Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed
In reply to Jed Rothwell's message of Thu, 8 May 2014 19:50:52 -0400: Hi, [snip] Thank you for proving my point that the cathode is an engine. ;) mix...@bigpond.com wrote: You do not calculate the energy density of engines. You calculate the energy density of fuels. (Unless as Jed mentioned, you are stuck with the Hydrogen in the cathode, and it is not replaceable - in which case the outlook for CF is far more restricted.) I do not think that would be a major problem. It is easy to work around it. First, a well-established fact: The reaction produces helium. Roughly half of that comes out of metal, and the other half goes deeper in, and McKubre points out. That tells us that some gas does get trapped in the metal, and even the dynamic flux of an active cold fusion cell does not drive it out automatically. Of course, helium is not hydrogen, but still, it does indicate there is trapped gas. Now for some speculation. Suppose that gas loading, electrolysis and other methods all depend on a trapped supply of hydrogen in the metal, as I suggested. We still know how to drive the hydrogen and helium out, by various methods. We may have to turn off the reaction while doing that, and then reload the metal and start it up again. That would be a problem if entire machine ran with a single metal cathode, or one single discrete batch of gas loaded powder. But there is not need to make it that way. If the load/deload duty cycles were about equal, that means you need 10 cathodes to do the work that 5 cathodes could do full time. That is of no importance, except that it makes the machine a little less compact than it would be otherwise. You would not grouse about it any more than you would complain that a 6-cylinder automobile ICE fires only one cylinder at a time, so it operates at 1/6 of total capacity. (Actually some early ICEs and Diesel engines had only one cylinder, but I expect they vibrated like the dickens and made a lot of noise.) Controlling and keeping track of the load/deload cycles would call for sophisticated computer controls, but any kind of cold fusion engine will need this. It will call for multiple independently sealed cell, rather than a single discrete cell. That will make manufacturing a little more complicated, but with robotic assembly lines it will hardly affect the cost. Nowadays, increased complexity does not increase the cost of machinery much, and it does not reduce reliability. That is why hybrid automobiles work so well. It is worth the trade-off in complexity, even though you end up with a machine that can only be assembled by robots, and that can only be operated with computer controls. - Jed Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed
In reply to Bob Cook's message of Thu, 8 May 2014 15:54:23 -0700: Hi, [snip] Rossi's low temperature E-Cat I believe has a fixed H supply and a fixed Ni supply. They are loaded together in the sealed reactor tube at the beginning of the heating to start the reaction. Rossi's Hot Cat reactor may have a continuous supply of H. Bob True, but I think the low temperature E-cat is really just a prototype, not really production ready. Furthermore, I think it is as yet far from proven that the Ni actually takes part in the reaction. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed
Robin, My point was that this anomaly is NOT in accordance with the present definition of COE and the change in geometry [DCE]of powder or skeletal catalyst is needed to form an HUP trap fueled by the gas motion which never diminishes regardless of quanity - the same gas could be used endlessly needing only enough pressure and circulation to maintain loading as the process heats and cools the gas similar to wind patterns where acute hydrinos are formed in the geometry of highest confinement and become less acute as they are randomly directed to less confined areas - not that this alone would create energy but at this point you would append your favorite theory to create the asymmetry needed to produce heat, you know my favorite is that hydrino molecules are relativistic and their phase opposes movement to a different inertial frame while hydrino atoms can change inertial frames unopposed which has the effect of discounting the heat needed to disassociate the molecule to over unity using the normally unexploitable energy source of random motion. IMHO it is a self assembling form of a Maxwellian demon but I am open to many of the other theorys - I just think using DCE and HUP as your underlying starting point is at least a better start that gives the plasmons, ion charges, hydrotrons and all the others an initial leg to stand on - I also like the commonality in this perspective because you can easily envision this same sort of changing confinement in the collapsing bubbles of sonoluminescence. Of course my initial theory that virtual particle density equates to relativistic values of consequence is a tall order for the mainstream that sees near C velocities as the entry fee to these types of effects but I remain convinced that suppressing density is much easier than compressing it like the difference between accelerating a car thru a rainstorm to compress the pressure as opposed to opening a beach umbrella to reduce it. Albeit a very small nano beach umbrella where the rest of the macro world remains in the rainstorm we call the isotropy. I think this system allows us to pit the square law of isotropy against the emerging dynamic inverse cube law of DCE while still being powered by the local random motion of gas law in these tiny inertial frames the gas is encountering. Getting back to topic I think you need cathode DCE geometry AND gas loading to create energy making the DCE geometry a better metric since it is the only area this type of energy can be harnessed into the macro world. Fran -Original Message- From: mix...