RE: [Vo]:It will be ironic if 60 Minutes has a major effect
Jed wrote: So many energy problems could have been solved by now, and so many lives saved, if only scientists had done their job. It sure seems that when we most needed science, it failed us, utterly. Well, not the 'institution' of science, but the scientists turned politicians. And what do we expect when humans are administering science? Where is Lt.Cmdr. Data when you need him? :-) Picard/Data in 2012! -Mark -Original Message- From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 1:38 PM To: vortex-L@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:It will be ironic if 60 Minutes has a major effect If 60 Minutes has a major effect on public opinion, and helps free up funding for the field, that will not surprise me. But it will be ironic. It will demonstrate that scientists and decision makers in government tend to be more influenced by the mass media than by scientific publications. The tide does seem to be turning. Press coverage is more friendly than it used to be. More facts and fewer rumors are reported. But funding is still dreadfully restricted and I still fear that the researchers will not live long enough to make significant progress. Based on previous press reports favorable toward cold fusion, such as a report of the Arata experiment last year, I predict this event it will increase Internet chatter and traffic to LENR-CANR for a few weeks, and then fade away. But the effect may linger long enough to jog a few decision-makers to allocate a few more dollars, or perhaps a few million more! And that is all we need. We require an end to the beginning, if not the beginning of the end. We do not need Nature and Scientific American to wave a white flag and admit they were wrong. I predict that the present editors and writers at these journals will never do that, unless commercial products are rolled out, which I regard as highly unlikely under the present circumstances. But I could be wrong about them. I never imaged that Robert Park would give an inch. Of course he needs to give a mile, which he will never do. The other day I told Mizuno that Maddox died, and I related the famous quote about cold fusion will remain dead for a long time which is surely an enigmatic thing to say. Did he mean that he hoped it would revive only after he was gone? Mizuno responded: perhaps I should be angry at the man but honestly I pity him. Here was the most important and interesting discovery in his lifetime and he never even looked at it. What a wasted opportunity. That is how I feel about the whole history of cold fusion. So much talent wasted; so many years. So many energy problems could have been solved by now, and so many lives saved, if only scientists had done their job. I do not blame the mass media for this sad history. I blame scientists and scientific administrators at places like the DOE and the APS. The ones who never looked at the experiments. They never did their jobs. Huizenga and the DoE review panels. Of course there is plenty of blame to go around. Even the cold fusion researchers share a small tiny fraction of the blame for this fiasco, but they are more sinned against than sinning. - Jed No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.59/2064 - Release Date: 4/17/2009 7:08 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.59/2064 - Release Date: 4/17/2009 7:08 AM
Re: [Vo]:OT:Whewell
If by it you mean the motion of the current, the answer is yes. Think of the cell/device as the sky, the anode is the place where the current enters it (where the sun rises into it), and the cathode where it departs (goes down, cata, as in catacombs). See the wikipedia articles for the full story. Michel 2009/4/18, Harry Veeder hvee...@ncf.ca: He really likened it to the motion of the Sun? harry - Original Message - From: Michel Jullian michelj...@gmail.com Date: Thursday, April 16, 2009 6:42 pm Subject: Re: [Vo]:OT:Whewell He also coined, on Faraday's request, the words anode (from Greek anodos = way up) and cathode (way down), where what goes up or down is not current nor electrons nor ions, but... the Sun, unobviously! Michel /4/16, Harry Veeder hvee...@ncf.ca: Biography of the man who coined the words scientist and physicist: http://www-history.mcs.st-andrews.ac.uk/Biographies/Whewell.html Harry
Re: [Vo]:Energetics Technology website features 60 Minutes preview
Kim Y. wrote several papers on Bose Einstein Condensate, and one is rumored to be published in naturwissenschaften soon. You'll find them on lenr-canr.org Pierre C. On Sat, Apr 18, 2009 at 1:55 AM, thomas malloy temall...@usfamily.netwrote: Sounds more like a Bose Einstein Condensate to me.
