Re: Fwd: Unsubscribe footer
To whom it's sure to upset: "Ignoring and disregarding community is neither an "Apache Way" nor "morally right"." Yes it is. "When a community opposes something that someone did and their reply is "I had an itch" it sends a message: I don't care what you think and I'm not wrong." Wow, clearly. Yep! Glad you got that. OFBiz as a product, sucks. OFBiz as a project, is nowhere, and this is why. The point of free and open software is that you do what you want to with it. Now, I do see a difference between the software, and the "community." Operative word: community. But consensus is not the goal of community, productive accomplishment is. This is a project to produce and support OFBiz as a solution for accounting and resource management. Not consensus. Consensus is not our goal, competent accounting and resource management software is. To loose your poop over the addition of a useful unsubscribe link in the email footer, well, seems to me you're rejecting a good idea because your fragile feelings are hurt. You're embarrassing. David Weeks Information Developer On 6/7/19 7:48 AM, Pierre Smits wrote: To keep everyone interested in the loop. -- Forwarded message - From: Taher Alkhateeb Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2019 at 13:44 Subject: Re: Unsubscribe footer To: Pierre Smits Ignoring and disregarding community is neither an "Apache Way" nor "morally right". When a community opposes something that someone did and their reply is "I had an itch" it sends a message: I don't care what you think and I'm not wrong. Typical behavior, I'm not surprised. On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 12:44 PM Pierre Smits wrote: First of all: IANAL, and for those who don't know what that means (or don't do acronyms): I Am Not A Lawyer! That being said, the question has been raised and needs to be answered: Why? The answer to that question is simple when having the Apache Way and its vernacular in mind: I experienced an itch, and, per good old Apache custom, I scratched it. I acted not only with the various anti-spam legislations in mind ([1] may provide a good starting point). Some here may see it ethically wrong, but it felt morally right. [1] https://litmus.com/blog/the-ultimate-guide-to-international-email-law-infographic Best regards, Pierre Smits *Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President* *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer *Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without privileges) since 2008* Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer On Thu, Jun 6, 2019 at 2:23 PM Michael Brohl wrote: Thanks everyone, the footers are removed by Infra on my request (with apologies) with reference to this discussion (see [1]). @Pierre: do you want to tell us why you think it's ok to act independently of any community consensus or even discussion? Thanks, Michael [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 Am 06.06.19 um 06:37 schrieb Swapnil M Mane: +1 - Best Regards, Swapnil M Mane On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 5:58 PM Taher Alkhateeb < slidingfilame...@gmail.com> wrote: I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth the extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to unsubscribe. I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a PMC member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the project. On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl Hi all, I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement from the community, see [1] Should I ask them to remove the footers? Thanks, Michael [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of conduct should be enough. I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. Thanks, Michael Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: +1 But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom Jacques Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : Good question, Taher. This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should have consensus before taking any action towards infra. Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 or two lines to make them more readable. Some bad example with a content/nois
Re: Fwd: Unsubscribe footer
+1 for Taher's statement. The Apache way is about community, discussion and consensus. Not caring about the project's community opinion but simply forcing through own ideas or acting on behalf of the project without any legitimation is exactly the opposite. Regards, Michael Am 07.06.19 um 13:48 schrieb Pierre Smits: To keep everyone interested in the loop. -- Forwarded message - From: Taher Alkhateeb Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2019 at 13:44 Subject: Re: Unsubscribe footer To: Pierre Smits Ignoring and disregarding community is neither an "Apache Way" nor "morally right". When a community opposes something that someone did and their reply is "I had an itch" it sends a message: I don't care what you think and I'm not wrong. Typical behavior, I'm not surprised. On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 12:44 PM Pierre Smits wrote: First of all: IANAL, and for those who don't know what that means (or don't do acronyms): I Am Not A Lawyer! That being said, the question has been raised and needs to be answered: Why? The answer to that question is simple when having the Apache Way and its vernacular in mind: I experienced an itch, and, per good old Apache custom, I scratched it. I acted not only with the various anti-spam legislations in mind ([1] may provide a good starting point). Some here may see it ethically wrong, but it felt morally right. [1] https://litmus.com/blog/the-ultimate-guide-to-international-email-law-infographic Best regards, Pierre Smits *Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President* *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer *Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without privileges) since 2008* Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer On Thu, Jun 6, 2019 at 2:23 PM Michael Brohl wrote: Thanks everyone, the footers are removed by Infra on my request (with apologies) with reference to this discussion (see [1]). @Pierre: do you want to tell us why you think it's ok to act independently of any community consensus or even discussion? Thanks, Michael [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 Am 06.06.19 um 06:37 schrieb Swapnil M Mane: +1 - Best Regards, Swapnil M Mane On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 5:58 PM Taher Alkhateeb < slidingfilame...