@bigpond.com [mailto:mix...@bigpond.com] Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2014 6:25 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed In reply to Roarty, Francis X's message of Thu, 8 May 2014 11:27:09 +: Hi, [snip] I disagree with this portion of your reply [snip] Since the actual source of energy is likely to be the Hydrogen in the water, not the actual cathode metal, the volume of the cathode is pretty much irrelevant [/snip] Yes the energy may come from the gas but it is the lattice confinement and change in level of confinement at the defects that provide the environment that liberates this normally inaccessible source of energy from hydrogen - We don't have to accept ZPE, hydrino or hydrotron to all agree that defects in lattice geometry, their population density and their topologies allow this energy to be produced such that you have to consider the hydrogen and the containment together as the actual energy source so Jeds' focus on the cathode geometry as a crude metric seems viable. This would only be true if the NAE was destroyed when the reaction happened, and were incapable of reforming. If either of these two are not true, then the cathode (for want of a more general term) has to be considered to be an engine and the Hydrogen has to be considered the fuel. You do not calculate the energy density of engines. You calculate the energy density of fuels. (Unless as Jed mentioned, you are stuck with the Hydrogen in the cathode, and it is not replaceable - in which case the outlook for CF is far more restricted.) Note however that both Rossi Defkalion appear to use a regular supply of external Hydrogen. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
[Vo]:A Giant Sequoia is planted by Elon Musk
Tree-huggers have something new to talk about today. The genius has struck again. (BTW Elon means tree in Hebrew) http://www.forbes.com/sites/uciliawang/2014/05/07/teslas-elon-musk-on-creati ng-a-cool-battery-system-with-a-beautiful-cover-for-home-energy-storage/ No one could figure out exactly why Tesla needed a billion dollar battery plant which was 10 times too large for projected production. Answer: they will sell the excess to home owners (or Utilities or Solar installers) for load leveling and for solar storage... not to mention: use the leverage of plant location to get some silly laws off the books in places like Texas. Think about it - extremely large differential electrical rates (highly favorable) exist between late night and midday - in many states, which will pay back such a basic storage system in a much shorter time than would solar, but the two together make sense as well. Even without solar, you charge the batteries at late night for the next day's use. The grid supplier is better off since he can keep the generators turning 24/7. In fact, the big electricity consumer can probably get a load leveling system installed for free - eventually, once the power companies realize how this can save them money. It may eve become a requirement in some states. attachment: winmail.dat
Re: [Vo]:A Giant Sequoia is planted by Elon Musk
On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 9:58 AM, Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net wrote: No one could figure out exactly why Tesla needed a billion dollar battery plant which was 10 times too large for projected production. Answer: they will sell the excess to home owners (or Utilities or Solar installers) for load leveling and for solar storage... not to mention: use the leverage of plant location to get some silly laws off the books in places like Texas. http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/In-Gear/2014/0508/Tesla-TSLA-will-break-ground-on-battery-factory-next-month.-But-where As of yesterday, the plant's location is a carefully guarded secret. And their stock price is a real puzzler. Today it's trading in the $180 range, down from $250 just weeks ago. It's a day trader's dream or nightmare with $10 - $20 swings daily. I can see how load leveling batteries can be cost effective by reducing the need for extra generating plants; but, PV systems in my area are not cost effective for the consumer even without the expense of batteries. But, we pay about $0.10 per kWhr. And what if a bettery displaces LiON? Musk is a brave man. Meanwhile Musk has gotten access to the Apollo launch pads for his SpaceX venture and is going after the MIC's monopoly on government launches. The Desolation of Smaug.
