Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fwd: Funding Opportunity: Google launch the Global Impact Challenge

[Thomas Dalton]

On 26 March 2013 21:35, Gordon Joly  wrote:
>
> Indeed
>
>
>
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room

I've always considered that a pretty stupid thought experiment. The
beauty of language is that it allows you to communicate new ideas by
combining known ones. The instruction book in the room would need to
be practically infinite. If you have a book that big, then I'm happy
to fudge the definition of "understand" such that the book
"understands" the language - the definition won't be any less useful
for it.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fwd: Funding Opportunity: Google launch the Global Impact Challenge

[Gordon Joly]

On 26/03/13 18:24, Thomas Dalton wrote:

On 26 March 2013 13:53, Harry Burt  wrote:

IMHO the idea of translation "hints" embedded into Wikipedia articles is a
better one. I'm not sure it's going to be possible to construct a pitch for
as complex a project as that within a short amount of time however; it may
even require a new web standard.

It could possibly be done using existing standards for the Semantic
Web (as little used as they are!). Making text machine-translatable is
basically the same job as making it machine-readable - translation
errors happen because the computer doesn't know what the words
actually mean and it is meaning you need to translate, not words.



Indeed




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room

Gordo

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fwd: Funding Opportunity: Google launch the Global Impact Challenge

[WereSpielChequers]

On 26 March 2013 13:55, Andy Mabbett  wrote:

> On 26 March 2013 08:45, WereSpielChequers 
> wrote:
> > Taking things to the logical next step, we could introduce a system of
> > hidden templates to resolve words with multiple meanings such as bonnet,
> > bolt, batter, tramp or pants. As well as transforming the quality of
> machine
> > translation of the pedia, this would also make it easier to offer people
> a
> > choice as to which version of English they view Wikipedia in.
>
> I've tried to introduce this previously, for example for species names
> ("Parus major" should not become "Parus mayor", when the
> English-language page it's on is translated into German.
>
> The template was deleted:
> <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Templates_for_deletion/Log/2008_September_16#Template:Biota
> >
>
> There's a version in my userspace if you wish to examine it:
> 
>
> --
> Andy Mabbett
> @pigsonthewing
> http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
>
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I think that one key enabling change here will be the visual editor. Once
we can edit without seeing templates then maybe the community will accept
an increased use of templates, especially ones that work behind the scenes
and aren't visible to the reader.

WSC
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fwd: Funding Opportunity: Google launch the Global Impact Challenge

[Thomas Dalton]

On 26 March 2013 13:53, Harry Burt  wrote:
> IMHO the idea of translation "hints" embedded into Wikipedia articles is a
> better one. I'm not sure it's going to be possible to construct a pitch for
> as complex a project as that within a short amount of time however; it may
> even require a new web standard.

It could possibly be done using existing standards for the Semantic
Web (as little used as they are!). Making text machine-translatable is
basically the same job as making it machine-readable - translation
errors happen because the computer doesn't know what the words
actually mean and it is meaning you need to translate, not words.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fwd: Funding Opportunity: Google launch the Global Impact Challenge

[Andy Mabbett]

On 26 March 2013 08:45, WereSpielChequers  wrote:
> Taking things to the logical next step, we could introduce a system of
> hidden templates to resolve words with multiple meanings such as bonnet,
> bolt, batter, tramp or pants. As well as transforming the quality of machine
> translation of the pedia, this would also make it easier to offer people a
> choice as to which version of English they view Wikipedia in.

I've tried to introduce this previously, for example for species names
("Parus major" should not become "Parus mayor", when the
English-language page it's on is translated into German.

The template was deleted:


There's a version in my userspace if you wish to examine it:


--
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fwd: Funding Opportunity: Google launch the Global Impact Challenge

[Harry Burt]

Incidentally, it's worth noting that Google Translate is already
crowdsourced to an extent.

IMHO the idea of translation "hints" embedded into Wikipedia articles is a
better one. I'm not sure it's going to be possible to construct a pitch for
as complex a project as that within a short amount of time however; it may
even require a new web standard.

Harry

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fwd: Funding Opportunity: Google launch the Global Impact Challenge

[Thomas Dalton]

On 26 March 2013 09:45, WereSpielChequers  wrote:
> ... If Google were willing to work with us ...

It's a great idea, but that "if" is pretty fundamental. We would need
to get buy-in from Google as a partner in the project before we could
apply for the grant. It wouldn't surprise me if Google loved the idea,
but it might be difficult to develop the idea enough in the 22 days
remaining to get a grant application in.

There is, of course, no reason why we can't develop the idea, talk to
Google and then get funding from elsewhere (or perhaps just from
Google Translate's budget). The key point I've been trying to make in
this thread is that you should have good ideas and then go looking for
funding, not the other way around.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Audio stream of 23 March event

[Richard Symonds]

I'm downloading it at the moment. It's a 1.5 hour audio file in m4a format.
Audio quality is sort of... telephone quality. Not bad, a bit echoey. It
would be good to get it to Commons.

Richard Symonds
Wikimedia UK
0207 065 0992

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.
United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia
movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who
operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control
over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*


On 23 March 2013 22:56, Michael Peel  wrote:

> Hi Richard,
>
> Many thanks for setting up the livestreaming for today's event. I don't
> know how Awdio works - does it keep a copy of the broadcast, or does it
> just live-broadcast the audio without keeping a record? If the former,
> would it be possible to upload a copy of the record to Commons? It would be
> a valuable record of a good and useful event if so.
>
> Thanks,
> Mike
>
> On 22 Mar 2013, at 18:03, Richard Symonds <
> richard.symo...@wikimedia.org.uk> wrote:
>
> All,
>
> Just to let you know that tomorrow's event will be livestreamed (audio
> only) at
> http://www.awdio.com/wikimedia-uk/d63e-the-future-of-wikimedia-uk_35945.html
> .
>
> All the best,
>
> Richard Symonds
> Wikimedia UK
> 0207 065 0992
> Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
> Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
> Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.
> United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia
> movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who
> operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).
> *Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control
> over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
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[Wikimediauk-l] Call for content: Wikimedia UK monthly report - February 2013

[Stevie Benton]

Hello everyone,

This is a last call for content for the Wikimedia UK monthly report for
February 2013. If you've any news or content you'd like to share in the
report please do so here.
I'm going to publish the report on Thursday.

