[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
https://groups.google.com/d/topic/web2py/HkkZ_-kMUYE/discussion On Tuesday, April 5, 2011 1:55:35 PM UTC-4, pbreit wrote: > I think we need a new repository for information. I'm not sure Slices is > quite the right approach. A wiki might work better.
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
I think we need a new repository for information. I'm not sure Slices is quite the right approach. A wiki might work better.
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
On Tuesday, April 5, 2011 12:51:46 PM UTC-4, pbreit wrote: > > Perception is reality, even more so on these topics. Yeah, maybe instead of flashing a warning, the FAQ should just include dates on the postings.
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
Perception is reality, even more so on these topics.
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
On Tuesday, April 5, 2011 12:13:45 PM UTC-4, mikech wrote: > > Thanks Anthony, that's the information I'm looking for. The only downside > re: the blog is that it's marked as old. Is there an updated source? There's a flash message saying the blog is old, but not all the entries are actually that old (and just because a particular entry is old doesn't mean its content is necessarily out of date). I don't think entry 260 is more than a few months old. Maybe Massimo can provide some insight. Anthony
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
Thanks Anthony, that's the information I'm looking for. The only downside re: the blog is that it's marked as old. Is there an updated source?
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
It could be interesting to have an IDE configuration section. As far as Eclipse is concerned you can look at these: http://code.google.com/p/neo-web2py2eclipse/ http://pierrethibault.posterous.com/2010/10/web2py-eclipse-pydev-recipe.html Are you currently using an IDE???, which one? On Apr 4, 1:21 pm, mikech wrote: > I'd like to see some FAQ topics that can be pointed to on the usual FUD > about Web2py. For instance: > > In web2py the code you write for the controller layer (views) goes into > files that are not Python modules because they don't include any imports to > give context to external identifiers. Web2py loads, compiles, and executes > those modules at runtime passing a global context using Python's exec() > function. That strange (and unjustified) way of doing things disables > important capabilities of modern IDEs (code completion, code hints, help, > static checking, refactoring) because those files are not Python modules. It > also makes it very difficult to write unit tests for the controller layer, > because the global runtime context of web2py cannot be mocked. > > I tried to look for the Google thread in which Massimo addressed these and > other issues, but the search didn't easily retrieve it, and though I knew > that I had participated in it my profile history only showed posts thru the > end of 2010.
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
A while back, Massimo posted this: http://www.web2py.com/AlterEgo/default/show/271 Regarding taking advantage of "modern IDE" features, check out http://kollerie.wordpress.com/2009/04/07/setting-up-your-ide-for-web2py-development/ . Regarding unit tests for controllers, check out http://packages.python.org/web2py_utils/test_runner.html, http://web2py.com/AlterEgo/default/show/260, and http://www.web2py.com/AlterEgo/default/show/213 (also, see http://web2py.com/book/default/chapter/04#Execution-Environment regarding creating a web2py execution environment). Anthony On Monday, April 4, 2011 5:31:11 PM UTC-4, mikech wrote: > Agreed. Really can't argue with your point. And, anyone who is serious > enough about researching their options would find out > that these issues are never mentioned in this group, except when they are > made by people unfamiliar with the framework. So, > they are either non-issues or we're all involved with a huge Web2py > conspiracy :) That being said, it may be the care bear in me > but I like the idea of leaving hints for those who are asking the > questions. > > >
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
Agreed, I looked at all the usual suspects for a Python framework and came to the conclusion web2py was the best integrated of any and represented the path of least resistance to getting work done with well chosen defaults in the design and a well defined way of implementing applications. The admin functions helped a lot as well. Nothing since starting to work with web2py has changed my mind on the choice I made. I spent years in the land of Java before this so am familiar with working with databases from using an ORM down to writing my own SQL in JDBC. I like the DAL, close enough to the database that you don't lose sight of it in a slew of object mappings but far enough away from the drudgery of doing it all by yourself. The layering of the controllers and views over top is icing on the cake as they say, no reference to CakePHP intended. :-)
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
Agreed. Really can't argue with your point. And, anyone who is serious enough about researching their options would find out that these issues are never mentioned in this group, except when they are made by people unfamiliar with the framework. So, they are either non-issues or we're all involved with a huge Web2py conspiracy :) That being said, it may be the care bear in me but I like the idea of leaving hints for those who are asking the questions.
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
On Apr 4, 7:21 pm, mikech wrote: > I'd like to see some FAQ topics that can be pointed to on the usual FUD > about Web2py. Why even bother addressing the FUD? It is better to let others stew in their own FUD, while we concentrate on writing awesome applications. This has always been my view. FUD is the problem of those that produce it. It is not my problem what others may say. The fact of the matter is that web2py does a lot of work for the programmer. The proof is in the pudding as they say. People like myself who build web apps do not find detriment in the design decisions of web2py. So why should we care what people from the other frameworks are saying? We know our own mind.
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
Thanks all. I'm participating in the Linkedin conversation, and trying to redirect the questioners to places that these issues have already been adressed, rather than let the detractor's comments stand.
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
Also, there are options for what you are looking for: http://wingware.com/doc/howtos/web2py
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
Mikech, here's one thread: https://groups.google.com/d/topic/web2py/uIYf-dTjd88/discussion I guess it could be helpful to note that the framework design may impede certain development aspects such as IDE code-completion. "unjustified" is unjustified as the justification has been published several times and makes sense. Massimo, kind of a snarky, unhelpful response.
[web2py] Re: FAQ topic(s) on typical Web2py FUD
I too have lots of issues with searching google groups. On Apr 4, 12:21 pm, mikech wrote: > I'd like to see some FAQ topics that can be pointed to on the usual FUD > about Web2py. For instance: > > In web2py the code you write for the controller layer (views) goes into > files that are not Python modules because they don't include any imports to > give context to external identifiers. Web2py loads, compiles, and executes > those modules at runtime passing a global context using Python's exec() > function. That strange (and unjustified) way of doing things disables > important capabilities of modern IDEs (code completion, code hints, help, > static checking, refactoring) because those files are not Python modules. It > also makes it very difficult to write unit tests for the controller layer, > because the global runtime context of web2py cannot be mocked. > > I tried to look for the Google thread in which Massimo addressed these and > other issues, but the search didn't easily retrieve it, and though I knew > that I had participated in it my profile history only showed posts thru the > end of 2010.