[Vo]:A different use for your brain
Proessor Roger Bowley unlocks his car from various distances, using waves from his key, brain and a big bottle of water. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Uqf71muwWc Harry
RE: [Vo]:nice essay Jed
Another thought regarding fuel vs engine when I said [snip] Of course my initial theory that virtual particle density equates to relativistic values of consequence is a tall order for the mainstream that sees near C velocities as the entry fee to these types of effects but I remain convinced that suppressing density is much easier than compressing it like the difference between accelerating a car thru a rainstorm to compress the pressure as opposed to opening a beach umbrella to reduce it.[/snip] I should also have made the proposition that supplying energy to accelerate a spacecraft to near luminal velocity relative to a stationary observer is equivalent to a stationary observer relative to gas atoms occupying regions where vacuum density is suppressed / regions where the isotropy is breached - but instead of real world propellants as fuel to ADD energy we can now use geometrical confinement to SUBTRACT the energy that is all around us - slowing the intersection rate of vp thru these regions to create regions that breach the isotropy on a scale that physical matter can actually interact with instead of the wormholes below the Plank scale that are said to be part of the chaotic foam. I don't think we get something for nothing and ascribe to the notion that the suppressed regions are balanced by compressed regions in the surrounding wall geometry making these cavities more a reservoir of segregation and concentration but just so.. most gas migration will naturally have more affinity for the open cavities then permeating thru the walls forming the cavities. Maybe some gases do have an affinity for permeating thru the walls rather than residing in cavities which would explain the half-life anomalies where life is extended instead of reduced. In any case most radioactive measurements of half life are averages of the bulk gas and these anomalies could all have proportions of both type of anomalous decay but we only see the average. Fran -Original Message- From: Roarty, Francis X Sent: Friday, May 09, 2014 7:50 AM To: 'vortex-l@eskimo.com' Subject: Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed Robin, My point was that this anomaly is NOT in accordance with the present definition of COE and the change in geometry [DCE]of powder or skeletal catalyst is needed to form an HUP trap fueled by the gas motion which never diminishes regardless of quanity - the same gas could be used endlessly needing only enough pressure and circulation to maintain loading as the process heats and cools the gas similar to wind patterns where acute hydrinos are formed in the geometry of highest confinement and become less acute as they are randomly directed to less confined areas - not that this alone would create energy but at this point you would append your favorite theory to create the asymmetry needed to produce heat, you know my favorite is that hydrino molecules are relativistic and their phase opposes movement to a different inertial frame while hydrino atoms can change inertial frames unopposed which has the effect of discounting the heat needed to disassociate the molecule to over unity using the normally unexploitable energy source of random motion. IMHO it is a self assembling form of a Maxwellian demon but I am open to many of the other theorys - I just think using DCE and HUP as your underlying starting point is at least a better start that gives the plasmons, ion charges, hydrotrons and all the others an initial leg to stand on - I also like the commonality in this perspective because you can easily envision this same sort of changing confinement in the collapsing bubbles of sonoluminescence. Of course my initial theory that virtual particle density equates to relativistic values of consequence is a tall order for the mainstream that sees near C velocities as the entry fee to these types of effects but I remain convinced that suppressing density is much easier than compressing it like the difference between accelerating a car thru a rainstorm to compress the pressure as opposed to opening a beach umbrella to reduce it. Albeit a very small nano beach umbrella where the rest of the macro world remains in the rainstorm we call the isotropy. I think this system allows us to pit the square law of isotropy against the emerging dynamic inverse cube law of DCE while still being powered by the local random motion of gas law in these tiny inertial frames the gas is encountering. Getting back to topic I think you need cathode DCE geometry AND gas loading to create energy making the DCE geometry a better metric since it is the only area this type of energy can be harnessed into the macro world. Fran -Original Message- From: mix...@bigpond.com [mailto:mix...@bigpond.com] Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2014 6:25 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed In reply to Roarty, Francis X's message of Thu, 8 May 2014 11:27:09 +: Hi, [snip] I