@gmail.com> wrote: I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth the extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to unsubscribe. I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a PMC member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the project. On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl Hi all, I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement from the community, see [1] Should I ask them to remove the footers? Thanks, Michael [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of conduct should be enough. I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. Thanks, Michael Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: +1 But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom Jacques Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : Good question, Taher. This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should have consensus before taking any action towards infra. Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 or two lines to make them more readable. Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen below... Regards, Michael Brohl ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: Why was this done without community agreement first? On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits wrote: The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o Best regards, Pierre Smits smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Fwd: Unsubscribe footer
To keep everyone interested in the loop. -- Forwarded message - From: Taher Alkhateeb Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2019 at 13:44 Subject: Re: Unsubscribe footer To: Pierre Smits Ignoring and disregarding community is neither an "Apache Way" nor "morally right". When a community opposes something that someone did and their reply is "I had an itch" it sends a message: I don't care what you think and I'm not wrong. Typical behavior, I'm not surprised. On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 12:44 PM Pierre Smits wrote: > First of all: IANAL, and for those who don't know what that means (or don't > do acronyms): I Am Not A Lawyer! > > That being said, the question has been raised and needs to be answered: > Why? > > The answer to that question is simple when having the Apache Way and its > vernacular in mind: > > I experienced an itch, and, per good old Apache custom, I scratched it. > > > I acted not only with the various anti-spam legislations in mind ([1] may > provide a good starting point). > > Some here may see it ethically wrong, but it felt morally right. > > [1] > > https://litmus.com/blog/the-ultimate-guide-to-international-email-law-infographic > > Best regards, > > Pierre Smits > > *Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President* > *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* > Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer > *Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without privileges) > since 2008* > Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer > > > On Thu, Jun 6, 2019 at 2:23 PM Michael Brohl > wrote: > > > Thanks everyone, > > > > the footers are removed by Infra on my request (with apologies) with > > reference to this discussion (see [1]). > > > > @Pierre: do you want to tell us why you think it's ok to act > > independently of any community consensus or even discussion? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Michael > > > > [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > > > > Am 06.06.19 um 06:37 schrieb Swapnil M Mane: > > > +1 > > > > > > > > > - Best Regards, > > > Swapnil M Mane > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 5:58 PM Taher Alkhateeb < > > slidingfilame...@gmail.com> > > > wrote: > > > > > >> I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth > > the > > >> extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to > > >> unsubscribe. > > >> > > >> I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a > > PMC > > >> member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary > > >> resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the > > >> project. > > >> > > >> On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl > > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >>> Hi all, > > >>> > > >>> I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement > > >>> from the community, see [1] > > >>> > > >>> Should I ask them to remove the footers? > > >>> > > >>> Thanks, > > >>> > > >>> Michael > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: > > >>>> I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code > of > > >>>> conduct should be enough. > > >>>> > > >>>> I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here > and > > >>>> there, but those who participate more often should be able to > create a > > >>>> shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. > > >>>> > > >>>> Thanks, > > >>>> > > >>>> Michael > > >>>> > > >>>> Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: > > >>>>> +1 > > >>>>> > > >>>>> But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, > and > > >>>>> even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have > > >>>>> those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom > > >>>>> > > >>&
Re: Unsubscribe footer
First of all: IANAL, and for those who don't know what that means (or don't do acronyms): I Am Not A Lawyer! That being said, the question has been raised and needs to be answered: Why? The answer to that question is simple when having the Apache Way and its vernacular in mind: I experienced an itch, and, per good old Apache custom, I scratched it. I acted not only with the various anti-spam legislations in mind ([1] may provide a good starting point). Some here may see it ethically wrong, but it felt morally right. [1] https://litmus.com/blog/the-ultimate-guide-to-international-email-law-infographic Best regards, Pierre Smits *Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President* *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer *Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without privileges) since 2008* Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer On Thu, Jun 6, 2019 at 2:23 PM Michael Brohl wrote: > Thanks everyone, > > the footers are removed by Infra on my request (with apologies) with > reference to this discussion (see [1]). > > @Pierre: do you want to tell us why you think it's ok to act > independently of any community consensus or even discussion? > > Thanks, > > Michael > > [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > > Am 06.06.19 um 06:37 schrieb Swapnil M Mane: > > +1 > > > > > > - Best Regards, > > Swapnil M Mane > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 5:58 PM Taher Alkhateeb < > slidingfilame...