Re: Do Proxies Interfere With Sockets? [RevNet?]

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 05:27 PM, David Kwinter wrote:

Geez, I really hope there's a way to make sockets work. I'd hate to 
redo
everything using HTTP and a webserver to sidestep the proxies & 
firewalls.
Here is an approach.

Have a few lines in the doc describe exactly what is needed.  Something 
like this:

   TCP outgoing
   Port: 4401
   IP Addresses: all
   Protocol:  Proprietary Database Access
If you can narrow it down to a small range of IP address or even one, 
that is better.

The user can take that to the keeper of the firewall.

Dar Scott





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no binary keys for arrays

[Dar Scott]

Recently, I mentioned on some list or maybe in private that arrays can 
have binary keys and binary elements.  I was sure I ran the test.  I 
must have been thinking of my element test.  Well, I ran into a bug in 
my code and learned that nulls break keys.  So, what I said is not true.

Dar Scott

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RE: Do Proxies Interfere With Sockets? [RevNet?]

[Chipp Walters]

There are many different kinds of Proxy servers, and many different
authentication schemes. At some point, RR will want to support as many
different authentication schemes as possible -- though it may take a bit of
'expert' programming.

Altuit, and Daniels-Mara are hoping to work on this problem in the near
future, as we have several enterprise products which need to work through
different proxy servers. If anyone has a desire to help, or share any
existing solutions, please email me offlist and I'll try and setup a website
with status (and hopefully some beta code) of some preliminary solutions.
IMHO, I think this all needs to be integrated with libURL.

It may also be necessary to create some custom externals in order to handle
some of the more difficult authentication schemes (such as MS
challenge/response), though I'm not an expert on this.

best,

Chipp


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Re: cRevgeneral["script"]

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 03:50 PM, Alex Rice wrote:

MLXEditor gets and sets the script property of objects. It assumes the 
script property is just a long string, and it writes the script to a 
file and launches an external editor on the file. Then when the file 
has been modified, MLXEditor reads it and sets the script property of 
the object. MLXEditor doesn't have any concept of fancy formatting. 
Whatever editor being used can of course do formatting or syntax 
coloring if it's capable.
I get it.  And this makes sense.

My kibitzing at this point is to encourage you to make sure one who 
goes back to the IDE editor does not edit old script data--which may 
already be the case.

Dar Scott

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Accessing Multidimensional Arrays

[Sharon Stamps]

I am interested in creating several large, multidimensional
arrays within my stack (I’m creating a diagnostic testing program).  What
I want to do is add info to and remove info from these arrays during the use of
the program, and then, when the user completes the test, pipe the information
contained in the arrays to a text file for teacher assessment.  Is there a
quick and painless way to do this?  So far I have been able to create and
edit the values of the dimensions of the arrays just fine, but the end text
file baffles me.  I have toyed with the idea of using a function or a repeat
loop to obtain the values to put into the file, but I was hoping there would be
an easier way.  There isn’t much documentation on arrays, so I would
really appreciate any suggestions!

Re: Do Proxies Interfere With Sockets?

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 03:40 PM, David Kwinter wrote:

On openStack my program gets the IP address of the host computer via 
the URL
http://www.sofaking.tv/w.txt
Currently 137.186.182:8080

It then does its communication via sockets.
Do you mean via tcp using "open socket"?  One might infer from the 
above IP address and port that it is tcp to an http port.

I understand that the first request may not work if "httpProxy" is not 
set
first. That is ok and I can change it.

My question is: Will my socket communication work normally thereafter 
or
does a proxy mess with it too?
No.  Well, not with simply an "open socket" command.  If it really is 
http, then you need to open the port at the proxy.  (Well, some 
firewalls will forward requests to its proxy, so... maybe.)

If it is not http, then you will likely have to deal with the firewall 
and firewall keepers.

Unfortunately I don't have a proxy to test
with.
Maybe somebody has figured out how to provide that service.

Dar Scott

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Re: JDBC instead of ODBC

[Alex Rice]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 02:57  PM, Júlio César Ködel wrote:

Those links that I passed in my messages are both for open source ODBC
engines (for both Windows and Linux). I think would not be hard to 
make a
MacOS X version, but, for MacOS, I don't know (therefore, I hate macs 
;-] )
I once tried to compile an open-source ODBC driver for OS X, but 
utterly failed.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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to make machines that are disposable  -Ani DiFranco
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Re: cRevgeneral["script"]

[Alex Rice]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 03:02  PM, Dar Scott wrote:
My mind had gone down some bunny trail and started wandering into to 
thinking a script editor edits a source that is processed to become a 
script.  If I put fancy formatting and tabular data and math and color 
and multiple languages in my /* */ handler/function headers, then they 
might be lost in MLXEditor, I guess.  I don't know how this would 
really work; my mind wanders off in directions that my actions have 
yet to find.  (I won't mention pictures; that would be a distraction.)
MLXEditor gets and sets the script property of objects. It assumes the 
script property is just a long string, and it writes the script to a 
file and launches an external editor on the file. Then when the file 
has been modified, MLXEditor reads it and sets the script property of 
the object. MLXEditor doesn't have any concept of fancy formatting. 
Whatever editor being used can of course do formatting or syntax 
coloring if it's capable.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

what a waste of thumbs that are opposable
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Re: Decompress cross platform

[Alex Rice]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 02:45  PM, J. Landman Gay wrote:

I may be mis-remembering, but I thought character conversions were now 
done on custom properties as well as on fields. Or was I dreaming > that?
I hope that's not the case- then there would be no safe place to put 
binary data in stacks.

