HTML5 deployment and using widgets (not the browser widget)
> [C] HTML5 in LC Builder (and the browser widget, javascript via FFI)
> [D] LC Builder: Communication between widgets
>
> Yes, there are intersections. Just an idea to have more 'structure'.
>
>
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>



-- 
On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
On the second day, God created the oceans.
On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
   and did a little diving.
And God said, "This is good."
___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: HTML5 deployment: progress comes into sight

[hh via use-livecode]

We really should start to split this thread into branches, for example

[A] HTML5 deployment and "do as javascript" as already implemented
[B] HTML5 deployment and using widgets (not the browser widget)
[C] HTML5 in LC Builder (and the browser widget, javascript via FFI)
[D] LC Builder: Communication between widgets

Yes, there are intersections. Just an idea to have more 'structure'.


___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: HTML5 deployment: progress comes into sight

[Mark Waddingham via use-livecode]

It has substantial and wide ranging implications - all to the good.

At the very least 'WASM' is more compact than asm.js and eliminates the 
compiling overhead which you have when you load a text based representation of 
the language.

We've got a fair bit of housekeeping to do (particularly in our build system) 
to be able to start leveraging it, but it is a case of when and not if.

Warmest Regards,

Mark.

Sent from my iPhone

> On 2 Jun 2017, at 07:53, Dan Brown via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> A bit OT but there's an interesting discussion here
> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14458648 on the merits of WebAssembly
> vs JavaScript for in browser applications. As WebAssembly matures it will
> be interesting to see what implications (if any) it has for livecode html5
> i.e. will it ultimately become a better fit
> 
> 
> On 2 Jun 2017 3:08 am, "Andre Garzia via use-livecode" <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> 
>> What I believe BR was referring to is that we can expose LC handlers to the
>> local JS context of a browser widget thus enabling liveCode.* calls. What
>> would be good, was to have functions (synchronous ones for the sake of
>> complexity) exposed as well so that calling a liveCode.* function from JS
>> on a browser widget not only would trigger the function but also return the
>> results.
>> 
>> Right now, we need to play musical chairs where JS calls a liveCode.*
>> handler, which doesn't return anything but executes, then the said handler
>> execute something in the JS context which is essentially a callback thus
>> forcing every call into an async call. I know pretty well how async JS
>> world is but even if we could simply have synchronous functional calls
>> there it would be awesome and open a whole new world to customized
>> experiences.
>> 
>> On Thu, Jun 1, 2017 at 9:50 PM, Mark Wieder via use-livecode <
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> On 06/01/2017 04:59 PM, Monte Goulding via use-livecode wrote:
>>> 
>>> Why not check for CopySpecial() if the object is a widget before passing
 to the owner? It makes more sense that the library handler a widget
>> exports
 is part of the message path. That way we can dispatch to the instance
>> and
 the instance can overload/override it if they want necessary.
 
>>> 
>>> +1. I like the way you think.
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Mark Wieder
>>> ahsoftw...@gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>>> subscription preferences:
>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> http://www.andregarzia.com -- All We Do Is Code.
>> http://fon.nu -- minimalist url shortening service.
>> ___
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>> subscription preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>> 
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
> preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode


___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: HTML5 deployment: progress comes into sight

[Mark Waddingham via use-livecode]

The thought did occur to me - whilst it 'sounds' like a good idea at first 
glance there's a lot of i's to dot and t's to cross especially as the goal of 
widgets is they should be indistinguishable from controls written in C++ direct 
in the engine.

As it stands many of the implications of that approach are hard to assess 
because the current message path behaviour is more a result of iterative 
additions over the years (the code is spread all over the place in the engine) 
rather than something which has been explicitly designed ahead of time.

For example - we added behaviours, then we added before/after, then we added 
chained behaviours. However the latter don't take into account before/after 
explicitly which means there are somewhat murky interactions there (it is 
actually quite difficult to see how those two features should interact as it 
stands).

