Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP - Go Dreamhost!

2005-10-21 Thread Alex Tweedly

Stephen Barncard wrote:


"Go Dreamhost!


Thank you - I did.

Thanks to everyone who replied - I knew some of you guys would have done 
the same research I was doing.


I decided to go with Dreamhost, mostly due to
- good recommendations (though others also had that)
- good price (since I'm not moving my existing sites, I needed another 
domain to be registered, so by including that in the price they sneaked 
in below Jaguar in price)
- separate, different-network status page [this is so obvious, why does 
no-one else do it !!]
- better support and FAQ pages (e.g. giving version numbers of the 
various packages installed)
- I liked their bit on Frontpage ("we recommend you don't run this, but 
if you must, we'll let you" :-)



I now have tweedly.org hosted at Dreamhost (but don't even look - 
there's nothing interesting there).


btw - my brother beat me to tweedly.com and tweedly.co.uk - guess there 
are advantages to an unusual surname)



--
Alex Tweedly   http://www.tweedly.net



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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-21 Thread Rishi Viner
Just chipping in late with a possible work around for this libc version issue.

> -jailshell-2.05b$ ldd mc
>  linux-gate.so.1 =>  (0xe000)
>  libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x00341000)
>  libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x4cba8000)
>  libXext.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libXext.so.6 (0x4cc72000)
>  libm.so.6 => /lib/tls/libm.so.6 (0x00347000)
>  libc.so.6 => /lib/tls/libc.so.6 (0x00223000)
>  /lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x0020a000)
>
>
> There you see libc.so.6... the problem in Dans webhost is a wrong
> version of libC, if he uses ldd then search for the file, he'll not
> find it... the server is using an older version of libC, he is
> probably using GLIB2.2 and needs 2.3...

I work with a lot of linux machines here and have encountered this sort of 
thing fairly often. Sometimes a linux distribution will package a "compat" or 
compatibility version of a library when they ship their distro with a new 
version of the library. The idea being that your older software will work 
more easily on the new upgraded distro. So you may be able to install a 
"compat" package to get it working. This is the best solution.

Assuming you can't do this on someone else's web server there is another 
possibility... This assumes you get a message like "libc.so.5 is missing and 
I need this library to run".  Looking at these "compat" packages (often 
installed as say 'libc-6.0-compat') I find that sometimes they just provide a 
symbolic link from the old shared object ('so') library to the new one. For 
example they will provide a link in the library directory from libc.so.5 -> 
libc.so.6. This assumes that the new version of the library is backward 
compatible... Dangerous assumption, but they often are. I have generally had 
good success making these links when needed and the advantage is that you 
might be able to create these symbolic links on the web server even if you 
can't install software/libraries. If this is a possibility for you, you would 
do something like this at the linux command line:

#ln -s /lib/tls/libc.so.5 /lib/tls/libc.so.6
which creates the link from the .5 to the .6.

Now if we do:
# ls -la /lib/tls/
you would see something with:
/lib/tls/libc.so.5  ->  /lib/tls/libc.so.6
Now if your program accesses libc.so.5 it gets redirected to libc.so.6 without 
knowing it. 

I know this will only help in some specific circumstances, but hope it is 
useful anyway. 

Cheers,

-- 
Rishi Viner
--
PUREDATA
Australia

www.puredata.com.au
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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP - Go Dreamhost!

2005-10-20 Thread Stephen Barncard
Dreamhost has been adding new features, more bandwidth, and more 
storage every month for each customer. They always seem to give more 
stuff as time goes on, with no increase in price. I know it sounds 
idealistic, but its true. And there's now no limit to the number of 
real domains. They also offer more  programming tools than anyone 
else. All the servers are Debian Linux and the focus is definitely 
non-Microsoft but they'll let you host a Frontpage document if you 
really have to. They're currently running 4.1.14-Debian_3.


Their servers are in the Long Beach area, connected directly to one 
of the biggest pipes in the country through multiple ports. Their 
uptime is extraordinary (and they tell you what is happening when in 
the rare case it's not up with an out-of-their-network web page) and 
the control panel software (that they wrote) is really good - Point 
and click for all server functions. Finally they are Linux/Perl/Open 
Source geeks and have included 'one click' installs for many goodies 
including Gallery and Wordpress.


I spent a couple of years searching for a host like this. I usually 
don't evangelize anymore, but this is a good one. They have great 
plans for around 10 buck/month and their 'Code Monster' plan for 20 
is also useful to me.