I will try the ISO conversions though and see if that helps.
I think the automatic ISO conversion is the culprit if you are storing 
the compressed data in fields. Try storing it in a custom property.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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Do Proxies Interfere With Sockets?

[David Kwinter]

Hello,

I have a program which works great on Mac and PCs which are either directly
connected to the internet or behind a router, not a proxy.

On openStack my program gets the IP address of the host computer via the URL
http://www.sofaking.tv/w.txt

It then does its communication via sockets.

I understand that the first request may not work if "httpProxy" is not set
first. That is ok and I can change it.

My question is: Will my socket communication work normally thereafter or
does a proxy mess with it too? Unfortunately I don't have a proxy to test
with.


Please help,


David Kwinter

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Re: Decompress cross platform

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 03:15 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote:

It won't work for me. In re: your other note, there are no nulls and 
the lines are not long; it is just plain ascii. So I don't think the 
problem is with the source text, especially since I can reproduce the 
problem no matter what I put in the field.
I mean the compressed data.  Starting at the fourth byte are some 
nulls.  And since it is binary, there is no reason why there might not 
be no Lf chars for well over the max line length.

Here is a hex dump of compress("abc"):

1f8b08034b4c4a0600c24124350300

(Compression is only shorter for strings over, uh, about 25 bytes, I 
think.  A trick is to store strings less than 20 as uncompressed 
strings; you know whether to uncompress or not by the length.)

Dar Scott



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Re: Decompress cross platform

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 02:45 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote:

I may be mis-remembering, but I thought character conversions were now 
done on custom properties as well as on fields. Or was I dreaming > that?
From the dictionary entry for ISOToMac():

Revolution automatically translates text in fields and scripts, as 
well as the names of custom properties, into the appropriate character 
set when you move a stack from one platform to another. It is 
therefore not necessary to translate them. However, the contents of 
custom properties, since they may contain binary data, are not 
translated automatically and must be translated if they contain 
characters whose ASCII value is 128 or greater.

From "Why... is a custom property garbled when switching platforms":

However, text in custom properties is not converted between the ISO 
and Macintosh character sets. This is because custom properties can 
contain binary data as well as text, and converting them would garble 
the data. If you plan to display the data in a custom property as 
text, you must convert it yourself when you use the stack on another 
platform.
So, my panic was premature.

Maybe the compressed htmlText could go into a custom property.

I don't think storing binary in fields is safe, be it crossplatform or 
not.

Dar Scott
panic prone
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Re: Decompress cross platform

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 02:45 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote:

I may be mis-remembering, but I thought character conversions were now 
done on custom properties as well as on fields. Or was I dreaming > that?
Yikes!

Does this mean all binary data in a stack will have to be base64 or 
hex?  This is crazy.  It is not a field.  Next, I'll find out that 
stack encryption will destroy binary data.

Dar Scott

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Re: Decompress cross platform

[J. Landman Gay]

On 10/3/03 3:20 PM, Dar Scott wrote:

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 01:14 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote:

I don't want to maintain separate stacks for each platform. Any idea 
how to get around this problem? I thought compression was supposed to 
work the same way on all plaforms.


Me, too.

There is a decompression bug for OS X & Revolution 2.1, but this does 
not seem to be it.  Or is it?  That bug is fixed and the fix will be in 
an upcoming release.

Revolution compression uses a gzip style compression that is the same as 
that (the best I can tell) in RFC1952.  The decompression does not check 
the CRC, so it can't be compliant.  In my opinion, it should _not_ check 
the CRC in decompression.  I would expect this to work across 
platforms.  IIRC, the OS X bug is a type bug and those might make 
differences across platforms.

Do you have a small example that does not work the same across platforms.
You can use anything. Just create a field and put any text into it. Then 
do this:

 put compress(fld x) into fld x

Save the stack and transfer it to the other platform. Then do:

 put decompress(fld x) into fld x

It won't work for me. In re: your other note, there are no nulls and the 
lines are not long; it is just plain ascii. So I don't think the problem 
is with the source text, especially since I can reproduce the problem no 
matter what I put in the field.

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
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Re: Decompress cross platform

[J. Landman Gay]

On 10/3/03 3:13 PM, Jeanne A. E. DeVoto wrote:

At 2:14 PM -0500 10/3/2003, J. Landman Gay wrote:

The data decompresses fine on whatever platform did the compression. 
But when the data is compressed on Windows, it won't decompress when 
the stack is copied to a Mac. When the data is compressed on a Mac, it 
won't decompress when the stack is copied to Windows. I suspect this 
may have something to do with line endings, but maybe not. In any 
case, I get an error saying the data is not compressed data.