We need to rework the message path is implemented for html5 as part of solving 
the 'wait' problem (we can't use the same trick as on mobile because web worker 
threads are not fully featured enough - and the unknown number of years before 
they will likely be is not something we can depend on) so that will help shake 
out all the skeletons and make deeper changes much easier to assess.

[ the wait problem is that android, iOS and emscripten don't allow nested 
dispatch of the system event loop - control has to return to system (i.e. Empty 
c stack) for them to be dispatched ]

TL;DR - it might well be the way to go, but some prep work is needed first. Or 
at the very least, some time spent pondering it in a dark room to make sure we 
don't back ourselves into a corner.

Mark.

Sent from my iPhone

> On 2 Jun 2017, at 00:59, Monte Goulding via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On 1 Jun 2017, at 8:27 pm, Mark Waddingham via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Would export fooCopySpecial() as a function accessible from LCS where you 
>> can do:
>> 
>>  fooCopySpecial(the long id of widget 1, ...)
> 
> Why not check for CopySpecial() if the object is a widget before passing to 
> the owner? It makes more sense that the library handler a widget exports is 
> part of the message path. That way we can dispatch to the instance and the 
> instance can overload/override it if they want necessary.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Monte
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
> preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode


___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: using tsNet external

[Charles Warwick via use-livecode]

Hi Terry,

On 24/05/2017 11:55 AM, Terry Judd via use-livecode wrote:

Couple of questions about the tsNet external...

# if I’m just using get or post url (i.e. no special tsNet commands) do I still 
need to call tsNetInit?
No.  tsNetInit is automatically called on startup as part of libUrl 
initialisation.



# what is the default timeout for a synchronous get or post url call, and how 
do I change it?
tsNet has a number of different settings related to determining if a 
connection has timed out.  At the moment, these cannot be changed.


Having said that, I am in the process of adding the ability to change 
these values for the next release.


Cheers,

Charles

TIA,

Terry...
___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode



___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

Re: HTML5 deployment: progress comes into sight

[Dan Brown via use-livecode]

A bit OT but there's an interesting discussion here
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14458648 on the merits of WebAssembly
vs JavaScript for in browser applications. As WebAssembly matures it will
be interesting to see what implications (if any) it has for livecode html5
i.e. will it ultimately become a better fit


On 2 Jun 2017 3:08 am, "Andre Garzia via use-livecode" <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> What I believe BR was referring to is that we can expose LC handlers to the
> local JS context of a browser widget thus enabling liveCode.* calls. What
> would be good, was to have functions (synchronous ones for the sake of
> complexity) exposed as well so that calling a liveCode.* function from JS
> on a browser widget not only would trigger the function but also return the
> results.
>
> Right now, we need to play musical chairs where JS calls a liveCode.*
> handler, which doesn't return anything but executes, then the said handler
> execute something in the JS context which is essentially a callback thus
> forcing every call into an async call. I know pretty well how async JS
> world is but even if we could simply have synchronous functional calls
> there it would be awesome and open a whole new world to customized
> experiences.
>
> On Thu, Jun 1, 2017 at 9:50 PM, Mark Wieder via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>
> > On 06/01/2017 04:59 PM, Monte Goulding via use-livecode wrote:
> >
> > Why not check for CopySpecial() if the object is a widget before passing
> >> to the owner? It makes more sense that the library handler a widget
> exports
> >> is part of the message path. That way we can dispatch to the instance
> and
> >> the instance can overload/override it if they want necessary.
> >>
> >
> > +1. I like the way you think.
> >
> > --
> >  Mark Wieder
> >  ahsoftw...@gmail.com
> >
> >
> > ___
> > use-livecode mailing list
> > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> > subscription preferences:
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
> >
>
>
>
> --
> http://www.andregarzia.com -- All We Do Is Code.
> http://fon.nu -- minimalist url shortening service.
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>
___
use-livecode mailing list
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
preferences:
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode