[WISPA] Recommend a Product?

2010-08-12 Thread Steven McGehee
I have an unusual (for us, anyway) need for a point-to-point wireless 
product that is only needing to cover about 50 yards. This is a building 
to building setup, with one side (the masters side) needing to shoot 
through the exterior brick wall of one building (it will be mounted in 
the ceiling space) and then through a clear window on the other 
building. We currently serve this need with an old Tsunami 5.8Ghz, 8Mbps 
bridge, but it's old, and we want to go ahead and replace it.

I only need something like 10-20Mbps full duplex, and I'd prefer it to 
have a small-ish beamwidth and use low power. I'm leaning on using a 
Trango Atlas or T-Link, but something less capable and with a smaller 
channel size (those use 20Mhz) would be great. Unfortunately just doing 
ethernet in this scenario is not possible.

If you guys have any recommendations, please contact me offlist -- thanks!



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Re: [WISPA] SilverLining

2010-08-12 Thread Ralph
That is interesting, but I'm really having trouble figuring out the business
model of this particular captive portal implementation.

 

From what I see, it is centered on Batman/Robin based radios, requires a
hefty monthly fee, and plays ads.

Unless I am reading wrong, you can't connect your legacy network if you
choose not to use that type of mesh, or even a mesh at all.

The ads seem to be chosen by the Silverlining People for lack of a better
term. Is that correct?

I don't see any support for Authorize.net , iPay, or any other system other
than PayPal.

What if you don't want to have ads?

What/where is the open source part? Is it just  the Batman/Robin stuff?

Please give us more information about how this portal could be used for any
other thing than serving ads on these Meraki-ish radios, which are by no
means carrier class.

 

Thanks

 

Ralph

 

 

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Jerry Richardson
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 12:38 AM
To: motor...@afmug.com; WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] SilverLining

 

We rolled out SilverLining's new OPEN SOURCE captive portal system with
PayPal and OpenX ad server integration on Sunday. 

 

Yesterday we had 1000 splash page displays so we are seeing some good usage.
I'm sure that there are a fair number of users that are re-logging in after
the 30 minutes/50MB limits are reached but that's just driving them back to
the splash page where they see ads.

 

We are not seeing takers on the paid service, but that's fine - I'm really
after the Ad Revenue anyway. we'll see some takers on the 15/month service
which will help as well. Plus we will be advertising our services at no cost
to us.

 

We have the software running on an Alix board and it's doing fine. I'm
pleased.

 

Blog page here:
http://blog.silverliningnetworks.com/2010/08/announcing-the-silversplash-ope
n-source-captive-portal.html

 

Discussion here: http://groups.google.com/group/silversplash

 

 

 

 




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Re: [WISPA] Recommend a Product?

2010-08-12 Thread Scott Carullo
Use two Ubiquiti NSM2 radios (or the loco version if its out)

It will go through all the walls you need, transfer in excess of 20MB and 
is very inexpensive (less than $200) for all of it.

My 2 cents...

Scott Carullo
Brevard Wireless
321-205-1100 x102



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I have an unusual (for us, anyway) need for a point-to-point wireless 
product that is only needing to cover about 50 yards. This is a building 
to building setup, with one side (the masters side) needing to shoot 
through the exterior brick wall of one building (it will be mounted in 
the ceiling space) and then through a clear window on the other 
building. We currently serve this need with an old Tsunami 5.8Ghz, 8Mbps 
bridge, but it's old, and we want to go ahead and replace it.

I only need something like 10-20Mbps full duplex, and I'd prefer it to 
have a small-ish beamwidth and use low power. I'm leaning on using a 
Trango Atlas or T-Link, but something less capable and with a smaller 
channel size (those use 20Mhz) would be great. Unfortunately just doing 
ethernet in this scenario is not possible.

If you guys have any recommendations, please contact me 

Re: [WISPA] Recommend a Product?

2010-08-12 Thread Mark Dueck
Tranzeo has FDD radios that allow 20, 10 and 5 Mhz channel widths.  They
come with a built in 24dbi antenna.  You have to buy the channel shields
though.

On 08/12/2010 07:43 AM, Steven McGehee wrote:
 I have an unusual (for us, anyway) need for a point-to-point wireless 
 product that is only needing to cover about 50 yards. This is a building 
 to building setup, with one side (the masters side) needing to shoot 
 through the exterior brick wall of one building (it will be mounted in 
 the ceiling space) and then through a clear window on the other 
 building. We currently serve this need with an old Tsunami 5.8Ghz, 8Mbps 
 bridge, but it's old, and we want to go ahead and replace it.

 I only need something like 10-20Mbps full duplex, and I'd prefer it to 
 have a small-ish beamwidth and use low power. I'm leaning on using a 
 Trango Atlas or T-Link, but something less capable and with a smaller 
 channel size (those use 20Mhz) would be great. Unfortunately just doing 
 ethernet in this scenario is not possible.

 If you guys have any recommendations, please contact me offlist -- thanks!


 
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Re: [WISPA] Recommend a Product?

2010-08-12 Thread Josh Luthman
Nanostation or loco M would be my choice too.  The antennas are 90* though.

On Aug 12, 2010 10:36 AM, Mark Dueck m...@netking.bz wrote:

Tranzeo has FDD radios that allow 20, 10 and 5 Mhz channel widths.  They
come with a built in 24dbi antenna.  You have to buy the channel shields
though.


On 08/12/2010 07:43 AM, Steven McGehee wrote:
 I have an unusual (for us, anyway) need for a point...



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Re: [WISPA] Recommend a Product?

2010-08-12 Thread Mark Dueck




Are the Nanostation or Loco M full duplex?

On 08/12/2010 09:37 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:

  Nanostation or loco M would be my choice too. The antennas are
90* though.
  On Aug 12, 2010 10:36 AM, "Mark Dueck" m...@netking.bz
wrote:

Tranzeo has FDD radios that allow 20, 10 and 5 Mhz channel widths. They
come with a built in 24dbi antenna. You have to buy the channel shields
though.

On 08/12/2010 07:43 AM, Steven McGehee wrote:
 I have an unusual (for us, anyway) need for a point...
  
  




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Re: [WISPA] POE Switch

2010-08-12 Thread Scott Parsons
Hello Paolo,

The 8 port non compliant switch should be available in September.
It has 7 POE ports and 1 uplink port.

It comes with DIN rail adapters for DIN rail mounting. The switches come
with the green DIN rail adapters.
http://tyconpower.com/products/images/TP-SW_DIN_Rail_mounting.jpg

It won't have an way to manage the switch remotely. We are working to add
that functionality to our switches but it is a long project. 

Scott
Tycon Power Systems
PH: 801-432-0003
FAX: 801-618-4220
sco...@tyconpower.com
www.tyconpower.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Paolo Di Francesco
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 5:32 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] POE Switch

also the temperature range is not good for industrial environment.

The switch range is -10C,70C while the midspan is 0,40C

Yes double input would be appreciated

Also a web/terminal (and SMNP?) to see what is happening would be maybe
more interesting than the led on the device itself.

About 1U, I would prefer to have the possibility to have half size (1/2
19) in a frame in order to have multiple things in the 1U slice.

If somebody is in touch with them... ;)


 The Tycon Power Midspan injectors look promising, but like you said they
 need to add redundant power supply inputs and switches/jumpers to reverse
 voltage polarity in order to support more products.  Sure would be nice if
 they added the current indicator too so you know if the radio up top is
 plugged in/powered up or not.  Lightening surge suppressor on each port is
 also a must have for a device like this.
 
