Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Michael Peel

On 18 Mar 2009, at 19:51, Cary Bass wrote:

>>
>> If it is, there is a minor issue - is he a member? If not, he's not
>> actually welcome at the AGM without an official invite! (It's a
>> minor formality, but the board should actually invite him if he's
>> going to come.)
>
> Will you kick me out if I show up too? :-)
>
> Cary

I don't think there'll be any kicking out, unless anyone becomes  
disruptive. I think it'd be great if you could turn up, Cary.

Mike

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Gift Aid update

2009-03-18 Thread Thomas Dalton
2009/3/18 AndrewRT :
> On Mar 18, 12:54 pm, "joseph seddon "
>  wrote:
>> I think that making preparations for both drafting a complaint to HMRC and 
>> preparing an application to CC should start now. Even if the preparations 
>> are only minor. Delaying either by any real length of time could affect 
>> Wikimania significantly.
>
> I agree entirely. Complaint letter has already been drafted and will
> hopefully go out tomorrow. I think the CC application should be ready
> to be put in the post the day after we win Wikimania? Even better,
> anyone know a benefactor willing to give us £4,700? Or a few to give
> us £1,000 each? They can even earmark it to whatever they want, just
> so we get the income to qualify!

You may have to wait a little after we win the bid in order to get
confirmed sponsorships - CC will almost certainly want written
confirmation (unconditionally, that is - what we have at the moment is
all conditional on us winning the bid). If the current board has time
to do it, starting work on the CC application now wouldn't hurt.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Gift Aid update

2009-03-18 Thread AndrewRT
On Mar 18, 12:54 pm, "joseph seddon "
 wrote:
> I think that making preparations for both drafting a complaint to HMRC and 
> preparing an application to CC should start now. Even if the preparations are 
> only minor. Delaying either by any real length of time could affect Wikimania 
> significantly.

I agree entirely. Complaint letter has already been drafted and will
hopefully go out tomorrow. I think the CC application should be ready
to be put in the post the day after we win Wikimania? Even better,
anyone know a benefactor willing to give us £4,700? Or a few to give
us £1,000 each? They can even earmark it to whatever they want, just
so we get the income to qualify!

Andrew

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[Wikimediauk-l] non-members at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread AndrewRT
On Mar 18, 8:19 pm, Thomas Dalton  wrote:
> 2009/3/18 Tom Holden :
>
> > To clarify (if it needed it), this was discussed at the board meeting this
> > week and we decided non-members are perfectly welcome to attend.
>
> Ok, a general invitation is fine (I've found the discussion in the IRC
> log, but I can't see it in the minutes - all decisions need to be
> minuted),

Good point - I've revised the minutes to add this in.

> but you'll need to give some thought to how you are going to
> conduct the meeting. I can see two options - separate seating areas
> for members and non-members, or voting cards. (If we have a very small
> turnout we can just rely on the chair knowing who is and isn't a
> member, but hopefully we'll get more people than that!)

Yes, we do. As will come clear when the notice is sent out (hopefully
Friday) most of the meeting will be informal talks, discussions and
presentations. The distinction between member and non-members will not
be an issue here. This also applies to the hustings. The formal part
where the distinction matetrs will probably only last about 30
minutes.

Voting for the Board will probably be entirely in paper form. I
imagine members who haven't already voted electronically will be given
a paper ballot paper to fill in and they will be counted by hand.

Voting for the resolutions will probably be a mixture of a show of
hands plus the electronic votes. In this case, the chair needs to make
sure he can distinguish between members and non-members. If the result
is at all close, the tellers will have to organise a paper vote.
Obviously we won't know till we get there, but I could see this
happening with your resolution but all the others will probably be
clear majorities.

> I know some people think I am being overly formal and strict about
> this kind of stuff, but the AGM of a limited company, particularly a
> charitable one, is a serious event and needs to be handled properly.
> This isn't just a bunch of people from the internet getting together
> for a pint and a chat about what we're going to do, it's an official
> meeting of the membership if a charitable company.

