Re: [WISPA] calea

2007-01-16 Thread Scott Reed
My understanding is that the law requires one of three particular 
protocols/formats and TCPDump is not one of them.  And, store and 
forward is not an option.


Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless wrote:

Sounds simple enough.  Any MT can stream packets a packet capture device.
As far as VPN, that's simple, etc.  So, the only thing that it would require
is double the customers bandwidth during the time they were monitored.
Unless you had a box to store it locally and then ship that off via dvd or
something.  Just as easy to stream it.

Dennis


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 12:43 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Cc: isp-wireless@isp-wireless.com
Subject: [WISPA] calea

Hi All,

I've finally found the folks at the FBI that we need to talk to.  We'll have

a lot more info soon.  We've also got Kris and Larry working on 
documentation for us.


First, CALEA is NOT a data retention requirement.  Do do NOT have to 
routinely store any customer data in order to be compliant.


CALEA is, basically, an electronic wire tap.  WE have to be able to 
surreptitiously intercept a data stream from our customer, copy that to a 
device, then VPN that data to law enforcement.  And ONLY that data.  (Unless


you are also a voip provider, then you'll have to send the voice stream 
differently.)


You MAY be subpoenaed separately for any log files or other records that you

routinely keep in relation to your business.  But that's NOT a part of 
CALEA.


The FBI was very clear.  THEY aren't to be given the ability to snoop on 
your whole network as a part of CALEA.  YOU have to provide the customer 
data stream, after you've broken it out from the rest of your data flow.


There are already standards in place on what and how to do this for the DSL 
industry, cable is working on a standard.  The conversation was more 
technical than I can recall word for word, but it sounds like it would be a 
very very good idea for us to either adopt an existing CALEA standard or 
develop one for our industry.  Anyone care to head up a committee on the 
topic???


I'll have more to you guys as I get it.  Most of the really good stuff will 
likely be available only to WISPA members though.  Certainly the write-up 
that's being done by the legal beagles will only be available to WISPA 
membership.


laters,
Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



  


--
Scott Reed
Owner
NewWays
Wireless Networking
Network Design, Installation and Administration
www.nwwnet.net

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RE: [WISPA] calea

2007-01-16 Thread Rick Harnish
That was my understanding as well Scott.  I can't seem to remember what
formats they said were ok to use, do you?

Rick Harnish
President
OnlyInternet Broadband  Wireless, Inc.
260-827-2482
Founding Member of WISPA

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Scott Reed
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:46 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] calea

My understanding is that the law requires one of three particular 
protocols/formats and TCPDump is not one of them.  And, store and 
forward is not an option.

Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless wrote:
 Sounds simple enough.  Any MT can stream packets a packet capture device.
 As far as VPN, that's simple, etc.  So, the only thing that it would
require
 is double the customers bandwidth during the time they were monitored.
 Unless you had a box to store it locally and then ship that off via dvd or
 something.  Just as easy to stream it.

 Dennis


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
 Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 12:43 PM
 To: wireless@wispa.org
 Cc: isp-wireless@isp-wireless.com
 Subject: [WISPA] calea

 Hi All,

 I've finally found the folks at the FBI that we need to talk to.  We'll
have

 a lot more info soon.  We've also got Kris and Larry working on 
 documentation for us.

 First, CALEA is NOT a data retention requirement.  Do do NOT have to 
 routinely store any customer data in order to be compliant.

 CALEA is, basically, an electronic wire tap.  WE have to be able to 
 surreptitiously intercept a data stream from our customer, copy that to a 
 device, then VPN that data to law enforcement.  And ONLY that data.
(Unless

 you are also a voip provider, then you'll have to send the voice stream 
 differently.)

 You MAY be subpoenaed separately for any log files or other records that
you

 routinely keep in relation to your business.  But that's NOT a part of 
 CALEA.

 The FBI was very clear.  THEY aren't to be given the ability to snoop on 
 your whole network as a part of CALEA.  YOU have to provide the customer 
 data stream, after you've broken it out from the rest of your data flow.

