[Wikitech-l] MediaWiki's manual of style for occasional patch contributors

[Rainer Rillke]

We have a number of contributors who do prefer contributing through
web-interfaces or minimal installations to MediaWiki's code base. Often
they run -1 with MediaWiki's coding conventions and do not have the time
to set up commit hooks [1]. To save them some work re-indenting or
adding a space between braces, I have decided to expose the excellent
stylize.php from wikimedia tools-code-utils and js-beautifier as a web
service at WMF labs.

The result is a web interface:
http://tools.wmflabs.org/stylize/

If you find a security vulnerable in the source code[2], you get a
barnstar by me personally.

Happy coding and don't forget to recommend it when -1ing for whitespace
reasons!

-- Rillke


[1]
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Chemical_Markup_support_for_Wikimedia_Commons/Internship_Report/Stylize
[2] https://github.com/Rillke/stylize

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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Florian Schmidt]

e.g. you have to restart
your browser and are logged out in the process: all open tabs are
redirected to Special:Userlogin, and you have to log in a dozen times, 
or

manually edit URLs.


Is there any use case for this scenario why to have a login page when 
returnto/returntoquery is set and you are already logged in? My idea 
behind this: You have to reload the page in all cases (with redirect to 
login and without, with a reload using browser (F5 e.g.) or with a click 
on login on login page). So maybe the following implementation helps:
If you are already logged in and returnto/returntoquery is set, you will 
be redirect to the returnto location directly without the "you are 
already loggedin, login with another account" screen. So, to come back 
to your use case, you login in one tab and hit F5 to all other tabs and 
will be redirected to the pages you requested as a logged in user.


Just an idea :)

Kind regards
Florian

Am 2014-07-16 00:35, schrieb Gergo Tisza:
On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Tyler Romeo  
wrote:



Yes. Actually, that is existing functionality. Special:Userlogin will
redirect users
if the returnto (and optionally returntoquery) are specified. (The 
only

exception is if
a hook intervenes).



The other exception is when you are already logged in (in which case 
you

get a very confusing form telling you to log in as another user). This
change makes that behavior much more annoying when e.g. you have to 
restart

your browser and are logged out in the process: all open tabs are
redirected to Special:Userlogin, and you have to log in a dozen times, 
or

manually edit URLs.
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Strange mailing list behavior

[Jeremy Baron]

On Jul 16, 2014 1:42 AM, "Pine W"  wrote:
> When there are technical issues such as this email issue, Wikipedia pages
> not loading, and so on, is there a page or mailing list (ironic, I know)
> where alerts should be visible? I'm familiar with the IRC tech channel but
> I am hoping there is a webpage or mailing list that anyone could access
> through a desktop or mobile web browser.

This list, status.wikimedia.org, nagios web interface, and
#wikimedia-tech/#wikimedia-operations both have logs available by HTTP.
(usually they lag less than a second behind.)

If you follow the link to the page report you'll see it says this
particular service needs better nagios coverage.

oh, whoops, s/nagios/icinga/g :-)

-Jeremy
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Strange mailing list behavior

[Pine W]

Thank you very much.

When there are technical issues such as this email issue, Wikipedia pages
not loading, and so on, is there a page or mailing list (ironic, I know)
where alerts should be visible? I'm familiar with the IRC tech channel but
I am hoping there is a webpage or mailing list that anyone could access
through a desktop or mobile web browser.

Thanks,

Pine


On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 8:32 AM, Greg Grossmeier  wrote:

> Outage report:
>
> https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Incident_documentation/2014-07-14-Lists
>
> SPOILER: Should be better now.
>
> 
> > So this evening, besides my one email to Wikimedia-l that got through, 2
> > others disappeared into thin air. Also, I just received an email in my
> > Google account that was sent 11 hours ago. Can someone check for gremlins
> > in the mail system? The problem might be on Google's end or in the mail
> > system, I can't tell, but I suspect the mail system because mail sent to
> > non-list addresses seems to get through ok.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Pine
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
> --
> | Greg GrossmeierGPG: B2FA 27B1 F7EB D327 6B8E |
> | identi.ca: @gregA18D 1138 8E47 FAC8 1C7D |
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] logging out on one device logs user out everywhere

[Greg Grossmeier]

> I'd prefer that we did Google's system that, in addition to allowing a
> separate "sign out all other sessions" option, also allows users to monitor
> which IP addresses their account was accessed from (which however would be
> akin to self CheckUser and might run afoul of our privacy policy).

https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=27242
and
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:AccountInfo

-- 
| Greg GrossmeierGPG: B2FA 27B1 F7EB D327 6B8E |
| identi.ca: @gregA18D 1138 8E47 FAC8 1C7D |


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Re: [Wikitech-l] logging out on one device logs user out everywhere

[Jasper Deng]

I've actually found this to be a rather big pet peeve of mine w/
CentralAuth over the years. It would seem that logging out in CentralAuth
means deleting everything in the cache with the user's info in it.

I'd prefer that we did Google's system that, in addition to allowing a
separate "sign out all other sessions" option, also allows users to monitor
which IP addresses their account was accessed from (which however would be
akin to self CheckUser and might run afoul of our privacy policy).


On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 8:07 PM, Isarra Yos  wrote:

> On 16/07/14 02:50, Risker wrote:
>
>> On 15 July 2014 22:28, Steven Walling  wrote:
>>
>>  On Tuesday, July 15, 2014, Jon Robson  wrote:
>>>
>>>  (Forked from Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page)

 Is it time to revisit this behaviour? It's come up as being a usability
 problem a few times now.

 Currently if I log out of a public computer it logs me out of my tablet
 device,mobile device and home computer. :(

 See bug for reference [1]

 [1] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=49890

>>>
>>> Yes, this is terrible UX. Logging out or in should only apply to one
>>> device.
>>>
>>>
>>>  Or alternately have a "log out on this device/log out everywhere"
>> option.
>>
>
> Aye, they should be separated. The need to log out everywhere is a special
> case, but a potentially important one, as there are instances when users
> will want to forcibly log out devices they may not have direct access to
> (usually specifically because they don't have direct access to them). It's
> the sort of thing we'd want to have a special page/action for, but one
> that's not necessarily prominent - while the normal logout would be on
> every page, this would only be linked from the preferences, or something.
>
> -I
>
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] logging out on one device logs user out everywhere

[Isarra Yos]

On 16/07/14 02:50, Risker wrote:

On 15 July 2014 22:28, Steven Walling  wrote:


On Tuesday, July 15, 2014, Jon Robson  wrote:


(Forked from Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page)

Is it time to revisit this behaviour? It's come up as being a usability
problem a few times now.

Currently if I log out of a public computer it logs me out of my tablet
device,mobile device and home computer. :(

See bug for reference [1]

[1] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=49890


Yes, this is terrible UX. Logging out or in should only apply to one
device.



Or alternately have a "log out on this device/log out everywhere" option.


Aye, they should be separated. The need to log out everywhere is a 
special case, but a potentially important one, as there are instances 
when users will want to forcibly log out devices they may not have 
direct access to (usually specifically because they don't have direct 
access to them). It's the sort of thing we'd want to have a special 
page/action for, but one that's not necessarily prominent - while the 
normal logout would be on every page, this would only be linked from the 
preferences, or something.


-I

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Re: [Wikitech-l] logging out on one device logs user out everywhere

[Risker]

On 15 July 2014 22:28, Steven Walling  wrote:

> On Tuesday, July 15, 2014, Jon Robson  wrote:
>
> > (Forked from Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page)
> >
> > Is it time to revisit this behaviour? It's come up as being a usability
> > problem a few times now.
> >
> > Currently if I log out of a public computer it logs me out of my tablet
> > device,mobile device and home computer. :(
> >
> > See bug for reference [1]
> >
> > [1] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=49890
>
>
> Yes, this is terrible UX. Logging out or in should only apply to one
> device.
>
>

Or alternately have a "log out on this device/log out everywhere" option.

Risker/Anne
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Re: [Wikitech-l] logging out on one device logs user out everywhere

[Steven Walling]

On Tuesday, July 15, 2014, Jon Robson  wrote:

> (Forked from Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page)
>
> Is it time to revisit this behaviour? It's come up as being a usability
> problem a few times now.
>
> Currently if I log out of a public computer it logs me out of my tablet
> device,mobile device and home computer. :(
>
> See bug for reference [1]
>
> [1] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=49890


Yes, this is terrible UX. Logging out or in should only apply to one
device.


> On 15 Jul 2014 18:38, "Bryan Davis" >
> wrote:
>
> > On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 7:25 PM, Jon Robson  > wrote:
> > >> regularly.  I've found mediawiki logs me out despite the 'keep me
> > >> logged in' box, when logging out on a different device, etc.
> > > Well that's the bug then no and that should be fixed. Help us work out
> > why
> > > it is occurring and let's get that dealt with.:)
> > >
> > > We shouldn't be designing features for edge cases!
> >
> > Logout was discussed recently on the QA list [0]. The discussion lead
> > to Jon Robson pointing out bug 49890 [1] where Chris Steipp stated
> > that logout is global.
> >
> > [0]:https://www.mail-archive.com/qa@lists.wikimedia.org/msg01559.html
> > [1]: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=49890
> > --
> > Bryan Davis  Wikimedia Foundation >
> > [[m:User:BDavis_(WMF)]]  Sr Software EngineerBoise, ID USA
> > irc: bd808v:415.839.6885 x6855
> >
> > ___
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> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org 
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
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[Wikitech-l] logging out on one device logs user out everywhere

[Jon Robson]

(Forked from Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page)

Is it time to revisit this behaviour? It's come up as being a usability
problem a few times now.