Indeed! No harm in doing things correctly.

Andrew

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread AndrewRT
I sent out a message telling everyone in the facebook group that the
AGM was happening and inviting them to the facebook "event". Jimbo
replied saying yes he was coming. I've messaged him to say did he
really mean that or did he press the wrong button, and if he does,
will he give us a talk.

I'll let you know what he says in response!

On Mar 18, 1:12 pm, "Brian McNeil" 
wrote:
> Then ask Jimbo: jwa...@wikimedia.org
>
> Not so painful?
>
> Brian.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wikimediauk-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org
>
> [mailto:wikimediauk-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of joseph
> seddon
> Sent: 18 March 2009 14:03
> To: wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM
>
> This point I quickly mentioned on irc earlier in the week but noone could
> confirm it.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Gordon Joly 
> Sent: 18 March 2009 12:58
> To: wikimediau...@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM
>
>  According to Facebook, Jimbo will be at the AGM.
>
>  Is this true?
>
>  Gordo
>
>  --
>  "Think Feynman"/http://pobox.com/~gordo/
>  gordon.j...@pobox.com///
>
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread David Gerard
2009/3/18 Thomas Dalton :
> 2009/3/18 joseph seddon :

>> I think having two areas is a good idea plus voting cards to avoid
>> confusion.
>> Discussion amoungst members should be as free flowing as possible but
>> directed
>> by the chair. If non-members wish to add to the discussion, they must be
>> recognised
>> by the chair to be able to make a comment.

> We need to be careful with voting, but I think we can just make it up
> as we go along with discussion. If some people are hogging the floor,
> particularly non-members, then the chair can intervene and start
> directing who can speak when, but if everything is going fine with
> free-form discussion we might as well let non-members join in.


I'd suggest getting the meeting bit over with expeditiously (as long
as needed but not a moment longer), with someone saying "Non-members
are welcome to observe, but please don't interrupt. Could members come
over here please ..."


- d.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Thomas Dalton
2009/3/18 joseph seddon :
> I think having two areas is a good idea plus voting cards to avoid
> confusion.
> Discussion amoungst members should be as free flowing as possible but
> directed
> by the chair. If non-members wish to add to the discussion, they must be
> recognised
> by the chair to be able to make a comment.

We need to be careful with voting, but I think we can just make it up
as we go along with discussion. If some people are hogging the floor,
particularly non-members, then the chair can intervene and start
directing who can speak when, but if everything is going fine with
free-form discussion we might as well let non-members join in.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread joseph seddon

I think having two areas is a good idea plus voting cards to avoid confusion. 

Discussion amoungst members should be as free flowing as possible but directed 

by the chair. If non-members wish to add to the discussion, they must be 
recognised 

by the chair to be able to make a comment.

 
> Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 20:19:23 +
> From: thomas.dal...@gmail.com
> To: wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM
> 
> 2009/3/18 Tom Holden :
> > To clarify (if it needed it), this was discussed at the board meeting this
> > week and we decided non-members are perfectly welcome to attend.
> 
> Ok, a general invitation is fine (I've found the discussion in the IRC
> log, but I can't see it in the minutes - all decisions need to be
> minuted), but you'll need to give some thought to how you are going to
> conduct the meeting. I can see two options - separate seating areas
> for members and non-members, or voting cards. (If we have a very small
> turnout we can just rely on the chair knowing who is and isn't a
> member, but hopefully we'll get more people than that!)
> 
> I know some people think I am being overly formal and strict about
> this kind of stuff, but the AGM of a limited company, particularly a
> charitable one, is a serious event and needs to be handled properly.
> This isn't just a bunch of people from the internet getting together
> for a pint and a chat about what we're going to do, it's an official
> meeting of the membership if a charitable company.
> 
> ___
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Thomas Dalton
2009/3/18 Tom Holden :
> To clarify (if it needed it), this was discussed at the board meeting this
> week and we decided non-members are perfectly welcome to attend.