 There are already standards in place on what and how to do this for the
DSL 
 industry, cable is working on a standard.  The conversation was more 
 technical than I can recall word for word, but it sounds like it would be
a 
 very very good idea for us to either adopt an existing CALEA standard or 
 develop one for our industry.  Anyone care to head up a committee on the 
 topic???

 I'll have more to you guys as I get it.  Most of the really good stuff
will 
 likely be available only to WISPA members though.  Certainly the write-up 
 that's being done by the legal beagles will only be available to WISPA 
 membership.

 laters,
 Marlon
 (509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
 42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
 www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



   

-- 
Scott Reed
Owner
NewWays
Wireless Networking
Network Design, Installation and Administration
www.nwwnet.net

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[WISPA] WCA Show

2007-01-16 Thread Jeff Broadwick
Hi All,

If anyone needs a floor pass for the show this week, you can get one at:

http://www.imagestream.com/WCA_Discount.PDF

Regards,

Jeff


Jeff Broadwick
Sales Manager, ImageStream
800-813-5123 x106 (US/Can)
+1 574-935-8484 x106  (Int'l)
+1 574-935-8488   (Fax) 


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Re: [WISPA] calea

2007-01-16 Thread Frank Muto

http://www.askcalea.net/standards.html  See website for more details


 Service Type Technology

 Voice   Wireline / Wireless: TIA TR45 TIA/EIA J-STD-025-A
   TIA TR45 TIA/EIA J-STD-025-B
   Wireline VOIP: (LAES) for Voice over Packet Technologies in Wireline 
Telecommunication Networks   PTSC 
ATIS-1000678 (T1.678v2)
   Cable VOIP Release 1.1: PacketCable Electronic Surveillance 
Specification

   PKT-SP-ESP-I03-40113
   Cable VOIP Release 1.5: PacketCable Electronic Surveillance 
Specification

   PKT-SP-ESP1.5-I01-050128
   Cable VOIP Release 2.0: PacketCable Electronic Surveillance Delivery 
Function
   Collection Function Interface Specification 
PKT-SP-ES-DCI-I01
   PacketCable Electronic Surveillance 
Intra-Network Specification PKT-SP-ES-INF-I02
   Voice over Packet: Electronic Surveillance Needs for Carrier Grade 
Voice over Packet Service

CGVoP
   CDMA2000 VOIP: LAES for CDMA2000 VoIP TIA-1066
   UMTS VOIP: WTSC P.0008 (In Ballot)
 Push-To-Talk   UMTS / GPRS: T1P1 T1.724 Rel. 5 - UMTS
   ESMR: EWA Electronic Surveillance for ESMR Dispatch Ver. 1.0
   CDMA2000 POC: TIA-1072
 Paging   PAGING: Paging, Advanced Messaging, CALEA - Ver. 1.3
 Data Access   UMTS / GPRS: T1P1 T1.724 Rel. 5 - UMTS
   CDMA 2000: TIA TR45 LAES J-STD-025-B, plus Addendum 1
   Wireline: PTSC T1.IAS (In Ballot)




Frank Muto
Co-founder -  Washington Bureau for ISP Advocacy - WBIA
http://gigabytemarch.blog.com/ www.wbia.us






- Original Message - 
From: Rick Harnish [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 8:24 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] calea



That was my understanding as well Scott.  I can't seem to remember what
formats they said were ok to use, do you?

Rick Harnish
President
OnlyInternet Broadband  Wireless, Inc.
260-827-2482
Founding Member of WISPA




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[WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

2007-01-16 Thread Rick Smith
If I were to build a script for my tech support phone answering,
and share it with you all as an FAQ, what do you think the most
common questions are, and how are they answered.  Keep in mind,
that I'm attempting to write a script, so to speak, for an operator
to pick up the phone and cluefully help someone through wireless
or hotspot problems in hotels...

R


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RE: [WISPA] IPsec/UDP and my border NAT gateway

2007-01-16 Thread Eric Rogers
Marshall,

True IPSec is not NAT friendly.  The reason is because the client
connects to the VPN Server, whether it was TCP/UDP and says...I want a
VPN Connection.  The VPN Server, if it is IPSec, will then create a GRE
tunnel directly to the client.  The reason it won't work via NAT is
because you are modifying the headers of the packet at the NAT device,
therefore destroying the integrity of the packet because the checksums
that are sent through (inside the encrypted tunnel) no longer match the
packet.