 Hopefully their design team is listening to people like us!
 
 Best,
 
 
 Brad
 
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Jerry Richardson
 Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 10:45 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] POE Switch
 
 Just talked to Tycon Power.
 
 The image on the PDF is incorrect. The correct image is:

http://www.wlanparts.com/product/TP-SW5/High-Speed-10100Mb-5-Port-POE-Switch
 .html
 
 I was more interested in a 4/8 port POE device with redundant power supply
 inputs and switches/jumpers to reverse polarity. I called and spoke with
 Tycon and described this and he said to look for something around end of
 Sept/Early Oct. I guess they had something like this in the works.
 
 Combine that with a managed switch or a Router Board and it's a nice clean
 tower cabinet.
 
 No hacking required. 
 
 - Jerry
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Mike Hammett
 Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 8:05 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] POE Switch
 
   They also appear to have a 12 port pass through model.
 
 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com
 
 
 
 On 8/11/2010 3:11 AM, Paolo Di Francesco wrote:
 Hi all,

 I saw this interesting switch which is has NON stardard POE, i.e. good
 for 12-24V devices:

 http://tyconpower.com/products/files/TP-SW8_POE_Switch_Spec_Sheet.pdf

 It seems a good idea instead of multiple POE (but also a single POE, is
 a single point of failure...)

 Anybody using it? Comments?

 Thank you

 
 


 
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-- 


Ing. Paolo Di Francesco

Teleinform s.r.l.
Sede Legale: Via Francesco Paolo Di Blasi 1, 90144 Palermo
Unita' Operativa: Via Regione Siciliana 49, 90046 Monreale (Palermo)
Tel: +39-091-6408576, +39-091-6404501
Fax: +39-091-6406200

http://www.wikitel.it
http://www.teleinform.com







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Re: [WISPA] Recommend a Product?

2010-08-12 Thread Josh Luthman
No.  They are 802.11 or Airmax (TDMA).  Mimo 2x2.

You get up to 150 megs HDX and can do up to 100 one way.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373



On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 11:58 AM, Mark Dueck m...@netking.bz wrote:
 Are the Nanostation or Loco M full duplex?

 On 08/12/2010 09:37 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:

 Nanostation or loco M would be my choice too.  The antennas are 90* though.

 On Aug 12, 2010 10:36 AM, Mark Dueck m...@netking.bz wrote:

 Tranzeo has FDD radios that allow 20, 10 and 5 Mhz channel widths.  They
 come with a built in 24dbi antenna.  You have to buy the channel shields
 though.

 On 08/12/2010 07:43 AM, Steven McGehee wrote:
 I have an unusual (for us, anyway) need for a point...


 
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 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

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Re: [WISPA] Recommend a Product?

2010-08-12 Thread Jerry Richardson
Is it really not possible to fly Fiber or outdoor Arial Cat5?

If not, are there phone lines between the buildings? If so, these work 
extremely well: http://netsys-direct.com/proddetail.php?prod=NV-600EKIT

Otherwise a true FDD radio is going to be pricey.

- Jerry

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mark Dueck
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 8:58 AM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Recommend a Product?

Are the Nanostation or Loco M full duplex?

On 08/12/2010 09:37 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:

Nanostation or loco M would be my choice too.  The antennas are 90* though.
On Aug 12, 2010 10:36 AM, Mark Dueck 
m...@netking.bzmailto:m...@netking.bz wrote:

Tranzeo has FDD radios that allow 20, 10 and 5 Mhz channel widths.  They
come with a built in 24dbi antenna.  You have to buy the channel shields
though.

On 08/12/2010 07:43 AM, Steven McGehee wrote:
 I have an unusual (for us, anyway) need for a point...











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Re: [WISPA] Recommend a Product?

2010-08-12 Thread Steven McGehee
Thanks Jerry, and the rest of you gents, for your recommendations -- I'm 
taking them all into consideration, although wireless is still likely 
the route we'll go.

Have a great afternoon.



On 8/12/2010 12:04, Jerry Richardson wrote:


Is it really not possible to fly Fiber or outdoor Arial Cat5?

If not, are there phone lines between the buildings? If so, these work 
extremely well: http://netsys-direct.com/proddetail.php?prod=NV-600EKIT


Otherwise a true FDD radio is going to be pricey.

- Jerry

*From:* wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] 
*On Behalf Of *Mark Dueck

*Sent:* Thursday, August 12, 2010 8:58 AM
*To:* wireless@wispa.org
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Recommend a Product?

Are the Nanostation or Loco M full duplex?

On 08/12/2010 09:37 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:

Nanostation or loco M would be my choice too.  The antennas are 90* 
though.


On Aug 12, 2010 10:36 AM, Mark Dueck m...@netking.bz
mailto:m...@netking.bz wrote:

Tranzeo has FDD radios that allow 20, 10 and 5 Mhz channel widths.
 They
come with a built in 24dbi antenna.  You have to buy the channel
shields
though.


On 08/12/2010 07:43 AM, Steven McGehee wrote:
 I have an unusual (for us, anyway) need for a point...

  
  
  
  


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[WISPA] Powerstation2 with very low throughput

2010-08-12 Thread Mark Dueck




Hi Everyone,

I had a bunch of my equipment burnt on a tower. Previously I had all
Tranzeo. Now I put up a Powerstation2 for my main AP with a Tranzeo 17
dbi sector. I'm getting a max throughput of around 3 mbits. That's
looking at the throughput graphs in the PS2. Once I'm reaching that
throughput though, pings to certain clients go way up to over 2
seconds. I do my testing from linux, using

ping IP -i .01 -s 1024 or even take the 1024 up to 2048.

I can do this to 3 clients at 1024 packet size.. Once I start
pushing it to a 4th client, pings get lost and replies come back 2
seconds later.

Is this normal?? I'm looking into it because I have clients
complaining they loose connection completely sometimes. When I ping to
3 clients, I can hardly ping any other clients. no response. I've
pinged the AP during this whole time and it never flaps. Very solid at
a few ms.

The previous Tranzeo AP had no problems. Clients are mostly Tranzeo
SL2s and their distances vary from 1/2 mile to about 3 miles

Here's the station list with their signal strength:


  

  Station MAC
  Signal, dBm
  Noise, dBm
  Tx Rate
  Rx Rate
  Idle (sec)


  00:15:6D:1A:0A:05
  -54
  -96
  48M
  36M
  0


  00:60:B3:E9:24:25
  -69
  -96
  24M
  18M
  0


  00:13:4F:10:09:0F
  -49
  -96
  48M
  36M
  0


  00:15:6D:1A:0F:D7
  -74
  -96
  11M
  18M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:C5:DB
  -78
  -96
  18M
  5M
  15


  00:1C:F0:EA:57:06
  -75
  -96
  11M
  11M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:C5:C2
  -72
  -96
  36M
  18M
  15


  00:60:B3:45:37:60
  -75
  -96
  11M
  12M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:97:96
  -52
  -96
  54M
  36M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:8E:E5
  -64
  -96
  48M
  11M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:A6:E6
  -65
  -96
  36M
  24M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:C3:91
  -77
  -96
  5M
  12M
  15


  00:13:4F:00:B7:FA
  -82
  -96
  36M
  1M
  15


  00:60:B3:59:89:54
  -72
  -96
  36M
  18M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:C5:C4
  -77
  -96
  18M
  12M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:A7:00
  -76
  -96
  11M
  12M
  15


  00:0B:6B:37:E5:2B
  -67
  -96
  24M
  36M
  15


  00:13:4F:10:01:D5
  -54
  -96
  11M
  36M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:8B:83
  -68
  -96
  36M
  18M
  0


  00:13:4F:00:D8:08
  -81
  -96
  12M
  1M
  0


  00:13:4F:10:02:3E
  -73
  -96
  48M
  12M
  30


  00:60:B3:E9:22:A0
  -84
  -96
  1M
  12M
  0

  



Anyone have any idea what it could be?





