[WSG] IE7 fixes CSS glitches for IE
Saw this little gem on Sean Corfields blog just now.. looks like a very interesting project. I especially like how its been implemented. http://dean.edwards.name/IE7/ "IE7 invokes a DHTML behavior to load and parse all style sheets into a form that Explorer can understand. You can then use most CSS2 selectors without having to resort to CSS hacks." -- geoff http://www.daemon.com.au/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Open critique?
Thanks, Hugh -- appreciate the kind words. I think the graphic headers were chosen because we wanted that lighter face font there, and couldn't get anything that light using the anticipated installed fonts. They're rendered using image replacement (FIR), so there are still H3 headers without the CSS, I believe... Basically, a design-driven decision. And Russ, thanks for those links on 'color deficiency'... Even reading that, it still looks like the issue is a low-contrast one, not color. That's still a valid issue, but not exactly the same thing. -Nate On Mar 6, 2004, at 6:07 PM, Hugh Todd wrote: Nate, I, too, was surprised at the 'forcefulness' of some of the feedback. I would be interested to know whether they could come anywhere close to your level of aesthetic competence. I was hugely impressed when I saw what you had done. There is a tension, isn't there, between the aesthetic and the accessible? Not always easily resolved. One thing I wanted to ask you about was why you chose to use graphic headers in the right hand boxes. Your large type in the left hand coloured boxes is very successful. -Hugh Todd Again, thanks for the feedback! I'm really enjoying the discussions on this list. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] A few questions needing answers
Thanks James and the others who replied, much appreciated. I've since disposed of the middleman and talked directly to the host and found out that the problems I was told existed do not at all - there's a lesson learnt! As for the other - yep, a step too far into programming land for me. I think I'll leave it to the experts! Thanks for the help all, Peter On 06/03/2004, at 12:02 PM, James Ellis wrote: Hope this helps. James Universal Head Design That Works. 7/43 Bridge Rd Stanmore NSW 2048 Australia T (+612) 9517 1466 F (+612) 9565 4747 E [EMAIL PROTECTED] W www.universalhead.com
[WSG] Now the footers playing up...
I'm having the friday afternoon rages.. Now the footer is not stretching out proper like!!! Page: http://www.healthpoint.com.au/new2.php Code: http://www.healthpoint.com.au/css/new.css set the browser window to 800x600 then look at the footer and scroll to the right it just stops dead. Why oh why is this so. :o( sat up till all hours last night on this rotten thing and now this is the last little bit thats giving me the irrits...I am so sick of the sight of it that i could just scream. Jackie Reid Mock Orange Web Site DevelopmentU: www.mockorange.com.auP: 07 4953 4035F: 07 4953 40301st Floor, 92 Victoria StreetMackay Q Australia 4740
Re: [WSG] He said she said :-) FIR and other such techniques
Scott, sorry for the late reply. Been off at the NSW surf lifesaving championships. But is an image of this text in a pretty font or whatever even content? Isn't it just presentation and therefore the perfect thing for the stylesheet to represent? It's not a bad question. What is content? I would suggest that is it is something that the viewer reads it is content. The content is still there, but we are presenting it differently. I see no difference between this and setting a font colour (ok a small difference but I am trying to make a point). The difference is that the content is still available if the decoration is not. But if the image is not available there is no content. john John Allsopp :: westciv :: software, courses, resources for a standards based web style master blog http://westciv.typepad.com/dog_or_higher/ http://www.westciv.com/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
RE: [SPAM] RE: [WSG] problem with footer
G'day Kim In my IE6.0.2800 it's right at the bottom. (I'll email you a screen shot off list if you want) but the footer's right at the bottom. It has a horiz scroll bar and a vertical scroll bar, but the footer's right on the bottom. Cheers Mike Kear -Original Message- From: Christiansen & Jonsson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 8 March 2004 1:34 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [SPAM] RE: [WSG] problem with footer Hi Mike, The problem is in IE6 the footer isn't at the bottom. It's floating some 30 px above the bottom of the browser window. Besides that it's spawning a vertical scrollbar in IE6 and Firefoxand Opera. Furthermore the footer stays on resize and that goes for all the browsers I've tested in. Kim - Original Message - From: "Michael Kear" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 3:09 PM Subject: [SPAM] RE: [WSG] problem with footer > > I had a look at the page, Kim, but to tell the truth I'm not sure what's the > problem. What is it supposed to be doing that it isn't now? > > > Cheers > Mike Kear > -Original Message- > From: Kim Kruse [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Monday, 8 March 2004 12:51 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [WSG] problem with footer > > > Hi, > > I'm sorry to bother you again but I've this problem with a footer I just > can't figure out. > > The page in question is here http://www.pagemakers.dk/jette/indextest.htm > and the css is here http://www.pagemakers.dk/jette/styles.css > > Any help appreciated > > Regards > Kim > > * > The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ > * > > > > * > The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ > * > * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] problem with footer
Hi. To get rid of the scrollbar in Firefox and Opera you can remove the padding on the footer or mess around with it more so the scrollbar goes away. And the fact that it's displaying kind of in the middle of the content has to do with the absolute positioning of it from the bottom. I had a problem like that and just redid it with floating it. Of course if the page doesn't take up more than the entire screen, the footer is at the exact end of the content. Hm. Christiansen & Jonsson wrote: Hi Mike, The problem is in IE6 the footer isn't at the bottom. It's floating some 30 px above the bottom of the browser window. Besides that it's spawning a vertical scrollbar in IE6 and Firefoxand Opera. Furthermore the footer stays on resize and that goes for all the browsers I've tested in. Kim -- Andy King Eggs create chickens so there can be more eggs. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] ASP.NET HTML (continued from my Bobby discussion)...