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > >> I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth > the > >> extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to > >> unsubscribe. > >> > >> I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a > PMC > >> member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary > >> resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the > >> project. > >> > >> On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl > >> wrote: > >> > >>> Hi all, > >>> > >>> I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement > >>> from the community, see [1] > >>> > >>> Should I ask them to remove the footers? > >>> > >>> Thanks, > >>> > >>> Michael > >>> > >>> > >>> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > >>> > >>> > >>> Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: > >>>> I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of > >>>> conduct should be enough. > >>>> > >>>> I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and > >>>> there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a > >>>> shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. > >>>> > >>>> Thanks, > >>>> > >>>> Michael > >>>> > >>>> Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: > >>>>> +1 > >>>>> > >>>>> But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and > >>>>> even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have > >>>>> those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom > >>>>> > >>>>> Jacques > >>>>> > >>>>> Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : > >>>>>> Good question, Taher. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should > >>>>>> have consensus before taking any action towards infra. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional > >>>>>> signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 > >>>>>> or two lines to make them more readable. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen > >>>>>> below... > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Regards, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Michael Brohl > >>>>>> > >>>>>> ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: > >>>>>>> Why was this done without community agreement first? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>> The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Best regards, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Pierre Smits > >>>>>>>> > >>> > >
Re: Unsubscribe footer
I don't think that Unsubscribe footer is needed in case of the mailing list. The users who are subscribed to the mailing list because they wished to be in touch with the communication going on within the project. Subscription and unsubscription information from the mailing list is publicly available and it is easily accessible on the Apache OFbiz website - https://ofbiz.apache.org/mailing-lists.html. The unsubscribe footer is more appropriate in the case of Newsletters. For example, there was a time when I subscribed to the newsletter of any of the company's or project's website but after some time I realized that the information which is being shared in the newsletters is of less interest for me or I am getting so many unwanted emails from the newsletter subscription. At that point in time, it is good to have Unsubscribe link available at the footer. I can help myself and can get unsubscribed from the newsletter. Thanks, Michael Brohl for working with infra and getting it removed. -- Kind Regards, Ashish Vijaywargiya http://www.hotwaxsystems.com On Thu, Jun 6, 2019 at 11:19 PM Mike wrote: > I agree that there should be an unsubscribe link. I'm with Pierre. > > On Thu, Jun 6, 2019 at 5:23 AM Michael Brohl > wrote: > > > Thanks everyone, > > > > the footers are removed by Infra on my request (with apologies) with > > reference to this discussion (see [1]). > > > > @Pierre: do you want to tell us why you think it's ok to act > > independently of any community consensus or even discussion? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Michael > > > > [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > > > > Am 06.06.19 um 06:37 schrieb Swapnil M Mane: > > > +1 > > > > > > > > > - Best Regards, > > > Swapnil M Mane > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 5:58 PM Taher Alkhateeb < > > slidingfilame...@gmail.com> > > > wrote: > > > > > >> I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth > > the > > >> extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to > > >> unsubscribe. > > >> > > >> I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a > > PMC > > >> member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary > > >> resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the > > >> project. > > >> > > >> On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl > > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >>> Hi all, > > >>> > > >>> I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement > > >>> from the community, see [1] > > >>> > > >>> Should I ask them to remove the footers? > > >>> > > >>> Thanks, > > >>> > > >>> Michael > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: > > >>>> I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code > of > > >>>> conduct should be enough. > > >>>> > > >>>> I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here > and > > >>>> there, but those who participate more often should be able to > create a > > >>>> shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. > > >>>> > > >>>> Thanks, > > >>>> > > >>>> Michael > > >>>> > > >>>> Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: > > >>>>> +1 > > >>>>> > > >>>>> But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, > and > > >>>>> even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have > > >>>>> those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Jacques > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : > > >>>>>> Good question, Taher. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should > > >>>>>> have consensus before taking any action towards infra. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional > > >>>>>> signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 > > >>>>>> or two lines to make them more readable. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be > seen > > >>>>>> below... > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Regards, > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Michael Brohl > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: > > >>>>>>> Why was this done without community agreement first? > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits > > >>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>> The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> Best regards, > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> Pierre Smits > > >>>>>>>> > > >>> > > > > >
