Re: [WISPA] wifi heat maps

[Russell Tester]

Heya - try covera zone, its not cheap tho. www.celtrio.com 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Rogelio
Sent: Wednesday, 14 May 2008 5:59 p.m.
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] wifi heat maps

I would like to make wifi heat maps, preferably with open source or free
software.

In other words, I would like to walk around a building or drive down a
street and show the coverage and strength of particular SSIDs and have
them
look something like this:

http://www.atdi-us.com/

Does anyone have any suggestions on how I might do this?




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[WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

[Steve]

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080513-philadelphias-municipal-wifi-network-to-go-dark.html




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Re: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity cell

[Mike Hammett]

So there's 4 sets of electronics and two dual polarity antenna per sector?

What size of tower is that?  It looks pretty good sized.


--
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


- Original Message - 
From: "Patrick Leary" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 6:01 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity cell


> Hi folks,
>
> Mike Bushard of Wisper High Speed Internet was kind enough to send me an
> excellent picture of one of their BreezeMAX 802.16e WiMAX cells. It is
> maybe the clearest example of what 4th order diversity, 3-sector cell
> actually looks like hanging on a tower. If you'd like a copy, send me a
> note and I'll reply with the 676k PNG file.
>
> Regards,
>
> Patrick Leary
> AVP, Market Development
> Alvarion, Inc.
> o: 650.314.2628
> c: 760.580.0080
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
>
> 
> This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by
> PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer 
> viruses(84).
> 
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
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> 




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Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

[Brad Belton]

Damn, there goes any hope for free water service too...




Brad






-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Steve
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 7:17 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark


http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080513-philadelphias-municipal-wifi-n
etwork-to-go-dark.html





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Re: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity cell

[Patrick Leary]

Exactly, yes. Not sure how big the tower is Mike. Lots of weight to this
rig for sure though.

Patrick Leary
AVP, Market Development
Alvarion, Inc.
o: 650.314.2628
c: 760.580.0080
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 5:24 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity
cell

So there's 4 sets of electronics and two dual polarity antenna per
sector?

What size of tower is that?  It looks pretty good sized.


--
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


- Original Message - 
From: "Patrick Leary" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 6:01 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity cell


> Hi folks,
>
> Mike Bushard of Wisper High Speed Internet was kind enough to send me
an
> excellent picture of one of their BreezeMAX 802.16e WiMAX cells. It is
> maybe the clearest example of what 4th order diversity, 3-sector cell
> actually looks like hanging on a tower. If you'd like a copy, send me
a
> note and I'll reply with the 676k PNG file.
>
> Regards,
>
> Patrick Leary
> AVP, Market Development
> Alvarion, Inc.
> o: 650.314.2628
> c: 760.580.0080
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
>
>


> This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by
> PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals &
computer 
> viruses(84).
>


>
>
>
>
>


> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>


>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 





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Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

[Sascha Meinrath]

 > Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 09:43:28 -0500
 > From: "Brad Belton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
 > To: "'WISPA General List'" 
 >
 > Damn, there goes any hope for free water service too...
 >
 > 
 >
 > Brad

Don't forget, Philly was a for-fee service -- so the correct retort would be, 
"Damn, there goes any hope for paid water service too..."  ;)

--Sascha



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[WISPA] 2008 WISPA Board Election Announcement

[Mac Dearman]

 

  The 2008 WISPA Board Election schedule has been set by the current Board
of Directors. 

 

Any and all members who are interested in entering the election process for
a seat on the board are encouraged to do so by going to
http://nominations.wispa.org/   - make sure that you qualify for the
position by checking the "hurdle criteria" and then fill out the application
that is also located by a hyper link at the bottom of the page.

 

 We look forward to having a large field of qualified candidates to choose
from and encourage all who feel they have something to contribute, a heart
for the wireless industry and a desire to step up to the plate to serve this
industry to follow through with the completing of the application. We have
seen substantial growth in the past year in both principal and vendor
memberships and as WISPA continues to grow and mature into what will be the
industries finest lobbying association  - we look forward to being a  "loud
voice" in Washington D.C. for all WISPs.

 

 

DEADLINES TO BE AWARE OF:

June 2, 2008 - Applications are due.

 

June 9, 2008 - Qualified applicants compiled and submitted. Applicant
information is made available via the WISPA Web site for member review.

 

June 16, 2008 - Voting begins

 

June 17, 2008 - Voting ends. Standing Board announces election results.

 

 

 

All members are eligible to run for a board position. Only Principal and
Vendor members are eligible to vote in the election of the BoD. Only one
vote per company is allowed and accepted for the BoD election. Instructions
and credentials for voting will be sent via WISPA mail server for each
Vendor Company and each Principal Member of WISPA. If you are a
member/vendor member and do not receive these instructions for voting (as
well as credentials) it is your duty to contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] or call me
at 318.728.8600 to request help in getting your instructions and credentials
for voting in the BoD election.

 

 

ROLE OF THE WISPA BoD

 

The Board of Directors set the policies that will ensure the fulfillment of
all legal and professional responsibility to its members. The BoD also sets
the strategic direction of WISPA and steer it in the direction it deems best
to accomplish the tasks and deeds needed for the advancement of the WISP
community of which it serves.

 

The WISPA BoD is comprised of 7 WISPA Members. Each of the directors shall
serve for a term of one (1) year and until his successor is elected and
qualified, or until such directors earlier death, resignation, incapacity to
serve or removal.

 

All paid WISPA members are eligible for board positions, however the
majority of board seats will be filled by WISPA Principal members as stated
in the bylaws located at http://www.wispa.org/?page_id=4 

 

Sincerely,

Mac Dearman

WISPA Secretary

318.728.8600

Founding member of WISPA




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Re: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity cell

[Ed Spoon - Computer Sales & Services, Inc.]

's OK - saved me from having to ask ;-)



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Patrick Leary
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:53 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity
cell

Uggh. Sorry folks. I thought it was an offlist request like all the
others I have received. 

Patrick

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Patrick Leary
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 10:48 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity
cell

Here you go Marlon...hope all is well

Patrick Leary
AVP, Market Development
Alvarion, Inc.
o: 650.314.2628
c: 760.580.0080
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 7:37 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity
cell

I'll take one please.
marlon

- Original Message - 
From: "Patrick Leary" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 4:01 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity cell


> Hi folks,
>
> Mike Bushard of Wisper High Speed Internet was kind enough to send me
an
> excellent picture of one of their BreezeMAX 802.16e WiMAX cells. It is
> maybe the clearest example of what 4th order diversity, 3-sector cell
> actually looks like hanging on a tower. If you'd like a copy, send me
a
> note and I'll reply with the 676k PNG file.
>
> Regards,
>
> Patrick Leary
> AVP, Market Development
> Alvarion, Inc.
> o: 650.314.2628
> c: 760.580.0080
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
>
>


> This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by
> PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals &
computer 
> viruses(84).
>


>
>
>
>
>


> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>


>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 





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computer viruses(190).











This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by

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computer viruses(43).











This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by
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computer viruses(84).










This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by

PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals &
computer viruses(190).











This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by

PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals &
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Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

[Brad Belton]

Well, true on the original failed Muni-WiFi business model, but my comment
was based on Mr. Huff's statement below.  They can't even give it away!  

EarthLink CEO Rolla Huff said in a statement today. "Unfortunately, our hope
that we could transfer our network to a nonprofit organization that had
planned to offer free WiFi throughout Philadelphia will not be realized.
Since we have exhausted our efforts to find a new owner of the network, our
only responsible alternative now is to remove our network at our cost and
assist our Wi-Fi customers with alternative ways to access the Internet."

Gee, maybe the AT&T, Verizon and Sprint Data cards are a more attractive
mobile solution after all.  Who would have ever thought of THAT!  Duh!  lol




Watch as Clearwire ends up with a similar fate.  I'm honestly surprised
Clearwire stock has even bumped beyond $20 even after all the "great" news
they've had recently.  Goes to show it's all smoke and mirrors with little
or no Clearwire profits in the foreseeable future.



Best,


Brad




-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Sascha Meinrath
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:47 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

 > Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 09:43:28 -0500
 > From: "Brad Belton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
 > To: "'WISPA General List'" 
 >
 > Damn, there goes any hope for free water service too...
 >
 > 
 >
 > Brad

Don't forget, Philly was a for-fee service -- so the correct retort would
be, 
"Damn, there goes any hope for paid water service too..."  ;)

--Sascha




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Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking bro adband’s reach

[reader]

I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is.

Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the 
only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required 
to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the 
census unit each customer and count them up.   At this moment, I have no 
idea what a "census unit" is, how it is determined, or even how to find out 
that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands 
of square miles.   Frankly, I haven't the time.

Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour 
intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers.

Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the 
FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to 
sell us down the river by lobbying for it?   It seemed that no organized 
resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start 
defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with 
mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from 
bankruptcy court to show for it.

Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to 
back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over 
and getting reamed?








- Original Message - 
From: "Rick Harnish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" 
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 6:03 AM
Subject: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband’s reach


>
> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215"FCC approves new method for 
> tracking
> broadband’s reach
>
>
> Filed under: HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?cat=1"General at 7:02 am
> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215#respond";(no comments) HYPERLINK
> "http://www.wispa.org/wp-admin/post.php?action=edit&post=215";(e)
>
> WASHINGTON–As expected, federal regulators on Wednesday voted to overhaul
> the way they measure how widely broadband is available across the United
> States.
>
> For years, the Federal Communications Commission has been drawing up 
> reports
> on the state of U.S. Internet access availability based on methodology 
> that
> considers 200 kilobits per second (Kbps) service to be “high speed”–and 
> such
> access to be widely available even in ZIP codes that may, in reality, 
> house
> only one connection.
>
> The decision to move away from that methodology is potentially 
> significant.
> Critics, both inside and outside the agency, have charged that the
> inadequacy of data that the FCC collects semiannually from Internet 
> service
> providers hinders both the government’s ability to set smart pro-broadband
> policies and could slow investment on the technology side. It could also
> help federal regulators determine whether HYPERLINK
> "http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9897103-7.html"the United States is 
> really
> as far behind in broadband penetration as some international studies have
> suggested during the past few years.
>
> If not for good government data, “our economy would come to a screeching
> halt,” said Commissioner Michael Copps, a Democrat. For example,
> manufacturers depend on unemployment and gross domestic product figures to
> set their production targets, and schools and hospitals rely on U.S. 
> Census
> numbers to project demand for their services, he said.
>
> “When companies and investors put money into e-commerce or voice over
> Internet Protocol or Internet video…they need to know what kind of 
> broadband
> infrastructure America actually has,” Copps said.
>
> Democratic Commissioner Jonathan Adelstein said, “This is really the first
> step toward the national broadband strategy that we so desperately need.”
>
> Despite his support for the new data collection method, FCC Chairman Kevin
> Martin said he believes the United States has made incredible strides in
> broadband deployment since he joined the commission in 2001, with the 
> number
> of lines growing from 9 million to more than 100 million. Still, he
> acknowledged, “there is certainly more work to be done.”
>
> The FCC, as is typical, won’t release the full text of the changes it
> adopted for a few weeks, but here’s a rundown of major components 
> described
> at Wednesday’s meeting:
>
> • 200Kbps speeds are no longer considered “broadband.” Until this point, 
> the
> FCC has considered any service that produces 200Kbps speeds in the upload 
> or
> download direction to be “high speed.” With Wednesday’s vote, that
> methodology is no more. Now, 768Kbps, which is the entry-level speed 
> offered
> by major DSL providers like Verizon, will be considered the low end of
> “basic broadband,” a range that extends to under 1.5Mbps.
> • Broadband service speeds will have to be reported both for uploads and
> downloads. Previously the FCC had six big categories of broadband speeds,
> and they effectively only tracked download speeds. 

Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

[George]

I'm surprised that a for profit wisp didn't try to take over the network 
and rework it's structure and pricing model.

How many times have we heard or thought, if we had the money. this is 
just as good, the equipment is there it just needs to have a ensible 
approach.


Brad Belton wrote:
> Well, true on the original failed Muni-WiFi business model, but my comment
> was based on Mr. Huff's statement below.  They can't even give it away!  
> 
> EarthLink CEO Rolla Huff said in a statement today. "Unfortunately, our hope
> that we could transfer our network to a nonprofit organization that had
> planned to offer free WiFi throughout Philadelphia will not be realized.
> Since we have exhausted our efforts to find a new owner of the network, our
> only responsible alternative now is to remove our network at our cost and
> assist our Wi-Fi customers with alternative ways to access the Internet."
> 
> Gee, maybe the AT&T, Verizon and Sprint Data cards are a more attractive
> mobile solution after all.  Who would have ever thought of THAT!  Duh!  lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Watch as Clearwire ends up with a similar fate.  I'm honestly surprised
> Clearwire stock has even bumped beyond $20 even after all the "great" news
> they've had recently.  Goes to show it's all smoke and mirrors with little
> or no Clearwire profits in the foreseeable future.
> 
> 
> 
> Best,
> 
> 
> Brad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Sascha Meinrath
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:47 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
> 
>  > Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 09:43:28 -0500
>  > From: "Brad Belton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>  > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
>  > To: "'WISPA General List'" 
>  >
>  > Damn, there goes any hope for free water service too...
>  >
>  > 
>  >
>  > Brad
> 
> Don't forget, Philly was a for-fee service -- so the correct retort would
> be, 
> "Damn, there goes any hope for paid water service too..."  ;)
> 
> --Sascha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking bro adband’s reach

[Brian Webster]

There are ways to do this in GIS software and I thought I heard mention
that the FCC was going to provide a site to do this as well. The census
block is the smallest sized geographic polygon that they use as a unit of
study at the Census Bureau. You can download the raw data and create them
yourself. The process will be to geocode (address to lat-long match) your
customer address list then overlay that with the census block data. Most GIS
tools will then be able to add a column with the census block ID each
customer falls within. The exceptions to this will be PO boxes since they
will not geocode properly to the actual customer location.
If the FCC can not provide a tool to do this I am sure I can figure
something out that we could provide to paid WISPA members.



Thank You,
Brian Webster
www.wirelessmapping.com 


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband’s reach


I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is.

Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the
only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required
to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the
census unit each customer and count them up.   At this moment, I have no
idea what a "census unit" is, how it is determined, or even how to find out
that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands
of square miles.   Frankly, I haven't the time.

Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour
intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers.

Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the
FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to
sell us down the river by lobbying for it?   It seemed that no organized
resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start
defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with
mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from
bankruptcy court to show for it.

Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to
back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over
and getting reamed?








- Original Message -
From: "Rick Harnish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" 
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 6:03 AM
Subject: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband’s reach


>
> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215"FCC approves new method for
> tracking
> broadband’s reach
>
>
> Filed under: HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?cat=1"General at 7:02 am
> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215#respond";(no comments) HYPERLINK
> "http://www.wispa.org/wp-admin/post.php?action=edit&post=215";(e)
>
> WASHINGTON–As expected, federal regulators on Wednesday voted to overhaul
> the way they measure how widely broadband is available across the United
> States.
>
> For years, the Federal Communications Commission has been drawing up
> reports
> on the state of U.S. Internet access availability based on methodology
> that
> considers 200 kilobits per second (Kbps) service to be “high speed”–and
> such
> access to be widely available even in ZIP codes that may, in reality,
> house
> only one connection.
>
> The decision to move away from that methodology is potentially
> significant.
> Critics, both inside and outside the agency, have charged that the
> inadequacy of data that the FCC collects semiannually from Internet
> service
> providers hinders both the government’s ability to set smart pro-broadband
> policies and could slow investment on the technology side. It could also
> help federal regulators determine whether HYPERLINK
> "http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9897103-7.html"the United States is
> really
> as far behind in broadband penetration as some international studies have
> suggested during the past few years.
>
> If not for good government data, “our economy would come to a screeching
> halt,” said Commissioner Michael Copps, a Democrat. For example,
> manufacturers depend on unemployment and gross domestic product figures to
> set their production targets, and schools and hospitals rely on U.S.
> Census
> numbers to project demand for their services, he said.
>
> “When companies and investors put money into e-commerce or voice over
> Internet Protocol or Internet video…they need to know what kind of
> broadband
> infrastructure America actually has,” Copps said.
>
> Democratic Commissioner Jonathan Adelstein said, “This is really the first
> step toward the national broadband strategy that we so desperately need.”
>
> Despite his support for the new data collection method, FCC Chairman Kevin
> Martin said he believes th

Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

[Travis Johnson]

It's starting to look like the dot-bomb era again, only in the 
communications realm this time.

