Re: Staying with WebObjects
Simon, I think you're right on it. It's just java now: install the Xcode tools (WO Frameworks--which you could put on any platform if you liked), download Eclipse (free/Java), download WOLips/WOnder (free/ Java) and then you can deploy on Linux/Tomcat/etc. (free/Java). I'm on OSX so the multi-platform development I'm not 100% sure about but I think it should work. The deployment definitely works as we deploy now on Linux/Tomcat with no issues. On Apr 11, 2008, at 1:09 PM, Simon McLean wrote: I don't understand the platform issue given that the tools are now deprecated. WO is just plain old java isn't it ? what is there to support ? when the tools were around i could understand it. let's face it, they didn't want to support the tools on OSX, let alone any other platform :-) maybe someone from apple could shed some light on it ? (as another pig passes overhead... ;-)) Simon On 11 Apr 2008, at 18:00, Elim Qiu wrote: WO is cool once you did something by using 20+% of its power. But this is only from developer's view point. From manager point jof view: (1) small user group; (2) limited official develop/deploy plantform; (3) Nothing attractive enough non-technically; these should be enough reasons to leave WO Obviously if WO supports windows and linux, (2) will be gone and the user group will getting bigger. The efforts of porting WO to linux in classic and popular sense are quite successful: GnuSTEP, SOEP and WO-direct-transplanting. But not many win developers ever heard about WO. As long as EOF still quite alien to cocoa developers, WO will not be so attractive even to many apple developers. (So windows and objC are important to WO) Situation will not change too much if the strength of WO is only appreciated by WO developers. What if the following become standard and easily customizable/localizable *Affair Editor/Publisher for business managers to manage affairs (eg. events like conferences, sales, etc) *Content management tools for business people instead of developers *Survey Creator/Publisher/ResponseAnalyser for business analyser *Business Rule editor and generic executor for business rule maker I believe WO/EOF can help achieve the above much easier than other techs (some of my work shows the feasibility). That's why I'll not leave WO. ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/simon_mclean%40mac.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/jas35%40mac.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Leaving WebObjects
I think there are a few technology director types that would have an issue with #1 and #2, although I feel like they're easy to get through. Proprietary usually means expensive to get into and either unsupported or supported with significant costs (think back to the multi-processor deployment license cost and bronze-silver-gold Apple Enterprise Support packages). I think for it being relatively free now (included w/developer tools, free Eclipse, free WOLips, etc.) and the public support out there (like this list) you're still in good shape. For #2, you can certainly develop on Windows since it's just Eclipse/ Java right now. I just don't know too many developers that would actually want to use Windows to write code these days aside from .NET stuff. You could even deploy on Windows using something like Tomcat I believe--but again why not just use Linux and save even more? I know a few devs out there that prefer (even like) Windows so I say go for it if it's your thing. But here's the trick: WO sells itself. It's usually fewer devs, shorter time to deployment, fewer bugs and a much better designed application. Use your time for your product features and not on just getting it work. If you look at it from a time and cost standpoint it still makes a lot of sense. On Apr 8, 2008, at 5:02 PM, Robert B. Hanviriyapunt wrote: I can ask about WWDC08. The answer will probably be no since the decision was made quite a long time ago (hard to de-couple it right now tho, so it will definitely be a while). Still the 3 issues I mentioned aren't going away, are they? You probably addressed the 3rd, but 1 and 2 are unfortunately stuck in the minds of the technology directors. = Robert = On Apr 8, 2008, at 2:18 PM, Christian Trotobas wrote: Hello Robert, Any chance you or any from your company could attend the WOWODC this year ? http://www.wocommunity.org/wowodc08/ WO is more than alive, and getting new adopters. Today, I gave a short (45 mn) introduction to 9 young students from the engineer school in Sophia Antipolis (France); to my own surprise, they were more than receptive, impressed. Cheers, Christian Trotobas [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://intellicore.net Le 8 avr. 08 à 20:50, Robert B. Hanviriyapunt a écrit : For some time now, my company has been set on leaving WebObjects. We have been running WebObjects 5.2 on Windows servers. We haven't moved 100% yet, but my next project will be using JavaServer Faces. And another fairly new project will be using OpenLaszlo with our existing J2E back-end. Company's reasons for leaving: 1. WebObjects is proprietary 2. New versions of WebObjects is not supported on Windows 3. Perceived