Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
On 30/6/04 8:24 PM, "John Taylor" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I got a $100 40GB hard disk drive here in Mandurah. No third party > drivers needed. All I had to do was partition it so I could install OS > X. > > So no-one has dug their ATI Rage 128 card out of their G3 to replace it > with a faster one? Oh well. I'll try my luck with the Quokka. > > -Chris Taylor > Ooohhh on the price. You could have bought a 60 or 80gig for less than a $100 from PLE. Not to worry! Good luck with the card, as they are rare has hens teeth! Try ebay! Seeya Rod!
Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
I got a $100 40GB hard disk drive here in Mandurah. No third party drivers needed. All I had to do was partition it so I could install OS X. So no-one has dug their ATI Rage 128 card out of their G3 to replace it with a faster one? Oh well. I'll try my luck with the Quokka. -Chris Taylor
Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
On Tue, 2004-06-29 at 15:25, Craig Ringer wrote: > I am extremely confused as to how you get the idea that I (or anyone > else on this thread) was at any point suggesting that firmware > modifications might be required to use non-Apple-supplied hard disks in > macs. The only firmware tweaks I'm aware of for hard disks are used for > failure simulation. You are absolutely correct. I suspect at 5:35 this morning when I typed it with my gloves on after waking up to the sound of my wife struggling with the remote control to the A/C, it must have resonated in my mind, that this was what was being discussed. So, apologies all round... I will close with an observation that in the past I have heard people exclaim that they needed Macintosh Firmware for their hard-disks, but in this case that was not at all muted. Again sorry for any confusion. Onno Benschop Connected via Optus B3 at S27°52'30" - E151°16'25" (Millmerran, QLD) -- ()/)/)()..ASCII for Onno.. |>>?..EBCDIC for Onno.. --- -. -. --- ..Morse for Onno.. Proudly supported by Skipper Trucks, Highway1, Concept AV, Sony Central, Dalcon ITmaze - ABN: 56 178 057 063 - ph: 04 1219 - onno at itmaze dot com dot au
Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
On Wed, 2004-06-30 at 01:41, Rod wrote: > > I'm all too familiar with the latter. RAM, anybody? > > I thought for older SCSI Macs, this was the case with hard drives. I seem to remember encountering that problem with my PowerMac 7200. HDT to the rescue! > Certain > model hard drives weren't recognized by drive setup and required the use of > a third party app, such as FWB Hard Drive Toolkit (which also let you set up > drives in a soft RAID). Or you bought the Apple recommended model. Not the > case now, but in the past yes. Otherwise what would have been the point of > Hard Drive Toolkit? HDT also provided some nice disk diagnostics, such as surface scans and mechanism tests. It could also blacklist bad sectors for you, permitting you to continue to use a drive with bad sectors - something that mattered in the days before you could go out and pick up a new disk for a hundred bucks. -- Craig Ringer
Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
On 29/6/04 1:25 PM, "Craig Ringer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Tue, 2004-06-29 at 05:35, Onno Benschop wrote: I've heard that you have to flash the ROM (change the firmware) for some cards, >> >> Uhm, a card and a hard-disk are *not* even close to being the same >> thing. >> >> I have no evidence at all that any firmware modifications are needed for >> any hard-disks. > >> I am suspicious of any such >> requirements for hard-disks and suspect either ill-informed users who >> confuse the two, or ruthless dealers charging a premium for Macintosh >> compatibility. > > I'm all too familiar with the latter. RAM, anybody? > I thought for older SCSI Macs, this was the case with hard drives. Certain model hard drives weren't recognized by drive setup and required the use of a third party app, such as FWB Hard Drive Toolkit (which also let you set up drives in a soft RAID). Or you bought the Apple recommended model. Not the case now, but in the past yes. Otherwise what would have been the point of Hard Drive Toolkit? Seeya Rod!
Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
On Tue, 2004-06-29 at 05:35, Onno Benschop wrote: > > > I've heard that you have to flash the ROM (change the firmware) for > > > some cards, > > Uhm, a card and a hard-disk are *not* even close to being the same > thing. > > I have no evidence at all that any firmware modifications are needed for > any hard-disks. I am extremely confused as to how you get the idea that I (or anyone else on this thread) was at any point suggesting that firmware modifications might be required to use non-Apple-supplied hard disks in macs. The only firmware tweaks I'm aware of for hard disks are used for failure simulation. Video cards, perhaps. Hard disks, I can't possibly imagine why. > If you are completely paranoid - which you should be - I > would recommend that you take your machine to the place where you are > thinking about purchasing a drive and testing it there. > > I would also bring a boot-able CD with me and a copy of the current > version of Drive Setup. That would seem a sensible approach to me, yes. > So, while a firmware change *might* be required for a brain-dead PCI or > AGP card - shoot the manufacturer, I wouldn't be too surprised if Open Firmware required different card firmware to boot with the card - in particular, a replacement for the VGA BIOS. It would seem to me that using VESA calls would be the sensible approach, but I don't know if that's what Open Firmware does, or in fact if VESA BIOSes are portable across CPU architectures. So it may not be the manufacturer's fault if a firmware change is in fact required. Of course, it could just as easily be drivers written only to work with the special "Mac edition" cards so they can charge more. > I am suspicious of any such > requirements for hard-disks and suspect either ill-informed users who > confuse the two, or ruthless dealers charging a premium for Macintosh > compatibility. I'm all too familiar with the latter. RAM, anybody? -- Craig Ringer
Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
> > I've heard that you have to flash the ROM (change the firmware) for > > some cards, Uhm, a card and a hard-disk are *not* even close to being the same thing. I have no evidence at all that any firmware modifications are needed for any hard-disks. If you are completely paranoid - which you should be - I would recommend that you take your machine to the place where you are thinking about purchasing a drive and testing it there. I would also bring a boot-able CD with me and a copy of the current version of Drive Setup. So, while a firmware change *might* be required for a brain-dead PCI or AGP card - shoot the manufacturer, I am suspicious of any such requirements for hard-disks and suspect either ill-informed users who confuse the two, or ruthless dealers charging a premium for Macintosh compatibility. Of course, I may be completely wrong, in which case I'd be happy to learn about it. Cheers, Onno Benschop Connected via Optus B3 at S27°52'30" - E151°16'25" (Millmerran, QLD) -- ()/)/)()..ASCII for Onno.. |>>?..EBCDIC for Onno.. --- -. -. --- ..Morse for Onno.. Proudly supported by Skipper Trucks, Highway1, Concept AV, Sony Central, Dalcon ITmaze - ABN: 56 178 057 063 - ph: 04 1219 - onno at itmaze dot com dot au
Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
On Mon, 2004-06-28 at 18:21, John Taylor wrote: > > That brings me to something I've been wondering about for a while - on > > AGP macs, is there any requirement to use an Apple-modified card? > I've heard that you have to flash the ROM (change the firmware) for > some cards, but I would check if you have to do this (and how) with a > G4. Here's one related post: > http://www.baseboard.net/forums/showthread.php?threadid=5330 > I know it has to be done with non-Apple-modified Voodoo 3 cards. Hmm. If that is actually needed, then it'd be better to bite the bullet and just buy a mac one, despite the steep price. I was _hoping_ the ATi Mac drivers would work fine with their generic cards (as this is true for basically all other hardware, such as network cards and even SCSI controllers if you're not booting off them). I suppose that the VGA BIOS would necessitate at least a firmware re-flash for video cards to work in macs, though. -- Craig Ringer
Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
On 28 Jun 2004, at 5:31 PM, Craig Ringer wrote: I'm also looking for a PCI ATI Rage 128 card that will go in my computer. Apparently this will make OS X go significantly faster, in addition to my 3D games. I don't doubt it. That brings me to something I've been wondering about for a while - on AGP macs, is there any requirement to use an Apple-modified card? It'd be nice if I could pick up a standard Radeon 9200 (I don't care about the ADC on the Apple ones) and use that. I've heard that you have to flash the ROM (change the firmware) for some cards, but I would check if you have to do this (and how) with a G4. Here's one related post: http://www.baseboard.net/forums/showthread.php?threadid=5330 I know it has to be done with non-Apple-modified Voodoo 3 cards. Regards, Chris Taylor
Re: Wanted: 6GB hard disk or larger, ATI Rage 128 card
On Mon, 2004-06-28 at 16:50, John Taylor wrote: > If anyone has a spare 6GB > hard drive or larger that will go in my computer that would be great. A > Mac one would be preferable to avoid having to use third party hard > disk drivers. Hmm. I was able to install a disk (a WD Caviar, in fact) in an OS9/OSX dual boot G4 the other day. It was a normal off-the-shelf drive from Austin, and no more Apple than an Intel CPU ;-) It was formatted using Drive Setup and installed with OS9 first. The only difference between it and the old drive was the massively increased storage space and small speed improvement. Is it possible that the days of artificially blocking users from using 3rd party ATA disks are over? A shiny new 40GB disk can be obtained for as little as $80, but buying one with a larger cache (in the $100 range) would seem wise, as even on old machines the disk can be a very important aspect of system performance. The price point seems to be the 80GB 7200RM disks with 8MB caches for about $110. Of course, I can't tell you for sure that the disk will work in your mac model, only that an 80GB 7200RPM WD JB works fine in one of the G4/400s here. Double checking would be strongly recommended (and as you say, an old mac disk will be cheaper and safer, albeit slower and smaller). > I'm also looking for a PCI ATI Rage 128 card that will go in my > computer. Apparently this will make OS X go significantly faster, in > addition to my 3D games. I don't doubt it. That brings me to something I've been wondering about for a while - on AGP macs, is there any requirement to use an Apple-modified card? It'd be nice if I could pick up a standard Radeon 9200 (I don't care about the ADC on the Apple ones) and use that. -- Craig Ringer