Travis
Microserv

Brad Belton wrote:
> Well, true on the original failed Muni-WiFi business model, but my comment
> was based on Mr. Huff's statement below.  They can't even give it away!  
>
> EarthLink CEO Rolla Huff said in a statement today. "Unfortunately, our hope
> that we could transfer our network to a nonprofit organization that had
> planned to offer free WiFi throughout Philadelphia will not be realized.
> Since we have exhausted our efforts to find a new owner of the network, our
> only responsible alternative now is to remove our network at our cost and
> assist our Wi-Fi customers with alternative ways to access the Internet."
>
> Gee, maybe the AT&T, Verizon and Sprint Data cards are a more attractive
> mobile solution after all.  Who would have ever thought of THAT!  Duh!  lol
>
>
>
>
> Watch as Clearwire ends up with a similar fate.  I'm honestly surprised
> Clearwire stock has even bumped beyond $20 even after all the "great" news
> they've had recently.  Goes to show it's all smoke and mirrors with little
> or no Clearwire profits in the foreseeable future.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
>
> Brad
>
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Sascha Meinrath
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:47 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
>
>  > Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 09:43:28 -0500
>  > From: "Brad Belton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>  > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
>  > To: "'WISPA General List'" 
>  >
>  > Damn, there goes any hope for free water service too...
>  >
>  > 
>  >
>  > Brad
>
> Don't forget, Philly was a for-fee service -- so the correct retort would
> be, 
> "Damn, there goes any hope for paid water service too..."  ;)
>
> --Sascha
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>   



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Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking bro adband’s reach

[reader]

Sigh.

I am in an industry filled with jellyfish.

It is unbelievably depressing.







- Original Message - 
From: "Brian Webster" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:37 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband’s reach


> There are ways to do this in GIS software and I thought I heard mention
> that the FCC was going to provide a site to do this as well. The census
> block is the smallest sized geographic polygon that they use as a unit of
> study at the Census Bureau. You can download the raw data and create them
> yourself. The process will be to geocode (address to lat-long match) your
> customer address list then overlay that with the census block data. Most 
> GIS
> tools will then be able to add a column with the census block ID each
> customer falls within. The exceptions to this will be PO boxes since they
> will not geocode properly to the actual customer location.
> If the FCC can not provide a tool to do this I am sure I can figure
> something out that we could provide to paid WISPA members.
>
>
>
> Thank You,
> Brian Webster
> www.wirelessmapping.com 
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband’s reach
>
>
> I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is.
>
> Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the
> only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are 
> required
> to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the
> census unit each customer and count them up.   At this moment, I have no
> idea what a "census unit" is, how it is determined, or even how to find 
> out
> that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over 
> thousands
> of square miles.   Frankly, I haven't the time.
>
> Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather 
> man-hour
> intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers.
>
> Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the
> FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going 
> to
> sell us down the river by lobbying for it?   It seemed that no organized
> resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start
> defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with
> mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from
> bankruptcy court to show for it.
>
> Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to
> back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over
> and getting reamed?
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> 
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Rick Harnish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "'WISPA General List'" 
> Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 6:03 AM
> Subject: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband’s reach
>
>
>>
>> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215"FCC approves new method for
>> tracking
>> broadband’s reach
>>
>>
>> Filed under: HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?cat=1"General at 7:02 am
>> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215#respond";(no comments) HYPERLINK
>> "http://www.wispa.org/wp-admin/post.php?action=edit&post=215";(e)
>>
>> WASHINGTON–As expected, federal regulators on Wednesday voted to overhaul
>> the way they measure how widely broadband is available across the United
>> States.
>>
>> For years, the Federal Communications Commission has been drawing up
>> reports
>> on the state of U.S. Internet access availability based on methodology
>> that
>> considers 200 kilobits per second (Kbps) service to be “high speed”–and
>> such
>> access to be widely available even in ZIP codes that may, in reality,
>> house
>> only one connection.
>>
>> The decision to move away from that methodology is potentially
>> significant.
>> Critics, both inside and outside the agency, have charged that the
>> inadequacy of data that the FCC collects semiannually from Internet
>> service
>> providers hinders both the government’s ability to set smart 
>> pro-broadband
>> policies and could slow investment on the technology side. It could also
>> help federal regulators determine whether HYPERLINK
>> "http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9897103-7.html"the United States is
>> really
>> as far behind in broadband penetration as some international studies have
>> suggested during the past few years.
>>
>> If not for good government data, “our economy would come to a screeching
>> halt,” said Commissioner Michael Copps, a Democrat. For example,
>> manufacturers depend on unemployment and gross domestic product figures 
>> to
>> set their production targets, and schools and hospitals rely on U.S.
>> Census
>> numbers to project dema

Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

[Brad Belton]

The story even gets better here:

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fiw-earthlink14-2008may14,0,2022464.story

Give the network away along with $1M in CASH and still no takers!
Haha...unbelievable...well not really.

This proves there are some business plans that are so bad you can't even PAY
someone to take over.  

Yah, that Muni-WiFI idea is a good one!  Ranks right up there with selling
ice to an Eskimo.  

Best,


Brad



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 2:42 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

It's starting to look like the dot-bomb era again, only in the 
communications realm this time.

Travis
Microserv

Brad Belton wrote:
> Well, true on the original failed Muni-WiFi business model, but my comment
> was based on Mr. Huff's statement below.  They can't even give it away!  
>
> EarthLink CEO Rolla Huff said in a statement today. "Unfortunately, our
hope
> that we could transfer our network to a nonprofit organization that had
> planned to offer free WiFi throughout Philadelphia will not be realized.
> Since we have exhausted our efforts to find a new owner of the network,
our
> only responsible alternative now is to remove our network at our cost and
> assist our Wi-Fi customers with alternative ways to access the Internet."
>
> Gee, maybe the AT&T, Verizon and Sprint Data cards are a more attractive
> mobile solution after all.  Who would have ever thought of THAT!  Duh!
lol
>
>
>
>
> Watch as Clearwire ends up with a similar fate.  I'm honestly surprised
> Clearwire stock has even bumped beyond $20 even after all the "great" news
> they've had recently.  Goes to show it's all smoke and mirrors with little
> or no Clearwire profits in the foreseeable future.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
>
> Brad
>
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Sascha Meinrath
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:47 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
>
>  > Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 09:43:28 -0500
>  > From: "Brad Belton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>  > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
>  > To: "'WISPA General List'" 
>  >
>  > Damn, there goes any hope for free water service too...
>  >
>  > 
>  >
>  > Brad
>
> Don't forget, Philly was a for-fee service -- so the correct retort would
> be, 
> "Damn, there goes any hope for paid water service too..."  ;)
>
> --Sascha
>
>
>

> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>

> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
>


> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>


>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>   




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Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach

[Steve Barnes]

I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like
another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already
short bottom line.  The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in
an hour or so.  I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting
around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census
track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data.

Steve Barnes
Executive Manager
PCS-WIN
RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service
(765)584-2288

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach

I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is.

Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the 
only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required 
to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the 
census unit each customer and count them up.   At this moment, I have no 
idea what a "census unit" is, how it is determined, or even how to find out 
that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands

of square miles.   Frankly, I haven't the time.

Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour

intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers.

Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the 
FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to 
sell us down the river by lobbying for it?   It seemed that no organized 
resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start 
defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with 
mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from 
bankruptcy court to show for it.

Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to 
back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over 
and getting reamed?








- Original Message - 
From: "Rick Harnish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" 
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 6:03 AM
Subject: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach


>
> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215"FCC approves new method for 
> tracking
> broadband's reach
>
>
> Filed under: HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?cat=1"General at 7:02 am
> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215#respond";(no comments) HYPERLINK
> "http://www.wispa.org/wp-admin/post.php?action=edit&post=215";(e)
>
> WASHINGTON-As expected, federal regulators on Wednesday voted to overhaul
> the way they measure how widely broadband is available across the United
> States.
>
> For years, the Federal Communications Commission has been drawing up 
> reports
> on the state of U.S. Internet access availability based on methodology 
> that
> considers 200 kilobits per second (Kbps) service to be "high speed"-and 
> such
> access to be widely available even in ZIP codes that may, in reality, 
> house
> only one connection.
>
> The decision to move away from that methodology is potentially 
> significant.
> Critics, both inside and outside the agency, have charged that the
> inadequacy of data that the FCC collects semiannually from Internet 
> service
> providers hinders both the government's ability to set smart pro-broadband
> policies and could slow investment on the technology side. It could also
> help federal regulators determine whether HYPERLINK
> "http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9897103-7.html"the United States is 
> really
> as far behind in broadband penetration as some international studies have
> suggested during the past few years.
>
> If not for good government data, "our economy would come to a screeching
> halt," said Commissioner Michael Copps, a Democrat. For example,
> manufacturers depend on unemployment and gross domestic product figures to
> set their production targets, and schools and hospitals rely on U.S. 
> Census
> numbers to project demand for their services, he said.
>
> "When companies and investors put money into e-commerce or voice over
> Internet Protocol or Internet video.they need to know what kind of 
> broadband
> infrastructure America actually has," Copps said.
>
> Democratic Commissioner Jonathan Adelstein said, "This is really the first
> step toward the national broadband strategy that we so desperately need."
>
> Despite his support for the new data collection method, FCC Chairman Kevin
> Martin said he believes the United States has made incredible strides in
> broadband deployment since he joined the commission in 2001, with the 
> number
> of lines growing from 9 million to more than 100 million. Still, he
> acknowledged, "there is certainly more work to be done."
>
> The FCC, as is typical, won't release the full text of the chang