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Re: [WISPA] Powerstation2 with very low throughput

2010-08-12 Thread Chris Gotstein
My guess would be the low symbol rate you have on a few clients.  Try
getting their signal better, or temporarily disabling them to see if
that helps.

   
Chris Gotstein, Network Engineer, U.P. Logon/Computer Connection U.P.
http://uplogon.com | +1 906 774 4847 | ch...@uplogon.com

On 8/12/2010 12:56 PM, Mark Dueck wrote:
 Hi Everyone,
 
 I had a bunch of my equipment burnt on a tower.  Previously I had all
 Tranzeo.  Now I put up a Powerstation2 for my main AP with a Tranzeo 17
 dbi sector.  I'm getting a max throughput of around 3 mbits.  That's
 looking at the throughput graphs in the PS2.  Once I'm reaching that
 throughput though, pings to certain clients go way up to over 2
 seconds.  I do my testing from linux, using
 
 ping IP -i .01 -s 1024  or even take the 1024 up to 2048.
 
 I can do this to 3 clients at 1024 packet size..Once I start pushing
 it to a 4th client, pings get lost and replies come back 2 seconds later.
 
 Is this normal??  I'm looking into it because I have clients complaining
 they loose connection completely sometimes.  When I ping to 3 clients, I
 can hardly ping any other clients.  no response.  I've pinged the AP
 during this whole time and it never flaps. Very solid at a few ms.
 
 The previous Tranzeo AP had no problems.  Clients are mostly Tranzeo
 SL2s and their distances vary from 1/2 mile to about 3 miles
 
 Here's the station list with their signal strength:
 
 Station MAC   Signal, dBm Noise, dBm  Tx Rate Rx Rate 
 Idle (sec)
 00:15:6D:1A:0A:05 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-54 -96 48M 
 36M 0
 00:60:B3:E9:24:25 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-69 -96 24M 
 18M 0
 00:13:4F:10:09:0F http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-49 -96 48M 
 36M 0
 00:15:6D:1A:0F:D7 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-74 -96 11M 
 18M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C5:DB http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-78 -96 18M 
 5M  15
 00:1C:F0:EA:57:06 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-75 -96 11M 
 11M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C5:C2 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-72 -96 36M 
 18M 15
 00:60:B3:45:37:60 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-75 -96 11M 
 12M 0
 00:13:4F:00:97:96 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-52 -96 54M 
 36M 0
 00:13:4F:00:8E:E5 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-64 -96 48M 
 11M 0
 00:13:4F:00:A6:E6 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-65 -96 36M 
 24M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C3:91 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-77 -96 5M  
 12M 15
 00:13:4F:00:B7:FA http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-82 -96 36M 
 1M  15
 00:60:B3:59:89:54 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-72 -96 36M 
 18M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C5:C4 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-77 -96 18M 
 12M 0
 00:13:4F:00:A7:00 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-76 -96 11M 
 12M 15
 00:0B:6B:37:E5:2B http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-67 -96 24M 
 36M 15
 00:13:4F:10:01:D5 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-54 -96 11M 
 36M 0
 00:13:4F:00:8B:83 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-68 -96 36M 
 18M 0
 00:13:4F:00:D8:08 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-81 -96 12M 
 1M  0
 00:13:4F:10:02:3E http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-73 -96 48M 
 12M 30
 00:60:B3:E9:22:A0 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-84 -96 1M  
 12M 0
 
 
 
 Anyone have any idea what it could be?
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Powerstation2 with very low throughput

2010-08-12 Thread Faisal Imtiaz
With Ubiquity gear the normal / standard for troubleshooting is 
something like this:-

... Update to the latest firmware (from their site)
  also review what fixes in the latest beta (posted in the forum)
  Try setting up your AP without Auto Ack and setup the Ack distance 
manually.

Regards.

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet  Telecom

On 8/12/2010 2:08 PM, Chris Gotstein wrote:
 My guess would be the low symbol rate you have on a few clients.  Try
 getting their signal better, or temporarily disabling them to see if
 that helps.

    
 Chris Gotstein, Network Engineer, U.P. Logon/Computer Connection U.P.
 http://uplogon.com | +1 906 774 4847 | ch...@uplogon.com

 On 8/12/2010 12:56 PM, Mark Dueck wrote:
 Hi Everyone,

 I had a bunch of my equipment burnt on a tower.  Previously I had all
 Tranzeo.  Now I put up a Powerstation2 for my main AP with a Tranzeo 17
 dbi sector.  I'm getting a max throughput of around 3 mbits.  That's
 looking at the throughput graphs in the PS2.  Once I'm reaching that
 throughput though, pings to certain clients go way up to over 2
 seconds.  I do my testing from linux, using

 pingIP  -i .01 -s 1024  or even take the 1024 up to 2048.

 I can do this to 3 clients at 1024 packet size..Once I start pushing
 it to a 4th client, pings get lost and replies come back 2 seconds later.

 Is this normal??  I'm looking into it because I have clients complaining
 they loose connection completely sometimes.  When I ping to 3 clients, I
 can hardly ping any other clients.  no response.  I've pinged the AP
 during this whole time and it never flaps. Very solid at a few ms.

 The previous Tranzeo AP had no problems.  Clients are mostly Tranzeo
 SL2s and their distances vary from 1/2 mile to about 3 miles

 Here's the station list with their signal strength:

 Station MAC  Signal, dBm Noise, dBm  Tx Rate Rx Rate 
 Idle (sec)
 00:15:6D:1A:0A:05http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-54 -96 48M 
 36M 0
 00:60:B3:E9:24:25http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-69 -96 24M 
 18M 0
 00:13:4F:10:09:0Fhttp://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-49 -96 48M 
 36M 0
 00:15:6D:1A:0F:D7http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-74 -96 11M 
 18M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C5:DBhttp://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-78 -96 18M 
 5M  15
 00:1C:F0:EA:57:06http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-75 -96 11M 
 11M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C5:C2http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-72 -96 36M 
 18M 15
 00:60:B3:45:37:60http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-75 -96 11M 
 12M 0
 00:13:4F:00:97:96http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-52 -96 54M 
 36M 0
 00:13:4F:00:8E:E5http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-64 -96 48M 
 11M 0
 00:13:4F:00:A6:E6http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-65 -96 36M 
 24M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C3:91http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-77 -96 5M  
 12M 15
 00:13:4F:00:B7:FAhttp://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-82 -96 36M 
 1M  15
 00:60:B3:59:89:54http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-72 -96 36M 
 18M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C5:C4http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-77 -96 18M 
 12M 0
 00:13:4F:00:A7:00http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-76 -96 11M 
 12M 15
 00:0B:6B:37:E5:2Bhttp://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-67 -96 24M 
 36M 15
 00:13:4F:10:01:D5http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-54 -96 11M 
 36M 0
 00:13:4F:00:8B:83http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-68 -96 36M 
 18M 0
 00:13:4F:00:D8:08http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-81 -96 12M 
 1M  0
 00:13:4F:10:02:3Ehttp://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-73 -96 48M 
 12M 30
 00:60:B3:E9:22:A0http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi#-84 -96 1M  
 12M 0



 Anyone have any idea what it could be?