I haven't checked this, but I'll bet it's because of the automatic 
character set conversion between Mac and Windows/Unix. So the fix would 
be to either store the thing in a custom property (which doesn't have 
this conversion done) or to run it through MacToISO or ISOToMac, as 
appropriate, before decompressing it.
Doesn't seem to work. :(

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
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Re: cRevgeneral["script"]

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 02:34 PM, Alex Rice wrote:

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 02:29  PM, Dar Scott wrote:

Wouldn't it be easier to use it?
It's the script marked up as HTML! That's not in MLXEditor's purview, 
nor do I want it to be. If MLXEditor touches it, it's only going to be 
for getting rid of it purposes.
Ah.  You think of a script editor as an editor that edits script 
properties.  ;-)

I think it quite reasonable to think that.  And it may be the right way 
to think about this.

My mind had gone down some bunny trail and started wandering into to 
thinking a script editor edits a source that is processed to become a 
script.  If I put fancy formatting and tabular data and math and color 
and multiple languages in my /* */ handler/function headers, then they 
might be lost in MLXEditor, I guess.  I don't know how this would 
really work; my mind wanders off in directions that my actions have yet 
to find.  (I won't mention pictures; that would be a distraction.)

If it does not match the script property, then getting rid of it might 
be best.  I don't know how the Revolution editor works, but if it 
assumes that is the latest, things can go wrong.  Or setting it to a 
trivial uncolored html value whenever the script is set, whatever works.

What might be good would be a function you can call to set the script 
and it can do what it needs to to keep a consistent 
cRevgeneral["script"].  Or get the script.

If color is a function of the script syntax, then the flow of info is 
not the direction my mind had wandered into, and there may not be a 
problem at all.  Except for my fancy headers.

Dar Scott



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Re: JDBC instead of ODBC

[Júlio César Ködel]

Those links that I passed in my messages are both for open source ODBC
engines (for both Windows and Linux). I think would not be hard to make a
MacOS X version, but, for MacOS, I don't know (therefore, I hate macs ;-] )

- Original Message -
From: "Alex Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, October 03, 2003 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: JDBC instead of ODBC


>
> On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 01:01  PM, Todd Geist wrote:
> >  Is it particular hard to build this kind of driver?
>
> If you are programming in Java it's not hard, I would imagine.
> But JDBC makes no sense for Rev because it's not related to Java in any
> way.
>
>
> Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com
>
> what a waste of thumbs that are opposable
> to make machines that are disposable  -Ani DiFranco
>
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Re: Decompress cross platform

[J. Landman Gay]

On 10/3/03 3:13 PM, Jeanne A. E. DeVoto wrote:

At 2:14 PM -0500 10/3/2003, J. Landman Gay wrote:

The data decompresses fine on whatever platform did the compression. 
But when the data is compressed on Windows, it won't decompress when 
the stack is copied to a Mac. When the data is compressed on a Mac, it 
won't decompress when the stack is copied to Windows. I suspect this 
may have something to do with line endings, but maybe not. In any 
case, I get an error saying the data is not compressed data.


I haven't checked this, but I'll bet it's because of the automatic 
character set conversion between Mac and Windows/Unix. So the fix would 
be to either store the thing in a custom property (which doesn't have 
this conversion done) or to run it through MacToISO or ISOToMac, as 
appropriate, before decompressing it.
I may be mis-remembering, but I thought character conversions were now 
done on custom properties as well as on fields. Or was I dreaming that?

I will try the ISO conversions though and see if that helps.

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
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Re: cRevgeneral["script"]

[Alex Rice]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 02:29  PM, Dar Scott wrote:

Wouldn't it be easier to use it?
It's the script marked up as HTML! That's not in MLXEditor's purview, 
nor do I want it to be. If MLXEditor touches it, it's only going to be 
for getting rid of it purposes.

Suppose someone switched back and forth?  I'm just making wild guesses 
on how things work.
Donnow I haven't looked at Rev IDEs source code carefully enough.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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Re: JDBC instead of ODBC

[Alex Rice]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 01:01  PM, Todd Geist wrote:
 Is it particular hard to build this kind of driver?
If you are programming in Java it's not hard, I would imagine.
But JDBC makes no sense for Rev because it's not related to Java in any 
way.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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Re: cRevgeneral["script"]

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 01:57 PM, Alex Rice wrote:

While using my MLXEditor plugin, I noticed that old copies of the 
scripts, in HTML markup!, were stored in cRevgeneral["script"]. Is it 
safe to set that property to empty? I assume it's something that the 
IDE's script editor stack writes, but I don't use it for MLXEditor.
Wouldn't it be easier to use it?  Suppose someone switched back and 
forth?  I'm just making wild guesses on how things work.

Dar Scott

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Re: Decompress cross platform

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 01:14 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote:

To save disk space, I run it through compress() and put the compressed 
data back into the field before saving the stack.
A field can lose data that contains a null or has "lines" too long.

...and what Jeanne said.