Currently if I log out of a public computer it logs me out of my tablet
device,mobile device and home computer. :(

See bug for reference [1]

[1] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=49890
On 15 Jul 2014 18:38, "Bryan Davis"  wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 7:25 PM, Jon Robson  wrote:
> >> regularly.  I've found mediawiki logs me out despite the 'keep me
> >> logged in' box, when logging out on a different device, etc.
> > Well that's the bug then no and that should be fixed. Help us work out
> why
> > it is occurring and let's get that dealt with.:)
> >
> > We shouldn't be designing features for edge cases!
>
> Logout was discussed recently on the QA list [0]. The discussion lead
> to Jon Robson pointing out bug 49890 [1] where Chris Steipp stated
> that logout is global.
>
> [0]:https://www.mail-archive.com/qa@lists.wikimedia.org/msg01559.html
> [1]: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=49890
> --
> Bryan Davis  Wikimedia Foundation
> [[m:User:BDavis_(WMF)]]  Sr Software EngineerBoise, ID USA
> irc: bd808v:415.839.6885 x6855
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Bryan Davis]

On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 7:25 PM, Jon Robson  wrote:
>> regularly.  I've found mediawiki logs me out despite the 'keep me
>> logged in' box, when logging out on a different device, etc.
> Well that's the bug then no and that should be fixed. Help us work out why
> it is occurring and let's get that dealt with.:)
>
> We shouldn't be designing features for edge cases!

Logout was discussed recently on the QA list [0]. The discussion lead
to Jon Robson pointing out bug 49890 [1] where Chris Steipp stated
that logout is global.

[0]:https://www.mail-archive.com/qa@lists.wikimedia.org/msg01559.html
[1]: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=49890
-- 
Bryan Davis  Wikimedia Foundation
[[m:User:BDavis_(WMF)]]  Sr Software EngineerBoise, ID USA
irc: bd808v:415.839.6885 x6855

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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Jon Robson]

> regularly.  I've found mediawiki logs me out despite the 'keep me
> logged in' box, when logging out on a different device, etc.
Well that's the bug then no and that should be fixed. Help us work out why
it is occurring and let's get that dealt with.:)

We shouldn't be designing features for edge cases!
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Re: [Wikitech-l] git-review 1.24 broken?

[Matthew Flaschen]

On 07/10/2014 05:09 PM, John Mark Vandenberg wrote:

On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 2:36 AM, Adrian Lang  wrote:

On Thu, Jul 10, 2014 at 6:33 PM, Moriel Schottlender  wrote:

It seems that the native package doesn't work correctly. Or, if that's no
longer true, we should update the docs.


1.23-2 works great for me.


I was using the distro package of git review for both FC and Ubuntu
for a long time without issues, so I think our docs should be updated
to recommend that, and document any issues with (older) distro
versions.


Done at 
https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Gerrit/git-review&diff=1068642&oldid=1068048 
.


If you hit an issue and want to put it back, please note the details.

Matt Flaschen


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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[John Mark Vandenberg]

On Wed, Jul 16, 2014 at 8:46 AM, Jon Robson  wrote:
> This seems like a bit of an edge case. If you are worried about this
> then I would say you want to check the keep me logged in box...

For some of us power users, it will be an edge case we hit annoyingly
regularly.  I've found mediawiki logs me out despite the 'keep me
logged in' box, when logging out on a different device, etc.

Irrespective of that, instead of redirecting to Special:UserLogin, the
login box could appear, with the form submission being processed at
Special:UserLogin.  Crazy idea, I know, but lots of other software
does that.

Another approach, which IMO should be done as a fallback, is to use an
approach similar to 'action=edit&redlink=1' and 'redirect=no' to state
in the URL that the user doesnt want to login a second time, but would
like to be logged in and return to another page.  i.e.

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&returnto=Special%3AWatchlist&skipifloggedin=1

If they reload that URL while logged in, it wont ask for login.

This would be similar to the API assert=bot/user logic.

http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/API:Assert

-- 
John Vandenberg

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Re: [Wikitech-l] What should be the recommended / supported way to do skins? (A proposal.)

[Bartosz Dziewoński]

On Tue, 15 Jul 2014 16:38:52 +0200, Isarra Yos  wrote:


On 14/07/14 18:41, Jon Robson wrote:

I wonder if we should create a skin boilerplate repository, to make it
really easy for people to get started making their own skins?


Theoretically that's what the skins/Example repository should be for,  
but it seems to be empty at present.


Yes, it's on my to-do list. I'm planning to do this tomorrow.


--
Matma Rex

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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Jon Robson]

This seems like a bit of an edge case. If you are worried about this
then I would say you want to check the keep me logged in box...

On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 3:35 PM, Gergo Tisza  wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Tyler Romeo  wrote:
>
>> Yes. Actually, that is existing functionality. Special:Userlogin will
>> redirect users
>> if the returnto (and optionally returntoquery) are specified. (The only
>> exception is if
>> a hook intervenes).
>>
>
> The other exception is when you are already logged in (in which case you
> get a very confusing form telling you to log in as another user). This
> change makes that behavior much more annoying when e.g. you have to restart
> your browser and are logged out in the process: all open tabs are
> redirected to Special:Userlogin, and you have to log in a dozen times, or
> manually edit URLs.
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-- 
Jon Robson
* http://jonrobson.me.uk
* https://www.facebook.com/jonrobson
* @rakugojon

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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Gergo Tisza]

On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Tyler Romeo  wrote:

> Yes. Actually, that is existing functionality. Special:Userlogin will
> redirect users
> if the returnto (and optionally returntoquery) are specified. (The only
> exception is if
> a hook intervenes).
>

The other exception is when you are already logged in (in which case you
get a very confusing form telling you to log in as another user). This
change makes that behavior much more annoying when e.g. you have to restart
your browser and are logged out in the process: all open tabs are
redirected to Special:Userlogin, and you have to log in a dozen times, or
manually edit URLs.
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Re: [Wikitech-l] [Product] Winter, v. 0.6

[Amir Ladsgroup]

Dear Amir,
I set up wikitest RTL and added winter to it (but I don't know why the
winter doesn't connect to my database, I haven't checked it very carefully
to see how that's possible)
Anyway the RTL wiki is here: http://tools.wmflabs.org/wikitest-rtl/w/
and winter framework is accessible by this url:
http://tools.wmflabs.org/wikitest-rtl/w/winter/index.html?page=%D7%97%D7%95%D7%A8%D7%A3&lang=he

Best


On Wed, Jul 16, 2014 at 1:49 AM, Steven Walling 
wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 2:07 PM, Brandon Harris 
> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 14, 2014, at 3:55 PM, David Gerard  wrote:
> >
> > > I *love* how typing into the search bar gives you related articles.
> > > How are you doing that?
> >
> > Through the magic of the new search API.
> >
>
> If you like that, you're also going to like upcoming work from the Growth
> team on task suggestions for things to edit. It's powered by the same
> search API. :)
>
>
> --
> Steven Walling,
> Product Manager
> https://wikimediafoundation.org/
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-- 
Amir
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Re: [Wikitech-l] [Product] Winter, v. 0.6

[Steven Walling]

On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 2:07 PM, Brandon Harris 
wrote:

> On Jul 14, 2014, at 3:55 PM, David Gerard  wrote:
>
> > I *love* how typing into the search bar gives you related articles.
> > How are you doing that?
>
> Through the magic of the new search API.
>

If you like that, you're also going to like upcoming work from the Growth
team on task suggestions for things to edit. It's powered by the same
search API. :)


-- 
Steven Walling,
Product Manager
https://wikimediafoundation.org/
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[David Gerard]

On 15 July 2014 22:09, Brandon Harris  wrote:

> /scramble, scramble, scramble.



The curse of doing something people like!


- d.

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[Chad]

On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 2:07 PM, Brandon Harris 
wrote:

>
> On Jul 14, 2014, at 3:55 PM, David Gerard  wrote:
>
> > I *love* how typing into the search bar gives you related articles.
> > How are you doing that?
>
> Through the magic of the new search API.
>
>
Very old API, new backend with better results :)

-Chad
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[Brandon Harris]

I have gotten said screenshot, and it matched exactly what I saw in IE 
9 earlier this morning.  The problem was a missing DOCTYPE, which, when added, 
broke a bunch of other stuff, which I have now fixed and deployed.

So it should work on IE now just fine.

I also fixed a metric ton of the issues with the responsive code, so 
that should be working as well.

/scramble, scramble, scramble.


On Jul 14, 2014, at 11:24 AM, Risker  wrote:

> Just to note, I've sent the screenshot directly to Brandon; I also
> forwarded a copy to this list but because of the size the email needs to go
> through moderation.

---
Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation

Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate


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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[Brandon Harris]

On Jul 14, 2014, at 3:55 PM, David Gerard  wrote:

> I *love* how typing into the search bar gives you related articles.
> How are you doing that?

Through the magic of the new search API.

---
Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation

Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate


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[Wikitech-l] CentralNotice Caching Overhaul - Frontend Proxy RfC

[Sumana Harihareswara]

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Requests_for_comment/CentralNotice_Caching_Overhaul_-_Frontend_Proxy

Matt Walker, praise be upon him, has just massively revised this RfC. See
the update for new details on URL unification, Varnish usage, and estimated
usage. It's now ready for another review pass, so have at it. :-)

Sumana Harihareswara
Senior Technical Writer
Wikimedia Foundation
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Re: [Wikitech-l] flow allows to mail change?

[Danny Horn]

We haven't added this feature to Flow yet. We'll have to work on email
notifications sometime this fall. We haven't thought about allowing replies
via mail; thanks for the suggestion!

Danny


On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 12:10 PM, rupert THURNER 
wrote:

> hi
>
> does flow allow to mail the added text. and allows to reply via mail?
>
> rupert
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[Wikitech-l] flow allows to mail change?