Now, Cisco (and many others) allow for the modification of the header to
happen, and ignores the header information.  This allows you to NAT the
packets to the clients via the Destination NAT rules.

You will have to create two rules, one that says DNAT UDP traffic from
x.x.x.x port xx to [PUBLIC IP] DNAT to y.y.y.y port xx (use the private
IP you are trying to NAT outbound for y.y.y.y).  You also need to DNAT
(protocol) 47 from x.x.x.x to [PUBLIC IP] DNAT to y.y.y.y.  If you do it
specifically from the VPN server they are trying to contact, you are
still able to do the same IPSec forwarding to other clients.

PPTP is Microsoft's answer to NAT and VPN.  It is VPN friendly, but it
Supposedly is less secure...but it is fine for most businesses, and
works WELL behind NAT on either end.

Eric


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of rabbtux rabbtux
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 1:23 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPsec/UDP and my border NAT gateway

I have one rule that I thought would work with all NAT friendly vpns:

# Masquerade for wireless 10.10.0.0
iptables -A POSTROUTING -s 10.10.0.0/16 -o ppp0 -j MASQUERADE

So is this Centerbeam VPN not 'NAT friendly'?   I don't currently have
the option to pass routable IPs to customers :(

On 1/15/07, Frank [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I seem to remember specifically allowing this UDP years ago when I
used
 iptables, ipfwm and ipchains.

 Once these rules were in place, the Cisco VPN (encapsulated inside
UDP)
 worked fine.

 Frank


  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dennis
  Burgess - 2K Wireless
  Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 4:36 PM
  To: 'WISPA General List'
  Subject: RE: [WISPA] IPsec/UDP and my border NAT gateway
 
  In case someone ddi'ent say, if they are using CISCO IPSEC,
  etc, what happen
  is this.
 
  1.  Client requests via TCP to start a VPN session
  2. Server sends back UDP packets to start the session
  3.  NAT/MASQ blocks these un-authed UDP packets.
 
  The two anaswers are.
 
  1. Tell the customer to change their CISCO VPN client to TCP,
  works just as
  good.
  2. Have the customer pay for a business account and a static IP.
 
  Those are my options for these customers, I have a number of them.
 
  Denni
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
  Behalf Of rabbtux rabbtux
  Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 1:45 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] IPsec/UDP and my border NAT gateway
 
  Anyone have suggestions on what I need to do to allow my customer to
  do this type of VPN.  I currently have customers behind my
  linux/iptables firewall that masquerades them out a single IP.
This
  is the first customer who is having problems.  Do I need a special
  rule to accomodate them??
 
  The customer is using CenterBeam VPN services, and they tell him
that,
  your isp is blocking VPN pass thru.   I'm not blocking anything.
  help!
 
  Thank you kindly,
  marshall
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Re: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

2007-01-16 Thread Mark Nash
Do you have a router?  If yes, then reboot the [EMAIL PROTECTED] router!!!  AND 
DON'T
CALL US AGAIN EVER UNTIL YOU DO!!!

Mark Nash
Network Engineer
UnwiredOnline.Net
350 Holly Street
Junction City, OR 97448
http://www.uwol.net
541-998-
541-998-5599 fax

- Original Message - 
From: Rick Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:50 AM
Subject: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?


 If I were to build a script for my tech support phone answering,
 and share it with you all as an FAQ, what do you think the most
 common questions are, and how are they answered.  Keep in mind,
 that I'm attempting to write a script, so to speak, for an operator
 to pick up the phone and cluefully help someone through wireless
 or hotspot problems in hotels...

 R


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 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

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RE: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

2007-01-16 Thread Forbes Mercy
We use almost all Smartbridge AP's but recently added one of their newer units, 
it just likes to stop associating or passing traffic randomely so that bridge 
is our nightmare.  My sysadmin doesn't like Microtic stuff but he' leaves at 
the week for another job so you can bet I will be buying some because he never 
gave me any good alternatives.  Of course for our new techs we love to call 
them with I can't get my PPP up just to see if they are listening.