Dar Scott

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JDBC instead of ODBC

[Todd Geist]

Hello,

All this talk about Rev and Firebird has got me wishing again for JDBC
instead of ODBC. Does anyone know if there are any plans for JDBC in Rev's
future.  Is it particular hard to build this kind of driver?  I know some
underemployed java programmers who might be interested in giving it go.  Is
it worth it?

Any comments?

Todd


-- 
Todd Geist
_
g e i s t   i n t e r a c t i v e

web hosting ­ web design ­ application design


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Re: Decompress cross platform

[Dar Scott]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 01:14 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote:

I don't want to maintain separate stacks for each platform. Any idea 
how to get around this problem? I thought compression was supposed to 
work the same way on all plaforms.
Me, too.

There is a decompression bug for OS X & Revolution 2.1, but this does 
not seem to be it.  Or is it?  That bug is fixed and the fix will be in 
an upcoming release.

Revolution compression uses a gzip style compression that is the same 
as that (the best I can tell) in RFC1952.  The decompression does not 
check the CRC, so it can't be compliant.  In my opinion, it should 
_not_ check the CRC in decompression.  I would expect this to work 
across platforms.  IIRC, the OS X bug is a type bug and those might 
make differences across platforms.

Do you have a small example that does not work the same across 
platforms.

Dar Scott

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Re: Decompress cross platform

[Jeanne A. E. DeVoto]

