Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
Darryl L. Pierce wrote: On Tue, Jul 23, 2013 at 11:08:19AM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: Darryl L. Pierce wrote: On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop (encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. Not sure what you mean by "still the case," I mean still an issue with fedup being unable to upgrade a system with encrypted filesystems. That's why I ended the piece being quoted with "fedup fails totally to workon drives with encrypted partitions,". it was as of 1PM yesterday when I posted, and since it's burned on DVD I doubt it's changes. Some systems refuse to install without network. I'm not sure we're talking the same thing then. I may have misread, we have a lot of depth to quotes here. There seem to be two issues, fedup on LUKS, and clean install looping asking for network. I may only see the network issue after fedup has been run, and I did find that if I write 100MB of /dev/zero to the partitions I'm going to use (from rescue CD) no issues on clean install. There MAY be an issue with reading the partitions and saving data, don't care as long as it can be done. I'm trying a yum upgrade in LUKS next week, I am taking a few days off from anything challenging to deal with real life. May wait and test more when the 18->19 cycle comes. -- Bill Davidsen "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
Junk wrote: On 24 Jul 2013, at 21:31, Bill Davidsen wrote: Junk wrote: On Tue, 2013-07-23 at 11:08 -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: Darryl L. Pierce wrote: On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop (encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. Not sure what you mean by "still the case," it was as of 1PM yesterday when I posted, and since it's burned on DVD I doubt it's changes. Some systems refuse to install without network. That was the response I got when I reported the bug before, "Can't reproduce" and "WFM" don't cover the ground with anything but a hard fail on all systems. And "you must be doing something wrong" really doesn't fit a process which consists of "load DVD" followed by "power on." I've been installing Linux since it hit usenet in 91 or so, and it works on other systems. It's clearly a Fedora bug, does not happen on the same machine with Mint, Ubuntu, or Puppy, and the other machine which has this issue installed Slackware fine. Note: after installing Slackware the problem went away, installing Ubentu didn't fix the machine of interest. -- Bill Davidsen "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot Firstly. Calm down. I believe your preconceptions are mostly at issue here. If you mean the preconception that install from DVD should not need a network connection, that's exactly the issue. After install the upgrade comes from another DVD holding a local repo of common things which have been updated. The posts you responded to are talking about the fedup over a network onto an encrypted partition. Not the DVD install. It works but your too het up on your issue to realise what they are talking about notice. Go back, read my post. I put a DVD into the machine with no network connection to do an install from scratch because fedup didn't work. Clear? My original post was clear that I was doing an install from DVD, and if "they" thought it was something else, I reread my original post and it still seems clear. Re-read the first line of your initial email. The one with the word 'fedup' in it. Are you, or are you not, talking about fedup? The one that says because fedup didn't work I was doing a clean install? That seems totally clear to be talking about the clean install. Booted from DVD, did scratch install, system demanded network. Can't say it any clearer than that, can't do it simpler than that. Just as have have done on all the ones which worked. Can't be explained away, if it's user error it wouldn't work on some systems but not all. I've been doing this a decade or two, after the first two fails the rest of the tests were carefully noted step by step, trying things like different filesystem types, reformatting the partitions or not, etc. In no case did I return to trying to use fedup, because after an early attempt the install could not recognize the boot or root partitions in any way. Secondly, people are responding to your bugs with "Can't Reproduce" because they can't. I can't. I've just now set up a machine with no network card at all and successfully installed Fedora 19 from a DVD. What makes this all the more fun is that the answer you want is in the screenshot you posted. Experience tells me that "doesn't happen every time" is not the same as "doesn't happen." No matter what's on that screen, that screen shouldn't come up on install from DVD. Ok. The clear short version. The screenshot you posted. Click continue. The machine installs. Glad it does that for you. Doesn't here, but you have concluded that if it works for you there's no problem. That screen is not saying network is a requirement for install. But that it is required to get updates once the machine is installed. It gives you an opportunity to get things sorted. You can ignore it. And as Reindl has been getting all the action recently I'll finish with this. You, Sir, are what Aristotle would call "a 'tard" Now you can get angry again, Don't know what prompted the personal attack, perhaps frustration at not being able to explain the problem, and not convincing me that it isn't a problem? -- Bill Davidsen "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot -- And thus the case of The Crown versus Davidson was proven. Junk. -- Bill Davidsen "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: h