Re: [WISPA] traffic reporting

[Joshua Rowe]

Travis,
 If they are using Cisco Routers you can use ManageEngine NetFlow Analyzer. It
provides source and destination info along with traffic info (utilization,
speed, packets, volume, etc.) There is nothing to change on the client or
server side, other than configure the router to send the info. to the
monitoring host. They have a free demo, and it's free to monitor one device,
runs on a windows box. Check it out and see if it will fit the bill.

Josh Rowe

--
NexGenAccess Inc. 


-- Original Message ---
From: Travis Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: WISPA General List 
Sent: Thu, 01 May 2008 20:48:54 -0600
Subject: Re: [WISPA] traffic reporting

> The problem is they need a "nice, easy to use" web interface to 
> lookupIP addresses, dates, etc.
> 
> Travis
> 
> Sam Tetherow wrote:You might be able to get ntop to show what you 
> need or you could use netflow and nfcapd along with custom 
> accounting scripts?
> 
> Sam Tetherow
> Sandhills Wireless
> 
> Travis Johnson wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I posted this message a few months ago, and never found anything 
> that was what I needed, so I'm posting again. :)
> 
> I have several school districts looking for a way to monitor their 
> internet traffic. They want to see where each IP address is going, 
> etc. They do NOT need filtering or any bandwidth management or 
> anything like that... just a reporting system. It can't be a proxy 
> system or anything that will require them to change all the client settings.
> 
> I would prefer some type of a linux solution that I could put on a 
> box with two ethernet ports and just run as transparent bridging.
> 
> Any suggestions?
> 
> thanks,
> 
> Travis
> Microserv
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> 
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--- End of Original Message ---




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Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach

[reader]

I"m going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other 
person...  I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately.
==

Maybe I should be more clear.   I fail to see why I should have to conduct
even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result
absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians
claim credit for the "spread of broadband", even though that "spread" has
been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our
own money and 12 hour days.

I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit
from this.   The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the
Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed
"expansion research" done for them.

I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at
all.   I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to
door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then
figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing
development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the
FCC or any "agency".   I'm DOING the work that needs to be done.   Why on
earth should I do free labor while doing it?

But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions
for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending
a dime in research.

I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not
covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people.
I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything
from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half
to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's
going to be close to two hours.

So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort
and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free?

Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal
govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a
contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of
all things.   If that's the case, my customers will become "unserved".   And
there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state
level.   Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and
smiling like some lobotomized sheep.







- Original Message - 
From: "Steve Barnes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" 
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach


>I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like
> another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already
> short bottom line.  The current reporting is a pain but can be completed 
> in
> an hour or so.  I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting
> around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census
> track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data.
>
> Steve Barnes
> Executive Manager
> PCS-WIN
> RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service
> (765)584-2288
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
>
> I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is.
>
> Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the
> only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are 
> required
> to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the
> census unit each customer and count them up.   At this moment, I have no
> idea what a "census unit" is, how it is determined, or even how to find 
> out
> that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over 
> thousands
>
> of square miles.   Frankly, I haven't the time.
>
> Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather 
> man-hour
>
> intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers.
>
> Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the
> FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going 
> to
> sell us down the river by lobbying for it?   It seemed that no organized
> resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start
> defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with
> mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from
> bankruptcy court to show for it.
>
> Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to
> back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over
> and getting reamed?
>
>
>
>
>
> ++

Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

[reader]

I just got back from Eskimo land.   How ironic... :)

Estimated c ost of operating the network is 3.6 million.

100,000 estimated possible customers.

36 dollars operating cost per customer, estimated.

6000 actual customers.

600 dollars per customer operating costs.

Could someone tell me what the blazes these costs are?

My business has costs of $7 per customer, not including wages, per month. 
This is bandwidth, leases, replacement of equipment, etc.

I see why even a million in cash would not create an incentive to take on 
this nightmare.











- Original Message - 
From: "Brad Belton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" 
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:06 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark


> The story even gets better here:
>
> http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fiw-earthlink14-2008may14,0,2022464.story
>
> Give the network away along with $1M in CASH and still no takers!
> Haha...unbelievable...well not really.
>
> This proves there are some business plans that are so bad you can't even 
> PAY
> someone to take over.
>
> Yah, that Muni-WiFI idea is a good one!  Ranks right up there with selling
> ice to an Eskimo.  
>
> Best,
>
>
> Brad
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 2:42 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
>
> It's starting to look like the dot-bomb era again, only in the
> communications realm this time.
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Brad Belton wrote:
>> Well, true on the original failed Muni-WiFi business model, but my 
>> comment
>> was based on Mr. Huff's statement below.  They can't even give it away!
>>
>> EarthLink CEO Rolla Huff said in a statement today. "Unfortunately, our
> hope
>> that we could transfer our network to a nonprofit organization that had
>> planned to offer free WiFi throughout Philadelphia will not be realized.
>> Since we have exhausted our efforts to find a new owner of the network,
> our
>> only responsible alternative now is to remove our network at our cost and
>> assist our Wi-Fi customers with alternative ways to access the Internet."
>>
>> Gee, maybe the AT&T, Verizon and Sprint Data cards are a more attractive
>> mobile solution after all.  Who would have ever thought of THAT!  Duh!
> lol
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Watch as Clearwire ends up with a similar fate.  I'm honestly surprised
>> Clearwire stock has even bumped beyond $20 even after all the "great" 
>> news
>> they've had recently.  Goes to show it's all smoke and mirrors with 
>> little
>> or no Clearwire profits in the foreseeable future.
>>
>>
>>
>> Best,
>>
>>
>> Brad
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>> Behalf Of Sascha Meinrath
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:47 PM
>> To: wireless@wispa.org
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
>>
>>  > Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 09:43:28 -0500
>>  > From: "Brad Belton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>  > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark
>>  > To: "'WISPA General List'" 
>>  >
>>  > Damn, there goes any hope for free water service too...
>>  >
>>  > 
>>  >
>>  > Brad
>>
>> Don't forget, Philly was a for-fee service -- so the correct retort would
>> be,
>> "Damn, there goes any hope for paid water service too..."  ;)
>>
>> --Sascha
>>
>>
>>
> 
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
> 
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 
> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
> 
> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
>
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>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
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>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> ---

Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach

[Chuck McCown - 2]

I guess a benefit I can see (out west here) is that we constantly hear of 
the need for government to step in and provide broadband because of the lack 
of such.  If there was a comprehensive coverage map, projects like UTOPIA, 
iProvo and Philladelphia/Earthlink might not ever launch.  They might be 
more inclined to allow WISPs to become ETC and USF eligible as well as 
become RUS borrowers and POLRs.  But first we have to prove we are getting 
the job done.  Coverage maps are one way to prove that.