At 2:14 PM -0500 10/3/2003, J. Landman Gay wrote:
The data decompresses fine on whatever platform did the compression. 
But when the data is compressed on Windows, it won't decompress when 
the stack is copied to a Mac. When the data is compressed on a Mac, 
it won't decompress when the stack is copied to Windows. I suspect 
this may have something to do with line endings, but maybe not. In 
any case, I get an error saying the data is not compressed data.
I haven't checked this, but I'll bet it's because of the automatic 
character set conversion between Mac and Windows/Unix. So the fix 
would be to either store the thing in a custom property (which 
doesn't have this conversion done) or to run it through MacToISO or 
ISOToMac, as appropriate, before decompressing it.
--
Jeanne DeVoto ~ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~ http://www.runrev.com/
Runtime Revolution - User-Centric Development Tools
~~~ Check our web site for new Revolution editions & special offers ~~~
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cRevgeneral["script"]

[Alex Rice]

While using my MLXEditor plugin, I noticed that old copies of the 
scripts, in HTML markup!, were stored in cRevgeneral["script"]. Is it 
safe to set that property to empty? I assume it's something that the 
IDE's script editor stack writes, but I don't use it for MLXEditor.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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to make machines that are disposable  -Ani DiFranco
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Re: specialFolderPath("Temporary") on OS X

[Thierry Arbellot]

Hi Alex,

I had a similar problem on one of my iMac, that didn't have the 
temporary folder, and specialFolderPath("Temporary") returned empty.
Worst, if I created this folder, it was removed when the system is 
restarted.

The solution was to add in the script the command "put the tempName" 
that creates the missing temporary folder.

Hope that helps.

Regards.

Thierry.

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 06:44 PM, Alex Rice wrote:

specialFolderPath("Temporary") works on Mac OS X, most of the time. It 
returns a path like /tmp/xxx/temporary items/ where xxx is the UID. 
However, on my OS X box, it has recently started cleaning out /tmp on 
reboot, and after that specialFolderPath("Temporary") returns empty. 
After some time has passed, some other app, or the OS, decides to 
recreate the /tmp/xxx/temporary directories and then 
specialFolderPath("Temporary") works again.

It's very strange. Anyone know the cause of this? I'm just going to 
use the unix-like "/tmp" and not use specialFolderPath("Temporary") 
for OS X, but I would like to know how this is happening.

Anyone using the MLXEditor plugin, this is a possible gotcha.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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Decompress cross platform

[J. Landman Gay]

This has come up on the list before, but I didn't find a solution in the 
archives.

I have a field with a lot of data in it. To save disk space, I run it 
through compress() and put the compressed data back into the field 
before saving the stack. When the stack opens, it uses decompress() to 
extract the information.

The data decompresses fine on whatever platform did the compression. But 
when the data is compressed on Windows, it won't decompress when the 
stack is copied to a Mac. When the data is compressed on a Mac, it won't 
decompress when the stack is copied to Windows. I suspect this may have 
something to do with line endings, but maybe not. In any case, I get an 
error saying the data is not compressed data.

I don't want to maintain separate stacks for each platform. Any idea how 
to get around this problem? I thought compression was supposed to work 
the same way on all plaforms.

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
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Re: Mac OSX standalone voice record problem

[Mark Talluto]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 05:05 AM, Dan Soneson wrote:

Hi everyone,

I am once again trying to get a voice recording application to work 
appropriately in an OSX standalone. I develop on a G4 dual 1.42 Ghz, 
Rev 2.02, OSX 10.2.6 and deploy on both 700Mzh G4 eMacs and 500Mhz G3 
iBooks, same OS. In the development environment, everything works just 
fine. However, when I build a standalone and try to record through an 
attached microphone (plantronics Audio 90 with Griffin iMic), the 
recording tends to be truncated and jumbled up. In other words, if I 
were to say "1,2,3,4,5" I might get "3,4,2" as a result -- very 
strange. Also, I have noticed a tendency to limit the recording file 
to about 4 seconds total.

Several months ago I thought I had licked the problem by making 
absolutely sure the recorded file was located outside the application 
package. This workaround now seems to have no effect. The frustrating 
part is that we might occasionally get a perfectly normal recording, 
but the next time we try, we get the jumbled up results again. It just 
doesn't seem to be consistent.

We intend to deploy a recording application in our language lab, so 
that students may record their voices and the files can be saved so 
that instructors can hear the students' output. Occasionally, the 
program can be used for oral testing. However, if the recording is 
unstable at all, the program is useless.

I have checked the bugzilla database, but have been able to find 
anything regarding this problem there. Before I post it on bugzilla, I 
wonder if anyone out there has found a consistent solution to the 
problem.

I remember the problem existing when I first started using the 
recording features in MC.  At the time I could not find a workaround 
and gave up.  Was told by Scott that using the wrong compression 
settings could cause problems.  I never looked deeper into it as it was 
not needed at the time.  Bugzilla it!



Best regards,
Mark Talluto
http://www.canelasoftware.com
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Re: specialFolderPath("Temporary") on OS X

[Alex Rice]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 11:35  AM, Scott Rossi wrote:
Not sure why you see this but what happens if you do:

  put the tempName
Good idea- I'll try that next reboot.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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Sculley on lost opportunity with HyperCard

[Richard K. Herz]

Interesting comment from John Scully on lost opportunity with HyperCard at

http://news.com.com/2008-7351-5085423.html?tag=nefd_gutspro

Interview with John Sculley, former CEO of Apple Computer, October 2, 2003,
4:00 AM PDT, By Dawn Kawamoto, Staff Writer, CNET News.com

Any missed opportunities that you wish you could do over?

As I look back on things that I wished we would have done differently when I
was at Apple, I think one of the biggest missed opportunities, and it was on
my watch, so I feel responsible and disappointed that we didn't do more with
it, was Hypercard. It was created back in 1987 by Bill Atkinson, Apple's
first software programmer. We could never figure out exactly what it was...