[rupert THURNER]

hi

does flow allow to mail the added text. and allows to reply via mail?

rupert
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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Tyler Romeo]

Yes. Actually, that is existing functionality. Special:Userlogin will redirect 
users
if the returnto (and optionally returntoquery) are specified. (The only 
exception is if
a hook intervenes).
-- 
Tyler Romeo
0x405D34A7C86B42DF

From: Risker 
Reply: Wikimedia developers >
Date: July 15, 2014 at 15:04:18
To: Wikimedia developers >
Subject:  Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page  

Would this return the user to the page that was originally requested, and
from which they were diverted?

I ask because a lot of people bookmark their watchlist as the easiest way
to wind up where they want to be. Getting a log-in screen first if they're
not already logged in would work fine, but then they'd want to be sent back
to the watchlist.

Risker/Anne


On 15 July 2014 14:49, Tyler Romeo  wrote:

> https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146515
> --
> Tyler Romeo
> 0x405D34A7C86B42DF
>
> From: Jon Robson 
> Reply: Wikimedia developers >
> Date: July 15, 2014 at 14:32:19
> To: Wikimedia developers >
> Subject: Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page
>
> Yes someone please submit a patch and I will help us get a fix for this
> merged.
>
> On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 6:10 AM, Bartosz Dziewoński 
> wrote:
> > On Tue, 15 Jul 2014 13:00:04 +0200, David Cuenca 
> wrote:
> >
> >> Sometimes while not logged in I try to access my Watchlist and then the
> >> "Not logged in" page appears. It is quite useless since then you have to
> >> click again to go to the "Log in" page. Wouldn't it be better to just
> >> redirect to the "log in" page instead of showing that dumb "Not logged
> in"
> >> page?
> >>
> >> Or perhaps I am missing some hidden use or reasoning behind the
> existence
> >> of that page...?
> >
> >
> > There is some old discussion on
> > , which asks for
> the
> > same thing.
> >
> >
> > --
> > Matma Rex
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
>
>
> --
> Jon Robson
> * http://jonrobson.me.uk
> * https://www.facebook.com/jonrobson
> * @rakugojon
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Risker]

Would this return the user to the page that was originally requested, and
from which they were diverted?

I ask because a lot of people bookmark their watchlist as the easiest way
to wind up where they want to be. Getting a log-in screen first if they're
not already logged in would work fine, but then they'd want to be sent back
to the watchlist.

Risker/Anne


On 15 July 2014 14:49, Tyler Romeo  wrote:

> https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146515
> --
> Tyler Romeo
> 0x405D34A7C86B42DF
>
> From: Jon Robson 
> Reply: Wikimedia developers >
> Date: July 15, 2014 at 14:32:19
> To: Wikimedia developers >
> Subject:  Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page
>
> Yes someone please submit a patch and I will help us get a fix for this
> merged.
>
> On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 6:10 AM, Bartosz Dziewoński 
> wrote:
> > On Tue, 15 Jul 2014 13:00:04 +0200, David Cuenca 
> wrote:
> >
> >> Sometimes while not logged in I try to access my Watchlist and then the
> >> "Not logged in" page appears. It is quite useless since then you have to
> >> click again to go to the "Log in" page. Wouldn't it be better to just
> >> redirect to the "log in" page instead of showing that dumb "Not logged
> in"
> >> page?
> >>
> >> Or perhaps I am missing some hidden use or reasoning behind the
> existence
> >> of that page...?
> >
> >
> > There is some old discussion on
> > , which asks for
> the
> > same thing.
> >
> >
> > --
> > Matma Rex
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
>
>
> --
> Jon Robson
> * http://jonrobson.me.uk
> * https://www.facebook.com/jonrobson
> * @rakugojon
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Tyler Romeo]

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146515
-- 
Tyler Romeo
0x405D34A7C86B42DF

From: Jon Robson 
Reply: Wikimedia developers >
Date: July 15, 2014 at 14:32:19
To: Wikimedia developers >
Subject:  Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page  

Yes someone please submit a patch and I will help us get a fix for this merged.

On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 6:10 AM, Bartosz Dziewoński  wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Jul 2014 13:00:04 +0200, David Cuenca  wrote:
>
>> Sometimes while not logged in I try to access my Watchlist and then the
>> "Not logged in" page appears. It is quite useless since then you have to
>> click again to go to the "Log in" page. Wouldn't it be better to just
>> redirect to the "log in" page instead of showing that dumb "Not logged in"
>> page?
>>
>> Or perhaps I am missing some hidden use or reasoning behind the existence
>> of that page...?
>
>
> There is some old discussion on
> , which asks for the
> same thing.
>
>
> --
> Matma Rex
>
>
> ___
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--  
Jon Robson
* http://jonrobson.me.uk
* https://www.facebook.com/jonrobson
* @rakugojon

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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Jon Robson]

Yes someone please submit a patch and I will help us get a fix for this merged.

On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 6:10 AM, Bartosz Dziewoński  wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Jul 2014 13:00:04 +0200, David Cuenca  wrote:
>
>> Sometimes while not logged in I try to access my Watchlist and then the
>> "Not logged in" page appears. It is quite useless since then you have to
>> click again to go to the "Log in" page. Wouldn't it be better to just
>> redirect to the "log in" page instead of showing that dumb "Not logged in"
>> page?
>>
>> Or perhaps I am missing some hidden use or reasoning behind the existence
>> of that page...?
>
>
> There is some old discussion on
> , which asks for the
> same thing.
>
>
> --
> Matma Rex
>
>
> ___
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> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l



-- 
Jon Robson
* http://jonrobson.me.uk
* https://www.facebook.com/jonrobson
* @rakugojon

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Preliminary ogv.js integration for Ogg playback in Safari, IE

[Brion Vibber]

On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 1:35 PM, Derk-Jan Hartman <
d.j.hartman+wmf...@gmail.com> wrote:

> This is impressive Brion, really nice work. I can actually play
> multiple 160p clips at the same time on my iPhone 5S.


Thanks! :)

Note that performance in Safari should improve further on iOS 8 and OS X
10.10, which enable WebGL in the browser -- this approximately halves the
CPU requirements by combining YUV->RGB colorspace conversion into the
drawing step on the GPU.

Who ever said JavaScript had to be slow, eh? ;)


> I have no
> controls in iOS yet but other than that.. Really getting somewhere.
>

Currently seeking and volume control are not supported so the controls are
indeed very minimal... I'm not quite sure why the resolution selector
doesn't show on the control bar, I'll have to poke it some more. (Maybe it
depends on seeking?)

I think I can partially implement seeking in Safari since it actually
progressively downloads the entire file into a memory buffer (!) but doing
it properly will require either a server-side addition to do streaming
chunks, or MPEG DASH-style pre-splitting of a/v streams into small files
that can be individually loaded via a series of small XMLHTTPRequest hits
(see  and links for
background on MPEG DASH and the WebM streaming profile; presumably I'd
either have to implement WebM decoding in addition to Ogg or devise a DASH
profile for the Ogg container).

-- brion


>
> DJ
>
> On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 6:31 AM, Brion Vibber 
> wrote:
> > I spent the weekend hacking at integration of my ogv.js JavaScript Ogg
> > media player into TimedMediaHandler's embedded player widget. Patch set
> in
> > progress:
> > https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/145756/
> >
> > It's pretty much working in Safari 7 and IE 10/11, but needs various
> tweaks
> > and fixes still. Some older browser versions should be supportable using
> a
> > Flash cross-compile, but I haven't got that running in the embedding yet.
> >
> > Here's a wiki running the patch with some sample files:
> > https://ogvjs-testing.wmflabs.org/
> >
> >
> > In the process I've noticed several issues with TimedMediaHandler and its
> > dependencies when running on cutting-edge infrastructure; various bugs
> > filed:
> >
> > HHVM issues:
> > * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67937 - players don't
> > display (patch)
> > * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67973 - job runner
> doesn't
> > work
> >
> > Ubuntu Trusty video transcoding issues:
> > * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67953 .ogv transcodes
> > broken (upstream; workaround)
> > * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67951 .webm transcodes
> > broken (upstream)
> >
> > And a Vagrant configuration issue:
> > * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67930 - no job runner
> for
> > TMH role
> >
> > -- brion
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Email for London Hackathon Participants

[Sumana Harihareswara]

According to http://korma.wmflabs.org/browser/ we have had over a thousand
contributors to MediaWiki, with about 136 regular developers.

"Wikimedia developers" to me includes people who improve MediaWiki core,
gadgets, templates, user scripts, bots and tools and apps that use our API
or dumps, etc. So it's totally feasible to imagine an event that gathers
400 of those people. But I'm not involved in Wikimania hackathon planning
(and will not be at the hackathon), and I don't know what proportions y'all
should expect.

Sumana Harihareswara
Senior Technical Writer
Wikimedia Foundation


On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 1:13 PM, Brian Wolff  wrote:

> On 7/9/14, Lars Aronsson  wrote:
> > On 07/08/2014 10:30 PM, Rachel Farrand wrote:
> >> This year we are expecting a very large turnout at the London Hackathon.
> >> Last I heard there were just under 400 people registered.
> >
> > Are those 400 already contributors to the code base, or
> > does it include total newbies who never edited Wikipedia?
>
> I doubt there even exists 400 active contributors to our code base, so
> probably not all are active contributors to our code base.
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Email for London Hackathon Participants

[Risker]

On 14 July 2014 17:38, Rachel Farrand  wrote:

> Hi Lars,
>
> All we currently know about the 400 contributors, is that they have
> registered for the Hackathon and Wikimania. Only 20/400 are registered just
> for the hackathon. I am planning to send out a survey shorty to everyone
> who is registered for the hackathon to get a better idea of backgrounds and
> attendance intentions. Some of them may not have realized they were
> registering for a developers event.
>

A fair number of people who were planning to attend other events or
activities on those two days registered for the hackathon because it was
the only way to show that they would be around on Tuesday and Wednesday.