Re: Unsubscribe footer
I agree that there should be an unsubscribe link. I'm with Pierre. On Thu, Jun 6, 2019 at 5:23 AM Michael Brohl wrote: > Thanks everyone, > > the footers are removed by Infra on my request (with apologies) with > reference to this discussion (see [1]). > > @Pierre: do you want to tell us why you think it's ok to act > independently of any community consensus or even discussion? > > Thanks, > > Michael > > [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > > Am 06.06.19 um 06:37 schrieb Swapnil M Mane: > > +1 > > > > > > - Best Regards, > > Swapnil M Mane > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 5:58 PM Taher Alkhateeb < > slidingfilame...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > >> I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth > the > >> extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to > >> unsubscribe. > >> > >> I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a > PMC > >> member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary > >> resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the > >> project. > >> > >> On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl > >> wrote: > >> > >>> Hi all, > >>> > >>> I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement > >>> from the community, see [1] > >>> > >>> Should I ask them to remove the footers? > >>> > >>> Thanks, > >>> > >>> Michael > >>> > >>> > >>> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > >>> > >>> > >>> Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: > >>>> I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of > >>>> conduct should be enough. > >>>> > >>>> I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and > >>>> there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a > >>>> shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. > >>>> > >>>> Thanks, > >>>> > >>>> Michael > >>>> > >>>> Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: > >>>>> +1 > >>>>> > >>>>> But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and > >>>>> even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have > >>>>> those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom > >>>>> > >>>>> Jacques > >>>>> > >>>>> Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : > >>>>>> Good question, Taher. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should > >>>>>> have consensus before taking any action towards infra. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional > >>>>>> signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 > >>>>>> or two lines to make them more readable. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen > >>>>>> below... > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Regards, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Michael Brohl > >>>>>> > >>>>>> ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: > >>>>>>> Why was this done without community agreement first? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>> The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Best regards, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Pierre Smits > >>>>>>>> > >>> > >
Re: Unsubscribe footer
Thanks everyone, the footers are removed by Infra on my request (with apologies) with reference to this discussion (see [1]). @Pierre: do you want to tell us why you think it's ok to act independently of any community consensus or even discussion? Thanks, Michael [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 Am 06.06.19 um 06:37 schrieb Swapnil M Mane: +1 - Best Regards, Swapnil M Mane On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 5:58 PM Taher Alkhateeb wrote: I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth the extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to unsubscribe. I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a PMC member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the project. On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl wrote: Hi all, I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement from the community, see [1] Should I ask them to remove the footers? Thanks, Michael [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of conduct should be enough. I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. Thanks, Michael Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: +1 But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom Jacques Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : Good question, Taher. This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should have consensus before taking any action towards infra. Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 or two lines to make them more readable. Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen below... Regards, Michael Brohl ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: Why was this done without community agreement first? On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits wrote: The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o Best regards, Pierre Smits smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: Unsubscribe footer