 
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Re: [WISPA] Wireless Digest, Vol 32, Issue 25

2010-08-12 Thread Fred Moyer
Responding from the digest list, so hopefully this thread won't break,
but I've added responses inline also:

On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 10:00 AM,  wireless-requ...@wispa.org wrote:
 From: Jerry Richardson jrichard...@aircloud.com
 Ralph,
 Answers inline

 - Jerry

 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On 
 Behalf Of Ralph
 Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 6:51 AM
 To: 'WISPA General List'
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] SilverLining

 That is interesting, but I'm really having trouble figuring out the business 
 model of this particular captive portal implementation.

 From what I see, it is centered on Batman/Robin based radios
 Don't look at the website. that is no longer the model. The captive portal is 
 network agnostic.  In our case we drive all WiFi traffic to our head end over 
 VLANs. We can also tunnel over anyone's ISP making every HotSpot an extension 
 of our network and use the same Captive Portal

That is correct, we have end of lifed our wifi repeater based service.
 This open source captive portal we have released runs on any Linux
device.  We have some additional services that will be listed on our
website in due time.

 , requires a hefty monthly fee, and plays ads.

The feedback that we got from customers, and our comparisons with
similar products, showed that our solution was very much less
expensive than competitive products.  We were offering a $9/month
service at the low end, and the closest competition required you to
buy a $30k rack mounted appliance which (in my humble opinion) did not
come close to the performance of our service.

 It's now Open Source, no fees. The ad revenue is yours.

That's correct, the captive portal is licensed under the Apache 2.0
license, which gives you a great deal of flexibility on how you can
deploy and modify the code (much more so than the GPL).


 Unless I am reading wrong, you can't connect your legacy network if you 
 choose not to use that type of mesh, or even a mesh at all.
 See above

That's correct - this captive portal can be installed as a gateway on
any layer2 network.

 The ads seem to be chosen by the Silverlining People for lack of a better 
 term. Is that correct?
 No, you are 100% in control of the Ads. You can sell display advertising to 
 local businesses or use the space to promote your company's products and 
 services, or use Ad Exchanges, orwhatever suits you.  OpenX is an 
 ad-service appliance that will allow you to deliver ads on a rotating basis 
 so that each time a user logs onto the network, they see a different ad.

You have 100% control of the ads.  We can provide you with
advertisements specifically geared towards wifi networks, and deliver
revenue share from those ads.  We understand the nuances of what
advertisers want on wifi networks very much after going at this for
several years.  But you can run whatever content you want in that
space.

 I don't see any support for Authorize.net , iPay, or any other system other 
 than PayPal.
 It's Open Source so I would expect to see support for alternate services 
 developed. We chose PayPal because we were in a hurry.

PayPal offered several advantages over the other options.  Having used
Authorize.Net for several years, I can say they have a reliable
merchant service.  But it didn't turn out to be a good fit for a pay
per use option on visitor based wifi networks.  The fees were always
increasing (up 30% so far in 2010), there was a significant amount of
paperwork that had to be managed, and dealing with multiple entities
(i.e. Cybersource and other vendors they required you to report to)
became a non starter over the long term.

PayPal is a well known brand that consumers trust for the most part,
and their payment API fit well into the captive portal design.  Best
of all, you can get going with just a paypal address - no monthly fees
whatsoever.  We may add iPay support at some point depending on the
details of that interface.

 What if you don't want to have ads?
 You are in control of the pages.

If you don't want to have ads, SilverSplash is probably not a good
choice for your visitor based captive portal.  It was designed
specifically with advertising in mind.  Other general purpose captive
portals do not work well with advertising, which is why we designed
SilverSplash.

 What/where is the open source part? Is it just  the Batman/Robin stuff?

 Blog page here: 
 http://blog.silverliningnetworks.com/2010/08/announcing-the-silversplash-open-source-captive-portal.html

Batman is an open source mesh implementation which is available at
open-mesh.org.  ROBIN is a visible source firmware distribution which
is available at robin.forumup.it.

The SilverSplash captive portal is separate from both of those; it is
only a captive portal.  The development for SilverSplash can be
tracked at github - http://github.com/redhotpenguin/App-SilverSplash


 Discussion here: http://groups.google.com/group/silversplash

 Please give us more information about how 

Re: [WISPA] Wireless Digest, Vol 32, Issue 25

2010-08-12 Thread Fred Moyer
My follow up to this post did not go through last night because of my
list settings.  Posting it here, apologies if I broke the list thread.

 Message: 17
 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2010 01:36:26 -0400
 From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Motorola II] SilverLining
 To: motor...@afmug.com
 Cc: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Message-ID:
        aanlktinx+mq9yga4yte=8kgmasgh=b-pahslp0viy...@mail.gmail.com
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

 Can you point out where to start?  How does it work?  What libraries is it
 dependent on?

On Wed, Aug 11, 2010 at 11:17 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.com wrote:
 So it must be the gateway, correct?  Can I run dhcpd on the same box?

That's correct, it is the gateway for the network segment where you
provide visitor based access.  A dhcp server is actually required with
the current version, but may be optional in future versions.  I've
been using the dnsmasq dhcp server for SilverSplash.  I assume you
meant a dhcp server instead of the client daemon?
- Hide quoted text -


 On Aug 12, 2010 1:55 AM, Fred Moyer f...@slwifi.com wrote:

 On Wed, Aug 11, 2010 at 10:36 PM, Josh Luthman
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com wrote:
 Can you point ...

 It uses the iptables program to configure various firewall chains to
 route traffic depending on what options the end user selects in the
 web page that is presented to the user when they connect and attempt
 to access the WAN.

 You'll need to install iptables, Apache, and mod_perl using whatever
 packaging system that your Linux distribution uses.

 From there, you can grab a copy of cpanminus (a great tool for install
 Perl modules) at http://xrl.us/cpanminus

 Then install SilverSplash with 'perl cpanminus App::SilverSplash'.

 If you can manage a Linux box, you have the skills to set it up
 successfully.



 On Aug 12, 2010 1:15 AM, Fred Moyer f...@slwifi.com wrote:

 You can run it on any Linux box that has Apache 2.x installed.  It has
 been tested on Centos 5.5, so you can install most of the dependencies
 easily with yum, and then install SilverSplash from CPAN.  From there
 it is just a couple of text file modifications and testing to get up
 and running.

 Happy to answer any questions here about it, but for both the users of
 this list and the SilverSplash list, in depth discussions are most
 helpful at the captive portal group.  The development is being hosted
 at github, so any developers here are welcome to hack it up and submit
 patches back to the master branch.


 On Wed, Aug 11, 2010 at 9:43 PM, Josh Luthman
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com wrote:
 Great to hear



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Re: [WISPA] Lightning AGAIN

2010-08-12 Thread Marco Coelho
We had all sorts of lightning issues at our primary tower 15 years
ago.  Here's what fixed it:

What we did was put a ground ring around the tower, and another ring
around the building connected to that ring.  150 ground rods
interconnected with #2 solid copper cad welded to the rods.  Each leg
of the tower is cadwelded with #2 sold and that is cadwelded to the
tower ring.
From that ring, we bring in #2 awg 'stingers', or connections into the
building that the equipment gets grounded to.  Rack, Routers,
everything.  Avoid ground loops.

I would also recommend lightning dissapators that discharge the ion
field before the strike ever happens.  A ground rod with it's own #2
from the top of the tower should also get connected to the ring.

Shielded ethernet cables everywhere since the emf from the lightning
couples into the high impedance line and fries ports.

APC UPS's on all AC, TrippLite IsoBar surge protectors or TrippLite
PDUs on all AC connections.