You're not going to get 400 developers.  You'll probably get about 15% more
people than what you had in Washington in 2012.  The rest of us will just
be hanging around and being annoying distractions :)

Risker/Anne
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Email for London Hackathon Participants

[Brian Wolff]

On 7/9/14, Lars Aronsson  wrote:
> On 07/08/2014 10:30 PM, Rachel Farrand wrote:
>> This year we are expecting a very large turnout at the London Hackathon.
>> Last I heard there were just under 400 people registered.
>
> Are those 400 already contributors to the code base, or
> does it include total newbies who never edited Wikipedia?

I doubt there even exists 400 active contributors to our code base, so
probably not all are active contributors to our code base.

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Email for London Hackathon Participants

[Quim Gil]

On Tuesday, July 15, 2014, Derk-Jan Hartman 
wrote:

> We should probably update parts of "The laptop setup guide"
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Hackathon/Laptop_setup, which is linked
> from the Hackathon coordination page.


The MediaWiki-vagrant troupe should take over that part.


-- 
Quim Gil
Engineering Community Manager @ Wikimedia Foundation
http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Qgil
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Anonymous editors & IP addresses

[Nick White]

(a little off topic diversion)

On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 06:22:17PM +1000, Gryllida wrote: 
> An IP, as a fundamental identifier, has as much to do with privacy 
> as a car number you see on a street. (Anyone can look up a name by 
> car number, in my area, which I expect to be common.)

Actually numberplates were originally conceived as a privacy 
enhancing technology. The first numberplates had peoples' names on 
them, but that was considered too intrusive.

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Tech Talk: Hadoop and Beyond. An overview of Analytics infrastructure, Tuesday!

[Rachel Farrand]

This Tech Talk will be starting in 30 minuets. Thanks!


On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 3:30 PM, Rachel Farrand 
wrote:

> Hello!
>
> Please join Nuria Ruiz and Andrew Otto next Tuesday, July 15th at 10am SF
> time/5pm UTC
> 
> for a 30 min tech talk. You can join our hangout or follow along on
> youtube:
> https://plus.google.com/u/0/b/103470172168784626509/events/c53ho5esd0luccd09a1c30rlrmg
> (please note that a link to join the hangout will be posted in the comments
> of this event just as it starts).
>
> You can follow ask questions on IRC during the talk in #wikimedia-dev.
>
> If you are not able to follow along live, a video recording will be posted
> here
> ,
> to the MediaWiki YouTube channel immediately following the tech talk for
> you to view at any time.
>
> More information about the tech talk:
>
> *Hadoop and Beyond. An overview of Analytics infrastructure*In this tech
> talk we will be presenting the analytics infrastructure that we have
> recently rolled out in production. By now probably everybody knows that
> wikimedia hosts an instance of hadoop from which we are going to extract
> pageview data in the near future. But .. how exactly does the data get
> there?
>
> We will go over the path that webrequest log data takes from varnish to
> kafka (a distributed log buffer) to hadoop and the challenges of deploying
> this java-based infrastructure in production. We will also talk about how
> can we query the data with hive, an SQL-like interface. How can you set up
> this stack on vagrant to play with and, last but not least, how we used
> hive recently to provide GLAM folks with image view stats:
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:GLAMwiki_Toolset_Project/NARA_analytics_pilot
>
> Thanks!
>
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-ambassadors] Deprecating print-on-demand functionality

[Matthew Walker]

The new renderer should already be working in Hebrew and other RTLs.

~Matt Walker
Wikimedia Foundation


On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 2:16 PM, Itzik Edri  wrote:

> Any plans also to improve this module and make it work well also in Hebrew
> (and maybe other RTL languages)?
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 6:48 PM, Erik Moeller  wrote:
>
> > On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 8:45 AM, Luca Martinelli
> >  wrote:
> > > so the Book Creator will still be active, maybe under another name,
> > > maybe with another engine, but still active?
> >
> > Same name and functionality, just the "Order a printed book" feature
> > will disappear.
> >
> > Erik
> > --
> > Erik Möller
> > VP of Engineering and Product Development, Wikimedia Foundation
> >
> > ___
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > wikimedi...@lists.wikimedia.org
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > 
> >
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> 
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Re: [Wikitech-l] What should be the recommended / supported way to do skins? (A proposal.)

[Jon Robson]

Thanks for the info Isarra!

Does anyone want to make it not empty...? :)

I'll personally +2 any changes if the author sends me a private email to
the patchsets!
On 15 Jul 2014 07:39, "Isarra Yos"  wrote:

> On 14/07/14 18:41, Jon Robson wrote:
>
>> I just wanted to thank Bartosz for all the good work he's done here!
>> It's great that finally installing a skin is consistent with
>> installing an extension :)
>>
>> I wonder if we should create a skin boilerplate repository, to make it
>> really easy for people to get started making their own skins?
>>
>
> Theoretically that's what the skins/Example repository should be for, but
> it seems to be empty at present.
>
> -I
>
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[Wikitech-l] Wikimedia engineering report, June 2014

[Guillaume Paumier]

Hi,

The report covering Wikimedia engineering activities in June 2014 is now
available.

Wiki version:
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Engineering/Report/2014/June
Blog version:
https://blog.wikimedia.org/2014/07/15/engineering-report-june-2014/

We're also proposing a shorter, simpler and translatable version of this
report that does not assume specialized technical knowledge:
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Engineering/Report/2014/June/summary

Below is the HTML text of the report.

As always, feedback is appreciated on the usefulness of the report and its
summary, and on how to improve them.

--

Major news in June include:

   - the release of the new Wikipedia for Android app
   
,
   preceded by its beta version
   ;
   - the decision to move away from Bugzilla in favor of Phabricator
   ;
   - A new tablet view for Wikimedia sites
   

   .

*Note: We’re also providing a shorter, simpler and translatable version of
this report

that
does not assume specialized technical knowledge.*

Engineering metrics in June:

   - 151 unique committers contributed patchsets of code to MediaWiki.
   - The total number of unresolved commits
   
went
   from around 1440 to about 1575.
   - About 14 shell requests
 were
   processed.

Contents

   - Upcoming events
   

   - Personnel
   

  - Work with us
  

  - Announcements
  

   - Technical Operations
   

   - Features Engineering
   

  - Editor retention: Editing tools
  

  - Core Features
  

  - Growth
  

  - Support
  

   - Mobile
   
   - Language Engineering
   

   - Platform Engineering
   

  - MediaWiki Core
  

  - Quality assurance
  

  - Multimedia
  

  - Engineering Community Team
  

   - Analytics
   

   - Wikidata
   

   - Future
   

 Personnel Work with us 

Are you looking to work for Wikimedia? We have a lot of hiring coming up,
and we really love talking to active community members about these roles.

   - VP of Engineering
   

   - Software Engineer – Front-end (VisualEditor)
   

   - Software Engineer – Services
   

   - Software Engineer – Internationalization
   

   - Software Engineer – Front-end
   

Re: [Wikitech-l] Strange mailing list behavior

[Greg Grossmeier]

Outage report:

https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Incident_documentation/2014-07-14-Lists

SPOILER: Should be better now.


> So this evening, besides my one email to Wikimedia-l that got through, 2
> others disappeared into thin air. Also, I just received an email in my
> Google account that was sent 11 hours ago. Can someone check for gremlins
> in the mail system? The problem might be on Google's end or in the mail
> system, I can't tell, but I suspect the mail system because mail sent to
> non-list addresses seems to get through ok.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Pine
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-- 
| Greg GrossmeierGPG: B2FA 27B1 F7EB D327 6B8E |
| identi.ca: @gregA18D 1138 8E47 FAC8 1C7D |

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Re: [Wikitech-l] RFC: Composer managed libraries for use on WMF cluster

[Bryan Davis]

On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 2:07 AM, Bryan Davis  wrote:
> I have converted my email on using composer to manage a set of library
> dependencies for MediaWiki-Core [0] into an RFC [1]. Work is
> continuing on the implementation of this project, but there are still
> debatable implementation details and the RFC process is meant to not
> only validate ideas but leave behind a record of the design decisions
> that have been made and trade offs that were considered in the
> process.
>
> In particular, the current draft RFC omits discussion of the concept
> of library "ownership" for long term updates and security fixes and
> could use more detail around the process of forking, patching and
> subsequently maintaining a external library. I will attempt to fill in
> some of these details as I see them over the next day or so, but now
> would be a great time for people with strong ideas or opinions on
> these aspects to comment on the talk page.
>
> [0]: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/wikitech/467520?page=last
> [1]: 
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Requests_for_comment/Composer_managed_libraries_for_use_on_WMF_cluster

Thanks in no small part to a reminder from Sumana, I have updated the
RFC for "Composer managed libraries for use on WMF cluster". Much of
the initial work required for this RFC has now been implemented:

* The mediawiki/core/vendor.git gerrit repository has been created.
* make-wmf-branch has been updated to branch mediawiki/core/vendor and
add it as a submodule on new 1.XwmfY branches.
* The beta cluster is tracking the current HEAD of
mediawiki/core/vendor's master branch.
* The PSR-3 logging interface and Monolog libraries have been added to
mediawiki/core/vendor via gerrit commits.
* Work is progressing to configure Jenkins/Zuul to checkout
mediawiki/core/vendor during test runs.

I would appreciate feedback on the RFC. In particular I would like to
see discussion on how we should manage tracking upstream
vulnerabilities and security patches for deployed libraries. How
should we assign "ownership" of maintaining a particular library and
what techniques can we use to ensure that vulnerabilities are patched
in a timely and responsible manner?