Ok, a general invitation is fine (I've found the discussion in the IRC
log, but I can't see it in the minutes - all decisions need to be
minuted), but you'll need to give some thought to how you are going to
conduct the meeting. I can see two options - separate seating areas
for members and non-members, or voting cards. (If we have a very small
turnout we can just rely on the chair knowing who is and isn't a
member, but hopefully we'll get more people than that!)

I know some people think I am being overly formal and strict about
this kind of stuff, but the AGM of a limited company, particularly a
charitable one, is a serious event and needs to be handled properly.
This isn't just a bunch of people from the internet getting together
for a pint and a chat about what we're going to do, it's an official
meeting of the membership if a charitable company.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Al Tally
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 7:54 PM, Tom Holden  wrote:

> To clarify (if it needed it), this was discussed at the board meeting this
> week and we decided non-members are perfectly welcome to attend.
>
> Tom
>

Good. I do intend to join at some point, just not at this moment :) I still
maintain an interest in it nonetheless.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Tom Holden
To clarify (if it needed it), this was discussed at the board meeting this
week and we decided non-members are perfectly welcome to attend.

Tom

> -Original Message-
> From: wikimediauk-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:wikimediauk-l-
> boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Thomas Dalton
> Sent: 18 March 2009 19:55
> To: wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM
> 
> 2009/3/18 Thomas Dalton :
> > 2009/3/18 Al Tally :
> >> I'm not a member, but I intend to go. Will I get kicked out?
> >
> > Why aren't you a member? I can't see why anybody would be interested
> > in going to the AGM without wanting to join...
> 
> PS Other than people coming to give a talk, that is.
> 
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Al Tally
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 7:53 PM, Thomas Dalton wrote:

> 2009/3/18 Al Tally :
> > I'm not a member, but I intend to go. Will I get kicked out?
>
> Why aren't you a member? I can't see why anybody would be interested
> in going to the AGM without wanting to join...
>

I've simply been far too busy to think of things like this. I'm also not
made of money! I'd really like a good reason to part with my money. I'm
still totally uncertain as to what Wikimedia UK is actually for...

The reason why I am interested is I think it would nice to be there, as I am
so close anyway, and to see the board in person.

If this is not acceptable, I can always save £3 bus fare and stay at home :)

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Thomas Dalton
2009/3/18 Thomas Dalton :
> 2009/3/18 Al Tally :
>> I'm not a member, but I intend to go. Will I get kicked out?
>
> Why aren't you a member? I can't see why anybody would be interested
> in going to the AGM without wanting to join...

PS Other than people coming to give a talk, that is.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Thomas Dalton
2009/3/18 Al Tally :
> I'm not a member, but I intend to go. Will I get kicked out?

Why aren't you a member? I can't see why anybody would be interested
in going to the AGM without wanting to join...

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Thomas Dalton
2009/3/18 Cary Bass :
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Thomas Dalton wrote:
>> 2009/3/18 Gordon Joly :
>>> According to Facebook, Jimbo will be at the AGM.
>>>
>>> Is this true?
>>
>> If it is, there is a minor issue - is he a member? If not, he's not
>> actually welcome at the AGM without an official invite! (It's a
>> minor formality, but the board should actually invite him if he's
>> going to come.)
>
> Will you kick me out if I show up too? :-)

There's a simple way to avoid that - just join!

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Al Tally
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 7:51 PM, Cary Bass  wrote:

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Thomas Dalton wrote:
> > 2009/3/18 Gordon Joly :
> >> According to Facebook, Jimbo will be at the AGM.
> >>
> >> Is this true?
> >
> > If it is, there is a minor issue - is he a member? If not, he's not
> > actually welcome at the AGM without an official invite! (It's a
> > minor formality, but the board should actually invite him if he's
> > going to come.)
>
> Will you kick me out if I show up too? :-)
>
> Cary
>

I'm not a member, but I intend to go. Will I get kicked out?