All radio cables coming from outside are shielded and grounded.  All
those go to grounded surge protectors.   All RF cables have grounded
polyphaser surge protectors (these rock).

Knock on wood, not an issue since then (10+ years).

Marco Coelho
Argon Technologies Inc.



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Re: [WISPA] 5 GHz Canopy and 900 MHz

2010-08-12 Thread Marco Coelho
take a 900MHz radio there and put it in spectrum analyzer mode.  show
them you have nothing in that band.



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[WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Mike
The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon
pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly
objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming
together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to
enjoy this naked-eye event.

Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.

Friendly Regards,

Mike Gilchrist
Disruptive Technologist
Advanced Wireless Express
P.O. Box 255
Toledo, IA   52342
239.770.6203
m...@aweiowa.com
 





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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread St. Louis Broadband
This is also known as the T-Square Convergence:

PLANETS ALIGN FOR THE PERSEIDS: Mark your calendar- On Thursday, August
12th, an alignment of planets in the sunset sky will kick off the finest
meteor shower of 2010, the Perseids. Solar wind speed has remained
consistent over the last 8 days- perhaps an early indication that solar
intensity is strengthening. Geomagnetic activity has subsided to low levels
and the aurora show of August 3rd and 4th has come to an end but the Earth
could face another potential geomagnetic storm as early as next week.
Sunspots have erupted across the entire surface of the Sun, facing Earth.
Sunspots 1092 and 1093 pose a threat for C-class solar flares. -Space
Weather


Victoria Proffer  - President/CEO 
StLouisBroadband.com http://stlbroadband.com/   
ShowMeBroadband.com http://showmebroadband.com/  


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Mike
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 7:36 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon
pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly
objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming
together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to
enjoy this naked-eye event.

Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.

Friendly Regards,

Mike Gilchrist
Disruptive Technologist
Advanced Wireless Express
P.O. Box 255
Toledo, IA   52342
239.770.6203
m...@aweiowa.com
 






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No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3060 - Release Date: 08/12/10
13:34:00



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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Josh Luthman
Sweet!  Headed out for my run in a moment, which way are we looking, just
west and we will see it?

On Aug 12, 2010 8:36 PM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:

The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon
pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly
objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming
together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to
enjoy this naked-eye event.

Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.

Friendly Regards,

Mike Gilchrist
Disruptive Technologist
Advanced Wireless Express
P.O. Box 255
Toledo, IA   52342
239.770.6203
m...@aweiowa.com






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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Mike Hammett
  I don't know much about astronomy.  What's the bright white object up 
and to the left?

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com



On 8/12/2010 7:35 PM, Mike wrote:
 The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon
 pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly
 objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming
 together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to
 enjoy this naked-eye event.

 Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.

 Friendly Regards,

 Mike Gilchrist
 Disruptive Technologist
 Advanced Wireless Express
 P.O. Box 255
 Toledo, IA   52342
 239.770.6203
 m...@aweiowa.com





 
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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Mike
Venus.

 -Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 8:53 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

  I don't know much about astronomy.  What's the bright white object up 
and to the left?

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com



On 8/12/2010 7:35 PM, Mike wrote:
 The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon
 pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly
 objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming
 together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to
 enjoy this naked-eye event.

 Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.

 Friendly Regards,

 Mike Gilchrist
 Disruptive Technologist
 Advanced Wireless Express
 P.O. Box 255
 Toledo, IA   52342
 239.770.6203
 m...@aweiowa.com








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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Josh Luthman
I thought it looked like Uranus.

On Aug 12, 2010 9:59 PM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:

Venus.


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On...

Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 8:53 PM
To: WISPA General List

Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

I don't know much about astronomy. What's the...



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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Jason Bailey
Not seeing it,where should I be looking???


--- On Thu, 8/12/10, St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com wrote:


From: St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Date: Thursday, August 12, 2010, 8:46 PM



This is also known as the T-Square Convergence:

PLANETS ALIGN FOR THE PERSEIDS: Mark your calendar- On Thursday, August 12th, 
an alignment of planets in the sunset sky will kick off the finest meteor 
shower of 2010, the Perseids. Solar wind speed has remained consistent over the 
last 8 days- perhaps an early indication that solar intensity is strengthening. 
Geomagnetic activity has subsided to low levels and the aurora show of August 
3rd and 4th has come to an end but the Earth could face another potential 
geomagnetic storm as early as next week. Sunspots have erupted across the 
entire surface of the Sun, facing Earth. Sunspots 1092 and 1093 pose a threat 
for C-class solar flares. -Space Weather


Victoria Proffer  - President/CEO 
StLouisBroadband.com  
ShowMeBroadband.com 


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 7:36 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon
pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly
objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming
together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to
enjoy this naked-eye event.
Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.
Friendly Regards,
Mike Gilchrist
Disruptive Technologist
Advanced Wireless Express
P.O. Box 255
Toledo, IA   52342
239.770.6203
m...@aweiowa.com
 




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No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3060 - Release Date: 08/12/10 
13:34:00
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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Josh Luthman
Well can anyone see it at the moment?

On Aug 12, 2010 10:09 PM, Jason Bailey j284...@yahoo.com wrote:

Not seeing it,where should I be looking???


--- On *Thu, 8/12/10, St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com* wrote:


From: St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Date: Thursday, August 12, 2010, 8:46 PM



 This is also known as the T-Square Convergence:



 PLANETS ALIGN FOR THE PERSEIDS: Mark your calendar- On Thursday, August
12th, an alignment of p...

 ***Victoria Proffer  - President/CEO *

*StLouisBroadband.com* http://stlbroadband.com/

*ShowMeBroadband.com* http://showmebroadband.com/* *



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.or...



 The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon



 pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly



 objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming



 together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to



 enjoy this naked-eye event.



 Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.

Friendly Regards,

Mike Gilchrist

Disruptive Technologist

Advanced Wireless Express

P.O. Box 255

Toledo, IA   52342

239.770.6203

m...@aweiowa.com








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 No virus found in this incoming message.



 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com



 Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3060 - Release Date: 08/12/10
13:34:00
-Inline Attachment Follows-







 WISPA Wa...






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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Mike
To the west in the setting sun.  The moon has set at my location but Venus
is brightest with mars up and left, and Saturn up and right. 

 

  _  

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Jason Bailey
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 9:07 PM
To: li...@stlbroadband.com; WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

 


Not seeing it,where should I be looking???



--- On Thu, 8/12/10, St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com wrote:


From: St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Date: Thursday, August 12, 2010, 8:46 PM

This is also known as the T-Square Convergence:

PLANETS ALIGN FOR THE PERSEIDS: Mark your calendar- On Thursday, August
12th, an alignment of planets in the sunset sky will kick off the finest
meteor shower of 2010, the Perseids. Solar wind speed has remained
consistent over the last 8 days- perhaps an early indication that solar
intensity is strengthening. Geomagnetic activity has subsided to low levels
and the aurora show of August 3rd and 4th has come to an end but the Earth
could face another potential geomagnetic storm as early as next week.
Sunspots have erupted across the entire surface of the Sun, facing Earth.
Sunspots 1092 and 1093 pose a threat for C-class solar flares. -Space
Weather

Victoria Proffer  - President/CEO 

 http://stlbroadband.com/ StLouisBroadband.com  

 http://showmebroadband.com/ ShowMeBroadband.com 

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Mike
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 7:36 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon

pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly

objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming

together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to

enjoy this naked-eye event.

Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.