Re: [Vo]:Energetics Technology website features 60 Minutes preview
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 As the smoke cleared, Harry Veeder hvee...@ncf.ca mounted the barricade and roared out: - Original Message - From: Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net Date: Friday, April 17, 2009 5:34 pm Subject: Re: [Vo]:Energetics Technology website features 60 Minutes preview Guys - Ah, yes. The HK Hare Krishna hypothesis. Atoms loosing their identity. That's as good an explanation as any I've heard! ;-) I think socio-political prejudices are everywhere, even in the language of physics. As I see it, under certain conditions atoms refuse to behave like rugged individualists. However, a rugged individual physicist might equate such cooperative behaviour with a loss of identity, but I see it as the expression of a shared identity. Harry And of course you'd never find herd mentality on this eList full of individualists, rugged or otherwise, would you now. - -- grok. - -- ** FULL-SPECTRUM DOMINANCE! *BOYCOTT BOURGEOIS* Get your news analysis * * MASS-MEDIA:* from the Best on the Web * Critical endorsement only Most sites need donations * http://www.africasia.com/newafrican The New African magazine * * http://www.livingroomradio.org Against the Grain * * http://liveradio.indymedia.org Worldwide IMC Radio Network * * http://www.fromthewilderness.com From The Wilderness * * http://www.sinclairaction.com SinclairAction * * http://www.freepress.org/index2.php The Free Press * *** Capitalism: Slums are more efficient when they're vertical *** GPG fingerprint = 2E7F 2D69 4B0B C8D5 07E3 09C3 5E8D C4B4 461B B771 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAknpvUYACgkQXo3EtEYbt3GFegCgmEPPokP1qVKCXuam9PLxvGPe BHAAnAzy92lu9iU3LvymCuBGsIGiE2HF =oaHh -END PGP SIGNATURE-
[Vo]:Another segment of CBS video
Part of an interview with Mike McKubre: http://www.joost.com/097vy0y/t/Preview-Cold-Fusion#id=097vy0y
RE: [Vo]:Red Skeletons
-Original Message- From: Harry Veeder Related... Sinkholes below Lake Huron hold strange ecosystem: researchers http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2009/02/25/sinkholes.html Harry, This could be a different situation for the appearance of abundant but extreme life. Cyanobacteria obtain their energy through photosynthesis and would not need another mechanism for energy, (i.e. the fractional ground state) which is so extreme (in exotherm) in the sense that it probably kills off most of its host for the benefit of the next generation (the offspring of the host). That kind of sacrificial parenting or cooperative regeneration - is not at all unusual in evolution, in itself. But if any hydrino mechanism were to evolve this way - it would not be very competitive with other organisms that got their energy from solar, instead of EUV photons. It encourages parasitism. Any such hydrino mechanism, it seems, would likely need to be for the benefit of the cellular life in an extreme niche, where there is nothing else to compete against. After thinking about Robin's objection to this hypotheses (wrt the large and facile natural IP gap which would be there naturally in Fe+++ (58.8 eV vs. 54.4 eV)- a revised scenario emerges. It would be a mechanisms for the polar regions which have a lot of available iron, in the form of colloids of a solid electrolyte such as magnetite (hematite). Cellular life would attach to the colloids and use any UV radiation emerging from that particle as the energy for metabolism and reproduction. It could be that the initial cell which takes in a high energy photon immediately dies, and others feed off of it. Here are more specifics- These extreme regions are at the magnetic poles, which are in total darkness for many month. Therefore, let's consider the implications resources which are still available in total darkness at the poles - still coming from of the solar coronoa ... and which according to Mills' theory is where the bulk of solar energy is actually created via hydrino shrinkage. About half the emitted energy happens through fusion in the solar core, and this explains the solar neutrino problem. (only about half the expected neutrinos from solar fusion can be detected). The other half comes from fractional ground states, and some of the hydrinos are expelled into the solar wind. At any rate, the solar wind - which believe it or not - has never been collected for analysis outside our stratosphere - to prove or disprove this hypothesis, would contain a percentage of singly ionized hydrino hydride (of predominantly first stage shrinkage) as it approaches the magnetosphere of earth. This would be a shrunken hydrogen species with an extreme magnetic moment, among other features, and would be attracted to magnetite if it ever reached the surface. Since the hydrino hydride (Hy-) is charged, most of it could ONLY enter into our atmosphere, from the magnetosphere of earth - *at