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 11:03:07PM +0100, Frank Murphy wrote: > On Mon, 22 Jul 2013 15:57:21 -0400 > "Darryl L. Pierce" wrote: > > > On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: > > > This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails > > > totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, > > > > I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop > > (encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. > > > > Everything bar /boot encrypted, fedup worked. F18 > F19 on 3 boxes. Same here. I have four physical machines (2 desktops, 2 laptops), one of each being 32-bit and the other 64-bit, several VMs, all upgraded perfectly from f18->f19 using fedup. -- Darryl L. Pierce http://mcpierce.fedorapeople.org/ "What do you care what people think, Mr. Feynman?" pgpsp8XtaNmwc.pgp Description: PGP signature -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
On Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 04:31:37PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: > Junk wrote: > >The posts you responded to are talking about the fedup over a network > >onto an encrypted partition. Not the DVD install. It works but your too > >het up on your issue to realise what they are talking about notice. > > > Go back, read my post. Go back, please, and re-read my reply. I was specifically talking about fedup and encrypted file systems. Nothing about DVD installs. Completely about fedup. > I put a DVD into the machine with no network > connection to do an install from scratch because fedup didn't work. > Clear? My original post was clear that I was doing an install from > DVD, and if "they" thought it was something else, I reread my > original post and it still seems clear. But you didn't re-read what in your original post I specifically targeted with my reply. Look at what I quoted and, specifically, where I ended my quote of your text. -- Darryl L. Pierce http://mcpierce.fedorapeople.org/ "What do you care what people think, Mr. Feynman?" pgpu7pUOwH5gG.pgp Description: PGP signature -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
On Tue, Jul 23, 2013 at 11:08:19AM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: > Darryl L. Pierce wrote: > >On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: > >>This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails > >>totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, > > > >I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop > >(encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. > > > Not sure what you mean by "still the case," I mean still an issue with fedup being unable to upgrade a system with encrypted filesystems. That's why I ended the piece being quoted with "fedup fails totally to workon drives with encrypted partitions,". > it was as of 1PM > yesterday when I posted, and since it's burned on DVD I doubt it's > changes. Some systems refuse to install without network. I'm not sure we're talking the same thing then. -- Darryl L. Pierce http://mcpierce.fedorapeople.org/ "What do you care what people think, Mr. Feynman?" pgprjnIM9kl3W.pgp Description: PGP signature -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
On 24 Jul 2013, at 21:31, Bill Davidsen wrote: > Junk wrote: >> On Tue, 2013-07-23 at 11:08 -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: >>> Darryl L. Pierce wrote: On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: > This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails > totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop (encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. >>> Not sure what you mean by "still the case," it was as of 1PM yesterday when >>> I >>> posted, and since it's burned on DVD I doubt it's changes. Some systems >>> refuse >>> to install without network. >>> >>> That was the response I got when I reported the bug before, "Can't >>> reproduce" >>> and "WFM" don't cover the ground with anything but a hard fail on all >>> systems. >>> And "you must be doing something wrong" really doesn't fit a process which >>> consists of "load DVD" followed by "power on." I've been installing Linux >>> since >>> it hit usenet in 91 or so, and it works on other systems. It's clearly a >>> Fedora >>> bug, does not happen on the same machine with Mint, Ubuntu, or Puppy, and >>> the >>> other machine which has this issue installed Slackware fine. Note: after >>> installing Slackware the problem went away, installing Ubentu didn't fix the >>> machine of interest. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Bill Davidsen >>>"We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from >>> the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot >> >> Firstly. Calm down. I believe your preconceptions are mostly at issue >> here. > If you mean the preconception that install from DVD should not need a network > connection, that's exactly the issue. After install the upgrade comes from > another DVD holding a local repo of common things which have been updated. > >> The posts you responded to are talking about the fedup over a network >> onto an encrypted partition. Not the DVD install. It works but your too >> het up on your issue to realise what they are talking about notice. > Go back, read my post. I put a DVD into the machine with no network > connection to do an install from scratch because fedup didn't work. Clear? My > original post was clear that I was doing an install from DVD, and if "they" > thought it was something else, I reread my original post and it still seems > clear. > Re-read the first line of your initial email. The one with the word 'fedup' in it. Are you, or are you not, talking about fedup? > Booted from DVD, did scratch install, system demanded network. Can't say it > any clearer than that, can't do it simpler than that. Just as have have done > on all the ones which worked. > > Can't be explained away, if it's user error it wouldn't work on some systems > but not all. I've been doing this a decade or two, after the first two fails > the rest of the tests were carefully noted step by step, trying things like > different filesystem types, reformatting the partitions or not, etc. In no > case did I return to trying to use fedup, because after an early attempt the > install could not recognize the boot or root partitions in any way. > >> Secondly, people are responding to your bugs with "Can't Reproduce" >> because they can't. I can't. I've just now set up a machine with no >> network card at all and successfully installed Fedora 19 from a DVD. >> What makes this all the more fun is that the answer you want is in the >> screenshot you posted. > Experience tells me that "doesn't happen every time" is not the same as > "doesn't happen." No matter what's on that screen, that screen shouldn't come > up on install from DVD. > Ok. The clear short version. The screenshot you posted. Click continue. The machine installs. That screen is not saying network is a requirement for install. But that it is required to get updates once the machine is installed. It gives you an opportunity to get things sorted. You can ignore it. >> And as Reindl has been getting all the action recently I'll finish with >> this. >> You, Sir, are what Aristotle would call "a 'tard" >> >> Now you can get angry again, > > Don't know what prompted the personal attack, perhaps frustration at not > being able to explain the problem, and not convincing me that it isn't a > problem? > > -- > Bill Davidsen > "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from > the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot > -- > And thus the case of The Crown versus Davidson was proven. Junk. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
Junk wrote: On Tue, 2013-07-23 at 11:08 -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: Darryl L. Pierce wrote: On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop (encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. Not sure what you mean by "still the case," it was as of 1PM yesterday when I posted, and since it's burned on DVD I doubt it's changes. Some systems refuse to install without network. That was the response I got when I reported the bug before, "Can't reproduce" and "WFM" don't cover the ground with anything but a hard fail on all systems. And "you must be doing something wrong" really doesn't fit a process which consists of "load DVD" followed by "power on." I've been installing Linux since it hit usenet in 91 or so, and it works on other systems. It's clearly a Fedora bug, does not happen on the same machine with Mint, Ubuntu, or Puppy, and the other machine which has this issue installed Slackware fine. Note: after installing Slackware the problem went away, installing Ubentu didn't fix the machine of interest. -- Bill Davidsen "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot Firstly. Calm down. I believe your preconceptions are mostly at issue here. If you mean the preconception that install from DVD should not need a network connection, that's exactly the issue. After install the upgrade comes from another DVD holding a local repo of common things which have been updated. The posts you responded to are talking about the fedup over a network onto an encrypted partition. Not the DVD install. It works but your too het up on your issue to realise what they are talking about notice. Go back, read my post. I put a DVD into the machine with no network connection to do an install from scratch because fedup didn't work. Clear? My original post was clear that I was doing an install from DVD, and if "they" thought it was something else, I reread my original post and it still seems clear. Booted from DVD, did scratch install, system demanded network. Can't say it any clearer than that, can't do it simpler than that. Just as have have done on all the ones which worked. Can't be explained away, if it's user error it wouldn't work on some systems but not all. I've been doing this a decade or two, after the first two fails the rest of the tests were carefully noted step by step, trying things like different filesystem types, reformatting the partitions or not, etc. In no case did I return to trying to use fedup, because after an early attempt the install could not recognize the boot or root partitions in any way. Secondly, people are responding to your bugs