Friendly Regards,

Mike Gilchrist

Disruptive Technologist

Advanced Wireless Express

P.O. Box 255

Toledo, IA   52342

239.770.6203

m...@aweiowa.com

 








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No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 

Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3060 - Release Date: 08/12/10
13:34:00


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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Jason Bailey
been looking,no luck,I'll keep at it. Thanks

--- On Thu, 8/12/10, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:


From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Date: Thursday, August 12, 2010, 10:19 PM








To the west in the setting sun.  The moon has set at my location but Venus is 
brightest with mars up and left, and Saturn up and right. 
 



From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Jason Bailey
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 9:07 PM
To: li...@stlbroadband.com; WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
 





Not seeing it,where should I be looking???



--- On Thu, 8/12/10, St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com wrote:


From: St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Date: Thursday, August 12, 2010, 8:46 PM

This is also known as the T-Square Convergence:
PLANETS ALIGN FOR THE PERSEIDS: Mark your calendar- On Thursday, August 12th, 
an alignment of planets in the sunset sky will kick off the finest meteor 
shower of 2010, the Perseids. Solar wind speed has remained consistent over the 
last 8 days- perhaps an early indication that solar intensity is strengthening. 
Geomagnetic activity has subsided to low levels and the aurora show of August 
3rd and 4th has come to an end but the Earth could face another potential 
geomagnetic storm as early as next week. Sunspots have erupted across the 
entire surface of the Sun, facing Earth. Sunspots 1092 and 1093 pose a threat 
for C-class solar flares. -Space Weather
Victoria Proffer  - President/CEO 
StLouisBroadband.com  
ShowMeBroadband.com 
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 7:36 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon
pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly
objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming
together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to
enjoy this naked-eye event.
Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.
Friendly Regards,
Mike Gilchrist
Disruptive Technologist
Advanced Wireless Express
P.O. Box 255
Toledo, IA   52342
239.770.6203
m...@aweiowa.com
 




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No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3060 - Release Date: 08/12/10 
13:34:00

-Inline Attachment Follows-




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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Mike
If you are in city lights you won't see it.  Venus will be obvious but Mars
and Saturn are dimmer.  Westerners will be seeing it now.  Easterners missed
it.

  _  

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Jason Bailey
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 9:23 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

 


been looking,no luck,I'll keep at it. Thanks

--- On Thu, 8/12/10, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:


From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Date: Thursday, August 12, 2010, 10:19 PM

To the west in the setting sun.  The moon has set at my location but Venus
is brightest with mars up and left, and Saturn up and right. 

 

  _  

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Jason Bailey
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 9:07 PM
To: li...@stlbroadband.com; WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

 


Not seeing it,where should I be looking???



--- On Thu, 8/12/10, St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com wrote:


From: St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Date: Thursday, August 12, 2010, 8:46 PM

This is also known as the T-Square Convergence:

PLANETS ALIGN FOR THE PERSEIDS: Mark your calendar- On Thursday, August
12th, an alignment of planets in the sunset sky will kick off the finest
meteor shower of 2010, the Perseids. Solar wind speed has remained
consistent over the last 8 days- perhaps an early indication that solar
intensity is strengthening. Geomagnetic activity has subsided to low levels
and the aurora show of August 3rd and 4th has come to an end but the Earth
could face another potential geomagnetic storm as early as next week.
Sunspots have erupted across the entire surface of the Sun, facing Earth.
Sunspots 1092 and 1093 pose a threat for C-class solar flares. -Space
Weather

Victoria Proffer  - President/CEO 

 http://stlbroadband.com/ StLouisBroadband.com  

 http://showmebroadband.com/ ShowMeBroadband.com 

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org
http://us.mc525.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=wireless-boun...@wispa.org ]
On Behalf Of Mike
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 7:36 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon

pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly

objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming

together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to

enjoy this naked-eye event.

Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.

Friendly Regards,

Mike Gilchrist

Disruptive Technologist

Advanced Wireless Express

P.O. Box 255

Toledo, IA   52342

239.770.6203

m...@aweiowa.com

 

 




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No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 

Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3060 - Release Date: 08/12/10
13:34:00


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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Josh Luthman
Aww :(

Anxious for the meteor showers.  CNN suggests midnight is a good time to
start watching, with the best time to be 2am.

On Aug 12, 2010 10:36 PM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:

 If you are in city lights you won’t see it.  Venus will be obvious but Mars
and Saturn are dimmer.  Westerners will be seeing it now.  Easterners missed
it.
 --

*From:* wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] *On
Behalf Of *Jason Bailey
*Sent:* Thursday, August 12, 2010 9:23 PM
*To:* WISPA General List


Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight





been looking,no luck,I'll keep at it. Thanks

--- On Thu, 8/12/10, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrot...




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[WISPA] Electrical Question.......

2010-08-12 Thread Robert West
Putting together a new NOC.  The new NOC is in an older warehouse and we
ripped out ALL the crazy wiring and the multiple electrical panels.  Total
gut job.  Installed a single phase electrical panel for the retail and
service area in the front but we have three phase coming into the building.
Electrician uncle Dude, 80+ years, tells me that three phase protects
against power surges since it adds another transformer.  

 

My question is, would installing a three phase panel for the NOC be a
proactive thing?  Advantageous against the great lightning and idiotic power
company Godz?  (GODZ Rock And Roll Machine)  

 

Old location was all three phase and we never had one lick of trouble   Not
one.  Would this be the reason or would it be just a stroke of luck, one
that didn't involve the lottery..  Figures.

 

Bob-

 

 




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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread Robert West
Okay, Mike.  So I take it that you are also an amateur astronomer.
Celestron  C14 and 12 StarHopper on this end.

Bob-

I suffer from aperture envy.





-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Mike
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 8:36 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

The show begins at sundown when Venus, Saturn, Mars and the crescent Moon
pop out of the western twilight in tight conjunction. All four heavenly
objects will fit within a circle about 10 degrees in diameter, beaming
together through the dusky colors of sunset. No telescope is required to
enjoy this naked-eye event.

Stay up late and the Perseid meteor shower will be peaking too.

Friendly Regards,

Mike Gilchrist
Disruptive Technologist
Advanced Wireless Express
P.O. Box 255
Toledo, IA   52342
239.770.6203
m...@aweiowa.com
 






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Re: [WISPA] Powerstation2 with very low throughput

2010-08-12 Thread Robert West
How old is your PS2?  A year or so ago, a batch of PS2's had an issue with
bad MMCX connectors to the internal board.  Caused me some crazy low
throughput issues.  

 

Bob-

 

 

 

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Mark Dueck
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 1:56 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Powerstation2 with very low throughput

 

Hi Everyone,

I had a bunch of my equipment burnt on a tower.  Previously I had all
Tranzeo.  Now I put up a Powerstation2 for my main AP with a Tranzeo 17 dbi
sector.  I'm getting a max throughput of around 3 mbits.  That's looking at
the throughput graphs in the PS2.  Once I'm reaching that throughput though,
pings to certain clients go way up to over 2 seconds.  I do my testing from
linux, using

ping IP -i .01 -s 1024  or even take the 1024 up to 2048.

I can do this to 3 clients at 1024 packet size..Once I start pushing it
to a 4th client, pings get lost and replies come back 2 seconds later.

Is this normal??  I'm looking into it because I have clients complaining
they loose connection completely sometimes.  When I ping to 3 clients, I can
hardly ping any other clients.  no response.  I've pinged the AP during this
whole time and it never flaps. Very solid at a few ms.