Thank you,

Stevie
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Communications Organiser
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 20 7065 0993 / +44 (0) 7803 505 173
@StevieBenton

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England
and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513.
Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street,
London EC2A 4LT. United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a
global Wikimedia movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the
Wikimedia Foundation (who operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal
control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fwd: Funding Opportunity: Google launch the Global Impact Challenge

[Gordon Joly]

On 26/03/13 08:45, WereSpielChequers wrote:


Taking things to the logical next step, we could introduce a system of 
hidden templates to resolve words with multiple meanings such as 
bonnet, bolt, batter, tramp or pants. As well as transforming the 
quality of machine translation of the pedia, this would also make it 
easier to offer people a choice as to which version of English they 
view Wikipedia in.


Hmmm.. sounds like a natural language research project.

How about a crowd sourced translation engine? Using OTRS?


Gordo


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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fwd: Funding Opportunity: Google launch the Global Impact Challenge

[WereSpielChequers]

Making the English Wikipedia more accessible to non-English speakers is a
worthy objective and something which we could easily make a big difference
to. Currently the main route for non-English speakers to access EN wiki is
via Google translate and similar online translation services. If Google
were willing to work with us, we could make an easy and uncontentious
difference to that by getting lists of translation anomalies and where
practical amending the Wikipedia article. I've been doing this on a small
scale for years working my way though easily confused words like
staring/starring and cavalry/calvary. It is now far less common to have
Wikipedia articles about actors staring in particular movies or calvary
armies charging into battle, and as for the throwing of discusses I've
abolished an entire Olympic sport. My understanding of translation software
is that it works on a probability basis, so if we were to get lists of
articles and phrases on EN wiki that a particular translation software
finds to be ambiguous and can only give a borderline probability to, we
should be able to identify a lot of ambiguities and errors on EN wiki;.
Fixing these would benefit all editors but particularly those who depend on
translation software.

Taking things to the logical next step, we could introduce a system of
hidden templates to resolve words with multiple meanings such as bonnet,
bolt, batter, tramp or pants. As well as transforming the quality of
machine translation of the pedia, this would also make it easier to offer
people a choice as to which version of English they view Wikipedia in.

Working in the opposite direction would be more contentious due to
licensing, in fact I doubt we could help any translation software improve
its own code unless they had a compatible license. I'd also be loathe to
see us work with one set of machine translation software in a way that gave
them an advantage over their competitord

WSC

On 25 March 2013 21:43, rexx  wrote:

> The most impact that we could realise on a global scale would be to make
> the knowledge in the English Wikipedia available to people who don't speak
> English. £500,000 and Google technical support would go a long way to
> realising some of that goal.
>
> As the largest established chapter in the English-speaking world, the onus
> should probably fall on us to coordinate an effort of that sort.
>
> Thoughts?
> --
> Doug
>
>
>
> On 25 March 2013 12:20, Thomas Dalton  wrote:
>
>> I agree, it is interesting and we do desperately need to diversify our
>> revenue. Do we have any suitable projects we've been wanting to run
>> but haven't due to lack of funds, though? Funds haven't really been
>> our limiting factor.
>>
>> The VLE work might be suitable, but I doubt Google would consider it
>> interesting enough (it's useful, but it isn't really transformative).
>>
>> Coming up with new projects specifically to apply for a particular
>> grant is generally a bad idea.
>>
>> On 25 March 2013 10:21, Jon Davies  wrote:
>> >
>> > Interesting
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Dear Jon,
>> >
>> > Today Google launched the Global Impact Challenge. Over the past few
>> > months ACEVO has been working very closely with Google and think that
>> this
>> > game-changing award will celebrate the innovative work happening within
>> the
>> > sector. So we are inviting charities and voluntary organisations to
>> showcase
>> > how they would use technology to transform the lives of their
>> beneficiaries.
>> > The top four entries of the competition will each receive £500,000 and
>> > support to help their project become a reality. A team at Google will
>> > announce 10 finalists in mid-May and the public will be invited to vote
>> and
>> > donate to their favourite project.
>> >
>> > The prestigious panel judging the finalists will be inventor of the
>> > Internet Sir Tim Berners-Lee, Mogul Sir Richard Branson and founder and
>> CEO
>> > of Forster Communications Jilly Forster. It’s thrilling to know how
>> similar
>> > Google and ACEVO’s approach is in celebrating innovation - I feel that
>> this
>> > is the start of a great corporate friendship.
>> >
>> > Applications opened today so apply here www.g.co/impactchallenge for
>> your
>> > chance win.
>> >
>> > Best wishes and good luck,
>> >
>> > Sir Stephen Bubb
>> > Chief Executive
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > If you would like to unsubscribe from this list, please click here
>> >
>> > Privacy Policy (Privacy Page)
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Jon Davies - Chief Executive Wikimedia UK.  Mobile (0044) 7803 505 169
>> > tweet @jonatreesdavies
>> >
>> > Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
>> > Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
>> > Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A
>> 4LT.
>> > United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia
>> > movement. The Wi