Cheers Woric... that's given me a bit more confidence. I didn't post any sample pages though, may have been an example by someone else replying to me earlier. As you say, the code is at the mercy of another, thus I can't vouch on their willingness to recode about 50-75 pages (on top of their already busy schedule)... here's to hoping! On 7 Mar 2004, at 14:14, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi Martin, the page you posted with the sample datagrid is auto-generated. It also looks like your developers had spent at least 30 seconds writing the page. (Click on datagrid component, drop on page, specify table, save page. Thats it, no kidding.) It is not hard to replace the auto-generated datagrid code with templated code which can be written as valid html, but this does require a rudimentary knowledge of ASP.NET, which the developers may not have. Tell them to go and read about templating in MSDN. It has many examples of how to use custom html for the datagrid. But be warned, it will take longer than 30 seconds to write the page. Probably 3 or 4 minutes, or if they are really untalented, 30 or 40 minutes. Good luck. woric * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * Kind regards Martin Chapman -- Web development, identity and design. co-ord.com Limited 9 Tynwald Road West Kirby Merseyside CH48 4DA Tel: +44 (0)151 625 1443 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.co-ord.com -- * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
RE: [WSG] Bobby question
Left these info out..
This page here http://www.sodesires.com/links/index.html is using
transitional and the rest using strict.
You can have a look at this page http://www.sodesires.com/weblog which is in
strict as it has the calendar javascript on it as well.
Both DTDs are invalid due to g! I wouldn't even bother to put
this in if not for priority one.
With Regards
Jaime Wong
~~
SODesires Design Team
http://www.sodesires.com
~~
---Original Message---
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 03/07/04 20:49:26
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [WSG] Bobby question
Thanks Peter for the wonderful explanation :)
I tested it straight away but facing some problem with Strict DTD.
This is what I have in my html
var d=new Date();
yr=d.getFullYear();
if (yr!=2003)
document.write("- "+yr);
- 2004!
and
dT();
GMT +8
This is the errors
Line 224, column 55: character data is not allowed here
dT();GMT +8
^
Line 683, column 9: document type does not allow element "noscript" here;
missing one of "object", "ins", "del", "map", "button" start-tag
- 2004!
^
Line 683, column 10: character data is not allowed here
- 2004!
With Regards
Jaime Wong
~~
SODesires Design Team
http://www.sodesires.com
~~
---Original Message---
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 03/07/04 20:11:50
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [WSG] Bobby question
Hi Jaime,
A tag is read only when JavaScript isn't present (except in
Netscape 4 as I recall but may have been Netscape 3 which shows both the
script and the noscript content and this was when it WAS the dominant
browser! Someone may like to check that but I can't be bothered as I never
use it any more).
So you would have something like:
Something else if JS not available.
Much like .
A search for on Google brings up everything you need to know in
the first 5 links.
However, for something like onclick this doesn't work. The best thing to do
is test it in Lynx and make sure the default behaviour of the link or button
still works. If you're doing something else with onclick (than a form
element or link) then you may well have to rethink it. Remember, Google (the
worlds biggest blind user) may not be able to follow it if it is
inaccessible so your pages may remain hidden to the world.
As for the other question (below), much the same answer. However, when we do
it, if you don't have JavaScript turned on, you simply don't get the
styleswitcher links at all as they wouldn't work anyway. If you do have
JavaScript, and you tab to the link and hit enter, the appropriate behaviour
is invoked.