The previous Tranzeo AP had no problems.  Clients are mostly Tranzeo SL2s
and their distances vary from 1/2 mile to about 3 miles

Here's the station list with their signal strength:


Station MAC

Signal, dBm

Noise, dBm

Tx Rate

Rx Rate

Idle (sec)


00:15:6D:1A:0A:05 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-54

-96

48M

36M

0


00:60:B3:E9:24:25 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-69

-96

24M

18M

0


00:13:4F:10:09:0F http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-49

-96

48M

36M

0


00:15:6D:1A:0F:D7 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-74

-96

11M

18M

0


00:13:4F:00:C5:DB http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-78

-96

18M

5M

15


00:1C:F0:EA:57:06 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-75

-96

11M

11M

0


00:13:4F:00:C5:C2 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-72

-96

36M

18M

15


00:60:B3:45:37:60 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-75

-96

11M

12M

0


00:13:4F:00:97:96 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-52

-96

54M

36M

0


00:13:4F:00:8E:E5 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-64

-96

48M

11M

0


00:13:4F:00:A6:E6 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-65

-96

36M

24M

0


00:13:4F:00:C3:91 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-77

-96

5M

12M

15


00:13:4F:00:B7:FA http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-82

-96

36M

1M

15


00:60:B3:59:89:54 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-72

-96

36M

18M

0


00:13:4F:00:C5:C4 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-77

-96

18M

12M

0


00:13:4F:00:A7:00 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-76

-96

11M

12M

15


00:0B:6B:37:E5:2B http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-67

-96

24M

36M

15


00:13:4F:10:01:D5 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-54

-96

11M

36M

0


00:13:4F:00:8B:83 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-68

-96

36M

18M

0


00:13:4F:00:D8:08 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-81

-96

12M

1M

0


00:13:4F:10:02:3E http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-73

-96

48M

12M

30


00:60:B3:E9:22:A0 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi 

-84

-96

1M

12M

0



Anyone have any idea what it could be?




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Re: [WISPA] Electrical Question.......

2010-08-12 Thread Chris Gotstein
One bad thing that i have seen with 3 phase is that you can lose 1 leg 
of it and bad things happen.  But as long as you are protected with a 
UPS with filtering, you should be all good.  Will also let you run more 
efficiently with higher voltages.


On 8/12/2010 10:31 PM, Robert West wrote:
 Putting together a new NOC.  The new NOC is in an older warehouse and we
 ripped out ALL the crazy wiring and the multiple electrical panels.
 Total gut job. Installed a single phase electrical panel for the retail
 and service area in the front but we have three phase coming into the
 building. Electrician uncle Dude, 80+ years, tells me that three phase
 protects against power surges since it adds another transformer.

 My question is, would installing a three phase panel for the NOC be a
 proactive thing? Advantageous against the great lightning and idiotic
 power company Godz? (GODZ Rock And Roll Machine)

 Old location was all three phase and we never had one lick of trouble
 Not one. Would this be the reason or would it be just a stroke of luck,
 one that didn’t involve the lottery…. Figures.

 Bob-





 
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-- 
   
Chris Gotstein, Network Engineer, U.P. Logon/Computer Connection U.P.
http://uplogon.com | +1 906 774 4847 | ch...@uplogon.com



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Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

2010-08-12 Thread St. Louis Broadband
@Midnight it is Friday the 13th.  This is the only Friday the 13th of this
year, whereas last year we had three.

 

This is way OT, but . here is some info I picked up on one of those 'tin
foil hat' forums, regarding this 696 year event:

 

Friday the 13th is the Mourning day of the year, because it is when the
brave Grand Master of the Temple and his servants were put to death by
BURGUNDY FROGS in conspiracy with the Pope. The Temple Knight on guard of
the Holy Grail, they were captured in the year 1307 and burned to death in
the year 1314.

696 years ago they were burned to death, but before he died, The Grand
Master de'Moulay Yacub promised a mayor apocalypse for the 13th Generation!
And He Would see the King and Pope on Judgment day.

Yes that was 696 years ago that some started to fear Friday the 13th

and while others felt it like their lucky day...

Friday the 13th is the mourning of the anniversary of the death of the
Temple Grand Priest Coward murdered by conspirators of darkness... If you
wish it will be a lucky day, say a prayer to honor the warriors of Light.

Swing with the history flag, and light a candle and say a little prayer to
honor the Knights, the 13th is here, and so is the 703th Anniversary of the
Persecution of the Knights Templar. And try understand the historical
reasoning why these events took place...


It's was not for the money or gold they where murdered, but because of the
truth they knew, ... that was what the evil frog King and the evil Pope were
afraid for. The knight's had discovered the betrayal of the burgundy Frogs,
the pope and their secret alliance with the Mongols.

A betrayal that currently is, may never completely be revealed, but all we
know, is that we were here to witness it.

 

 

Just thought it was interesting . I LOVE the net!

 

~V~

 

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 9:50 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight

 

Aww :(

Anxious for the meteor showers.  CNN suggests midnight is a good time to
start watching, with the best time to be 2am.

On Aug 12, 2010 10:36 PM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:

If you are in city lights you won't see it.  Venus will be obvious but Mars
and Saturn are dimmer.  Westerners will be seeing it now.  Easterners missed
it.

  _  

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Jason Bailey
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010 9:23 PM
To: WISPA General List


Subject: Re: [WISPA] off topic -- sky show tonight



 

been looking,no luck,I'll keep at it. Thanks

--- On Thu, 8/12/10, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrot...






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Re: [WISPA] Electrical Question.......

2010-08-12 Thread Frank Crawford
3 phase metering (as in how much you pay the utility )is done different 
than single phase, I would check with your utility, also check your 
initial costs of 3 phase equipment - meter base and entrance panel. How 
I understand the billing in our area is, 3 phase meter has a needle that 
is moved to the max use and you are billed that amount whether the elec 
is on or off. Just check, it may not be important but then again.


Frank

On 8/12/2010 8:31 PM, Robert West wrote:


Putting together a new NOC.  The new NOC is in an older warehouse and 
we ripped out ALL the crazy wiring and the multiple electrical 
panels.  Total gut job.  Installed a single phase electrical panel for 
the retail and service area in the front but we have three phase 
coming into the building.  Electrician uncle Dude, 80+ years, tells me 
that three phase protects against power surges since it adds another 
transformer.


My question is, would installing a three phase panel for the NOC be a 
proactive thing?  Advantageous against the great lightning and idiotic 
power company Godz?  (GODZ Rock And Roll Machine)


Old location was all three phase and we never had one lick of 
trouble   Not one.  Would this be the reason or would it be just a 
stroke of luck, one that didn't involve the lottery  Figures.


Bob-





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Re: [WISPA] Electrical Question.......

2010-08-12 Thread ccrum
Three phase does not provide any more or less protection against
lightning. I have three phase power to my house...lucky me...live in a 60
year old house. I, and one other guy on my block who still has three phase
power, both lost our AC compressors in a lightning storm on the same night
two summers ago. Everyone on single phase...no problem. Three phase does
have some advantages especially with efficiency with high current devices
like compressors and such, but it does not provide inherent protection
against power surges like lightning strikes.

Cameron

 3 phase metering (as in how much you pay the utility )is done different
 than single phase, I would check with your utility, also check your
 initial costs of 3 phase equipment - meter base and entrance panel. How
 I understand the billing in our area is, 3 phase meter has a needle that
 is moved to the max use and you are billed that amount whether the elec
 is on or off. Just check, it may not be important but then again.