We weren't insightful enough to recognize that what we had inside of
Hypercard, essentially, was everything that later was developed so
successfully by Tim Berners-Lee with HTTP (Hypertext Transfer Protocol) and
HTML (Hypertext Markup Language)...



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Re: specialFolderPath("Temporary") on OS X

[Scott Rossi]

Recently, "Alex Rice"  wrote:

> specialFolderPath("Temporary") works on Mac OS X, most of the time. It
> returns a path like /tmp/xxx/temporary items/ where xxx is the UID.
> However, on my OS X box, it has recently started cleaning out /tmp on
> reboot, and after that specialFolderPath("Temporary") returns empty.
> After some time has passed, some other app, or the OS, decides to
> recreate the /tmp/xxx/temporary directories and then
> specialFolderPath("Temporary") works again.
> 
> It's very strange. Anyone know the cause of this?

Not sure why you see this but what happens if you do:

  put the tempName

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
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Re: Window's Icon

[Robert Presender]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 02:23 AM, Chipp wrote:
snip
btw, if you install the altPlugins toolbar, it will put the version, 
engine
and build info in the message box each time you open RR. You can find 
it at:

Thanks Chipp.

Regards ... Bob

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specialFolderPath("Temporary") on OS X

[Alex Rice]

specialFolderPath("Temporary") works on Mac OS X, most of the time. It 
returns a path like /tmp/xxx/temporary items/ where xxx is the UID. 
However, on my OS X box, it has recently started cleaning out /tmp on 
reboot, and after that specialFolderPath("Temporary") returns empty. 
After some time has passed, some other app, or the OS, decides to 
recreate the /tmp/xxx/temporary directories and then 
specialFolderPath("Temporary") works again.

It's very strange. Anyone know the cause of this? I'm just going to use 
the unix-like "/tmp" and not use specialFolderPath("Temporary") for OS 
X, but I would like to know how this is happening.

Anyone using the MLXEditor plugin, this is a possible gotcha.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

what a waste of thumbs that are opposable
to make machines that are disposable  -Ani DiFranco
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Re: [OT] aspiring game developers

[Alex Rice]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 04:10  AM, Geoff Canyon wrote:

There the similarities end.
And unfortunately it doesn't have the "trails" effect caused by the 
slow old monochrome vector display in the Asteroids console game. :-)

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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Re: [OT] aspiring game developers

[Scott Rossi]

On 10/3/03 3:10 AM, "Geoff Canyon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I've posted the stack "Star Battle."
> Type this in the message box and press return to try it out:
> 
> go stack url "http://www.inspiredlogic.com/rev/starbattle.rev";
> ...
> Let me know what you think.

I think "this is really cool."  I think "'inspired logic' is an appropriate
name for this guy's operation."  I think "I hope sometime he can provide a
simple demo of some the gravity/bounce algorithms he uses in Rev."

So I wonder if you used four vector objects instead of one (a stretch, I
know), you might be able to introduce colored objects?  (player's ship
color, rock color, enemy ship color, shot color)  Maybe setting the points
of more than one graphic is too slow, but if the current experiment works so
well?  Maybe more experiments are in order...

Thanks for sharing Geoff.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
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Re: 'bout Revolution and FireBird]

[Júlio César Ködel]

I get it!
The database name CONTAINS the hostname =\
host:c:\databasename.ext

This works with 2 ODBC drivers that I get... Only in the second driver there
was a minimal tip of achieving this... People are a little lazy 'bout
documentation =(

Thanx for the help of all of you, now I can start to program with Revolution
(and fill this list with doubts, he he he)...

[]

For those who want to use FireBird and have the same problem o'mine:

Use any ODBC driver for FB (I recommend IBOLEDB, which is easier to install
and faster to connect), then, when creating a DSN, put the hostname before
the path:

HOSTNAME:PATH\DATABASE.GDB or FDB

- Original Message -
From: "Bernard Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 11:18 AM
Subject: Re: 'bout Revolution and FireBird]


> Julio,
>
> >>
> In ODBC with DSN, I can't declare host, thus, only local databases can be
> used =(
> <<
>
> I have connected Windows clients to remote Firebird databases via ODBC.
> Can you provide me with
>
> - the server name where your remote Firebird db is located
> - the port being used (if other than that used with the default Firebird
> install)
> - the path to the database on the server.
>
> Which ODBC driver are you using?  Can you send me a screenshot of what you
> are seeing?
>
> Please send me this off-list to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  -- I
> will post my response back to the list for you and any other interested
> party.
>
> Regards,
> Bernard
>
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Re: [OT] aspiring game developers

[Alex Rice]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 04:10  AM, Geoff Canyon wrote:

With a plug like that, how can I resist? I've posted the stack "Star 
Battle." Type this in the message box and press return to try it out:

go stack url "http://www.inspiredlogic.com/rev/starbattle.rev";
That's cool thanks Geoff. Good learning resource. I noticed that the 
sound kept playing after I did "close and remove from memory" in the 
application browser. Do you know what causes that or how to workaround?

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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to make machines that are disposable  -Ani DiFranco
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Re: 'bout Revolution and FireBird]

[Alex Rice]

On Friday, October 3, 2003, at 07:37  AM, Júlio César Ködel wrote:

That's the point... I didn't found this option... It only permits 
create DSN
for local databases =(
In VB, we use connection string, not DSN... I know it's not a 
Revolution
issue, but could you give-me more information about remote databases 
and
DSNs? (I will not program for Macs, only for IBM, in both Microsoft 
and *nix
plataforms).
In Windows 2000:
Control Panel | Administrative Tools | Data Sources (ODBC) | User DSN 
or System DSN | Add | Select Driver | (now what you see depends on 
which driver selected)

If the ODBC driver supports remote databases, then you will see a 
"server" or "hostname" field to type into. Not being a firebird user I 
can't give any more details than that.

For Unix you will have to either compile everything- or download the 
commercial drivers from IODBC. I've never used IODBC on Unix- it's 