On 10/19/05 6:58 PM, "Alex Tweedly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
 > I'm looking for a reasonable priced ISP to host some of my web site.

 [reasonable == cheap !!]


I would strongly recommend Hostway (www.hostway.com)... really fast servers,
full Rev CGI support (I'm running mine now), with low prices ($8.95 USD per
month for 150MB, $13.95 for the 'Gold' plan with 600MB of storage - I'm
using the 'Gold Plus' plan at $19.95 for 800MB of storage). The guy I spoke
with even let me try it out free for a month, with no strings attached!

Ken Ray


--
stephen barncard
s a n  f r a n c i s c o
- - -  - - - - - - - - -
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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-20 Thread Richard K. Herz

andre wrote:

I use JaguarPC.net and never had any problem. It's cheap, fast, their

> support crew is fantastic and I am running Rev fine.

I also use www.jaguarpc.com and have done Rev CGI on it with no problem. 
Some history - I started using www.aletiahosting.com just because the 
MetaCard web site was on it at some point, then jaguarpc bought 
aletiahosting. Scott Raney made some recommendations concerning ISPs on 
the MC email list, including having your domain name registered at a 
different company than your web site host - he had some problems once.




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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP - Go Hostway!

2005-10-20 Thread Ken Ray
On 10/19/05 6:58 PM, "Alex Tweedly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Definitely off-topic - please delete if you're busy.
> 
> I'm looking for a reasonable priced ISP to host some of my web site.
> [reasonable == cheap !!]

I would strongly recommend Hostway (www.hostway.com)... really fast servers,
full Rev CGI support (I'm running mine now), with low prices ($8.95 USD per
month for 150MB, $13.95 for the 'Gold' plan with 600MB of storage - I'm
using the 'Gold Plus' plan at $19.95 for 800MB of storage). The guy I spoke
with even let me try it out free for a month, with no strings attached!

Needless to say, I moved over to them two weeks later after testing it out.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Web site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Andre Garzia


On Oct 20, 2005, at 3:49 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:


Dan Shafer wrote:


Yeah, I think it's the same problem, Andre.



I currenlty use an ISP that maintains a server farm preconfigured  
specifically for Rev CGI.  So while I'll stay there for now, this  
does raise a MUCH bigger question for those of us looking to sell  
server-side solutions:


Can Rev be compiled in such a way that it doesn't need the GUI libs  
while running as a CGI?




Richard,

the problem I quoted is not related to the GUI libraries but related  
to the standard C library... If you run 'ldd mc' you'll see what  
libraries the metacard engine is linked to, for example


-jailshell-2.05b$ ldd mc
linux-gate.so.1 =>  (0xe000)
libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x00341000)
libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x4cba8000)
libXext.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libXext.so.6 (0x4cc72000)
libm.so.6 => /lib/tls/libm.so.6 (0x00347000)
libc.so.6 => /lib/tls/libc.so.6 (0x00223000)
/lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x0020a000)


There you see libc.so.6... the problem in Dans webhost is a wrong  
version of libC, if he uses ldd then search for the file, he'll not  
find it... the server is using an older version of libC, he is  
probably using GLIB2.2 and needs 2.3...


If you execute libc.so.6 you receive further information like:

-jailshell-2.05b$ /lib/libc.so.6
GNU C Library stable release version 2.3.3, by Roland McGrath et al.
Copyright (C) 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
This is free software; see the source for copying conditions.
There is NO warranty; not even for MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A
PARTICULAR PURPOSE.
Compiled by GNU CC version 3.3.3 20040412 (Red Hat Linux 3.3.3-7).
Compiled on a Linux 2.4.20 system on 2004-10-28.
Available extensions:
GNU libio by Per Bothner
crypt add-on version 2.1 by Michael Glad and others
linuxthreads-0.10 by Xavier Leroy
The C stubs add-on version 2.1.2.
BIND-8.2.3-T5B
NIS(YP)/NIS+ NSS modules 0.19 by Thorsten Kukuk
Glibc-2.0 compatibility add-on by Cristian Gafton
GNU Libidn by Simon Josefsson
libthread_db work sponsored by Alpha Processor Inc
Thread-local storage support included.
For bug reporting instructions, please see:
.


I do think he's running 2.2 or older and for that reason cannot run  
rev... (will run older rev versions though)


cheers
andre






--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 ___
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.FourthWorld.com





Dan
On Oct 19, 2005, at 8:57 PM, Andre Garzia wrote:


Dan,

if it still the same problem that I saw when I was there during   
RevConWest is a old version of libC (GLIBC), Rev is linked to a  
new  one, it's hard to upgrade libc... I never tried, too spooky  
for me.