Bryan
-- 
Bryan Davis  Wikimedia Foundation
[[m:User:BDavis_(WMF)]]  Sr Software EngineerBoise, ID USA
irc: bd808v:415.839.6885 x6855

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Moving Mathoid to production cluster

[Chris McMahon]

On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 1:10 AM, Moritz Schubotz 
wrote:

> Hi Chris,
>
> me too.
> How can I implement in in beta labs?
>

I'd say to start by filing a bugzilla ticket for Wikimedia
Labs/deployment-prep.
Then it is a matter of registering the proper extensions and config in
puppet.
Would mathoid need a dedicated host?


>
> Best
> Moritz
>
> On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 6:35 PM, Chris McMahon 
> wrote:
> > I would really like to see this follow the standard deploy scheme:
> >  implement it in beta labs; then enable it for mediawiki.org and
> test2wiki;
> > then enable it on production cluster nodes.
> > -Chris
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 3:07 AM, Moritz Schubotz 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> during the last year the math extension achieved a goal defined back
> >> in 2003. Support of MathML. In addition there is SVG support for
> >> MathML disabled browsers. (See http://arxiv.org/abs/1404.6179 for the
> >> details)
> >> I would like to give Wikipedia users a chance to test this new long
> >> awaited feature.
> >> Therefore we would need a mathoid instance that is accessible from the
> >> production cluster. Greg Grossmeier already created the required table
> >> in the database. (Sorry for the "friction" connected with this
> >> process)
> >> Currently the MathJax team is working on a phantom.js less method to
> >> render texvc to mathml and svg. Some days ago I have tested that it,
> >> and it works quite well. I would appreciate a discussion with ops that
> >> to figure out how this can be can go to production. The original idea
> >> was to use jenkins to build the mathoid debian package. Even though
> >> the debian package builds without any issues in the launchpad ppa repo
> >> jenkins can not build the package. If there is a reference project
> >> that uses jenkins to build debian packages that go to production this
> >> would really help to figure out what is different for mathoid and why
> >> the package building does not work even though it works on launchpad.
> >>
> >> Best
> >> Physikerwelt
> >>
> >> PS: I was informed that there is a related RT that I can not access
> >> https://rt.wikimedia.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=6077
> >>
> >> --
> >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
> >> Moritz Schubotz
> >>
> >> ___
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> >> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
>
>
> --
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
> Moritz Schubotz
>
>   Telefon (Büro):  +49 30 314 22784
>   Telefon (Privat):+49 30 488 27330
>   E-Mail: schub...@itp.physik.tu-berlin.de
>   Web: http://www.physikerwelt.de
>   Skype: Schubi87
>   ICQ: 200302764
>   Msn: mor...@schubotz.de
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] What should be the recommended / supported way to do skins? (A proposal.)

[Isarra Yos]

On 14/07/14 18:41, Jon Robson wrote:

I just wanted to thank Bartosz for all the good work he's done here!
It's great that finally installing a skin is consistent with
installing an extension :)

I wonder if we should create a skin boilerplate repository, to make it
really easy for people to get started making their own skins?


Theoretically that's what the skins/Example repository should be for, 
but it seems to be empty at present.


-I

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Email for London Hackathon Participants

[Derk-Jan Hartman]

We should probably update parts of "The laptop setup guide"
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Hackathon/Laptop_setup, which is linked
from the Hackathon coordination page.
I notice there are a few parts that are still in their 2012 state,
which probably could use a bit of updating (Like using Smultron on
OSX, now a $5 paid app).


I have just added a link to the Git section about
http://pcottle.github.io/learnGitBranching/, which I think is a nice
online exercise for git cli beginners.

DJ

On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 11:38 PM, Rachel Farrand  wrote:
> Hi Lars,
>
> All we currently know about the 400 contributors, is that they have
> registered for the Hackathon and Wikimania. Only 20/400 are registered just
> for the hackathon. I am planning to send out a survey shorty to everyone
> who is registered for the hackathon to get a better idea of backgrounds and
> attendance intentions. Some of them may not have realized they were
> registering for a developers event.
>
> As far as what sessions will be at the hackathon: It all depends on what
> sessions are proposed by the participants. At
> https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Hackathon you can see already
> several introductory sessions and tutorials, with a few explicit
> invitations to non-developers (i.e. "Translathon - Where developers meet
> translators").
>
> We expect to have diversity of sessions in terms of skills required and
> formats. We assume participants will have familiarity with software
> development, design, testing or documentation, and a genuine technical
> interest.
>
> We haven't thought about tutorials about using editor tools. Then again,
> the hackathon is an unconference-like event, which means that any session
> with offer, demand, and a slot available in the schedule is possible.
>
> See for instance
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Z%C3%BCrich_Hackathon_2014/Schedule , taking
> into account that many ad-hoc small activities were not scheduled there,
> and considering also that we expect a higher percentage of newcomers and
> power users / non-developers hackathon in London because of the wider
> Wikimania context.
>
> Again, if anyone has anything specific they would like to work on at the
> Hackathon please add it to the topics section soon:
> https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Hackathon Along with my survey I
> will be also asking participants to indicate interest in proposed topics.
>
> Thanks!
> Rachel
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 10:29 AM, Lars Aronsson  wrote:
>
>> On 07/08/2014 10:30 PM, Rachel Farrand wrote:
>>
>>> This year we are expecting a very large turnout at the London Hackathon.
>>> Last I heard there were just under 400 people registered.
>>>
>>
>> Are those 400 already contributors to the code base, or
>> does it include total newbies who never edited Wikipedia?
>> When I signed up for participation in the hackathon, there
>> was no way to indicate the level of skills. Are there other
>> sessions that include tutorials, so the hackathon is a pure
>> developer meeting? Or should the hackathon also cover
>> tutorials on editing, uploading images, categorization, etc.?
>>
>>
>> --
>>   Lars Aronsson (l...@aronsson.se)
>>   Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[Bartosz Dziewoński]

On Tue, 15 Jul 2014 13:00:04 +0200, David Cuenca  wrote:


Sometimes while not logged in I try to access my Watchlist and then the
"Not logged in" page appears. It is quite useless since then you have to
click again to go to the "Log in" page. Wouldn't it be better to just
redirect to the "log in" page instead of showing that dumb "Not logged  
in"

page?

Or perhaps I am missing some hidden use or reasoning behind the existence
of that page...?


There is some old discussion on  
, which asks for the  
same thing.



--
Matma Rex

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[David Gerard]

On 14 July 2014 21:06, Trevor Parscal  wrote:

> I want to suggest that we give Brandon a lot of slack here, and be as
> supportive as possible.
> This is a prototype of a design, which is far better than a mockup of a
> design. It is not an actual implementation, but that is totally fine. I
> want to see more of this kind of thing, and by being more supportive and
> understanding I think we can encourage that.



It is in fact gorgeous, and is evidently good enough to get bug reports :-)


- d.

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[Risker]

Yes, I think you may have a point, Trevor.

The one thing that comes to my mind is that all the stuff at the right of
the screen is what might be called the "bottom matter" from articles.
Giving it primary place in an article, well above the majority of content
is...well, suboptimal. It's at the bottom because it's really not all that
important; links to other similar articles and other Wikimedia sites is
(I'm going to be honest here) fluff, not content - especially those massive
templates that take the place of proper categorization.  I get the visual
theory behind having it there; the problem isn't really the format, it's
the quality and relative importance of the information.

Risker




On 14 July 2014 16:06, Trevor Parscal  wrote:

> I want to suggest that we give Brandon a lot of slack here, and be as
> supportive as possible.
>
> This is a prototype of a design, which is far better than a mockup of a
> design. It is not an actual implementation, but that is totally fine. I
> want to see more of this kind of thing, and by being more supportive and
> understanding I think we can encourage that.
>
> - Trevor
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 8:52 AM, Brandon Harris 
> wrote:
>
> >
> > As I've said before, it doesn't work in IE. I've only just gained
> > access to a Windows laptop and I'll see what I can do.
> >
> >
> > On Jul 14, 2014, at 5:55 AM, Risker  wrote:
> >
> > > Thanks Brandon for letting us know about this.  Since it will be many
> > hours
> > > before I have a chance to make comments elsewhere, I'm going to let you
> > > know that, using a Win7 platform and IE9, the screen is illegible.  All
> > > writing is in a faint shade of grey (or blue where applicable); text
> > > overlaps images and infoboxes; and there's massive whitespace to the
> > right
> > > of the screen.  Because of the very faint text, I can't be certain
> what's
> > > supposed to be above the title; however, what is there looks to all be
> > > crowded over to the right of the screen above the large amount of
> > > whitespace.
> > >
> > > I'll try to grab a screenshot and send it in.
> > >
> > > Risker/Anne
> > >
> > > On 14 July 2014 01:03, Brandon Harris  wrote:
> > >
> > >>
> > >>I have uploaded a new version of the Winter
> framework/prototype,
> > >> v. 0.6.
> > >>
> > >>http://unicorn.wmflabs.org/winter/
> > >>
> > >>This version has significant changes over 0.5.  The entire
> > >> undercarriage has been refactored into a framework to allow for anyone
> > to
> > >> do rapid prototyping within their own copy.  The source code has been
> > >> installed into gerrit, in the form of two depots, one of which is for
> > >> specialized "modules" that change the way the prototype behaves
> > >> (snowflakes).
> > >>
> > >>Links to the source depots are available at:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#The_Winter_Framework
> > >>
> > >>This release adds in several major changes:
> > >>
> > >>* "Right rail" functionality, designed to surface
> content
> > >>* Search functionality
> > >>* Watchlist functionality (for testing)
> > >>* A revisit to the design of the edit interface.
> > >>
> > >>A full changelog for version 0.6 can be found here:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#Version_0.6.2C_July_13.2C_2014
> > >>
> > >>As usual, feedback is welcomed here:
> > >>
> > >>https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Winter
> > >>
> > >> ---
> > >> Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
> > >>
> > >> Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ___
> > >> Wikitech-l mailing list
> > >> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> > > ___
> > > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> > ---
> > Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
> >
> > Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[David Cuenca]

I like it and I hope it gets to the point where it can be deployed as beta.