- Original Message - 
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 2:49 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach


> I"m going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other
> person...  I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately.
> ==
>
> Maybe I should be more clear.   I fail to see why I should have to conduct
> even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result
> absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some 
> politicians
> claim credit for the "spread of broadband", even though that "spread" has
> been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking 
> our
> own money and 12 hour days.
>
> I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to 
> benefit
> from this.   The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the
> Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed
> "expansion research" done for them.
>
> I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at
> all.   I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going 
> to
> door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then
> figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing
> development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the
> FCC or any "agency".   I'm DOING the work that needs to be done.   Why on
> earth should I do free labor while doing it?
>
> But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the 
> directions
> for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without 
> spending
> a dime in research.
>
> I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas 
> not
> covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up 
> people.
> I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers 
> everything
> from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a 
> half
> to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's
> going to be close to two hours.
>
> So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort
> and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free?
>
> Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal
> govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a
> contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, 
> of
> all things.   If that's the case, my customers will become "unserved". 
> And
> there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the 
> state
> level.   Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and
> smiling like some lobotomized sheep.
>
>
>
>
> 
> 
>
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Steve Barnes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "'WISPA General List'" 
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's 
> reach
>
>
>>I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like
>> another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already
>> short bottom line.  The current reporting is a pain but can be completed
>> in
>> an hour or so.  I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting
>> around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census
>> track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data.
>>
>> Steve Barnes
>> Executive Manager
>> PCS-WIN
>> RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service
>> (765)584-2288
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>> Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's 
>> reach
>>
>> I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is.
>>
>> Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the
>> only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are
>> required
>> to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of 
>> the
>> census unit each customer and count them up.   At this moment, I have no
>> idea what a "census unit" is, how it is determined, or even how to find
>> out
>> that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over
>> thousands
>>
>> of square miles

Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach

[reader]

I kinda think that the news about municipal operatoins would provide 
reasonable evidence why public provision of such is is SUCH a bad idea...






- Original Message - 
From: "Chuck McCown - 2" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:56 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach


>I guess a benefit I can see (out west here) is that we constantly hear of
> the need for government to step in and provide broadband because of the 
> lack
> of such.  If there was a comprehensive coverage map, projects like UTOPIA,
> iProvo and Philladelphia/Earthlink might not ever launch.  They might be
> more inclined to allow WISPs to become ETC and USF eligible as well as
> become RUS borrowers and POLRs.  But first we have to prove we are getting
> the job done.  Coverage maps are one way to prove that.
>
>
> - Original Message - 
> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 2:49 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's 
> reach
>
>
>> I"m going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other
>> person...  I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately.
>> ==
>>
>> Maybe I should be more clear.   I fail to see why I should have to 
>> conduct
>> even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result
>> absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some
>> politicians
>> claim credit for the "spread of broadband", even though that "spread" has
>> been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking
>> our
>> own money and 12 hour days.
>>
>> I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to
>> benefit
>> from this.   The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the
>> Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed
>> "expansion research" done for them.
>>
>> I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at
>> all.   I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going
>> to
>> door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then
>> figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a 
>> housing
>> development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by 
>> the
>> FCC or any "agency".   I'm DOING the work that needs to be done.   Why on
>> earth should I do free labor while doing it?
>>
>> But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the
>> directions
>> for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without
>> spending
>> a dime in research.
>>
>> I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas
>> not
>> covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up
>> people.
>> I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers
>> everything
>> from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a
>> half
>> to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's
>> going to be close to two hours.
>>
>> So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort
>> and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free?
>>
>> Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal
>> govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a
>> contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP,
>> of
>> all things.   If that's the case, my customers will become "unserved".
>> And
>> there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the
>> state
>> level.   Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and
>> smiling like some lobotomized sheep.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> 
>>
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "Steve Barnes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "'WISPA General List'" 
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's
>> reach
>>
>>
>>>I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like
>>> another great way for some company to make extra income off of my 
>>> already
>>> short bottom line.  The current reporting is a pain but can be completed
>>> in
>>> an hour or so.  I am not privileged to have GIS software and data 
>>> setting
>>> around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census
>>> track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data.
>>>
>>> Steve Barnes
>>> Executive Manager
>>> PCS-WIN
>>> RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service
>>> (765)584-2288
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>>> Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM
>>> To: WISPA General List
>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's
>>> reach
>>>
>>> I'm curious to know WISPA's officia

[WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Patrick Nix Jr.]

Just curious to NAT or not to NAT, 

 

We have been operating with NATed addresses out to our customers on a
10.x.x.x private network, the trouble is more and more customers are
wanting to use services that require a public IP, such as remote
security camera monitoring, etc... we currently have been offering a
static public IP for $30/mo in addition to subscription, but this is not
so popular.  Is anyone offering public IPs out to customers and how do
you do so when you have more customers than IP addresses.  FYI, we are
using MT routers to handle DHCP and NATing.

 

Thanks

 

__

 

Patrick Nix, Jr.,

csweb.net

(800) 638-2614

http://www.csweb.net  

E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 



ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail
and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.



 




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Re: [WISPA] Philadelphia's municipal WiFi network to go dark

[David E. Smith]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Could someone tell me what the blazes these costs are?

The metro-wi-fi setups I've seen (admittedly not many) have crazy 
utilities costs. Using something like Tropos gear (the stuff I'm most 
familiar with), you need one repeater every four square blocks or so. 
Each of those repeaters needs electricity. If you're going for "total" 
coverage, that probably means getting on utility poles.

That's where it gets nasty - many power companies consider every utility 
pole to be a separate location, and will try to hit you with a 
facilities charge for every individual pole. Even if the unit doesn't 
draw very much electricity, there's usually a minimum charge. That's 
fifteen or twenty bucks a month, per unit, and you're probably looking 
at hundreds of units to provide blanket coverage of a decent urban area.

That doesn't even cover all the startup costs, where you buy those 
hundreds of units, and probably have to pay hundreds of linemen to mount 
them, and so on.

Many of us can provide coverage with wi-fi gear to whole cities with 
just one or two towers, but that's usually "fixed" at both ends, with a 
large directional antenna at the customer's home or office. Since the 
end-user's device (a laptop, Pocket PC, or similar) can only transmit a 
couple hundred feet, you more-or-less have to have hundreds of "towers," 
with all the expenses thereof.

If metro-wi-fi had taken off and gotten hundreds of thousands of 
subscribers, yeah, it might have been eventually profitable. But cell 
phone data cards already filled the "Internet in your pocket" niche 
quite nicely.

David Smith
MVN.net



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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[David E. Smith]

Patrick Nix Jr. wrote:

> We have been operating with NATed addresses out to our customers on a
> 10.x.x.x private network, the trouble is more and more customers are
> wanting to use services that require a public IP, such as remote
> security camera monitoring, etc... we currently have been offering a
> static public IP for $30/mo in addition to subscription, but this is not
> so popular.  Is anyone offering public IPs out to customers and how do
> you do so when you have more customers than IP addresses.  FYI, we are
> using MT routers to handle DHCP and NATing.

How can you get by without offering public addresses? Sorry, I sorta 
thought that was a "given."

If you don't have enough IP addresses, get some more. Your upstream ISP 
should be able to help you out with this easily enough - they'll 
probably want justification for your usage of the IP space to satisfy 
ARIN requirements, but "one IP per customer" is generally sufficient for 
that.

You'll want to continue using private addressing for some things (your 
network infrastructure, possibly even your CPE devices), just to 
conserve the limited number of public IPs available. (By some estimates, 
the entire IPv4 address space will be gone in four or five years.)

If you need more than a couple thousand IPs, you can probably qualify 
for a direct allocation from ARIN.

David Smith
MVN.net



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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Travis Johnson]

We have always offered a single public IP address to every customer 
(dial-up, DSL, wireless, fiber, etc.) and then we charge $5/mo for each 
extra IP.

It makes life SO much easier to track down customers when law 
enforcement comes with a subpeona, because the customer's IP never changes.

We have our own IP space from ARIN. Costs us $5.20 per month per Class C.

Travis
Microserv

Patrick Nix Jr. wrote:
> Just curious to NAT or not to NAT, 
>
>  
>
> We have been operating with NATed addresses out to our customers on a
> 10.x.x.x private network, the trouble is more and more customers are
> wanting to use services that require a public IP, such as remote
> security camera monitoring, etc... we currently have been offering a
> static public IP for $30/mo in addition to subscription, but this is not
> so popular.  Is anyone offering public IPs out to customers and how do
> you do so when you have more customers than IP addresses.  FYI, we are
> using MT routers to handle DHCP and NATing.
>
>  
>
> Thanks
>
>  
>
> __
>
>  
>
> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
>
> csweb.net
>
> (800) 638-2614
>
> http://www.csweb.net  
>
> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>  
>
> 
>
> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail
> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
>
> 
>
>  
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>   



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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Brad Belton]

Agreed.  There is no good reason not to give one public IP to each client.
There are many reasons why it is a bad idea to NAT clients behind private
IPs.  

Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:24 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

We have always offered a single public IP address to every customer 
(dial-up, DSL, wireless, fiber, etc.) and then we charge $5/mo for each 
extra IP.

It makes life SO much easier to track down customers when law 
enforcement comes with a subpeona, because the customer's IP never changes.