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed
Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com wrote: Of course, helium is not hydrogen, but still, it does indicate there is trapped gas. For palladium and deuterium, where we know 4He is produced, 4He is immobile in bulk palladium, while deuterium will escape over time. The 4He gets stuck in a way that H or D does not, as I remember. Yeah. It is well established that He gets stuck more easily. But I do not think the difference is so dramatic that H or D will all come out but the He will remain completely stuck. The methods they use to unstick it before taking an inventory are the same as the methods used to drive the H or D out. I have read various papers about this and discussed it but I do not recall which papers. An implication is that to measure the full amount of 4He that has been produced in a PdD system, it is advisable to melt down a cathode to get at the 4He trapped in the bulk. That is the extreme method! The point I am trying to make is that for a short experiment with bulk metal, that produces heat for a few weeks, probably most of the D that reacts was in the cathode to start with. Probably not much more comes from the electrolyte. So it is a reasonable approximation to the used the moles of metal and assume there are that many moles of D. Okay, for all I know it could be off by a factor of 5 or 10 but that still isn't many moles. They say that loading is never uniform, and bulk metal never loads 100%, so 1 mol gas per 1 mol metal is an exaggeration. (So they say.) Even when loading is measured at 100% that is because the 4 probes are hitting loaded areas between them, I think. Probably the lost gas method would show less than 100%. I would not know about nanoparticles. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed
In reply to Roarty, Francis X's message of Fri, 9 May 2014 11:50:16 +: Hi Francis, [snip] Robin, My point was that this anomaly is NOT in accordance with the present definition of COE and the change in geometry [DCE]of powder or skeletal catalyst is needed to form an HUP trap fueled by the gas motion which never diminishes regardless of quanity - the same gas could be used endlessly needing only enough pressure and circulation to maintain loading as the process heats and cools the gas similar to wind patterns where acute hydrinos are formed in the geometry of highest confinement and become less acute as they are randomly directed to less confined areas - not that this alone would create energy but at this point you would append your favorite theory to create the asymmetry needed to produce heat, you know my favorite is that hydrino molecules are relativistic and their phase opposes movement to a different inertial frame while hydrino atoms can change inertial frames unopposed which has the effect of discounting the heat needed to disassociate the molecule to over unity using the normally unexploitable energy source of random motion. IMHO it is a self assembling form of a Maxwellian demon but I am open to many of the other theorys - I just think using DCE and HUP as your underlying starting point is at least a better start that gives the plasmons, ion charges, hydrotrons and all the others an initial leg to stand on - I also like the commonality in this perspective because you can easily envision this same sort of changing confinement in the collapsing bubbles of sonoluminescence. Of course my initial theory that virtual particle density equates to relativistic values of consequence is a tall order for the mainstream that sees near C velocities as the entry fee to these types of effects but I remain convinced that suppressing density is much easier than compressing it like the difference between accelerating a car thru a rainstorm to compress the pressure as opposed to opening a beach umbrella to reduce it. Albeit a very small nano beach umbrella where the rest of the macro world remains in the rainstorm we call the isotropy. I think this system allows us to pit the square law of isotropy against the emerging dynamic inverse cube law of DCE while still being powered by the local random motion of gas law in these tiny inertial frames the gas is encountering. Getting back to topic I think you need cathode DCE geometry AND gas loading to create energy making the DCE geometry a better metric since it is the only area this type of energy can be harnessed into the macro world. Fran All you have said here is that both the Hydrogen and cathode constitute an engine and that the fuel is effectively the ZPE. You might be right. Time will tell. However I suspect that Hydrogen is more likely the fuel. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
[Vo]:New Interview with Mats Lewan On E-Cat Rossi
Hope Y'all enjoy it: Stream/Download MP3http://jmag0904.podomatic.com/entry/2014-05-09T05_58_46-07_00 Listen on YouTubehttp://jmag0904.wordpress.com/2014/05/09/nytekniks-mats-lewan-e-cat-andrea-rossi-an-impossible-invention/
Re: [Vo]:New Interview with Mats Lewan On E-Cat Rossi
Thanks!