And that right panel looks a perfect place for users to place some gadgets
of their choice. That would be wonderful!


On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 10:06 PM, Trevor Parscal 
wrote:

> I want to suggest that we give Brandon a lot of slack here, and be as
> supportive as possible.
>
> This is a prototype of a design, which is far better than a mockup of a
> design. It is not an actual implementation, but that is totally fine. I
> want to see more of this kind of thing, and by being more supportive and
> understanding I think we can encourage that.
>
> - Trevor
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 8:52 AM, Brandon Harris 
> wrote:
>
> >
> > As I've said before, it doesn't work in IE. I've only just gained
> > access to a Windows laptop and I'll see what I can do.
> >
> >
> > On Jul 14, 2014, at 5:55 AM, Risker  wrote:
> >
> > > Thanks Brandon for letting us know about this.  Since it will be many
> > hours
> > > before I have a chance to make comments elsewhere, I'm going to let you
> > > know that, using a Win7 platform and IE9, the screen is illegible.  All
> > > writing is in a faint shade of grey (or blue where applicable); text
> > > overlaps images and infoboxes; and there's massive whitespace to the
> > right
> > > of the screen.  Because of the very faint text, I can't be certain
> what's
> > > supposed to be above the title; however, what is there looks to all be
> > > crowded over to the right of the screen above the large amount of
> > > whitespace.
> > >
> > > I'll try to grab a screenshot and send it in.
> > >
> > > Risker/Anne
> > >
> > > On 14 July 2014 01:03, Brandon Harris  wrote:
> > >
> > >>
> > >>I have uploaded a new version of the Winter
> framework/prototype,
> > >> v. 0.6.
> > >>
> > >>http://unicorn.wmflabs.org/winter/
> > >>
> > >>This version has significant changes over 0.5.  The entire
> > >> undercarriage has been refactored into a framework to allow for anyone
> > to
> > >> do rapid prototyping within their own copy.  The source code has been
> > >> installed into gerrit, in the form of two depots, one of which is for
> > >> specialized "modules" that change the way the prototype behaves
> > >> (snowflakes).
> > >>
> > >>Links to the source depots are available at:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#The_Winter_Framework
> > >>
> > >>This release adds in several major changes:
> > >>
> > >>* "Right rail" functionality, designed to surface
> content
> > >>* Search functionality
> > >>* Watchlist functionality (for testing)
> > >>* A revisit to the design of the edit interface.
> > >>
> > >>A full changelog for version 0.6 can be found here:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#Version_0.6.2C_July_13.2C_2014
> > >>
> > >>As usual, feedback is welcomed here:
> > >>
> > >>https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Winter
> > >>
> > >> ---
> > >> Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
> > >>
> > >> Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ___
> > >> Wikitech-l mailing list
> > >> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> > > ___
> > > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> > ---
> > Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
> >
> > Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
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>



-- 
Etiamsi omnes, ego non
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[Amir E. Aharoni]

The source is available now. Amir, could you try setting it up on RTL in
labs?
בתאריך 15 ביול 2014 14:02, "Amir Ladsgroup"  כתב:

> This is awesome, thank you. but do you work on i18n? specially for RTL
> languages because in some languages (like Hebrew or Persian) it doesn't
> work correctly.
>
> Thank you
>
> Best
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 9:10 PM, Jon Robson  wrote:
>
> > Beautiful! When can we expect to be able to enable this as a beta
> > feature and try it out on Wikipedia.org?
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 5:55 AM, Risker  wrote:
> > > Thanks Brandon for letting us know about this.  Since it will be many
> > hours
> > > before I have a chance to make comments elsewhere, I'm going to let you
> > > know that, using a Win7 platform and IE9, the screen is illegible.  All
> > > writing is in a faint shade of grey (or blue where applicable); text
> > > overlaps images and infoboxes; and there's massive whitespace to the
> > right
> > > of the screen.  Because of the very faint text, I can't be certain
> what's
> > > supposed to be above the title; however, what is there looks to all be
> > > crowded over to the right of the screen above the large amount of
> > > whitespace.
> > >
> > > I'll try to grab a screenshot and send it in.
> > >
> > > Risker/Anne
> > >
> > > On 14 July 2014 01:03, Brandon Harris  wrote:
> > >
> > >>
> > >> I have uploaded a new version of the Winter
> framework/prototype,
> > >> v. 0.6.
> > >>
> > >> http://unicorn.wmflabs.org/winter/
> > >>
> > >> This version has significant changes over 0.5.  The entire
> > >> undercarriage has been refactored into a framework to allow for anyone
> > to
> > >> do rapid prototyping within their own copy.  The source code has been
> > >> installed into gerrit, in the form of two depots, one of which is for
> > >> specialized "modules" that change the way the prototype behaves
> > >> (snowflakes).
> > >>
> > >> Links to the source depots are available at:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#The_Winter_Framework
> > >>
> > >> This release adds in several major changes:
> > >>
> > >> * "Right rail" functionality, designed to surface
> > content
> > >> * Search functionality
> > >> * Watchlist functionality (for testing)
> > >> * A revisit to the design of the edit interface.
> > >>
> > >> A full changelog for version 0.6 can be found here:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#Version_0.6.2C_July_13.2C_2014
> > >>
> > >> As usual, feedback is welcomed here:
> > >>
> > >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Winter
> > >>
> > >> ---
> > >> Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
> > >>
> > >> Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ___
> > >> Wikitech-l mailing list
> > >> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> > > ___
> > > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Jon Robson
> > * http://jonrobson.me.uk
> > * https://www.facebook.com/jonrobson
> > * @rakugojon
> >
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> >
>
>
>
> --
> Amir
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[Wikitech-l] "Not logged in" page

[David Cuenca]

Sometimes while not logged in I try to access my Watchlist and then the
"Not logged in" page appears. It is quite useless since then you have to
click again to go to the "Log in" page. Wouldn't it be better to just
redirect to the "log in" page instead of showing that dumb "Not logged in"
page?

Or perhaps I am missing some hidden use or reasoning behind the existence
of that page...?

Cheers,
Micru
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[Trevor Parscal]

I want to suggest that we give Brandon a lot of slack here, and be as
supportive as possible.

This is a prototype of a design, which is far better than a mockup of a
design. It is not an actual implementation, but that is totally fine. I
want to see more of this kind of thing, and by being more supportive and
understanding I think we can encourage that.

- Trevor


On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 8:52 AM, Brandon Harris 
wrote:

>
> As I've said before, it doesn't work in IE. I've only just gained
> access to a Windows laptop and I'll see what I can do.
>
>
> On Jul 14, 2014, at 5:55 AM, Risker  wrote:
>
> > Thanks Brandon for letting us know about this.  Since it will be many
> hours
> > before I have a chance to make comments elsewhere, I'm going to let you
> > know that, using a Win7 platform and IE9, the screen is illegible.  All
> > writing is in a faint shade of grey (or blue where applicable); text
> > overlaps images and infoboxes; and there's massive whitespace to the
> right
> > of the screen.  Because of the very faint text, I can't be certain what's
> > supposed to be above the title; however, what is there looks to all be
> > crowded over to the right of the screen above the large amount of
> > whitespace.
> >
> > I'll try to grab a screenshot and send it in.
> >
> > Risker/Anne
> >
> > On 14 July 2014 01:03, Brandon Harris  wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>I have uploaded a new version of the Winter framework/prototype,
> >> v. 0.6.
> >>
> >>http://unicorn.wmflabs.org/winter/
> >>
> >>This version has significant changes over 0.5.  The entire
> >> undercarriage has been refactored into a framework to allow for anyone
> to
> >> do rapid prototyping within their own copy.  The source code has been
> >> installed into gerrit, in the form of two depots, one of which is for
> >> specialized "modules" that change the way the prototype behaves
> >> (snowflakes).
> >>
> >>Links to the source depots are available at:
> >>
> >>
> >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#The_Winter_Framework
> >>
> >>This release adds in several major changes:
> >>
> >>* "Right rail" functionality, designed to surface content
> >>* Search functionality
> >>* Watchlist functionality (for testing)
> >>* A revisit to the design of the edit interface.
> >>
> >>A full changelog for version 0.6 can be found here:
> >>
> >>
> >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#Version_0.6.2C_July_13.2C_2014
> >>
> >>As usual, feedback is welcomed here:
> >>
> >>https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Winter
> >>
> >> ---
> >> Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
> >>
> >> Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
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> > ___
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> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
> ---
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>
> Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
>
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Scribunto, Lua 5.2, and forward compatibility for Module code

[gnosygnu]

I reply inline below, but in brief, my general questions have been
answered. Thanks for the comprehensive reply.

On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 10:57 AM, Brad Jorsch (Anomie) <
bjor...@wikimedia.org> wrote:

> On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 12:22 AM, gnosygnu  wrote:
>
> > * Will Scribunto support Lua 5.2 in the future? According to this
> comment,
> > it may:
> >
> https://github.com/wikimedia/mediawiki-extensions-Scribunto/blob/master/Scribunto.php#L140
>
> It may someday, but there's no hurry to change over. And changing over will
> involve some rewriting of the sandboxing which will need security auditing.
>
> See https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/139479/ for example.
>

Thanks for the link. I didn't know about the abandoned patch for 5.2, and
Tim's replies and links to the lua mailing thread made for interesting
reading.