the polar regions*, that is: by following field lines. Actually most of it bypasses earth - but most of it that is captured, would happen predominantly at the poles. On adsorption into colloidal hematite or magnetite, once it reaches the ice, we might expect that a percentage of the species would be both neutralized and accelerated to the necessary level to develop redundancy within the iron's naturally present ions. IOW the energy hole which is presented at 54.8 eV is filled by nascent hydrogen in a slingshot effect, having gained ..4 eV in effective velocity from the capture of its extra electron. That extra energy is given off with the EUV photon, so you get the higher energy emission. Yes, this is a preliminary stab at shoehorning a methodology - and skeptics will say that is a strained rationalization without specific evidence, and admittedly highly conjectural - but which does provide a possible mechanism for radiant energy in cold dark environments, exactly like the Blood Falls location in Antarctica. The advantage of having such a hypothesis in place, is that it provides specific ways to prove or disprove in a laboratory setting. I can think of several experiments already. As of now, and on contrast - the Antarctic researchers appear to have been grasping at straws (icicles) with what I perceive to be comparatively weaker, but more mainstream rationalization That is: IF (big if) the hydrino is real (i.e. conclusively proved). Mills thinks that his proof is conclusive, but others do not. As a personal matter, I believe it is absolutely true on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays but am not so sure on the other days ;-). Let's hope he gives the kibitzers a real demo sooner rather than later. Given that his IP (patent portfolio) is ageing rapidly, as we speak, he has every incentive to get a piece of the DoE's multi-billion buck stimulus package. It is a golden opportunity, with a window which will not last long. Already a single solar plant near here has gotten hundreds of millions
Re: [Vo]:Energetics Technology website features 60 Minutes preview
On Apr 17, 2009, at 1:34 PM, Jones Beene wrote: BTW - wasn't Frank Z or maybe Horace the first to suggest something akin to boson-like coherence, or did Chubb come in ahead of them with the quasi-BEC slant? Its been tossed around for a long time... My first posting on this here was January, 1996, shortly after Weiman and Cornell published their achievement: http://mtaonline.net/~hheffner/BoseHyp.pdf Wave unction overlap is not a sufficient condition for fusion. Despite even being fully overlapped, large Bose wave functions do not of themselves produce fusion because the probability of finding two particles in proximity upon wave function collapse is small, much less in fact than random distribution within a wave function would imply. Multiple similarly charged particles particles are strongly co-located in mutually distant positions within the wave function. The main point of my posting was that co-location paradoxes result when multiple particles with diverse velocities are involved in a condensate, and one possible resolution of this is wave function collapse at a point, fusion. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
[Vo]:THE STIMULATED BOSE CONDENSATE HYPOTHESIS OF COLD FUSION
The following is a version posted April 5, 1996, The main addition was the THE ENERGY WITH NO ASH EFFECT section. THE STIMULATED BOSE CONDENSATE HYPOTHESIS OF COLD FUSION BACKGROUND The recent creation of a .002 inch 3000 atom Bose condensate by Carl Weiman and Eric Cornell may provide a possible insight to some cold fusion phenomena. The rubidium atom condensate was created with much difficulty and ingenuity at the extreme temperature of 20 nanokelvins, which was created by applying an RF field to atoms in a magnetic trap. The RF field was tuned to resonate with higher energy atoms, and thus caused these rubidium atoms to flip and then be shot out of the trap, thus leaving only those atoms with no significant energy. Though this was a difficult and amazing feat, demonstrating the Heisenberg uncertainty principle relates to a true physical state of matter, not just experimental uncertainty, perhaps nature readily accomplishes it in a small way in metallic lattices. It is a much less difficult feat to create an overlap of two hydrogen nuclei in a 1 A condensate than it is to create an overlap of 3000 rubidium atoms in a 500,000 A condensate. The rubidium atom overlap was sustainable for more than 15 minutes. To be significant to CF, a condensate of two protons or deuterons in a lattice site need only be formed a very short time, if formed often enough. It seems that the Weiman-Cornell experiment, supported by the Pritchard slit experiments, clearly demonstrates the reality of the wave nature of matter. Perhaps it is the only form of matter. The particle nature of matter might be explained