with "Can't Reproduce" because they can't. I can't. I've just now set up a machine with no network card at all and successfully installed Fedora 19 from a DVD. What makes this all the more fun is that the answer you want is in the screenshot you posted. Experience tells me that "doesn't happen every time" is not the same as "doesn't happen." No matter what's on that screen, that screen shouldn't come up on install from DVD. And as Reindl has been getting all the action recently I'll finish with this. You, Sir, are what Aristotle would call "a 'tard" Now you can get angry again, Don't know what prompted the personal attack, perhaps frustration at not being able to explain the problem, and not convincing me that it isn't a problem? -- Bill Davidsen "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
On Tue, 2013-07-23 at 11:08 -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: > Darryl L. Pierce wrote: > > On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: > >> This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails > >> totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, > > > > I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop > > (encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. > > > Not sure what you mean by "still the case," it was as of 1PM yesterday when I > posted, and since it's burned on DVD I doubt it's changes. Some systems > refuse > to install without network. > > That was the response I got when I reported the bug before, "Can't reproduce" > and "WFM" don't cover the ground with anything but a hard fail on all > systems. > And "you must be doing something wrong" really doesn't fit a process which > consists of "load DVD" followed by "power on." I've been installing Linux > since > it hit usenet in 91 or so, and it works on other systems. It's clearly a > Fedora > bug, does not happen on the same machine with Mint, Ubuntu, or Puppy, and the > other machine which has this issue installed Slackware fine. Note: after > installing Slackware the problem went away, installing Ubentu didn't fix the > machine of interest. > > > -- > Bill Davidsen >"We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from > the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot Firstly. Calm down. I believe your preconceptions are mostly at issue here. The posts you responded to are talking about the fedup over a network onto an encrypted partition. Not the DVD install. It works but your too het up on your issue to realise what they are talking about notice. Secondly, people are responding to your bugs with "Can't Reproduce" because they can't. I can't. I've just now set up a machine with no network card at all and successfully installed Fedora 19 from a DVD. What makes this all the more fun is that the answer you want is in the screenshot you posted. And as Reindl has been getting all the action recently I'll finish with this. You, Sir, are what Aristotle would call "a 'tard" Now you can get angry again, Junk. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
Darryl L. Pierce wrote: On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop (encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. Not sure what you mean by "still the case," it was as of 1PM yesterday when I posted, and since it's burned on DVD I doubt it's changes. Some systems refuse to install without network. That was the response I got when I reported the bug before, "Can't reproduce" and "WFM" don't cover the ground with anything but a hard fail on all systems. And "you must be doing something wrong" really doesn't fit a process which consists of "load DVD" followed by "power on." I've been installing Linux since it hit usenet in 91 or so, and it works on other systems. It's clearly a Fedora bug, does not happen on the same machine with Mint, Ubuntu, or Puppy, and the other machine which has this issue installed Slackware fine. Note: after installing Slackware the problem went away, installing Ubentu didn't fix the machine of interest. -- Bill Davidsen "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the machinations of the wicked." - from Slashdot -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
On Mon, 22 Jul 2013 15:57:21 -0400 "Darryl L. Pierce" wrote: > On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: > > This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails > > totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, > > I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop > (encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. > Everything bar /boot encrypted, fedup worked. F18 > F19 on 3 boxes. -- Regards, Frank "When in doubt PANIC!" I check for new mail app. 20min www.frankly3d.com -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Install fc18 from DVD demands network connection
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:01:43PM -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: > This is back, again. Having found out that fedup fails > totally to work on drives with encrypted partitions, I don't think this is still the case: I did F18->F19 on my laptop (encrypted /home and swap) using fedup and it worked just fine. -- Darryl L. Pierce http://mcpierce.multiply.com/ "What do you care what people think, Mr. Feynman?" pgpRsm_p1tpPy.pgp Description: PGP signature -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