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Cary Bass
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Thomas Dalton wrote:
> 2009/3/18 Gordon Joly :
>> According to Facebook, Jimbo will be at the AGM.
>>
>> Is this true?
>
> If it is, there is a minor issue - is he a member? If not, he's not
> actually welcome at the AGM without an official invite! (It's a
> minor formality, but the board should actually invite him if he's
> going to come.)

Will you kick me out if I show up too? :-)

Cary
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] BBC and Wikipedia - a thought

2009-03-18 Thread Thomas Dalton
2009/3/18 Steve Bowbrick :
> Question: would it be appropriate for one or more BBC people with an
> interest in collaboration to come along to the AGM? If so, should we
> bring a formal contribution or just sit quietly at the back? If not, is
> there a more appropriate forum we could get involved with?

It's not my decision, but I would very much support the BBC giving a
presentation at the AGM. There has been talk of trying to find someone
to give a talk in order to break up the monotony of the official
business we need to get through, and I think someone from the BBC
could fill that role perfectly. A presentation from you followed by an
open floor discussion could be extremely productive.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] BBC and Wikipedia - a thought

2009-03-18 Thread Paul Williams
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 3:00 PM, Steve Bowbrick wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> This is my first post here. I've been responsible for some discussion at
> the BBC about a possible contribution to the Wikipedia project from the
> BBC - I think it's come up on the list too. There's no hard proposal or
> plan, just an ongoing discussion of the appropriate relationship of a
> national public service content creator and the leading free knowledge
> source on the net.
>
> There's been some discussion of a 'BBC Wikipedia Club' for wannabe
> contributors/editors who work at the BBC, about more formally gifting
> content to Wikipedia and - more ambitiously - about hiring a 'Social
> Media Editor' to manage the corporation's relationship with Wikipedia
> and other open media sources.
>
> Question: would it be appropriate for one or more BBC people with an
> interest in collaboration to come along to the AGM? If so, should we
> bring a formal contribution or just sit quietly at the back? If not, is
> there a more appropriate forum we could get involved with?
>
> Steve
>
> Some relevant blog posts here:
> http://commonplatform.co.uk/index.php/2009/01/09/the-bbc-should-engage-w
> ith-wikipedia/
> http://commonplatform.co.uk/index.php/2009/01/12/more-on-the-bbc-and-wik
> ipedia/
> http://commonplatform.co.uk/index.php/2008/11/14/matt-mcdonnell-and-sear
> ch-as-a-gateway-to-the-bbc/
>
> --
> Editor, BBC Radio 4 Blog http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/radio4
> 07768 257 570
>
>


Hi Steve et all,

Speaking as a member of Wikimedia UK, I think this would be a fantastic
contribution to the AGM and a great start to what can hopefully be a
prosperous and fulfilling relationship between the two parties, both for
Wikimedia UK's activities and the Wikimedia's activities as a whole.

-- 
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[Wikimediauk-l] BBC and Wikipedia - a thought

2009-03-18 Thread Steve Bowbrick
Hi everyone,

This is my first post here. I've been responsible for some discussion at
the BBC about a possible contribution to the Wikipedia project from the
BBC - I think it's come up on the list too. There's no hard proposal or
plan, just an ongoing discussion of the appropriate relationship of a
national public service content creator and the leading free knowledge
source on the net. 

There's been some discussion of a 'BBC Wikipedia Club' for wannabe
contributors/editors who work at the BBC, about more formally gifting
content to Wikipedia and - more ambitiously - about hiring a 'Social
Media Editor' to manage the corporation's relationship with Wikipedia
and other open media sources.

Question: would it be appropriate for one or more BBC people with an
interest in collaboration to come along to the AGM? If so, should we
bring a formal contribution or just sit quietly at the back? If not, is
there a more appropriate forum we could get involved with?