Cheers
andre

On Oct 20, 2005, at 1:49 AM, Dan Shafer wrote:

They are willing to run Rev CGI but so far we have been unable  
to  do so. I haven't put any time into this but they put  
literally no  restrictions on CGIs because each domain has its  
own set of CGI  stuff.


I think there's a missing C library of some sort that stands   
between me and Rev CGI on Dreamhost but if I needed it I imagine  
I  could get that fixed.


On Oct 19, 2005, at 7:15 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:



Dan Shafer wrote:


You cannot, in my opinion (backed by way too much research  
time)  do  better than DreamHost (http://www.dreamhost.com).




Do they support Rev CGI?



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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Richard Gaskin

Dan Shafer wrote:

Yeah, I think it's the same problem, Andre.


I currenlty use an ISP that maintains a server farm preconfigured 
specifically for Rev CGI.  So while I'll stay there for now, this does 
raise a MUCH bigger question for those of us looking to sell server-side 
solutions:


Can Rev be compiled in such a way that it doesn't need the GUI libs 
while running as a CGI?


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 ___
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.FourthWorld.com




Dan

On Oct 19, 2005, at 8:57 PM, Andre Garzia wrote:


Dan,

if it still the same problem that I saw when I was there during  
RevConWest is a old version of libC (GLIBC), Rev is linked to a new  
one, it's hard to upgrade libc... I never tried, too spooky for me.


Cheers
andre

On Oct 20, 2005, at 1:49 AM, Dan Shafer wrote:
They are willing to run Rev CGI but so far we have been unable to  do 
so. I haven't put any time into this but they put literally no  
restrictions on CGIs because each domain has its own set of CGI  stuff.


I think there's a missing C library of some sort that stands  between 
me and Rev CGI on Dreamhost but if I needed it I imagine I  could get 
that fixed.


On Oct 19, 2005, at 7:15 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:


Dan Shafer wrote:

You cannot, in my opinion (backed by way too much research time)  
do  better than DreamHost (http://www.dreamhost.com).


Do they support Rev CGI?


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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Andre Garzia
Usually webhosts have farms of servers in different ages, if your is  
old (and you can check that by the version of the kernel and the libC  
version), you can always check with them if they can migrate your  
account to another box with newer specs... ;-)


cheers
andre


On Oct 20, 2005, at 2:09 AM, Dan Shafer wrote:


Yeah, I think it's the same problem, Andre.

Dan

On Oct 19, 2005, at 8:57 PM, Andre Garzia wrote:



Dan,

if it still the same problem that I saw when I was there during  
RevConWest is a old version of libC (GLIBC), Rev is linked to a  
new one, it's hard to upgrade libc... I never tried, too spooky  
for me.


Cheers
andre


On Oct 20, 2005, at 1:49 AM, Dan Shafer wrote:



They are willing to run Rev CGI but so far we have been unable to  
do so. I haven't put any time into this but they put literally no  
restrictions on CGIs because each domain has its own set of CGI  
stuff.


I think there's a missing C library of some sort that stands  
between me and Rev CGI on Dreamhost but if I needed it I imagine  
I could get that fixed.


Dan

On Oct 19, 2005, at 7:15 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:





Dan Shafer wrote:




You cannot, in my opinion (backed by way too much research  
time) do  better than DreamHost (http://www.dreamhost.com).







Do they support Rev CGI?

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 Fourth World Media Corporation
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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Dan Shafer

Yeah, I think it's the same problem, Andre.

Dan

On Oct 19, 2005, at 8:57 PM, Andre Garzia wrote:


Dan,

if it still the same problem that I saw when I was there during  
RevConWest is a old version of libC (GLIBC), Rev is linked to a new  
one, it's hard to upgrade libc... I never tried, too spooky for me.


Cheers
andre


On Oct 20, 2005, at 1:49 AM, Dan Shafer wrote:


They are willing to run Rev CGI but so far we have been unable to  
do so. I haven't put any time into this but they put literally no  
restrictions on CGIs because each domain has its own set of CGI  
stuff.


I think there's a missing C library of some sort that stands  
between me and Rev CGI on Dreamhost but if I needed it I imagine I  
could get that fixed.


Dan

On Oct 19, 2005, at 7:15 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:




Dan Shafer wrote:



You cannot, in my opinion (backed by way too much research time)  
do  better than DreamHost (http://www.dreamhost.com).