Whenever Wikimedia decides to go to 5.2, the "intermediate runtime between
5.1 and 5.2" may be the best way. For what it's worth, I did the same in
XOWA for Scribunto, and it wasn't that difficult. I used the Luaj project (
https://sourceforge.net/projects/luaj/files/luaj-3.0/3.0-beta2/), which is
a pretty faithful port of Lua 5.2. I then added a handful of patches to be
backward compatible with 5.1. The resulting version handles the Module code
for all Mainspace/Wikipedia articles in 20+ wikis (enwiki; ruwiki; dewiki;
enwiktionary; ruwikisource; etc). However, it didn't pick up more subtle
issues like the "tonumber" one (which returns a different value and doesn't
throw an error).


>
> > * If so, what is the best approach to ensure forward compatibility of
> > Module code for 5.2? Note that code that is valid for 5.1 may "break" in
> > 5.2. (Again, see below for details)
> > ** Should there be a reference page on MediaWiki or in the enwiki
> Wikipedia
> > Namespace that details these breaking issues for other Module writers?
> >
>
> Feel free to create one.


Okay. I created
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Scribunto/Lua_5.2_changes and
linked to it from
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Scribunto#Other_pages. Feel free
to (re)move it as necessary.


> > ** Or should 5.1 vs 5.2 issues be corrected on a case-by-case basis for
> > each Module?
> >
>
> They'd have to be anyway.
>
>
Okay. I'll comment later on each of the cited Module's talk pages, and
recommend changes as per this thread.


>
> > ** Or should they be left as is, as any future-proofing may be
> unnecessary
> > and / or premature?
> >
>
> Possibly.
>
>
Okay.


>
> > * Lastly, is there a general purpose mailing list for Scribunto issues?
> > I've had a few technical questions in the past that have been painful to
> > sort out on my own. I'd like to think that there might be other Module
> > writers who would also be interested in a mailing list as well.
> >
>
> No. There are various talk pages on enwiki and other wikis that are used
> for this purpose, although I don't remember the specifics offhand and am
> too lazy to search right now. ;)
>
>
Understood. For the record, I wasn't able to find a central hub /
discussion page for Scribunto issues, though I'm probably looking in the
wrong places.


>
> > * In contrast, Lua 5.2 has code that only cares if a base is not
> specified.
> > // http://www.lua.org/source/5.2/lbaselib.c.html
> > static int luaB_tonumber (lua_State *L) {
> >   if (lua_isnoneornil(L, 2)) {  /* standard conversion */
> > ** If a base is specified, Lua 5.2 will not do the standard conversion,
> and
> > instead try to parse the number
> > ** This parse code only accepts alpha-numeric characters. The dot is
> > considered invalid, and any decimal number is converted to NIL
> >
>
> Possibly sensible since it removes a weird special case of base-10 being
> different from all other bases.
>
>
Agreed. The earlier version induced a few head-scratches, but I kind of
wish the later version didn't just drop it altogether.


>
> > Finally, I've come across a related issue with the varargs operator
> > ("..."). This operator is valid in 5.1, but not in 5.2. I've seen some
> > Modules use this varargs operator, that will presumably just break in
> 5.2.
> > See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Module:Horizontal_timeline and
> "function
> > getNotNilValue(...)"
> >
>
> Note the 'arg' parameter is already deprecated in 5.1, so people should
> already be avoiding it. See http://www.lua.org/manual/5.1/manual.html#7.1
>

Agreed that it shouldn't be used. Unfortunately, there's at least one other
user who didn't realize it was deprecated. That's why I recommended
publicizing known 5.2 migration issues amongst Module editors. :)


> --
> Brad Jorsch (Anomie)
> Software Engineer
> Wikimedia Foundation
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Email for London Hackathon Participants

[Rachel Farrand]

Hi Lars,

All we currently know about the 400 contributors, is that they have
registered for the Hackathon and Wikimania. Only 20/400 are registered just
for the hackathon. I am planning to send out a survey shorty to everyone
who is registered for the hackathon to get a better idea of backgrounds and
attendance intentions. Some of them may not have realized they were
registering for a developers event.

As far as what sessions will be at the hackathon: It all depends on what
sessions are proposed by the participants. At
https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Hackathon you can see already
several introductory sessions and tutorials, with a few explicit
invitations to non-developers (i.e. "Translathon - Where developers meet
translators").

We expect to have diversity of sessions in terms of skills required and
formats. We assume participants will have familiarity with software
development, design, testing or documentation, and a genuine technical
interest.

We haven't thought about tutorials about using editor tools. Then again,
the hackathon is an unconference-like event, which means that any session
with offer, demand, and a slot available in the schedule is possible.

See for instance
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Z%C3%BCrich_Hackathon_2014/Schedule , taking
into account that many ad-hoc small activities were not scheduled there,
and considering also that we expect a higher percentage of newcomers and
power users / non-developers hackathon in London because of the wider
Wikimania context.

Again, if anyone has anything specific they would like to work on at the
Hackathon please add it to the topics section soon:
https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Hackathon Along with my survey I
will be also asking participants to indicate interest in proposed topics.

Thanks!
Rachel


On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 10:29 AM, Lars Aronsson  wrote:

> On 07/08/2014 10:30 PM, Rachel Farrand wrote:
>
>> This year we are expecting a very large turnout at the London Hackathon.
>> Last I heard there were just under 400 people registered.
>>
>
> Are those 400 already contributors to the code base, or
> does it include total newbies who never edited Wikipedia?
> When I signed up for participation in the hackathon, there
> was no way to indicate the level of skills. Are there other
> sessions that include tutorials, so the hackathon is a pure
> developer meeting? Or should the hackathon also cover
> tutorials on editing, uploading images, categorization, etc.?
>
>
> --
>   Lars Aronsson (l...@aronsson.se)
>   Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se
>
>
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Anonymous editors & IP addresses

[Gryllida]

On Fri, 11 Jul 2014, at 23:34, Gilles Dubuc wrote:
> IP addresses are closely guarded for registered users, why wouldn't
> anonymous users be identified by a hash of their IP address in order to
> protect their privacy as well?

While I don't horribly mind some changes in the direction you're writing, I 
think that:

1) Privacy is defined as "The state of being free from unsanctioned intrusion". 
An IP, as a fundamental identifier, has as much to do with privacy as a car 
number you see on a street. (Anyone can look up a name by car number, in my 
area, which I expect to be common.)

Firefox folks are, iirc, considering providing IP-based links in the new tab 
with one of the next releases. These links would include local shops and 
restaurants. I've seen some argue that such decision goes against "privacy", 
but I think it's the wrong term.

2) There are other nicer things to enable for anonymous readers that would make 
their editing experience more efficient. Such things include enabling some 
preferences and features for these contributors, which may be useful to a group 
of people editing from one IP:

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Musings_about_unregistered_contributors#Examples

Gryllida.

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[Wikitech-l] Fwd: Strange mailing list behavior

[James Alexander]

Apologies if this ends up being a duplicate, forwarding it along on Pine's
request because he's been having mail issues and is concerned this one is
also not getting through. It is also, of course, possible that my email
will get stuck too and they will all appear later down the road together.
So far I'm not seeing a huge pile of queued messages on ganglia (though
there was a bit of a bump earlier).

James Alexander
Legal and Community Advocacy
Wikimedia Foundation
(415) 839-6885 x6716 @jamesofur


-- Forwarded message --
From: Pine W 
Date: Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 1:02 AM
Subject: Strange mailing list behavior
To: "wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org" 


So this evening, besides my one email to Wikimedia-l that got through, 2
others disappeared into thin air. Also, I just received an email in my
Google account that was sent 11 hours ago. Can someone check for gremlins
in the mail system? The problem might be on Google's end or in the mail
system, I can't tell, but I suspect the mail system because mail sent to
non-list addresses seems to get through ok.

Thanks,

Pine
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Moving Mathoid to production cluster

[Moritz Schubotz]

Hi Chris,

me too.
How can I implement in in beta labs?

Best
Moritz

On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 6:35 PM, Chris McMahon  wrote:
> I would really like to see this follow the standard deploy scheme:
>  implement it in beta labs; then enable it for mediawiki.org and test2wiki;
> then enable it on production cluster nodes.
> -Chris
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 3:07 AM, Moritz Schubotz 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> during the last year the math extension achieved a goal defined back
>> in 2003. Support of MathML. In addition there is SVG support for
>> MathML disabled browsers. (See http://arxiv.org/abs/1404.6179 for the
>> details)
>> I would like to give Wikipedia users a chance to test this new long
>> awaited feature.
>> Therefore we would need a mathoid instance that is accessible from the
>> production cluster. Greg Grossmeier already created the required table
>> in the database. (Sorry for the "friction" connected with this
>> process)
>> Currently the MathJax team is working on a phantom.js less method to
>> render texvc to mathml and svg. Some days ago I have tested that it,
>> and it works quite well. I would appreciate a discussion with ops that
>> to figure out how this can be can go to production. The original idea
>> was to use jenkins to build the mathoid debian package. Even though
>> the debian package builds without any issues in the launchpad ppa repo
>> jenkins can not build the package. If there is a reference project
>> that uses jenkins to build debian packages that go to production this
>> would really help to figure out what is different for mathoid and why
>> the package building does not work even though it works on launchpad.
>>
>> Best
>> Physikerwelt
>>
>> PS: I was informed that there is a related RT that I can not access
>> https://rt.wikimedia.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=6077
>>
>> --
>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
>> Moritz Schubotz
>>
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-- 
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Moritz Schubotz

  Telefon (Büro):  +49 30 314 22784
  Telefon (Privat):+49 30 488 27330
  E-Mail: schub...@itp.physik.tu-berlin.de
  Web: http://www.physikerwelt.de
  Skype: Schubi87
  ICQ: 200302764
  Msn: mor...@schubotz.de

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[David Gerard]

Actually one annoyance I just found: I can't right-click on the talk
page link. Is there any good reason to make this a Javascript thing
rather than an ordinary link?