always seemed too complicated to bother with, when native drivers are 
also available for most databases.

Indeed, there is a ODBC driver for FireBird, and works fine, but, as I 
said,
VB works with connection string (which gives me possibilities to 
declare
provider (FireBird ODBC), host, database (in host), username and 
password.
In ODBC with DSN, I can't declare host, thus, only local databases can 
be
used =(
There must be more than one ODBC driver for Firebird then. Maybe you 
don't have the client-server ODBC driver? There are two different 
firebird versions right- single user and multi-user? Maybe you have the 
single-user ODBC driver. Just a guess.

Alex Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Mindlube Software | http://mindlube.com

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Re: 'bout Revolution and FireBird]

[Bernard Devlin]

Julio,

>>
In ODBC with DSN, I can't declare host, thus, only local databases can be
used =(
<<

I have connected Windows clients to remote Firebird databases via ODBC. 
Can you provide me with 

- the server name where your remote Firebird db is located
- the port being used (if other than that used with the default Firebird 
install)
- the path to the database on the server. 

Which ODBC driver are you using?  Can you send me a screenshot of what you 
are seeing? 

Please send me this off-list to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  -- I 
will post my response back to the list for you and any other interested 
party.

Regards,
Bernard

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Re: 'bout Revolution and FireBird]

[Júlio César Ködel]

> ODBC can be used with remote databases. When creating the DSN you
> specify the hostname or IP address of the server.
>
That's the point... I didn't found this option... It only permits create DSN
for local databases =(
In VB, we use connection string, not DSN... I know it's not a Revolution
issue, but could you give-me more information about remote databases and
DSNs? (I will not program for Macs, only for IBM, in both Microsoft and *nix
plataforms).

> Are you confusing the database server with the database client
> libraries? No matter what database you choose, if it's running on a
> remote server, then the client user should not need to download and
> install the database- all they need is the client libraries, whether
> they be ODBC drivers, or revDB drivers.
>
Indeed, there is a ODBC driver for FireBird, and works fine, but, as I said,
VB works with connection string (which gives me possibilities to declare
provider (FireBird ODBC), host, database (in host), username and password.
In ODBC with DSN, I can't declare host, thus, only local databases can be
used =(

Thanx for all the help ;-)

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Re: array on card

[Michael Young]

> On Wednesday, October 1, 2003, at 10:11 PM, Michael Young wrote:
>
> > How can I put an expandable indexed array as an object on a card. For
> > those few who have heard of LabVIEW I am looking for something
> > equivalent to how it handles array display.
>
> I know what you mean.  At one time almost all I made was in LabVIEW.
>
> I don't know of a direct way to do what you want.  I think it is
> possible to make a custom control to do what you want, but that might
> take some work.
>
> You might be better off looking for a way to address your immediate
> need.  What control or indicator were you thinking for your array
> element?  Can you get by with a fixed number of displayed elements?
>
> Dar Scott

My array element is a text string. I would prefer a non fixed length array
display since my array length may change, but a large enough fixed length
array would probably work.

Since, you know LabVIEW I will explain a little more about what I am doing.
I actually use LV now for a project that I would like to convert to RR. I
store simple comma delimited plain text files on disk that are read into my
current LV program. By simply selecting different text data files I of
course get different array elements in my program. My current text files are
a little more complicated in that I actually read text files into an LV
cluster with first element true/false control and second element string,
however I wanted to see if RR could do the more simple array first before
tackling the harder "cluster" project.

You know, I am probably looking for something similar to the Revolution
Tutorial setup but I want to have each tutorial number card be an object on
a card rather than the card itself.  I also want to see more than one
tutorial number card at a time. I will have to look into how I can do this.
Or maybe what I am looking to do might be best performed by setting up a
database.

If any of the above makes any sense, I would appreciate your input.

Michael
PS If you are wondering why I am converting a working LV project to RR, it
is simply that RR better meets my long range needs and the current LV
project needs a number of techniques that I know will be useful down the RR
road.



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Mac OSX standalone voice record problem

[Dan Soneson]

Hi everyone,

I am once again trying to get a voice recording application to work 
appropriately in an OSX standalone. I develop on a G4 dual 1.42 Ghz, 
Rev 2.02, OSX 10.2.6 and deploy on both 700Mzh G4 eMacs and 500Mhz G3 
iBooks, same OS. In the development environment, everything works just 
fine. However, when I build a standalone and try to record through an 
attached microphone (plantronics Audio 90 with Griffin iMic), the 
recording tends to be truncated and jumbled up. In other words, if I 
were to say "1,2,3,4,5" I might get "3,4,2" as a result -- very 
strange. Also, I have noticed a tendency to limit the recording file to 
about 4 seconds total.

Several months ago I thought I had licked the problem by making 
absolutely sure the recorded file was located outside the application 
package. This workaround now seems to have no effect. The frustrating 
part is that we might occasionally get a perfectly normal recording, 
but the next time we try, we get the jumbled up results again. It just 
doesn't seem to be consistent.

We intend to deploy a recording application in our language lab, so 
that students may record their voices and the files can be saved so 
that instructors can hear the students' output. Occasionally, the 
program can be used for oral testing. However, if the recording is 
unstable at all, the program is useless.

I have checked the bugzilla database, but have been able to find 
anything regarding this problem there. Before I post it on bugzilla, I 
wonder if anyone out there has found a consistent solution to the 
problem.

Thanks,
Dan
Daniel B. Soneson
Director, Language Lab
Southern CT State University
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Re: [OT] aspiring game developers

[Geoff Canyon]

On Thursday, October 2, 2003, at 01:24  AM, Scott Rossi wrote:

Geoff Canyon has also done some phenomenal (and I do mean phenomenal) 
game
stuff with vectors.  I'm hoping he'll post his experiments and formulas
sometime.
With a plug like that, how can I resist? I've posted the stack "Star 
