Re: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link
Travis, That is an insightful realization. I noticed the same thing when recently doing my 11Ghz, 18Ghz, and 24Ghz calculations. In terms of 9s reliabilty, the jump from 2ft-4ft didn't really make that much difference in the Higher Ghz gear. Not nearly as much a difference as with 5.8Ghz and 2.4Ghz. It was much more advantageous to use the next lower down spectrum range to gain the distance. The impact of 2ft to 4ft however has two major negative impacts... Windload, which is 4x worse, and Space preventing multiple antennas fro mcolocating next to each other. Its not jsut a space issue from verticle pole position, but also teh 4ft dishes may stick out further (if drum type) blocking coverage from sectors antennas mounted on tehsame horizontal plane. Just recently FiberTower mounted a 3ft dish and took out 30 degrees of one of my sectors, even though I was mounted 10-15 feet to the side of them, because the tip of the drum blocked part of the view. Even selecting a 3ft dish is way advantageous over a 4ft, just because of windload and space. You can get two 3ft dished on a 10fttall-3"dia pole, but only get about 1 4 ft. Considering, every foot you go taller on the pole, adds significant increased windload, do to leverage. Not to mention the ease and safety of working with a 2ft compared to a 4ft. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Travis Johnson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; WISPA General List Sent: Monday, October 08, 2007 12:10 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link I already have the 18ghz set sitting on the shelf, that would be the only reason to use it. Here's the interesting thing about a link that long: 2ft dishes = 99.9955% uptime (23 minutes per year outage) 4ft dishes = 99.9992% uptime (5 minutes per year outage) I can live with 23 minutes per year if I can use 2ft dishes. Travis Microserv [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 4 foot dishes but i would prefer 11 ghz Bob Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Travis Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2007 19:56:50 To:[EMAIL PROTECTED], WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link Hi, Does anyone have any information on long 18ghz links? I keep running the path calculations on a link I am considering (28 miles with 2ft dishes) and I come up with 99.99% uptime for my region. I would really like to chat with anyone that has anything around that range and frequency. I'm having a hard time believing those uptime numbers even in my area. Travis Microserv ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA
RE: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link
You might find this press release from Bridgewave interesting: BridgeWave Introduces AdaptPath Capability to Extend the Reach of Gigabit Wireless While Ensuring 'Five Nines' Network Availability Washington D.C.-Area ISP Deploys BridgeWave's AR80X With AdaptPath to Deliver Carrier-Class Business Services With Unparalleled Network Capacity and Uptime SANTA CLARA, Calif.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--BridgeWave Communications, the leading supplier of gigabit wireless solutions, today announced AdaptPathT technology, an innovative capability that seamlessly integrates the company's AdaptRateT Gigabit Ethernet wireless links with secondary connections using complementary wired or wireless technologies. The resulting dual technology solution provides unprecedented GigE wireless link availability and range. AdaptPath link switching creates an all-weather, dual-path data connection by pairing a BridgeWave 60GHz or 80GHz GigE wireless bridge with a lower speed, highly rain-tolerant secondary path. This path can be a leased-line wired connection, a license-free 5.xGHz radio bridge or a licensed-band 6 or 11GHz link. When a momentarily severe rain downpour occurs, the AdaptPath feature automatically switches data traffic from the primary GigE link to the secondary path before the link would start to experience data errors. According to Gregg Levin, senior vice president and chief marketing officer for BridgeWave, the AdaptPath feature offers customers the best of both worlds - gigabit data rates and superior link availability at longer distances. "AdaptPath is the next step in BridgeWave's strategy to offer enterprises, government entities and network operators greater flexibility in meeting their network capacity, range and uptime requirements," he says. "With our extended range, AdaptRate and now AdaptPath technologies, we enable the deployment of GigE links well beyond traditional distances with the highest levels of service availability." For Roadstar Internet, a leading broadband services provider based in Loudoun County, Va., located 25 miles outside Washington, D.C., BridgeWave's AR80X gigabit links with AdaptPath and AdaptRate features are accelerating the rollout of high-capacity, reliable Internet services to area businesses. "Our state-of-the-art GigE wireless backbone enables us to be first to deliver next-generation access services in this fast-growing region," says Marty Dougherty, CEO and founder of Roadstar. "The combination of BridgeWave's AdaptRate and AdaptPath features takes us well beyond what's currently available in the industry." Roadstar worked with BridgeWave to determine rain fade calculations for its region, factoring in summer periods when thunderstorms are common. The solution was designed to operate at full GigE speeds the vast majority of the time. When exceptional rain events occur, the BridgeWave link's AdaptRate feature first switches from GigE to a 100Mbps data rate; then, if needed, the AdaptPath capability switches traffic to a secondary, highly rain tolerant 40Mbps 5GHz bridge. As the storm cell passes, the link immediately returns to full GigE speed. "AdaptPath also reduces networking equipment costs and complexity since we don't have to provision redundant wireless paths using external Ethernet switches and routers," Dougherty adds. "Overall, BridgeWave's gigabit wireless links will let us scale our network faster and more economically than any other technology." To that end, Roadstar plans to connect hundreds of buildings to its new INET LoudounT network using BridgeWave's AR80X gigabit wireless links over the next 18-to-24 months. For existing AdaptRate link customers, the new AdaptPath feature is available as a no-cost software upgrade. BridgeWave is working with leading lower-frequency microwave radio vendors to certify that their RF bridges operate correctly as AdaptPath secondary links. About BridgeWave Communications Founded in 1999, BridgeWave Communications is the leading supplier of Gigabit Ethernet outdoor wireless connectivity solutions. The company's exclusive AdaptRateT technology and Forward Error Correction capabilities deliver the highest availability at the longest distances for full-rate GigE solutions. BridgeWave's point-to-point, fixed wireless solutions are ideally suited for a wide variety of enterprise, service provider, healthcare, education, public safety and government/military network applications. With the largest installed base of GigE radios worldwide, BridgeWave delivers the highest levels of product quality and reliability. For more information, visit www.bridgewave.com. Contacts BridgeWave Communications Gregg Levin, 408-567-6999 [EMAIL PROTECTED] or HetzelMeade Communications Sue Hetzel, 760-434-9927 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Re: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link