Do they support Rev CGI?

--
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 Fourth World Media Corporation
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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Andre Garzia

Dan,

if it still the same problem that I saw when I was there during  
RevConWest is a old version of libC (GLIBC), Rev is linked to a new  
one, it's hard to upgrade libc... I never tried, too spooky for me.


Cheers
andre


On Oct 20, 2005, at 1:49 AM, Dan Shafer wrote:

They are willing to run Rev CGI but so far we have been unable to  
do so. I haven't put any time into this but they put literally no  
restrictions on CGIs because each domain has its own set of CGI stuff.


I think there's a missing C library of some sort that stands  
between me and Rev CGI on Dreamhost but if I needed it I imagine I  
could get that fixed.


Dan

On Oct 19, 2005, at 7:15 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:



Dan Shafer wrote:


You cannot, in my opinion (backed by way too much research time)  
do  better than DreamHost (http://www.dreamhost.com).





Do they support Rev CGI?

--
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 Fourth World Media Corporation
 ___
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.FourthWorld.com
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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Dan Shafer
They are willing to run Rev CGI but so far we have been unable to do  
so. I haven't put any time into this but they put literally no  
restrictions on CGIs because each domain has its own set of CGI stuff.


I think there's a missing C library of some sort that stands between  
me and Rev CGI on Dreamhost but if I needed it I imagine I could get  
that fixed.


Dan

On Oct 19, 2005, at 7:15 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:


Dan Shafer wrote:

You cannot, in my opinion (backed by way too much research time)  
do  better than DreamHost (http://www.dreamhost.com).




Do they support Rev CGI?

--
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 Fourth World Media Corporation
 ___
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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Andre Garzia
I use JaguarPC.net and never had any problem. It's cheap, fast, their  
support crew is fantastic and I am running Rev fine.


Cheers
andre

On Oct 20, 2005, at 12:15 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:


Dan Shafer wrote:

You cannot, in my opinion (backed by way too much research time)  
do  better than DreamHost (http://www.dreamhost.com).




Do they support Rev CGI?

--
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 Fourth World Media Corporation
 ___
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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Richard Gaskin

Dan Shafer wrote:
You cannot, in my opinion (backed by way too much research time) do  
better than DreamHost (http://www.dreamhost.com).


Do they support Rev CGI?

--
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 Fourth World Media Corporation
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Re: OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Dan Shafer
You cannot, in my opinion (backed by way too much research time) do  
better than DreamHost (http://www.dreamhost.com). Stephen Barncard,  
another Rev developer who frequents this list, turned me on to it.  
Not only inexpensive and fast and powerful, but great support and  
they keep increasing the amount of disk capacity and bandwidth you get.


Can't recommend them highly enough.

If you sign up and remember, you can put "dshafer' in as the referrer  
and I get a little prize of some sort. If not, don't worry. I don't  
do this for the prize!



On Oct 19, 2005, at 4:58 PM, Alex Tweedly wrote:


Definitely off-topic - please delete if you're busy.

I'm looking for a reasonable priced ISP to host some of my web  
site. [reasonable == cheap !!]


~~
Dan Shafer, Information Product Consultant and Author
http://www.shafermedia.com
Get my book, "Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought"
From http://www.shafermediastore.com/tech_main.html


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OT: Looking for a cheap web hosting ISP

2005-10-19 Thread Alex Tweedly

Definitely off-topic - please delete if you're busy.

I'm looking for a reasonable priced ISP to host some of my web site. 
[reasonable == cheap !!]


I'm very happy with my main web-hosting ISP  (34sp.com in the UK) - good 
response times, great service and very cheap £15 ($24) per year for CGI, 
Python, SSH, telnet, ftp, mySQL, ) - the only snag is I only get 
50Mb, and additional space is quite expensive.


One of the sites I help run contains a photo-archive (currently 220Mb 
and growing about 20M per month).


My current thought is to keep the user access pages on my main ISP, and 
just put the bulk of the photos on some other site that gives cheaper 
disk space - so I don't need mySQL, CGI or indeed any other features - 
not even backups. Up until now, I've had this "overflow" of photos on 
the "free" space that came with my dial-up account (250Mb), but I just 
upgraded to broadband, and the "free" space that comes with it is only 
100Mb. (cheapest broadband service versus fairly top-range dial-up).



Of course, support for Rev CGI would be a big plus - but not one I'd pay 
very much for.


So - any suggestions for cheap web disk space ?
Thanks

--
Alex Tweedly   http://www.tweedly.net



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