+1 - Best Regards, Swapnil M Mane On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 5:58 PM Taher Alkhateeb wrote: > I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth the > extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to > unsubscribe. > > I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a PMC > member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary > resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the > project. > > On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl > wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement > > from the community, see [1] > > > > Should I ask them to remove the footers? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Michael > > > > > > [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > > > > > > Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: > > > I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of > > > conduct should be enough. > > > > > > I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and > > > there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a > > > shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Michael > > > > > > Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: > > >> +1 > > >> > > >> But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and > > >> even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have > > >> those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom > > >> > > >> Jacques > > >> > > >> Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : > > >>> Good question, Taher. > > >>> > > >>> This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should > > >>> have consensus before taking any action towards infra. > > >>> > > >>> Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional > > >>> signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 > > >>> or two lines to make them more readable. > > >>> > > >>> Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen > > >>> below... > > >>> > > >>> Regards, > > >>> > > >>> Michael Brohl > > >>> > > >>> ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: > > >>>> Why was this done without community agreement first? > > >>>> > > >>>> On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits > > >>>> wrote: > > >>>>> The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Best regards, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Pierre Smits > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >
Re: Unsubscribe footer
+1 Jacques Le 05/06/2019 à 14:28, Taher Alkhateeb a écrit : I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth the extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to unsubscribe. I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a PMC member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the project. On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl wrote: Hi all, I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement from the community, see [1] Should I ask them to remove the footers? Thanks, Michael [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of conduct should be enough. I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. Thanks, Michael Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: +1 But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom Jacques Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : Good question, Taher. This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should have consensus before taking any action towards infra. Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 or two lines to make them more readable. Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen below... Regards, Michael Brohl ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: Why was this done without community agreement first? On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits wrote: The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o Best regards, Pierre Smits - To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@ofbiz.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@ofbiz.apache.org
Re: Unsubscribe footer
I would recommend removing all footers from all emails. It's not worth the extra noise for the rare occasions of some individuals not wanting to unsubscribe. I would also recommend that future actions with infra to be taken by a PMC member (after community approval) since they have access to necessary resources and are hence best fit to guide infra on the needs of the project. On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 11:09 AM Michael Brohl wrote: > Hi all, > > I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement > from the community, see [1] > > Should I ask them to remove the footers? > > Thanks, > > Michael > > > [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 > > > Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: > > I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of > > conduct should be enough. > > > > I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and > > there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a > > shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Michael > > > > Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: > >> +1 > >> > >> But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and > >> even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have > >> those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom > >> > >> Jacques > >> > >> Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : > >>> Good question, Taher. > >>> > >>> This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should > >>> have consensus before taking any action towards infra. > >>> > >>> Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional > >>> signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 > >>> or two lines to make them more readable. > >>> > >>> Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen > >>> below... > >>> > >>> Regards, > >>> > >>> Michael Brohl > >>> > >>> ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de > >>> > >>> > >>> Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: > >>>> Why was this done without community agreement first? > >>>> > >>>> On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits > >>>> wrote: > >>>>> The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o > >>>>> > >>>>> Best regards, > >>>>> > >>>>> Pierre Smits > >>>>> > > > >
Re: Unsubscribe footer
Hi all, I've already informed Infra about this step taken without approvement from the community, see [1] Should I ask them to remove the footers? Thanks, Michael [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-18553 Am 03.06.19 um 15:12 schrieb Michael Brohl: I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of conduct should be enough. I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. Thanks, Michael Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: +1 But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom Jacques Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : Good question, Taher. This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should have consensus before taking any action towards infra. Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 or two lines to make them more readable. Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen below... Regards, Michael Brohl ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: Why was this done without community agreement first? On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits wrote: The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o Best regards, Pierre Smits smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: Unsubscribe footer