lack of knowledgeable WebObjects programmers (I'm in the Chicago suburbs -- Northbrook, IL, to be precise) We do NOT use: 1. Xcode/WebObjects tools [Xcode or WOBuilder or EOModeler] (except for me on a MacBook Pro -- only because I requested it) 2. EOF 3. WONDER 4. Servlet container (which I do not prefer anyway) I personally enjoy WebObjects development and wish that WebObjects would be more palatable to companies such as mine. Please excuse the ranting, but I want someone at Apple to know that as great as WebObjects technology is [I personally think it is the BEST I've seen anywhere], it is losing ground because if it's lack in thet top 3 items mentioned. I wish so bad that Apple would do something about it. I'm guessing people's response will be: Don't hold your breath. Pity. :( = Robert = ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/trotobas%40mac.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/jas35%40mac.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Leaving WebObjects
IMO, there's no excuse for somebody saying there aren't any good WO developers to hire these days. I know of several who are working on J2EE stuff that would gladly jump to a WO project if one came up. I'm more than happy to be working in WO now, I actually think it's much better now than just a few years ago. At least I feel like there's more WO going on these days (I actually got a WO call from a recruiter the other day, yikes!) Don't give up WO because of all these reasons--do what I do and show them that WO is better for all the right reasons and make them come around. There are lots of reasons to stick with it. On Apr 8, 2008, at 5:46 PM, Andrew Lindesay wrote: 3. Perceived lack of knowledgeable WebObjects programmers (I'm in the Chicago suburbs -- Northbrook, IL, to be precise) ... Perhaps they've not been paying attention to the mailings lists. (specifically: webobjects-dev, wonder-disc, woproject-dev). ... I think they meant lack of unemployed, knowledgeable WebObjects programmers. Most (all?) of us are gainfully employed most of the time. Good WO developers are a little hard to find. I'm having a lull at the moment if anybody wants to discuss anything... :) cheers. ___ Andrew Lindesay www.lindesay.co.nz ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/jas35%40mac.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: WO 5.4 Linux Deployment
FWIW, I'm getting the java name not found in context as well and I haven't figure out a way around getting the messages either including specifying my data source in the web.xml. Doesn't seem to hurt anything but it does clog up the log file. On Apr 2, 2008, at 10:34 AM, Aleksey Novicov wrote: Yes, I will post what I've learned on the WO wiki as soon as I think I have everything worked out. Aleksey On Apr 2, 2008, at 2:05 AM, Andrew Lindesay wrote: Hello Aleksey; It would be really great if you could write-up your experiences an tips in the WO wiki for others to read about. http://wiki.objectstyle.org/confluence/display/WO/Home 4. For the static resources to be served correctly via port 80 of the Apache web server (as opposed to Tomcat's port 8080), I had to install the Tomcat-Apache plugin, mod_jk. Actually Apache 2.2 has AJP support built-in as well as a neat little balancer web app to monitor the deploy. I have some unrelated, but possibly helpful notes on the Apache 2.2 setup for this in this document; http://homepage.mac.com/andrewlindesay/le/manuals/lewostuff/LEWOStuffOverview.pdf See 9.5 and 9.6. I find the Apache 2.2 balancer setup much more elegant than mod_jk. 5. In the Tomcat log file (catalina.out), I keep getting an exception (below) related to JDBC but everything runs fine regardless (I'm using MySQL). Tomcat seems to have it's own data source mechanism I think I read something about that in an old mailing list post. I think you need to give the data source the same name as the model or something -- perhaps somebody can clarify? cheers. ___ Andrew Lindesay www.lindesay.co.nz ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/jas35%40mac.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Strange servlet behaviour with WOSession subclass
Hi All, Just a quick question for anyone out there deploying with Tomcat WAR files. I have an existing application that runs fine under the standard WO deployment on Xserve (10.4/WO5.3) and I've spend the last week or so getting it into 10.5/Eclipse/WOLips so that I can deploy to Tomcat/Linux. Both running Sun Java 1.5. Using the latest Eclipse/ WOLips on 10.5 along with the latest 5.4 WO. The really crazy thing is that although it compiles and runs fine in my Eclipse/WOLips dev environment, once it gets to the servlet container (via a .war file) it complains about not being able to find my keys/methods/instance vars in Session. They're certainly in there, so before I go tearing through the app to debug, has anyone seen anything like this during servlet/war deployment? My bindings are of the session.keyname type and I believe it's actually trying to use WOSession instead of my subclass. Thanks for any help or points in the right direction!! Jeff ___ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