In reality the most questions we get are why is your Internet so slow and 
they yell at us because they have viruses and adware even though our startup 
disk includes adware and and AVG.  I swear we have been blamed for divorces and 
the porn they go to see.  It's always our fault.  It makes me wonder if Cable 
gets questions like you let my kid see evil shows too. 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Nash
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:47 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

Do you have a router?  If yes, then reboot the [EMAIL PROTECTED] router!!!  AND 
DON'T
CALL US AGAIN EVER UNTIL YOU DO!!!

Mark Nash
Network Engineer
UnwiredOnline.Net
350 Holly Street
Junction City, OR 97448
http://www.uwol.net
541-998-
541-998-5599 fax

- Original Message - 
From: Rick Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:50 AM
Subject: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?


 If I were to build a script for my tech support phone answering,
 and share it with you all as an FAQ, what do you think the most
 common questions are, and how are they answered.  Keep in mind,
 that I'm attempting to write a script, so to speak, for an operator
 to pick up the phone and cluefully help someone through wireless
 or hotspot problems in hotels...

 R


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 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

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Re: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

2007-01-16 Thread Mike Ireton

#1) IS THE INTERNET DOWN?

A) No, but it sounds like you're having trouble...

#2) IS THE INTERNET DOWN? (I just reinstalled my computer but that 
couldnt't be the problem...)


A) No, but it sounds like your computer isn't set up correctly...

#3) IS THE INTERNET DOWN? (The roofers just left, but I don't know what 
that would have to do with it, the screen says you're down and I want 
service credits now!)


	A) Hmm, it looks like your equipment has been destroyed and no longer 
registers with the service.






Rick Smith wrote:

If I were to build a script for my tech support phone answering,
and share it with you all as an FAQ, what do you think the most
common questions are, and how are they answered.  Keep in mind,
that I'm attempting to write a script, so to speak, for an operator
to pick up the phone and cluefully help someone through wireless
or hotspot problems in hotels...

R




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[WISPA] testorama

2007-01-16 Thread Matt Larsen - Lists
testing the new mail server. 


Matt
vistabeam.com

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Re: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

2007-01-16 Thread George Rogato
Sheesh, I hate to bad mouth smart bridges, but I went that way once, was 
sort of like being blinded while walking in your bare feet and stepping 
into a pit of hot coals. Kinda still haunts me.


I'm not that technically savy, but I have no problem using ssh'ing ito a 
star-os ap and configuring it. And they work.


George



Forbes Mercy wrote:

We use almost all Smartbridge AP's but recently added one of their newer units, it just 
likes to stop associating or passing traffic randomely so that bridge is our nightmare.  
My sysadmin doesn't like Microtic stuff but he' leaves at the week for another job so you 
can bet I will be buying some because he never gave me any good alternatives.  Of course 
for our new techs we love to call them with I can't get my PPP up just to see 
if they are listening.

In reality the most questions we get are why is your Internet so slow and they yell at us because they have viruses and adware even though our startup disk includes adware and and AVG.  I swear we have been blamed for divorces and the porn they go to see.  It's always our fault.  It makes me wonder if Cable gets questions like you let my kid see evil shows too. 


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Nash
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:47 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

Do you have a router?  If yes, then reboot the [EMAIL PROTECTED] router!!!  AND 
DON'T
CALL US AGAIN EVER UNTIL YOU DO!!!

Mark Nash
Network Engineer
UnwiredOnline.Net
350 Holly Street
Junction City, OR 97448
http://www.uwol.net
541-998-
541-998-5599 fax

- Original Message - 
From: Rick Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:50 AM
Subject: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?



If I were to build a script for my tech support phone answering,
and share it with you all as an FAQ, what do you think the most
common questions are, and how are they answered.  Keep in mind,
that I'm attempting to write a script, so to speak, for an operator
to pick up the phone and cluefully help someone through wireless
or hotspot problems in hotels...

