Re: [WISPA] [TowerTalk] LMR-400 LMR-600 Equivalent (and stuff)
kinking cat 5 doesn't hurt anything unless you mess up the insulation kinking clearly can damage CAT5 cable. Anytime a wire exceeds its allowable bending radius, it breaks or partially breaks, which can reduce conductivity at that weak point, and possibly even create an open. The most common way CAT5 wire gets damaged during installation, is via a Kink, that was manhandled to hard to cure. Sure a kink is not a problem if it did not damage the cable inside. And a mild kink, will not. But how does one see inside the cable to see if it was damaged? Either Cable Tester, or just be careful not to damage cable with Kinks when installing it :-) There is a reason that Cat5 patch cables get shipped coiled, and not distrubuted in a narrow figure8 pattern like a PC power supply cord. Go take a patch cable, and wrap it around your elbow and hand, then crease the ends, so that there are multiple Creases at the ends (equivellent to Kinks), and now looks like a 1 ft long tube, then unravel it and use it as a patch cable for your file server the next month, and get back to me on whether you think kinking effects the reliabilty of a CAT5 cable. PS. Sorry, don't mean to be confrontational. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Roger (K8RI) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; wireless@wispa.org; Nusrat Jamal [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2008 11:21 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] [TowerTalk] LMR-400 LMR-600 Equivalent (and stuff) Can anyone help these guys out on some Cat 5 questions? Also Roger, check out www.shireeninc.com (hope I got that right). Nusrat Jamal will give you the straight scoop on cables. kinking cat 5 doesn't hurt anything unless you mess up the insulation in the process. I've had customers help me with installs and pull too hard on the cable not giving me time to straighten it out before it hits something and kinks. Not at all as critical as coax is. It's great stuff to work with compared to coax. Also, check out these tools if you are working with cat 5. Makes life a LOT easier! http://www.telephoneparts.com/product/EZRJ45?gclid=CI29_YnX2JMCFR4sagod7jJ4Yw You have to have the special crimper to use those. Makes perfect connections every single time though! Very nice stuff. For a stripper I've not found anything easier or more cost effective than: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102881cp=2032058.2032236.2032310parentPage=family laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Roger (K8RI) [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Hector Garcia XE2K [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Towertalk e-Goups [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Rich Hallman - N7TR [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 10:56 PM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] LMR-400 LMR-600 Equivalent (and stuff) Hector Garcia XE2K wrote: Rick tnx for share the info not in the need for Coax but that CAT5 cable looks vy interesting for me at this moment I wish I could find a bit more about the flooded CAT5e. I really need the foam filled outdoor version, but by the reel it's not a bad price. OTOH all of mine (not flooded) has been free and through conduit it's not been a problem to use although a bear to install. I've kinked more than one pull and had to throw it out. Hence the desire for the foam filled and the flooded, outdoor comscope might meet that requirement. Typical CAT5e is just a hollow plastic tube with 4 twisted pair. One of the local contractors has been letting me have ends (makes the price right) which somethings amount to quite a bit in the easy feeding boxes. I need to make two more runs from the shack where the gigabit switch sets right next to the 756 Pro. I'll have 2 runs of CAT5e and at least 3 runs of RG-6 (possibly 5) in one conduit. Another will have two rotator control cables (one is spare for later) and on cable to the 6-pack and two for remote antenna switches. I'll also have an equivalent conduit run from the shop to the tower. Then there are the larger underground conduits from the shop and den to the tower containing the coax to the 6-pack as well as the UHF, VHF antennas. I plan on doing the switching between the antennas on the big tower and the one at the end of the shop in the control box at the base of the tower. It'll also switch rotator cable access to the big tower of shop tower to either the shop or Den. BTW all my CAT5e runs are custom length with me installing the connectors so I don't have a lot of excess laying around in the way. NOTE I hate RHoS compliance. It has cost me several equipment failures including a 40 HD TV set today, one mobile rig
Re: [WISPA] [TowerTalk] LMR-400 LMR-600 Equivalent (and stuff)
Can anyone help these guys out on some Cat 5 questions? Also Roger, check out www.shireeninc.com (hope I got that right). Nusrat Jamal will give you the straight scoop on cables. kinking cat 5 doesn't hurt anything unless you mess up the insulation in the process. I've had customers help me with installs and pull too hard on the cable not giving me time to straighten it out before it hits something and kinks. Not at all as critical as coax is. It's great stuff to work with compared to coax. Also, check out these tools if you are working with cat 5. Makes life a LOT easier! http://www.telephoneparts.com/product/EZRJ45?gclid=CI29_YnX2JMCFR4sagod7jJ4Yw You have to have the special crimper to use those. Makes perfect connections every single time though! Very nice stuff. For a stripper I've not found anything easier or more cost effective