On 14 July 2014 23:55, David Gerard  wrote:
> I *love* how typing into the search bar gives you related articles.
> How are you doing that?
>
>
> - d.

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[Wikitech-l] Strange mailing list behavior

[Pine W]

So this evening, besides my one email to Wikimedia-l that got through, 2
others disappeared into thin air. Also, I just received an email in my
Google account that was sent 11 hours ago. Can someone check for gremlins
in the mail system? The problem might be on Google's end or in the mail
system, I can't tell, but I suspect the mail system because mail sent to
non-list addresses seems to get through ok.

Thanks,

Pine
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[David Gerard]

I *love* how typing into the search bar gives you related articles.
How are you doing that?


- d.

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[Amir Ladsgroup]

This is awesome, thank you. but do you work on i18n? specially for RTL
languages because in some languages (like Hebrew or Persian) it doesn't
work correctly.

Thank you

Best


On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 9:10 PM, Jon Robson  wrote:

> Beautiful! When can we expect to be able to enable this as a beta
> feature and try it out on Wikipedia.org?
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 5:55 AM, Risker  wrote:
> > Thanks Brandon for letting us know about this.  Since it will be many
> hours
> > before I have a chance to make comments elsewhere, I'm going to let you
> > know that, using a Win7 platform and IE9, the screen is illegible.  All
> > writing is in a faint shade of grey (or blue where applicable); text
> > overlaps images and infoboxes; and there's massive whitespace to the
> right
> > of the screen.  Because of the very faint text, I can't be certain what's
> > supposed to be above the title; however, what is there looks to all be
> > crowded over to the right of the screen above the large amount of
> > whitespace.
> >
> > I'll try to grab a screenshot and send it in.
> >
> > Risker/Anne
> >
> > On 14 July 2014 01:03, Brandon Harris  wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> I have uploaded a new version of the Winter framework/prototype,
> >> v. 0.6.
> >>
> >> http://unicorn.wmflabs.org/winter/
> >>
> >> This version has significant changes over 0.5.  The entire
> >> undercarriage has been refactored into a framework to allow for anyone
> to
> >> do rapid prototyping within their own copy.  The source code has been
> >> installed into gerrit, in the form of two depots, one of which is for
> >> specialized "modules" that change the way the prototype behaves
> >> (snowflakes).
> >>
> >> Links to the source depots are available at:
> >>
> >>
> >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#The_Winter_Framework
> >>
> >> This release adds in several major changes:
> >>
> >> * "Right rail" functionality, designed to surface
> content
> >> * Search functionality
> >> * Watchlist functionality (for testing)
> >> * A revisit to the design of the edit interface.
> >>
> >> A full changelog for version 0.6 can be found here:
> >>
> >>
> >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#Version_0.6.2C_July_13.2C_2014
> >>
> >> As usual, feedback is welcomed here:
> >>
> >> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Winter
> >>
> >> ---
> >> Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
> >>
> >> Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
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> > ___
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>
>
>
> --
> Jon Robson
> * http://jonrobson.me.uk
> * https://www.facebook.com/jonrobson
> * @rakugojon
>
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-- 
Amir
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Preliminary ogv.js integration for Ogg playback in Safari, IE

[Derk-Jan Hartman]

This is impressive Brion, really nice work. I can actually play
multiple 160p clips at the same time on my iPhone 5S. I have no
controls in iOS yet but other than that.. Really getting somewhere.

DJ

On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 6:31 AM, Brion Vibber  wrote:
> I spent the weekend hacking at integration of my ogv.js JavaScript Ogg
> media player into TimedMediaHandler's embedded player widget. Patch set in
> progress:
> https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/145756/
>
> It's pretty much working in Safari 7 and IE 10/11, but needs various tweaks
> and fixes still. Some older browser versions should be supportable using a
> Flash cross-compile, but I haven't got that running in the embedding yet.
>
> Here's a wiki running the patch with some sample files:
> https://ogvjs-testing.wmflabs.org/
>
>
> In the process I've noticed several issues with TimedMediaHandler and its
> dependencies when running on cutting-edge infrastructure; various bugs
> filed:
>
> HHVM issues:
> * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67937 - players don't
> display (patch)
> * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67973 - job runner doesn't
> work
>
> Ubuntu Trusty video transcoding issues:
> * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67953 .ogv transcodes
> broken (upstream; workaround)
> * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67951 .webm transcodes
> broken (upstream)
>
> And a Vagrant configuration issue:
> * https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67930 - no job runner for
> TMH role
>
> -- brion
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[David Gerard]

When all the bits on the sides are actually functional *and* it works
in IE, presumably :-)

On 14 July 2014 17:40, Jon Robson  wrote:
> Beautiful! When can we expect to be able to enable this as a beta
> feature and try it out on Wikipedia.org?
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 5:55 AM, Risker  wrote:
>> Thanks Brandon for letting us know about this.  Since it will be many hours
>> before I have a chance to make comments elsewhere, I'm going to let you
>> know that, using a Win7 platform and IE9, the screen is illegible.  All
>> writing is in a faint shade of grey (or blue where applicable); text
>> overlaps images and infoboxes; and there's massive whitespace to the right
>> of the screen.  Because of the very faint text, I can't be certain what's
>> supposed to be above the title; however, what is there looks to all be
>> crowded over to the right of the screen above the large amount of
>> whitespace.
>>
>> I'll try to grab a screenshot and send it in.
>>
>> Risker/Anne
>>
>> On 14 July 2014 01:03, Brandon Harris  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I have uploaded a new version of the Winter framework/prototype,
>>> v. 0.6.
>>>
>>> http://unicorn.wmflabs.org/winter/
>>>
>>> This version has significant changes over 0.5.  The entire
>>> undercarriage has been refactored into a framework to allow for anyone to
>>> do rapid prototyping within their own copy.  The source code has been
>>> installed into gerrit, in the form of two depots, one of which is for
>>> specialized "modules" that change the way the prototype behaves
>>> (snowflakes).
>>>
>>> Links to the source depots are available at:
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#The_Winter_Framework
>>>
>>> This release adds in several major changes:
>>>
>>> * "Right rail" functionality, designed to surface content
>>> * Search functionality
>>> * Watchlist functionality (for testing)
>>> * A revisit to the design of the edit interface.
>>>
>>> A full changelog for version 0.6 can be found here:
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#Version_0.6.2C_July_13.2C_2014
>>>
>>> As usual, feedback is welcomed here:
>>>
>>> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Winter
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
>>>
>>> Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
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>
>
> --
> Jon Robson
> * http://jonrobson.me.uk
> * https://www.facebook.com/jonrobson
> * @rakugojon
>
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Who maintains GeoCrumbs? (a changeset waits for review)

[Brian Wolff]

On 7/14/14, Quim Gil  wrote:
> Hi, GeoCrumbs is an extension deployed in Wikimedia servers:
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:GeoCrumbs
>
> It has no official maintainers, what about unofficial ones? Any volunteers?
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Developers/Maintainers


I imagine that's the situation for most of the extensions
grandfathered in for wikivoyage.

--bawolff

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Re: [Wikitech-l] What should be the recommended / supported way to do skins? (A proposal.)

[Jon Robson]

I just wanted to thank Bartosz for all the good work he's done here!
It's great that finally installing a skin is consistent with
installing an extension :)

I wonder if we should create a skin boilerplate repository, to make it
really easy for people to get started making their own skins?


On Sat, Jul 12, 2014 at 6:30 PM, Bartosz Dziewoński  wrote:
> I finally implemented most of the ideas discussed here into documentation,
> and I think I settled on something that should be acceptable to everyone.
> The canonical recommended way to do skins, and one we hopefully all agree
> on, is now described at
> . Thanks for
> the comments!
>
>
> --
> Matma Rex
>
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Jon Robson
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* https://www.facebook.com/jonrobson
* @rakugojon

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Winter, v. 0.6

[Risker]

Just to note, I've sent the screenshot directly to Brandon; I also
forwarded a copy to this list but because of the size the email needs to go
through moderation.

Risker/Anne


On 14 July 2014 08:55, Risker  wrote:

> Thanks Brandon for letting us know about this.  Since it will be many
> hours before I have a chance to make comments elsewhere, I'm going to let
> you know that, using a Win7 platform and IE9, the screen is illegible.  All
> writing is in a faint shade of grey (or blue where applicable); text
> overlaps images and infoboxes; and there's massive whitespace to the right
> of the screen.  Because of the very faint text, I can't be certain what's
> supposed to be above the title; however, what is there looks to all be
> crowded over to the right of the screen above the large amount of
> whitespace.
>
> I'll try to grab a screenshot and send it in.
>
> Risker/Anne
>
> On 14 July 2014 01:03, Brandon Harris  wrote:
>
>>
>> I have uploaded a new version of the Winter framework/prototype,
>> v. 0.6.
>>
>> http://unicorn.wmflabs.org/winter/
>>
>> This version has significant changes over 0.5.  The entire
>> undercarriage has been refactored into a framework to allow for anyone to
>> do rapid prototyping within their own copy.  The source code has been
>> installed into gerrit, in the form of two depots, one of which is for
>> specialized "modules" that change the way the prototype behaves
>> (snowflakes).
>>
>> Links to the source depots are available at:
>>
>>
>> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#The_Winter_Framework
>>
>> This release adds in several major changes:
>>
>> * "Right rail" functionality, designed to surface content
>> * Search functionality
>> * Watchlist functionality (for testing)
>> * A revisit to the design of the edit interface.
>>
>> A full changelog for version 0.6 can be found here:
>>
>>
>> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Winter#Version_0.6.2C_July_13.2C_2014
>>
>> As usual, feedback is welcomed here:
>>
>> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Winter
>>
>> ---
>> Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
>>
>> Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
>>
>>
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>
>
>
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