Re: [Vo]:New Interview with Mats Lewan On E-Cat Rossi
I was surprised by how he described his experience at the Defkalion Milan demo. That didn't jive with his blog posts where he was more positive. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 5:31 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks!
Re: [Vo]:New Interview with Mats Lewan On E-Cat Rossi
Well that was a while ago now, no? Things can change over close to a years time. Not really that surprising to me. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 9:48 PM, Blaze Spinnaker blazespinna...@gmail.comwrote: I was surprised by how he described his experience at the Defkalion Milan demo. That didn't jive with his blog posts where he was more positive. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 5:31 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote: Thanks!
Re: [Vo]:New Interview with Mats Lewan On E-Cat Rossi
Foks0904 . foks0...@gmail.com wrote: Well that was a while ago now, no? Things can change over close to a years time. Not really that surprising to me. I think you mean he has reconsidered. Sometimes a person has one impression during an event, but it seems different in retrospect. Also, Defkalion was expected to follow-up on the test, but they never did. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:New Interview with Mats Lewan On E-Cat Rossi
Agreed. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 10:19 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Foks0904 . foks0...@gmail.com wrote: Well that was a while ago now, no? Things can change over close to a years time. Not really that surprising to me. I think you mean he has reconsidered. Sometimes a person has one impression during an event, but it seems different in retrospect. Also, Defkalion was expected to follow-up on the test, but they never did. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:New Interview with Mats Lewan On E-Cat Rossi
True, though it'll make you wonder what his view will be in another year or two as well. When you calculate the odds on an event you have to rely a lot on journalists because they do a lot of the investigation for you. One thing I do with a journalists is see them report something I'm familiar with and if they do a good job, then I have more confidence when they report something I'm not familiar with. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 7:32 PM, Foks0904 . foks0...@gmail.com wrote: Agreed. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 10:19 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote: Foks0904 . foks0...@gmail.com wrote: Well that was a while ago now, no? Things can change over close to a years time. Not really that surprising to me. I think you mean he has reconsidered. Sometimes a person has one impression during an event, but it seems different in retrospect. Also, Defkalion was expected to follow-up on the test, but they never did. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:New Interview with Mats Lewan On E-Cat Rossi
If he changed his mind again, would it matter to you for some reason? As long as an opinion is informed and based on the most up to date evidence available at the time, that's all that matters. I think the ability to change one's mind is a strength, not a weakness. Being open-minded is not the same as being a flake. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 10:35 PM, Blaze Spinnaker blazespinna...@gmail.comwrote: True, though it'll make you wonder what his view will be in another year or two as well. When you calculate the odds on an event you have to rely a lot on journalists because they do a lot of the investigation for you. One thing I do with a journalists is see them report something I'm familiar with and if they do a good job, then I have more confidence when they report something I'm not familiar with. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 7:32 PM, Foks0904 . foks0...@gmail.com wrote: Agreed. On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 10:19 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote: Foks0904 . foks0...@gmail.com wrote: Well that was a while ago now, no? Things can change over close to a years time. Not really that surprising to me. I think you mean he has reconsidered. Sometimes a person has one impression during an event, but it seems different in retrospect. Also, Defkalion was expected to follow-up on the test, but they never did. - Jed
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed
On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 7:27 AM, Roarty, Francis X francis.x.roa...@lmco.com wrote: Agree it is relevant to power density and less so for energy density since it is only certain metal lattices that possess this property and the property is far more dependent of the broken geometries of the lattice.. This property is the ability of the metal to reflect near infrared light. how often and to what extent defects occur seems more important than the volume even to the point where researches have to track manufacturers and lot numbers of the metal lattice to be certain they get the same materials capable of exhibiting these anomalous properties. Dipole energy (electrons) and infrared light are localized and concentrated and combined into polaritons by the sharp points and/or small cavities in the metal infrared reflecting metal I disagree with this portion of your reply [snip] Since the actual source of energy is likely to be the Hydrogen in the water, not the actual cathode metal, the volume of the cathode is pretty much irrelevant [/snip] The metal is the catalyzer of the reaction that involves production of magnetic fields from polariton vortex flow. Yes the energy may come from the gas but it is the lattice confinement and change in level of confinement at the defects that provide the environment that liberates this normally inaccessible source of energy from hydrogen - The uncertainty principle amplifies the polariton energy to shorten its wavelength into the EUV spectrum range. We don't have to accept ZPE, hydrino or hydrotron to all agree that defects in lattice geometry, their population density and their topologies allow this energy to be produced such that you have to consider the hydrogen and the containment together as the actual energy source so Jeds' focus on the cathode geometry as a crude metric seems viable. The key to the LENR process is the unique properties of the polariton and the metal that produces those polariton properties. These metals are not consumed in general. It is the hydrogen and other light elements that are the fuel.