than: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102881cp=2032058.2032236.2032310parentPage=family laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Roger (K8RI) [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Hector Garcia XE2K [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Towertalk e-Goups [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Rich Hallman - N7TR [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 10:56 PM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] LMR-400 LMR-600 Equivalent (and stuff) Hector Garcia XE2K wrote: Rick tnx for share the info not in the need for Coax but that CAT5 cable looks vy interesting for me at this moment I wish I could find a bit more about the flooded CAT5e. I really need the foam filled outdoor version, but by the reel it's not a bad price. OTOH all of mine (not flooded) has been free and through conduit it's not been a problem to use although a bear to install. I've kinked more than one pull and had to throw it out. Hence the desire for the foam filled and the flooded, outdoor comscope might meet that requirement. Typical CAT5e is just a hollow plastic tube with 4 twisted pair. One of the local contractors has been letting me have ends (makes the price right) which somethings amount to quite a bit in the easy feeding boxes. I need to make two more runs from the shack where the gigabit switch sets right next to the 756 Pro. I'll have 2 runs of CAT5e and at least 3 runs of RG-6 (possibly 5) in one conduit. Another will have two rotator control cables (one is spare for later) and on cable to the 6-pack and two for remote antenna switches. I'll also have an equivalent conduit run from the shop to the tower. Then there are the larger underground conduits from the shop and den to the tower containing the coax to the 6-pack as well as the UHF, VHF antennas. I plan on doing the switching between the antennas on the big tower and the one at the end of the shop in the control box at the base of the tower. It'll also switch rotator cable access to the big tower of shop tower to either the shop or Den. BTW all my CAT5e runs are custom length with me installing the connectors so I don't have a lot of excess laying around in the way. NOTE I hate RHoS compliance. It has cost me several equipment failures including a 40 HD TV set today, one mobile rig, and several other pieces of equipment. It's cost NASA many problems and even caused satellites to fail. Without the lead in solder or plating on circuit board the tendency to grow tin whiskers multiplies many fold. Plus it doesn't wet the base metal nearly as easy as regular solder. So I guess the US isn't the only government or group to over react with knee jerk reactions. sigh Sorry for the rant, but I think that every time I see the words RHoS compliant and think of the failures just I've seen. I have nearly a full rull of good solder, I should get another while I can still get the stuff. Lots of plans and work, but I'm getting tired of moving a raft of cables, or propping them on stepladders every time I mow between the shop and garage. :-)) As to the coax, it's supposedly come scope which is supposed to be reasonably good. I think I'd still going to order a bunch of Bury Flex to use in conjunction with my LMR 400 and 600 even though I do have several hundred feet of 600UF. OTOH it looks like I'm going to need to order a reel of flooded CAT5e and flooded RG-6 somewhere as I'm running low. Each run from the shjack is about 230 feet for the LMR-400 and 600 while the RG-6 runs for the TV are nearly 300 each. It doesn't take long to go through a 1000 feet of coax which starts to get expensive after a while, but cheap coax can be expensive in the long run. I'm beginning to think it's time to get rid of the two mobiles (Yaesu 897D and Icom 7000) along with my Henry 2002A and get another 756 Pro for the shop instead of the little rigs. Then get a good dual
Re: [WISPA] [TowerTalk] LMR-400 LMR-600 Equivalent (and stuff)
Here are the frequencies used. http://discountcablesusa.com/ethernetcables.html As for the speeds etc. I've heard that a few times before. Tell you what, work out a speed test in whatever way you'd like to. Run your test. Now tie the cable in a tight knot. I tried that, no change in speed. As for the disruption of the twist rates, ever look at what a connector does? grin I'm sure that some results could be seen in the lab. In the real world, with MILES of cat5 installed in just the last few years I've seen a lot of things effect speeds on my customers systems. Cat5 kinks haven't been one of them. marlon - Original Message - From: Jim Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Roger (K8RI) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; wireless@wispa.org; Nusrat Jamal [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2008 9:42 AM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] LMR-400 LMR-600 Equivalent (and stuff) On Tue, 3 Jun 2008 09:21:36 -0700, Marlon K. Schafer \(509\) 982-2181 wrote: kinking cat 5 doesn't hurt anything unless you mess up the insulation in the process. WRONG! Ethernet traffic is broadband data, with components well into the tens of MHz. CAT5 cable is four parallel transmission lines with twist ratios that are offset from each other to minimize crosstalk from one pair to another. Kinking puts discontinuities in the cable, which can degrade the data waveform. It can also degrade noise immunity and crosstalk, and increase leakage from the cable (to your radio). You may not notice the data degradation, because Ethernet includes error correction and re-sends when data is corrupted. The effect is slower data exchange. 73, Jim Brown K9YC ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