Michael Brohl writes: > This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should > have consensus before taking any action towards infra. > > Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional > signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 or > two lines to make them more readable. I would prefer not having this additional footer too. So +1. Pierre: It would be nice if you could explain us why you thought it would be OK to not ask for consensus before requesting infra to add that footer. -- Mathieu Lirzin GPG: F2A3 8D7E EB2B 6640 5761 070D 0ADE E100 9460 4D37 - To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@ofbiz.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@ofbiz.apache.org
Re: Unsubscribe footer
I don't think that we need a technical enforcement, community code of conduct should be enough. I don't see a problem with a longer signature from newcomers here and there, but those who participate more often should be able to create a shot signature which does not pollute the mail threads. Thanks, Michael Am 03.06.19 um 13:11 schrieb Jacques Le Roux: +1 But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom Jacques Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : Good question, Taher. This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should have consensus before taking any action towards infra. Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 or two lines to make them more readable. Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen below... Regards, Michael Brohl ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: Why was this done without community agreement first? On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits wrote: The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o Best regards, Pierre Smits smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: Unsubscribe footer
+1 But I can't see a way to enforce that. Apart maybe asking infra, and even then not sure it makes sense for "external writers" who have those kinds of disclaimer messages at bottom Jacques Le 03/06/2019 à 12:36, Michael Brohl a écrit : Good question, Taher. This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should have consensus before taking any action towards infra. Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 or two lines to make them more readable. Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen below... Regards, Michael Brohl ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: Why was this done without community agreement first? On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits wrote: The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o Best regards, Pierre Smits *Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President* *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer *Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without privileges) since 2008* Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer On Sun, Jun 2, 2019 at 9:00 PM Pierre Smits wrote: Hi all, I have asked INFRA to place an unsubscribe footer automatically at the end of each distributed posting. Best regards, Pierre - To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@ofbiz.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@ofbiz.apache.org
Re: Unsubscribe footer
Good question, Taher. This was done without any envolvement of others. I think we should have consensus before taking any action towards infra. Personally, I am not in favor of having another/additional signatures. In the contrary, I would like to see them reduced to 1 or two lines to make them more readable. Some bad example with a content/noise ratio of 1:7 lines can be seen below... Regards, Michael Brohl ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de Am 03.06.19 um 12:24 schrieb Taher Alkhateeb: Why was this done without community agreement first? On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits wrote: The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o Best regards, Pierre Smits *Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President* *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer *Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without privileges) since 2008* Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer On Sun, Jun 2, 2019 at 9:00 PM Pierre Smits wrote: Hi all, I have asked INFRA to place an unsubscribe footer automatically at the end of each distributed posting. Best regards, Pierre smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: Unsubscribe footer
Why was this done without community agreement first? On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 8:59 AM Pierre Smits wrote: > > The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o > > Best regards, > > Pierre Smits > > *Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President* > *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* > Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer > *Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without privileges) > since 2008* > Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer > > > On Sun, Jun 2, 2019 at 9:00 PM Pierre Smits wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > I have asked INFRA to place an unsubscribe footer automatically at the end > > of each distributed posting. > > > > Best regards, > > > > Pierre > > > > > > -- > > Sent from my phone > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@ofbiz.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@ofbiz.apache.org
Re: Unsubscribe footer
The unsubscribe footer is now in play for mail to dev@ofbiz.a.o Best regards, Pierre Smits *Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President* *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer *Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without privileges) since 2008* Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer On Sun, Jun 2, 2019 at 9:00 PM Pierre Smits wrote: > Hi all, > > I have asked INFRA to place an unsubscribe footer automatically at the end > of each distributed posting. > > Best regards, > > Pierre > > > -- > Sent from my phone >
Unsubscribe footer
Hi all, I have asked INFRA to place an unsubscribe footer automatically at the end of each distributed posting. Best regards, Pierre -- Sent from my phone