We have our own IP space from ARIN. Costs us $5.20 per month per Class C.

Travis
Microserv

Patrick Nix Jr. wrote:
> Just curious to NAT or not to NAT, 
>
>  
>
> We have been operating with NATed addresses out to our customers on a
> 10.x.x.x private network, the trouble is more and more customers are
> wanting to use services that require a public IP, such as remote
> security camera monitoring, etc... we currently have been offering a
> static public IP for $30/mo in addition to subscription, but this is not
> so popular.  Is anyone offering public IPs out to customers and how do
> you do so when you have more customers than IP addresses.  FYI, we are
> using MT routers to handle DHCP and NATing.
>
>  
>
> Thanks
>
>  
>
> __
>
>  
>
> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
>
> csweb.net
>
> (800) 638-2614
>
> http://www.csweb.net  
>
> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>  
>
> 
>
> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail
> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
>
> 
>
>  
>
>
>
>


> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>


>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
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>
>
>   




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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Patrick Nix Jr.]

So then, static or DHCP'd

__
 
Patrick Nix, Jr.,
csweb.net
(800) 638-2614
http://www.csweb.net
E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 

ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail
and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:31 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

Agreed.  There is no good reason not to give one public IP to each
client.
There are many reasons why it is a bad idea to NAT clients behind
private
IPs.  

Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:24 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

We have always offered a single public IP address to every customer 
(dial-up, DSL, wireless, fiber, etc.) and then we charge $5/mo for each 
extra IP.

It makes life SO much easier to track down customers when law 
enforcement comes with a subpeona, because the customer's IP never
changes.

We have our own IP space from ARIN. Costs us $5.20 per month per Class
C.

Travis
Microserv

Patrick Nix Jr. wrote:
> Just curious to NAT or not to NAT, 
>
>  
>
> We have been operating with NATed addresses out to our customers on a
> 10.x.x.x private network, the trouble is more and more customers are
> wanting to use services that require a public IP, such as remote
> security camera monitoring, etc... we currently have been offering a
> static public IP for $30/mo in addition to subscription, but this is
not
> so popular.  Is anyone offering public IPs out to customers and how do
> you do so when you have more customers than IP addresses.  FYI, we are
> using MT routers to handle DHCP and NATing.
>
>  
>
> Thanks
>
>  
>
> __
>
>  
>
> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
>
> csweb.net
>
> (800) 638-2614
>
> http://www.csweb.net  
>
> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>  
>
> 
>
> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this
e-mail
> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
>
> 
>
>  
>
>
>
>



> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>



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> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
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>   





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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Brad Belton]

I don't think there is anything wrong with DHCPing public IPs, but if we
used DHCP we would reserve an IP for each client to insure the client always
gets the same IP address.

We own and manage a CPE router for every client, so this is really a
non-issue for our network design.  For those that don't want to provide a
router for each client then it might be a little more to handle with DHCP,
but certainly still manageable.

Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Patrick Nix Jr.
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:45 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

So then, static or DHCP'd

__
 
Patrick Nix, Jr.,
csweb.net
(800) 638-2614
http://www.csweb.net
E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 

ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail
and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:31 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

Agreed.  There is no good reason not to give one public IP to each
client.
There are many reasons why it is a bad idea to NAT clients behind
private
IPs.  

Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:24 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

We have always offered a single public IP address to every customer 
(dial-up, DSL, wireless, fiber, etc.) and then we charge $5/mo for each 
extra IP.

It makes life SO much easier to track down customers when law 
enforcement comes with a subpeona, because the customer's IP never
changes.

We have our own IP space from ARIN. Costs us $5.20 per month per Class
C.

Travis
Microserv

Patrick Nix Jr. wrote:
> Just curious to NAT or not to NAT, 
>
>  
>
> We have been operating with NATed addresses out to our customers on a
> 10.x.x.x private network, the trouble is more and more customers are
> wanting to use services that require a public IP, such as remote
> security camera monitoring, etc... we currently have been offering a
> static public IP for $30/mo in addition to subscription, but this is
not
> so popular.  Is anyone offering public IPs out to customers and how do
> you do so when you have more customers than IP addresses.  FYI, we are
> using MT routers to handle DHCP and NATing.
>
>  
>
> Thanks
>
>  
>
> __
>
>  
>
> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
>
> csweb.net
>
> (800) 638-2614
>
> http://www.csweb.net  
>
> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>  
>
> 
>
> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this
e-mail
> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
>
> 
>
>  
>
>
>
>



> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>



>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>   





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--

Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Mike Hammett]

PPPoE


--
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


- Original Message - 
From: "Patrick Nix Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:45 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema


> So then, static or DHCP'd
>
> __
>
> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
> csweb.net
> (800) 638-2614
> http://www.csweb.net
> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> 
> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail
> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
> 
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Brad Belton
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:31 PM
> To: 'WISPA General List'
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema
>
> Agreed.  There is no good reason not to give one public IP to each
> client.
> There are many reasons why it is a bad idea to NAT clients behind
> private
> IPs.
>
> Best,
>
>
> Brad
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:24 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema
>
> We have always offered a single public IP address to every customer
> (dial-up, DSL, wireless, fiber, etc.) and then we charge $5/mo for each
> extra IP.
>
> It makes life SO much easier to track down customers when law
> enforcement comes with a subpeona, because the customer's IP never
> changes.
>
> We have our own IP space from ARIN. Costs us $5.20 per month per Class
> C.
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Patrick Nix Jr. wrote:
>> Just curious to NAT or not to NAT,
>>
>>
>>
>> We have been operating with NATed addresses out to our customers on a
>> 10.x.x.x private network, the trouble is more and more customers are
>> wanting to use services that require a public IP, such as remote
>> security camera monitoring, etc... we currently have been offering a
>> static public IP for $30/mo in addition to subscription, but this is
> not
>> so popular.  Is anyone offering public IPs out to customers and how do
>> you do so when you have more customers than IP addresses.  FYI, we are
>> using MT routers to handle DHCP and NATing.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>>
>> __
>>
>>
>>
>> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
>>
>> csweb.net
>>
>> (800) 638-2614
>>
>> http://www.csweb.net 
>>
>> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
>> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this
> e-mail
>> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 
> 
> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
> 
> 
> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
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> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> 




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WISPA Wirel

[WISPA] Interesting information about Gmail

[Cliff LeBoeuf]

This is an interesting article if you have a gmail account...

http://gmailblog.blogspot.com/2008/03/2-hidden-ways-to-get-more-from-your.ht
ml

Of course you all probably already knew about this trick as I am always the
last to know... :)

Cliff LeBoeuf
985-879-3219
www.cssla.com
www.triparish.net



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Re: [WISPA] Real good actual photo of a 4th order diversity cell

[Drew Lentz]

Please send! That would be great :)
Thanks Patrick! Hope all is well!

-drew



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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Bryan Scott]

Patrick Nix Jr. wrote:
> So then, static or DHCP'd


We use DHCP for everyone, then "hard code" it in the dhcp config file 
for those who want to get the same one each time (i.e. static IP).
As long as you can track who has what and when, it doesn't really 
matter.  You'll need to know when the feds come knockin'.  Your DHCP log 
is your best friend.  Best to keep a few months if you have space; some 
investigations go on for a long time.  For the sake of both the innocent 
and the guilty it's good to have some overlap in case IP's change from 
one customer to the next.

-- Bryan



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Re: [WISPA] 60 miles (90 KM) P2MP with CPE on Vessels, possible?

[Tom Sharples]

Cool! Does that mean my Model 28 teletype has a future after all??

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2424647132102049544

Tom Sharples
WA6HAS
QCWA


> RTTY or AMTOR




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Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach

[Brian Webster]

Steve,
This data is not being reported by census tracts I believe it is 
supposed
to be done to the census block or block group which is a much smaller area.
I'll dig around for the free on line sources to see if there is a way to do
this by anyone without having GIS software. If I dig that up I'll post some
links.



Thank You,
Brian Webster
www.wirelessmapping.com 


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Steve Barnes
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:19 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's
reach


I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like
another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already
short bottom line.  The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in
an hour or so.  I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting
around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census
track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data.

Steve Barnes
Executive Manager
PCS-WIN
RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service
(765)584-2288

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach

I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is.

Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the
only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required
to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the
census unit each customer and count them up.   At this moment, I have no
idea what a "census unit" is, how it is determined, or even how to find out
that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands

of square miles.   Frankly, I haven't the time.

Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour

intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers.

Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the
FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to
sell us down the river by lobbying for it?   It seemed that no organized
resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start
defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with
mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from
bankruptcy court to show for it.

Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to
back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over
and getting reamed?








- Original Message -
From: "Rick Harnish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" 
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 6:03 AM
Subject: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach


>
> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215"FCC approves new method for
> tracking
> broadband's reach
>
>
> Filed under: HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?cat=1"General at 7:02 am
> HYPERLINK "http://www.wispa.org/?p=215#respond";(no comments) HYPERLINK
> "http://www.wispa.org/wp-admin/post.php?action=edit&post=215";(e)
>
> WASHINGTON-As expected, federal regulators on Wednesday voted to overhaul
> the way they measure how widely broadband is available across the United
> States.
>
> For years, the Federal Communications Commission has been drawing up
> reports
> on the state of U.S. Internet access availability based on methodology
> that
> considers 200 kilobits per second (Kbps) service to be "high speed"-and
> such
> access to be widely available even in ZIP codes that may, in reality,
> house
> only one connection.
>
> The decision to move away from that methodology is potentially
> significant.
> Critics, both inside and outside the agency, have charged that the
> inadequacy of data that the FCC collects semiannually from Internet
> service
> providers hinders both the government's ability to set smart pro-broadband
> policies and could slow investment on the technology side. It could also
> help federal regulators determine whether HYPERLINK
> "http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9897103-7.html"the United States is
> really
> as far behind in broadband penetration as some international studies have
> suggested during the past few years.
>
> If not for good government data, "our economy would come to a screeching
> halt," said Commissioner Michael Copps, a Democrat. For example,
> manufacturers depend on unemployment and gross domestic product figures to
> set their production targets, and schools and hospitals rely on U.S.
> Census
> numbers to project demand for their services, he said.
>
> "When companies and investors put money into e-commerce or voice over
> Internet Protocol or Internet video.they need to know what kind of
> broadband
> infrastru

Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach

[Brian Webster]

Well based on your comments I can certainly understand your point of view
and frustrations. I was just trying to help out and assist WISP's so they
can easily comply with the new requirements.



Thank You,
Brian Webster
www.wirelessmapping.com 


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:49 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's
reach


I"m going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other
person...  I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately.
==

Maybe I should be more clear.   I fail to see why I should have to conduct
even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result
absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians
claim credit for the "spread of broadband", even though that "spread" has
been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our
own money and 12 hour days.

I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit
from this.   The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the
Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed
"expansion research" done for them.

I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at
all.   I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to
door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then
figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing
development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the
FCC or any "agency".   I'm DOING the work that needs to be done.   Why on
earth should I do free labor while doing it?

But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions
for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending
a dime in research.

I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not
covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people.
I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything
from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half
to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's
going to be close to two hours.

So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort
and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free?

Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal
govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a
contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of
all things.   If that's the case, my customers will become "unserved".   And
there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state
level.   Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and
smiling like some lobotomized sheep.







- Original Message -
From: "Steve Barnes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" 
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach


>I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like
> another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already
> short bottom line.  The current reporting is a pain but can be completed
> in
> an hour or so.  I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting
> around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census
> track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data.
>
> Steve Barnes
> Executive Manager
> PCS-WIN
> RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service
> (765)584-2288
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
>
> I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is.
>
> Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the
> only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are
> required
> to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the
> census unit each customer and count them up.   At this moment, I have no
> idea what a "census unit" is, how it is determined, or even how to find
> out
> that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over
> thousands
>
> of square miles.   Frankly, I haven't the time.
>
> Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather
> man-hour
>
> intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers.
>
> Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the
> FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going
> to
> sell us down the river by lobb

Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach

[David E. Smith]

> I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to
> benefit
> from this.   The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the
> Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed
> "expansion research" done for them.

If the collated data are made publicly available, there's no reason you
can't gain exactly the same benefits as 'they' do. This is assuming data
are made available at a sufficiently granular level as to be of benefit to
anyone; to the best of my knowledge, this hasn't been the case in the
past.

As an aside, at least on the "old" FCC 477, you have the option of
requesting that your company's data not be publicly disclosed. I'm not
immediately sure why anyone would choose that option, but it's there.

David Smith
MVN.net





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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[David E. Smith]

> PPPoE

Y'know, I've never understood why many ISPs are so fond of PPPOE. The only
benefits anyone has ever articulated to me are an alleged improvement in
ease of tracking customer-IP associations, and your DHCP server and tower
logs should take care of that for you just as easily. In the meantime, you
risk annoying your customers, because they have to take special steps to
set up a new computer or router, whereas with a DHCP server things will
"just work" 90% of the time.

Not meaning to troll, I'm genuinely curious.

David Smith
MVN.net





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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Travis Johnson]

And to take it one step further, I've never understood using DHCP for
customers. It makes it 10x easier for a rogue client to get on your
network if you run DHCP instead of just static. You don't have to
maintain any logs, or worry about your DHCP server having problems,
etc. It seems one step easier than DHCP.

Travis
Microserv

David E. Smith wrote:

  
PPPoE

  
  
Y'know, I've never understood why many ISPs are so fond of PPPOE. The only
benefits anyone has ever articulated to me are an alleged improvement in
ease of tracking customer-IP associations, and your DHCP server and tower
logs should take care of that for you just as easily. In the meantime, you
risk annoying your customers, because they have to take special steps to
set up a new computer or router, whereas with a DHCP server things will
"just work" 90% of the time.

Not meaning to troll, I'm genuinely curious.

David Smith
MVN.net





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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Chuck McCown - 2]

If you have ever renumbered your entire network due to changing upstream 
providers or running out of IP, you will wish you had used DHCP everywhere.
  - Original Message - 
  From: Travis Johnson 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; WISPA General List 
  Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 9:37 PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema


  And to take it one step further, I've never understood using DHCP for 
customers. It makes it 10x easier for a rogue client to get on your network if 
you run DHCP instead of just static. You don't have to maintain any logs, or 
worry about your DHCP server having problems, etc. It seems one step easier 
than DHCP.

  Travis
  Microserv

  David E. Smith wrote: 
PPPoE

Y'know, I've never understood why many ISPs are so fond of PPPOE. The only
benefits anyone has ever articulated to me are an alleged improvement in
ease of tracking customer-IP associations, and your DHCP server and tower
logs should take care of that for you just as easily. In the meantime, you
risk annoying your customers, because they have to take special steps to
set up a new computer or router, whereas with a DHCP server things will
"just work" 90% of the time.

Not meaning to troll, I'm genuinely curious.

David Smith
MVN.net





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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Brad Belton]

I think it's fair to say that any ISP of size has in fact done this once if
not twice.  It's not the end of the world unless there was little planning
done beforehand.  I've experienced both.  

We do not use DHCP anywhere, but within the client LAN environment.
However, I don't see where running DHCP and reserving IP's for specific MAC
addresses would be of much risk.  The additional headache of the occasional
client replacing their router (hence requiring you to update your DHCP MAC
table) might be worth it in some cases.

Everyone is going to have their own opinion as to what they feel is going to
be the best solution for their network and their target market.  Ours has
been to own and manage a CPE router for every client connection.  This gives
us a clear demarcation point where our network ends and the client network
begins.

Regarding the original poster's question as to whether to assign public IP
space vs. NAT'd IP space to end clients, I think the resounding opinion is
to use public IP space.

Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 10:40 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

If you have ever renumbered your entire network due to changing upstream
providers or running out of IP, you will wish you had used DHCP everywhere.
  - Original Message - 
  From: Travis Johnson 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; WISPA General List 
  Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 9:37 PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema


  And to take it one step further, I've never understood using DHCP for
customers. It makes it 10x easier for a rogue client to get on your network
if you run DHCP instead of just static. You don't have to maintain any logs,
or worry about your DHCP server having problems, etc. It seems one step
easier than DHCP.

  Travis
  Microserv

  David E. Smith wrote: 
PPPoE

Y'know, I've never understood why many ISPs are so fond of PPPOE. The only
benefits anyone has ever articulated to me are an alleged improvement in
ease of tracking customer-IP associations, and your DHCP server and tower
logs should take care of that for you just as easily. In the meantime, you
risk annoying your customers, because they have to take special steps to
set up a new computer or router, whereas with a DHCP server things will
"just work" 90% of the time.

Not meaning to troll, I'm genuinely curious.