 Frank

 On 8/12/2010 8:31 PM, Robert West wrote:

 Putting together a new NOC.  The new NOC is in an older warehouse and
 we ripped out ALL the crazy wiring and the multiple electrical
 panels.  Total gut job.  Installed a single phase electrical panel for
 the retail and service area in the front but we have three phase
 coming into the building.  Electrician uncle Dude, 80+ years, tells me
 that three phase protects against power surges since it adds another
 transformer.

 My question is, would installing a three phase panel for the NOC be a
 proactive thing?  Advantageous against the great lightning and idiotic
 power company Godz?  (GODZ Rock And Roll Machine)

 Old location was all three phase and we never had one lick of
 trouble   Not one.  Would this be the reason or would it be just a
 stroke of luck, one that didn't involve the lottery  Figures.

 Bob-




 
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Re: [WISPA] Electrical Question.......

2010-08-12 Thread Frank Crawford
Cameron;
I was currious, how does your monthly billing work where you are located.
Frank

On 8/12/2010 10:20 PM, cc...@dot11net.com wrote:
 Three phase does not provide any more or less protection against
 lightning. I have three phase power to my house...lucky me...live in a 60
 year old house. I, and one other guy on my block who still has three phase
 power, both lost our AC compressors in a lightning storm on the same night
 two summers ago. Everyone on single phase...no problem. Three phase does
 have some advantages especially with efficiency with high current devices
 like compressors and such, but it does not provide inherent protection
 against power surges like lightning strikes.

 Cameron


 3 phase metering (as in how much you pay the utility )is done different
 than single phase, I would check with your utility, also check your
 initial costs of 3 phase equipment - meter base and entrance panel. How
 I understand the billing in our area is, 3 phase meter has a needle that
 is moved to the max use and you are billed that amount whether the elec
 is on or off. Just check, it may not be important but then again.

 Frank

 On 8/12/2010 8:31 PM, Robert West wrote:
  
 Putting together a new NOC.  The new NOC is in an older warehouse and
 we ripped out ALL the crazy wiring and the multiple electrical
 panels.  Total gut job.  Installed a single phase electrical panel for
 the retail and service area in the front but we have three phase
 coming into the building.  Electrician uncle Dude, 80+ years, tells me
 that three phase protects against power surges since it adds another
 transformer.

 My question is, would installing a three phase panel for the NOC be a
 proactive thing?  Advantageous against the great lightning and idiotic
 power company Godz?  (GODZ Rock And Roll Machine)

 Old location was all three phase and we never had one lick of
 trouble   Not one.  Would this be the reason or would it be just a
 stroke of luck, one that didn't involve the lottery  Figures.

 Bob-




 
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Re: [WISPA] Powerstation2 with very low throughput

2010-08-12 Thread RickG
I'm assuming you have, but I've never had much luck with G mode. With that
said, I just fixed a similar issue by using a a Bullet2HP (non M). -RickG

On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 1:56 PM, Mark Dueck m...@netking.bz wrote:

  Hi Everyone,

 I had a bunch of my equipment burnt on a tower.  Previously I had all
 Tranzeo.  Now I put up a Powerstation2 for my main AP with a Tranzeo 17 dbi
 sector.  I'm getting a max throughput of around 3 mbits.  That's looking at
 the throughput graphs in the PS2.  Once I'm reaching that throughput though,
 pings to certain clients go way up to over 2 seconds.  I do my testing from
 linux, using

 ping IP -i .01 -s 1024  or even take the 1024 up to 2048.

 I can do this to 3 clients at 1024 packet size..Once I start pushing it
 to a 4th client, pings get lost and replies come back 2 seconds later.

 Is this normal??  I'm looking into it because I have clients complaining
 they loose connection completely sometimes.  When I ping to 3 clients, I can
 hardly ping any other clients.  no response.  I've pinged the AP during this
 whole time and it never flaps. Very solid at a few ms.

 The previous Tranzeo AP had no problems.  Clients are mostly Tranzeo SL2s
 and their distances vary from 1/2 mile to about 3 miles

 Here's the station list with their signal strength:

   Station MAC Signal, dBm Noise, dBm Tx Rate Rx Rate Idle (sec)
 00:15:6D:1A:0A:05 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -54 -96 48M 36M 0
 00:60:B3:E9:24:25 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -69 -96 24M 18M 0
 00:13:4F:10:09:0F http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -49 -96 48M 36M 0
 00:15:6D:1A:0F:D7 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -74 -96 11M 18M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C5:DB http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -78 -96 18M 5M 15
 00:1C:F0:EA:57:06 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -75 -96 11M 11M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C5:C2 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -72 -96 36M 18M 15
 00:60:B3:45:37:60 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -75 -96 11M 12M 0
 00:13:4F:00:97:96 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -52 -96 54M 36M 0
 00:13:4F:00:8E:E5 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -64 -96 48M 11M 0
 00:13:4F:00:A6:E6 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -65 -96 36M 24M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C3:91 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -77 -96 5M 12M 15
 00:13:4F:00:B7:FA http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -82 -96 36M 1M 15
 00:60:B3:59:89:54 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -72 -96 36M 18M 0
 00:13:4F:00:C5:C4 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -77 -96 18M 12M 0
 00:13:4F:00:A7:00 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -76 -96 11M 12M 15
 00:0B:6B:37:E5:2B http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -67 -96 24M 36M 15
 00:13:4F:10:01:D5 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -54 -96 11M 36M 0
 00:13:4F:00:8B:83 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -68 -96 36M 18M 0
 00:13:4F:00:D8:08 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -81 -96 12M 1M 0
 00:13:4F:10:02:3E http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -73 -96 48M 12M 30
 00:60:B3:E9:22:A0 http://172.20.0.3/stalist.cgi# -84 -96 1M 12M 0

 Anyone have any idea what it could be?




 
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Re: [WISPA] Electrical Question.......

2010-08-12 Thread ccrum
We just have a 3 phase meter. They read it like any other.

Cameron

 Cameron;
 I was currious, how does your monthly billing work where you are located.
 Frank

 On 8/12/2010 10:20 PM, cc...@dot11net.com wrote:
 Three phase does not provide any more or less protection against
 lightning. I have three phase power to my house...lucky me...live in a
 60
 year old house. I, and one other guy on my block who still has three
 phase
 power, both lost our AC compressors in a lightning storm on the same
 night
 two summers ago. Everyone on single phase...no problem. Three phase does
 have some advantages especially with efficiency with high current
 devices
 like compressors and such, but it does not provide inherent protection
 against power surges like lightning strikes.

 Cameron


 3 phase metering (as in how much you pay the utility )is done different
 than single phase, I would check with your utility, also check your
 initial costs of 3 phase equipment - meter base and entrance panel. How
 I understand the billing in our area is, 3 phase meter has a needle
 that
 is moved to the max use and you are billed that amount whether the elec
 is on or off. Just check, it may not be important but then again.

 Frank

 On 8/12/2010 8:31 PM, Robert West wrote:

 Putting together a new NOC.  The new NOC is in an older warehouse and
 we ripped out ALL the crazy wiring and the multiple electrical
 panels.  Total gut job.  Installed a single phase electrical panel for
 the retail and service area in the front but we have three phase
 coming into the building.  Electrician uncle Dude, 80+ years, tells me
 that three phase protects against power surges since it adds another
 transformer.

 My question is, would installing a three phase panel for the NOC be a
 proactive thing?  Advantageous against the great lightning and idiotic
 power company Godz?  (GODZ Rock And Roll Machine)

 Old location was all three phase and we never had one lick of
 trouble   Not one.  Would this be the reason or would it be just a
 stroke of luck, one that didn't involve the lottery  Figures.

 Bob-




 
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