strictly by wave function collapse, which is not a characteristic of ordinary waves, but clearly is a characteristic of quantum waveforms. For example, looking at the photoelectric effect, suppose a huge photon waveform from a distant star impacts via it's own random selection process at a particular point on a metal surface, ejecting an electron, why do we have to say the photon is a particle at the point of the electron ejection? It could just as easily be considered (called) a collapsed photon waveform as it could be considered a particle. A waveform collapse consists of an instantaneous change in wave form center and distribution. Such a collapse also clearly accounts for tunneling effects as well. Where is the need for a particle model at all? If matter is totally wave like, it seems inescapable that charge must therefore be distributed in the waveform, as there exists no point to carry it. This has the benefit, as Richard Feynman pointed out, of conservation of energy, because a point charge could generate an infinitely intense field, as you approach the point, requiring an infinite amount of energy to create the field. THE HYPOTHESIS Wave function collapse occurs probabilistically on the relative approach of two or more quantum waveforms. One quantum waveform can collapse to the location of the other. If two overlapped, i.e. relatively to each other slow, waveforms in a Bose condensate are penetrated by a high velocity waveform, a collapse can occur. Also, a kind of paradox occurs. All motion is relative. Assume the condensate is two deuterons, and the high velocity waveform is an electron. From the point of view of the proton condensate, the wavelength (size) of the electron is small. From the point of view of the electron, though, the condensate must appear very small, and more importantly, since the waveforms of the deuteron condensate are phase locked and overlapped, the condensate must appear, from the electron's point of view, phase locked and overlapped in a small volume, because the de Broglie wavelength of the single waveform of the condensate appears small to the electron due to the high relative velocity. Thus, if there is an interaction, it would seem there would be a high probability that the interaction would be a 3 body interaction. That is to say the formation of a single waveform of a condensate would greatly change waveform co-location probabilities from the perspective of the electron. Given two deuterons jammed into a lattice site, the Schroedinger Equation predicts that they will co-located, i.e. tend to be found in opposing locations within the site. However, should they form a Bose condensate, it is logical that the two deuteron locations would appear to a fast moving particle to be nearly the same , even though still co-located in the smaller volume, because the centers of mass of the individual particles will approach each other during the formation of the condensate, and their distributions co-mingle in the small de Broglie wavelength of the condensate, from the fast moving particles prospective. SOME EXPLAINED EFFECTS This hypothesis provides some explanation for various effects. One is the Kasagi experiment, where deuterated titanium is bombarded with deuterons.
Re: [Vo]:Energetics Technology website features 60 Minutes preview
Horace Heffner wrote: Wave unction overlap . . . So not only do we speculate that particles join the Hare Chrishna cult, but we have them excessive but superficial compliments given with affected charm and smug self-serving earnestness. They are anthropomorphic little devils! - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Another segment of CBS video
This segment has Mike speculating about all the good things cold fusion may bring to humanity. I am VERY glad he said this. I wrote to him: People may accuse you of hyping or overselling the prospects, but I think that your assertions are a straightforward extrapolation from what has been measured. Power density, temperature and so on. Of course we cannot be sure that cold fusion can be made practical! But I think it would intellectually dishonest to lowball expectations and say: 'there is no indication this can be made practical; it may only be a laboratory curiosity.' - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Energetics Technology website features 60 Minutes preview
On Apr 18, 2009, at 10:08 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: Horace Heffner wrote: Wave unction overlap . . . So not only do we speculate that particles join the Hare Chrishna cult, but we have them excessive but superficial compliments given with affected charm and smug self-serving earnestness. They are anthropomorphic little devils! - Jed My mistake - I think in the final analysis the little devils will be found to be effected with strange rather than giving with affected charm. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