David Smith
MVN.net






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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Jonathan Schmidt]

MAC/modem cloning is a real problem for cable Internet companies.  Modern
DOCSIS 1.1 and above cable modems have MD5 hashing the firmware with the
MAC but somehow the clones get stolen MAC addresses and there are
successful thieves.   Perhaps it's downgrading the firmware to DOCSIS 1.0
where it is possible without the hash...I don't know how they do it.

However, MAC cloning for less secure equipment in customer hands seems
like an invitation to a theft of service.  Any device, PC or router, can
switcheroo the old MAC.

. . . J o n a t h a n



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 11:04 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

I think it's fair to say that any ISP of size has in fact done this once
if not twice.  It's not the end of the world unless there was little
planning done beforehand.  I've experienced both.  

We do not use DHCP anywhere, but within the client LAN environment.
However, I don't see where running DHCP and reserving IP's for specific
MAC addresses would be of much risk.  The additional headache of the
occasional client replacing their router (hence requiring you to update
your DHCP MAC
table) might be worth it in some cases.

Everyone is going to have their own opinion as to what they feel is going
to be the best solution for their network and their target market.  Ours
has been to own and manage a CPE router for every client connection.  This
gives us a clear demarcation point where our network ends and the client
network begins.

Regarding the original poster's question as to whether to assign public IP
space vs. NAT'd IP space to end clients, I think the resounding opinion is
to use public IP space.

Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 10:40 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

If you have ever renumbered your entire network due to changing upstream
providers or running out of IP, you will wish you had used DHCP
everywhere.
  - Original Message -
  From: Travis Johnson
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; WISPA General List
  Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 9:37 PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema


  And to take it one step further, I've never understood using DHCP for
customers. It makes it 10x easier for a rogue client to get on your
network if you run DHCP instead of just static. You don't have to maintain
any logs, or worry about your DHCP server having problems, etc. It seems
one step easier than DHCP.

  Travis
  Microserv

  David E. Smith wrote: 
PPPoE

Y'know, I've never understood why many ISPs are so fond of PPPOE. The only
benefits anyone has ever articulated to me are an alleged improvement in
ease of tracking customer-IP associations, and your DHCP server and tower
logs should take care of that for you just as easily. In the meantime, you
risk annoying your customers, because they have to take special steps to
set up a new computer or router, whereas with a DHCP server things will
"just work" 90% of the time.

Not meaning to troll, I'm genuinely curious.

David Smith
MVN.net




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---

Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Bryan Scott]

Travis Johnson wrote:
> And to take it one step further, I've never understood using DHCP for 
> customers. It makes it 10x easier for a rogue client to get on your 
> network if you run DHCP instead of just static. You don't have to 
> maintain any logs, or worry about your DHCP server having problems, etc. 
> It seems one step easier than DHCP.

We control what radios are allowed to connect to our AP's, the router 
built into the radio can be enabled (customer has no access to radio 
interface) as can MAC address masquerading, and DHCP servers can be 
configured to only accept or ignore specific MAC addresses, so the rogue 
client argument is a moot point for us.

Our DHCP server has been humming along as-is for 5 years with occasional 
reboots for reasons unassociated with DHCP (boss shutting down circuit 
breaker, techs tripping on power cords, accidental reset button 
depression).  Another non-issue.

The situation we run into, in addition to what Chuck mentioned about 
renumbering, is adding, moving, or changing network segments, or moving 
customers from one segment to another without having access to the gear 
inside (i.e. re-aim to different tower while customer's at work).  Short 
DHCP leases also make it harder to host services.  (Those who want to 
though simply ask for a static IP, which we assign via DHCP to their 
router or computer. Statics come from different pools making other IP 
management tasks easier.)

If everything is hard-coded, that's one more step to walk 
customers/installers through when installing, configuring, 
troubleshooting, etc.  Since we don't own/maintain any CPE beyond the 
radio itself, DHCP is the best fit for us.

-- Bryan



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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[Travis Johnson]

We've renumbered our entire network once, when we got our own IP space. 
It took us about 30 days from start to finish... that was 6 years ago. 
Have never had an issue since then... but we have our own /18 block 
now... ;)

Travis
Microserv

Chuck McCown - 2 wrote:
> If you have ever renumbered your entire network due to changing upstream 
> providers or running out of IP, you will wish you had used DHCP everywhere.
>   - Original Message - 
>   From: Travis Johnson 
>   To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; WISPA General List 
>   Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 9:37 PM
>   Subject: Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema
>
>
>   And to take it one step further, I've never understood using DHCP for 
> customers. It makes it 10x easier for a rogue client to get on your network 
> if you run DHCP instead of just static. You don't have to maintain any logs, 
> or worry about your DHCP server having problems, etc. It seems one step 
> easier than DHCP.
>
>   Travis
>   Microserv
>
>   David E. Smith wrote: 
> PPPoE
> 
> Y'know, I've never understood why many ISPs are so fond of PPPOE. The only
> benefits anyone has ever articulated to me are an alleged improvement in
> ease of tracking customer-IP associations, and your DHCP server and tower
> logs should take care of that for you just as easily. In the meantime, you
> risk annoying your customers, because they have to take special steps to
> set up a new computer or router, whereas with a DHCP server things will
> "just work" 90% of the time.
>
> Not meaning to troll, I'm genuinely curious.
>
> David Smith
> MVN.net
>
>
>
>
> 
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>   
>
> --
>
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema

[reader]

There's a couple of nicely elegant options here...  One is that you NAT only 
at your core point(s), and at that point you do a 1:1 IP translation.  You 
can then choose who has direct IP connection and who doesn't at your core 
points, without any additional routing.  For those who don't, you merely 
masq...

I have chosen to use all public addressing for every device, from the CPE to 
backhauls, etc.   But my CPE does NAT.   If my customer needs a public IP, I 
route him a small subnet for his use.

This DOES suck up a lot of IP's.   My 2.4 AP's have a /27 assigned to them, 
and the 5 ghz have a /26 assigned wherever I expect to fully load the AP. 
So far, I've managed to get about 90 clients for every /24 I put in use. 
Perhaps not efficient, but I do have IP growth room in most places still. 
I expect to put around 45 clients for each 5 ghz using 20 mhz channels and 
20 or so for one with 10 mhz channels and about 10 clients at most for a 5 
mhz channel (900 mhz for instance).

My 2.4's are definitely fully loaded at 29 clients per AP - and they run in 
B mode.







- Original Message - 
From: "Patrick Nix Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 2:19 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Question concerning IP Schema


> Just curious to NAT or not to NAT,
>
>
>
> We have been operating with NATed addresses out to our customers on a
> 10.x.x.x private network, the trouble is more and more customers are
> wanting to use services that require a public IP, such as remote
> security camera monitoring, etc... we currently have been offering a
> static public IP for $30/mo in addition to subscription, but this is not
> so popular.  Is anyone offering public IPs out to customers and how do
> you do so when you have more customers than IP addresses.  FYI, we are
> using MT routers to handle DHCP and NATing.
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> __
>
>
>
> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
>
> csweb.net
>
> (800) 638-2614
>
> http://www.csweb.net 
>
> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
> 
>
> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail
> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
>
> 
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[WISPA] questions regarding utilizing 4940 - 4990 MHz safety band

[Rogelio]

I have two questions regarding some 4.9 GHz radios I'm provisinging, both
relating to how I provision channels for access and backhaul traffic.

I have 5 sites with 2 cameras a piece. Each camera has a 3 Mbps streaming
requirement. I'm told to use the 4.9 GHz safety band, as the city has (or
will have) a license for it soon. My setup is as follows: 10 cameras -> 5
radios (2 cameras per radio location) --(access traffic)--> tall building A
--(backhaul traffic)--> tall building B (which will be saving video)

Assuming that a 20 MHz channel supports 54 Mbps of throughput (b/c of OFDM,
right?), my questions are...

(1) Someone told me that each radio (which supports two cameras) can use a
separate 5 Mhz channel at 13.5 Mbps.  So can I simply have these 5 cameras
use 5 MHz (using 25 MHz of my 50 available MHz), and then use the remaing 20
GHz to backhaul to building two, where the video will be stored?

(2) I heard that one can get "more" out of the 50 MHz bandwidth if s/he
uses, say, 9 blocks of 5 MHz channels, rather than using 2 blocks of 20 MHz
and then trying to squeeze 5 MHz on the side. I'm not sure all the reasons,
but it had to do with something to do with the guard band and meeting the
emission requirements inside and outside the band. Could someone please
confirm this?

Any helpful advice in the right direction would be greatly appreciated.



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