Steve

Some relevant blog posts here:
http://commonplatform.co.uk/index.php/2009/01/09/the-bbc-should-engage-w
ith-wikipedia/
http://commonplatform.co.uk/index.php/2009/01/12/more-on-the-bbc-and-wik
ipedia/
http://commonplatform.co.uk/index.php/2008/11/14/matt-mcdonnell-and-sear
ch-as-a-gateway-to-the-bbc/

--
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07768 257 570

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Paul Williams
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 1:58 PM, Thomas Dalton wrote:

> 2009/3/18 Gordon Joly :
> >
> > According to Facebook, Jimbo will be at the AGM.
> >
> > Is this true?
>
> If it is, there is a minor issue - is he a member? If not, he's not
> actually welcome at the AGM without an official invite! (It's a minor
> formality, but the board should actually invite him if he's going to
> come.)


Oh come on... :P


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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Thomas Dalton
2009/3/18 Gordon Joly :
>
> According to Facebook, Jimbo will be at the AGM.
>
> Is this true?

If it is, there is a minor issue - is he a member? If not, he's not
actually welcome at the AGM without an official invite! (It's a minor
formality, but the board should actually invite him if he's going to
come.)

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Gift Aid update

2009-03-18 Thread Thomas Dalton
2009/3/18 joseph seddon :
> I think that making preparations for both drafting a complaint to HMRC and 
> preparing an application to CC should start now. Even if the preparations are 
> only minor. Delaying either by any real length of time could affect Wikimania 
> significantly.
>
> Our estimates for the venue are based on having charity status and bookings 
> need to happen in quick sucession to winning the bid. If we can start making 
> preparations now it may also alleviate any concerns that the jury/public may 
> have with this.

We are a charity now, just an exempt one that doesn't have tax-free
status. I agree it is something we need to work on ASAP, though -
perhaps something for after the AGM, however, since I think the
current board are rather busy!

If we win the bid, there are all kinds of legal stuff we'll have to
sort out - if everything will be done through us (rather than WMF),
which I think is likely, we will need to open a trading subsidiary. I
think the business risk of hosting Wikimania is too great for a
charity to do it directly. (We'll worry about that after we win,
though!)

PS I am thinking of adding another £10k to the budget for admin,
though - there will be lots of legal fees and accounting fees, at
least some of which should be allocated to Wikimania (some can be
considered general expenses and paid for out of the main WM UK
accounts). Hopefully we can get it done pro-bono, but it should
probably be on the budget.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Brian McNeil
Then ask Jimbo: jwa...@wikimedia.org

Not so painful?


Brian.

-Original Message-
From: wikimediauk-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org
[mailto:wikimediauk-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of joseph
seddon 
Sent: 18 March 2009 14:03
To: wikimediau...@wikimedia.org 
Subject: Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

This point I quickly mentioned on irc earlier in the week but noone could
confirm it.

-Original Message-
From: Gordon Joly 
Sent: 18 March 2009 12:58
To: wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Subject: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM


 According to Facebook, Jimbo will be at the AGM.

 Is this true?

 Gordo

 --
 "Think Feynman"/
http://pobox.com/~gordo/
 gordon.j...@pobox.com///

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread joseph seddon
This point I quickly mentioned on irc earlier in the week but noone could 
confirm it.

-Original Message-
From: Gordon Joly 
Sent: 18 March 2009 12:58
To: wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Subject: [Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM


 According to Facebook, Jimbo will be at the AGM.

 Is this true?

 Gordo

 --
 "Think Feynman"/
http://pobox.com/~gordo/
 gordon.j...@pobox.com///

 ___
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 wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
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 WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org


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[Wikimediauk-l] Jimbo at the AGM

2009-03-18 Thread Gordon Joly

According to Facebook, Jimbo will be at the AGM.

Is this true?

Gordo

-- 
"Think Feynman"/
http://pobox.com/~gordo/
gordon.j...@pobox.com///

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Gift Aid update

2009-03-18 Thread joseph seddon
I think that making preparations for both drafting a complaint to HMRC and 
preparing an application to CC should start now. Even if the preparations are 
only minor. Delaying either by any real length of time could affect Wikimania 
significantly. 

Our estimates for the venue are based on having charity status and bookings 
need to happen in quick sucession to winning the bid. If we can start making 
preparations now it may also alleviate any concerns that the jury/public may 
have with this. 

Joseph Seddon

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