I am using the calculator made by the company that made the radio (WitCom). They are +22db radios and they show using 2ft dishes a -55 RSSI with a needed -77 to keep the link up. These are not the newer style, auto modulating radios. They are 45Mbps full-duplex, and either they are up, or they are down. They don't rate shift or anything like that. I have two other links using these radios... one is 19 miles with 4ft dishes and we have never even seen the signal fade by 2db even in the heaviest rain storms. This is different than our 15 mile Dragonwave radios that we see 10-15db fades during the same storms. Travis Microserv Brad Belton wrote: Hey Travis, What calculator are you using and what is it telling you the expected rssi will be? Best, Brad From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 11:10 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link I already have the 18ghz set sitting on the shelf, that would be the only reason to use it. Here's the interesting thing about a link that long: 2ft dishes = 99.9955% uptime (23 minutes per year outage) 4ft dishes = 99.9992% uptime (5 minutes per year outage) I can live with 23 minutes per year if I can use 2ft dishes. Travis Microserv [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 4 foot dishes but i would prefer 11 ghz Bob Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Travis Johnson <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2007 19:56:50 To:[EMAIL PROTECTED], WISPA General List <mailto:wireless@wispa.org> Subject: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link Hi, Does anyone have any information on long 18ghz links? I keep running the path calculations on a link I am considering (28 miles with 2ft dishes) and I come up with 99.99% uptime for my region. I would really like to chat with anyone that has anything around that range and frequency. I'm having a hard time believing those uptime numbers even in my area. Travis Microserv ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ _ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register
Re: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link
Travis Johnson wrote: I can live with 23 minutes per year if I can use 2ft dishes. Speaking from experience... you may change your mind when your customers start calling. You DO NOT ever want your customers to think rain can take down your network. It only takes a couple of rain storms with associated outages to ruin your customer's perception. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link
Hey Travis, What calculator are you using and what is it telling you the expected rssi will be? Best, Brad From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 11:10 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link I already have the 18ghz set sitting on the shelf, that would be the only reason to use it. Here's the interesting thing about a link that long: 2ft dishes = 99.9955% uptime (23 minutes per year outage) 4ft dishes = 99.9992% uptime (5 minutes per year outage) I can live with 23 minutes per year if I can use 2ft dishes. Travis Microserv [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 4 foot dishes but i would prefer 11 ghz Bob Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Travis Johnson <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2007 19:56:50 To:[EMAIL PROTECTED], WISPA General List <mailto:wireless@wispa.org> Subject: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link Hi, Does anyone have any information on long 18ghz links? I keep running the path calculations on a link I am considering (28 miles with 2ft dishes) and I come up with 99.99% uptime for my region. I would really like to chat with anyone that has anything around that range and frequency. I'm having a hard time believing those uptime numbers even in my area. Travis Microserv ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ _ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link
I already have the 18ghz set sitting on the shelf, that would be the only reason to use it. Here's the interesting thing about a link that long: 2ft dishes = 99.9955% uptime (23 minutes per year outage) 4ft dishes = 99.9992% uptime (5 minutes per year outage) I can live with 23 minutes per year if I can use 2ft dishes. Travis Microserv [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 4 foot dishes but i would prefer 11 ghz Bob Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Travis Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2007 19:56:50 To:[EMAIL PROTECTED], WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link Hi, Does anyone have any information on long 18ghz links? I keep running the path calculations on a link I am considering (28 miles with 2ft dishes) and I come up with 99.99% uptime for my region. I would really like to chat with anyone that has anything around that range and frequency. I'm having a hard time believing those uptime numbers even in my area. Travis Microserv ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link
4 foot dishes but i would prefer 11 ghz Bob Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Travis Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2007 19:56:50 To:[EMAIL PROTECTED], WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Longest 18ghz link Hi, Does anyone have any information on long 18ghz links? I keep running the path calculations on a link I am considering (28 miles with 2ft dishes) and I come up with 99.99% uptime for my region. I would really like to chat with anyone that has anything around that range and frequency. I'm having a hard time believing those uptime numbers even in my area. Travis Microserv ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