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed
LENR always occurs on the surface of the metal. show me experimental results that contradict this fact. On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 8:54 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: That's for deuterium! No one knows what happens with H! Well, I suppose it produces some other gas, probably deuterium. But the point I was trying to make is that only half of the helium emerges. The rest is trapped. So there is no process going on that quickly and forcefully empties out the lattice and replaces all the gas in it. I do not think it is likely that the deuterium is be forced out and replaced, but the helium remains trapped. - Jed
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:nice essay Jed
Who's arguing to the contrary? A certain % of Helium can't be trapped in the surface layer why? On Sat, May 10, 2014 at 12:05 AM, Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote: LENR always occurs on the surface of the metal. show me experimental results that contradict this fact. On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 8:54 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote: Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: That's for deuterium! No one knows what happens with H! Well, I suppose it produces some other gas, probably deuterium. But the point I was trying to make is that only half of the helium emerges. The rest is trapped. So there is no process going on that quickly and forcefully empties out the lattice and replaces all the gas in it. I do not think it is likely that the deuterium is be forced out and replaced, but the helium remains trapped. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Re: [Vo] Rossi Effect Not Before June--
When this report is published it will probably be greeted with a yawn. Rossi needs to demo his plant to the patent office and then he'd get his patent approved. It would be at that point that LENR breaks out. On Fri, May 2, 2014 at 10:39 AM, Bob Cook frobertc...@hotmail.com wrote: Yesterday Rossi (on his reader blog) indicated that the third party tests would *not* be reported before June. Vortexers have at least another month to speculate on the mechanism of the Ni-H Rossi Effect. However it may be quite bit longer, depending upon patent disclosure strategy. What are the possibilities regarding outing of a theory supported by good data in conjunction with the release of the third party report? Like Rossi implies in his response to a comment yesterday regarding the probability of the Rossi Effect happening naturally, the design of his reactor certainly had some design behind it. I think Focardi nailed the theory and should be hailed appropriately. Rossi had the wherewithal to add some development funds and theory of his own and probably should get the Nobel Prize. I hope it happens soon. I am planning a trip to Italy in September and will visit the University of Bologna for two days with the objective of talking with folks who knew Focardi and are currently working in the field of solid states physics and nano technology. Alain has already asked me to visit the History Dept there as well to find out the facts about the death of Bruno which this blog discussed a few weeks ago. I will report on my trip and interactions. Vortexers that may have other ideas or questions, if so inclined, should present them to me via my own email address so that I might address them with the Bologna historians or researchers. Alain has already given me some good ideas and leads. Bob Cook - Original Message - *From:* Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com *To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com *Sent:* Friday, May 02, 2014 9:38 AM *Subject:* [Vo]:Re: [Vo]:Re: [Vo]:Pasadena: Theater Arts at Caltech dramatizes the discovery and debunking of “cold fusion” (bring tomatoes) I believe that play has been around for a while. I heard about it years ago. - Jed