R


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Re: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

2007-01-16 Thread George Rogato
Kinda got of the subject there, but I've spent a lot this past year 
retooling my network, and support has dropped to a very low level.


Guess the first thing I woul ask, is if they have rebooted everything, 
their poe adapter, their router, the pc's. in that order.


One major question I learned to ask real fast, like very first, was how 
many computers and laptops do they have and which one doesn't work.
If they say all, it's one direction and if they say, just my mac, etc, 
it's end of the story.




George Rogato wrote:
Sheesh, I hate to bad mouth smart bridges, but I went that way once, was 
sort of like being blinded while walking in your bare feet and stepping 
into a pit of hot coals. Kinda still haunts me.


I'm not that technically savy, but I have no problem using ssh'ing ito a 
star-os ap and configuring it. And they work.


George



Forbes Mercy wrote:
We use almost all Smartbridge AP's but recently added one of their 
newer units, it just likes to stop associating or passing traffic 
randomely so that bridge is our nightmare.  My sysadmin doesn't like 
Microtic stuff but he' leaves at the week for another job so you can 
bet I will be buying some because he never gave me any good 
alternatives.  Of course for our new techs we love to call them with 
I can't get my PPP up just to see if they are listening.


In reality the most questions we get are why is your Internet so 
slow and they yell at us because they have viruses and adware even 
though our startup disk includes adware and and AVG.  I swear we have 
been blamed for divorces and the porn they go to see.  It's always our 
fault.  It makes me wonder if Cable gets questions like you let my 
kid see evil shows too.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
On Behalf Of Mark Nash

Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:47 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

Do you have a router?  If yes, then reboot the [EMAIL PROTECTED] router!!!  AND 
DON'T
CALL US AGAIN EVER UNTIL YOU DO!!!

Mark Nash
Network Engineer
UnwiredOnline.Net
350 Holly Street
Junction City, OR 97448
http://www.uwol.net
541-998-
541-998-5599 fax

- Original Message - From: Rick Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:50 AM
Subject: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?



If I were to build a script for my tech support phone answering,
and share it with you all as an FAQ, what do you think the most
common questions are, and how are they answered.  Keep in mind,
that I'm attempting to write a script, so to speak, for an operator
to pick up the phone and cluefully help someone through wireless
or hotspot problems in hotels...

R


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[WISPA] Interested in learning

2007-01-16 Thread Kimo Crossman
Hi I was hoping to learn from Marlon - not be slapped - if he isn't going to 
provide useful feedback maybe it is better he not jump into the discussion that 
he does not have time to dig into.

Thanks
Kimo

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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:31:09 -0800
From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [WISPA] San Francisco Legislative Analyst  reportreleased
onEarthLink Google WiFi deal - says Start Over
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
reply-type=response

First page, first paragraph.

No I've not read the whole thing yet.  I've got family and customers to take 
care of first.  I'm also working on the next wisp fcc meetings.  Working on 
getting a meeting with the broadband group at the ftc and talking to the fbi 
about calea (more on that in another email).

I dig into the things I can't change when there's time between the things 
that I can.

laters,
Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam


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Re: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?

2007-01-16 Thread Tom DeReggi

HA HA HA.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: Mike Ireton [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 1:13 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Most Common Questions for Tech Support Line ?



#1) IS THE INTERNET DOWN?

A) No, but it sounds like you're having trouble...

#2) IS THE INTERNET DOWN? (I just reinstalled my computer but that 
couldnt't be the problem...)


A) No, but it sounds like your computer isn't set up correctly...

#3) IS THE INTERNET DOWN? (The roofers just left, but I don't know what 
that would have to do with it, the screen says you're down and I want 
service credits now!)


A) Hmm, it looks like your equipment has been destroyed and no longer 
registers with the service.






Rick Smith wrote:

If I were to build a script for my tech support phone answering,
and share it with you all as an FAQ, what do you think the most
common questions are, and how are they answered.  Keep in mind,
that I'm attempting to write a script, so to speak, for an operator
to pick up the phone and cluefully help someone through wireless
or hotspot problems in hotels...

R




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