Battle." Type this in the message box and press return to try it out:

go stack url "http://www.inspiredlogic.com/rev/starbattle.rev";

Star Battle is a thought experiment that I might want to do something 
with. As such, feel free to poke around in the script (everything 
useful is in the card script) offer critiques, suggestions, and even 
borrow if you like. Please don't redistribute the stack or claim it as 
your own.

Okay, I've kicked the lawyers out.

I used to be a big Asteroids player back in the early 80's. It was a 
vector video game from Atari.

Revolution graphic objects have a points property that can be set. If 
you leave a blank line in the points, you get a blank line segment in 
the graphic -- it appears as more than one graphic, in essence.

This is the point where I said to myself, "Revolution can't possibly 
set the points of a graphic fast enough to be useful in making a 
game...can it?" 600 lines of code later, it turns out it can. Be sure 
to check out the "Really nice technical details" at the bottom.

WHAT IT IS

Star Battle is a variation on the Asteroids theme. You have a bunch of 
rocks floating across the screen, and a little ship. You can rotate 
left and right, thrust and fire bullets.

There the similarities end.

In Star Battle, the rocks are impervious. Instead there are enemy ships 
that move much like yours, shooting at you just as you shoot at them.

The game keeps score, awards extra ships, has individual rounds, and 
can restart the game. No high score list, though.

TECHNICAL DETAILS

The rocks exert gravitational attraction on all the ships. This is done 
mathematically correctly, I believe (feel free to check and correct me 
if I've taken an inadvertent short cut). I don't do gravity on the 
bullets.

The game performs collision detection on all the bullets, ships, and 
rocks, each time through. It's a simple proximity test, not an actual 
overlap test. In practice it seems to work pretty well.

When placing a new ship, the game checks for other ships and rocks (but 
not bullets).

The game tracks levels and your score.

THE REALLY NICE TECHNICAL DETAILS

Everything drawn on screen except for the score and player's lives is a 
single graphic object. That includes all the rocks, your ship, the 
enemy's ships, and all the bullets. The game calculates and sets the 
points of the graphic repeatedly. The beautiful aspect of this is that 
no screen locking is required. Since the one graphic draws everything, 
and setting the points of the graphic is an atomic operation, there is 
no need.

Levels run a minute in length. A few months back I would have handled 
that by checking periodically whether it was time to update the level. 
Since then, I've learned the wonders of wait...with messages. The game 
logic is in a straight repeat loop. It just cranks and cranks and 
cranks. The loop has a timing governor -- even on the fastest machine 
the game will never go faster than twenty frames per second because it 
checks each time through the loop how long it has spent, and if it's 
running fast, it waits. To do that, I put the ticks() into a variable 
at the start of the loop, and at the end of the loop I do something 
like this:

put tStartTicks + 3 - ticks() into tWaitTicks

At this point, tWaitTicks is how long I need to wait to delay the game 
appropriately. On a really fast machine it might be as much as 3 ticks. 
On a slower machine it will be 0 ticks, or even negative.

To enforce the wait period, I use this:

wait tWaitTicks ticks with messages

It doesn't matter if tWaitTicks goes negative, the command above works.

Now the "with messages" part deserves special mention. Because of that, 
changing levels is easy (remember, this start out about how to update 
the level each minute).

To update the level, I use:

send "updateLevel" to me in 60 seconds

Because of the "with messages" part of the command above, the 
"updateLevel" message gets delivered just fine, and without an apparent 
hitch in the game. I don't have to keep track of time, I let Rev do it 
for me.

Anyway, it's late. Let me know what you think.

regards,

Geoff Canyon
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: about field list

[Jan Schenkel]

--- Eric Rognard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi everybody,
> 
> 1) I want to put long sentences as elements of a
> list field.
> 
> When I type a sentence in the "content" window of
> the object inspector, 
> the text wrap (if the small left button is hilited)
> but   my sentence 
> stays on one line in the field list object.
> 
> Can I have list elements that wrap to fit to the
> size of the object 
> list? And How?
> 
> 2) I want  the user can reorder the elements of the
> list field in the 
> browse mode with his mouse pointer. Is it possible?
> How?
> 
> 
> May be the list field is not the right object to do
> that? :-)
> 
> Eric Rognard
> Think different!
> 

Bonjour Eric,

Unfortunately, the response to your first question is
negative : listBehaviour negates dontWrap.
If you know the number of lines and their sizes in
advance, you may get around this by making each line
an individual field, grouping those fields together,
and then turning on the group's vertical scrollbar.

However, this won't help you for your second question
either. I do have a stack on my website that scripts a
way to support drag-and-drop of list field elements ;
direct link :


I'mp still hoping for a built-in solution in list
fields that we may turn on at some point in the
future, and praying for a full-blown table control
that would take care of optional drag-and-drop of its
elements. Maybe someday :-)

Jan Schenkel.

=
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La 
Rochefoucauld)

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about field list

[Eric Rognard]

Hi everybody,

1) I want to put long sentences as elements of a list field.

When I type a sentence in the "content" window of the object inspector, the text wrap (if the small left button is hilited) but   my sentence stays on one line in the field list object.

Can I have list elements that wrap to fit to the size of the object list? And How?

2) I want  the user can reorder the elements of the list field in the browse mode with his mouse pointer. Is it possible? How?


May be the list field is not the right object to do that? :-)

Eric Rognard
Think different!

RE: Kudos

[Ken Ray]

> I wanted to send some praise your way. :-)
>
> I just took a look at RevZilla and wow, this is just the 
> coolest thing.  Now I can see why you responded to my post 
> regarding specialized browsers - birds of a feather...

Thanks, Scott!

> Not only does RevZilla provide the info we want in a nicely 
> ordered fashion, but it looks great too (I'll bet 99% of my 
> money that you designed it on a Mac).  Too bad the scroll 
> fields are hampered by the stupid field redraw bug, but even 
> so, a really nice app.  How much time did you spend on this thing?

Yup, Mac developed, tweaked on Windows. I spent about 10 hours on it so
far, but there's more coming...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ 


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