Again, see http://www.gt.nsw.gov.au/ and try throwing the mouse away and
turning JavaScript off to see what happens.
You just have to think about it carefully as you put it together and then
test the pants off it.
My next question is for e.g. using the style switcher js from ALA, or
whichever js written by programmers for your website. Will you change the
all commands to satisfy the priority even if the script is non-applicable to
lynx users?
PS: Can you see better now Peter? This just make me realise that with all
the concentration for accessibility on websites, I forgot about others :P
Good wakeup call.
Yes thanks, but plain text beats it every time on a mail list :-)
P
*
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
*
*
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*
Re: [SPAM] RE: [WSG] problem with footer
Hi Mike, The problem is in IE6 the footer isn't at the bottom. It's floating some 30 px above the bottom of the browser window. Besides that it's spawning a vertical scrollbar in IE6 and Firefoxand Opera. Furthermore the footer stays on resize and that goes for all the browsers I've tested in. Kim - Original Message - From: "Michael Kear" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 3:09 PM Subject: [SPAM] RE: [WSG] problem with footer > > I had a look at the page, Kim, but to tell the truth I'm not sure what's the > problem. What is it supposed to be doing that it isn't now? > > > Cheers > Mike Kear > -Original Message- > From: Kim Kruse [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Monday, 8 March 2004 12:51 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [WSG] problem with footer > > > Hi, > > I'm sorry to bother you again but I've this problem with a footer I just > can't figure out. > > The page in question is here http://www.pagemakers.dk/jette/indextest.htm > and the css is here http://www.pagemakers.dk/jette/styles.css > > Any help appreciated > > Regards > Kim > > * > The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ > * > > > > * > The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ > * > * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] ASP.NET HTML (continued from my Bobby discussion)...
Hi Martin, the page you posted with the sample datagrid is auto-generated. It also looks like your developers had spent at least 30 seconds writing the page. (Click on datagrid component, drop on page, specify table, save page. Thats it, no kidding.) It is not hard to replace the auto-generated datagrid code with templated code which can be written as valid html, but this does require a rudimentary knowledge of ASP.NET, which the developers may not have. Tell them to go and read about templating in MSDN. It has many examples of how to use custom html for the datagrid. But be warned, it will take longer than 30 seconds to write the page. Probably 3 or 4 minutes, or if they are really untalented, 30 or 40 minutes. Good luck. woric * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
RE: [WSG] problem with footer
I had a look at the page, Kim, but to tell the truth I'm not sure what's the problem. What is it supposed to be doing that it isn't now? Cheers Mike Kear -Original Message- From: Kim Kruse [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 8 March 2004 12:51 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WSG] problem with footer Hi, I'm sorry to bother you again but I've this problem with a footer I just can't figure out. The page in question is here http://www.pagemakers.dk/jette/indextest.htm and the css is here http://www.pagemakers.dk/jette/styles.css Any help appreciated Regards Kim * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
[WSG] problem with footer
Hi, I'm sorry to bother you again but I've this problem with a footer I just can't figure out. The page in question is here http://www.pagemakers.dk/jette/indextest.htm and the css is here http://www.pagemakers.dk/jette/styles.css Any help appreciated Regards Kim * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] font-family : what fonts do you set as default?
I go with Verdana 9 times out of 10 unless the design calls for something more condensed then I'll go with Arial. In order of personal preference I usually go with font: Verdana, "Trebuchet MS", Helvetica, sans-serif. If the client wants serif then Georgia is the most readable. I know a bit about this as I work at the Font Factory in my day job. Verdana and Georgia were developed by Matthew Carter (commissioned by Microsoft) and were specially designed to be readable on screens/monitors. For that reason alone they should be first choice in style sheets IMO. Regards PAUL ROSS SkyRocket Design Co http://www.skyrocket.com.au - This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
RE: [WSG] Bobby question
Thanks Peter for the wonderful explanation :) I tested it straight away but facing some problem with Strict DTD. This is what I have in my html
var d=new Date();
yr=d.getFullYear();
if (yr!=2003)
document.write("- "+yr);
- 2004! and dT();GMT +8 This is the errors Line 224, column 55: character data is not allowed here dT();GMT +8 ^Line 683, column 9: document type does not allow element "noscript" here; missing one of "object", "ins", "del", "map", "button" start-tag - 2004! ^Line 683, column 10: character data is not allowed here - 2004! With Regards Jaime Wong ~~ SODesires Design Team http://www.sodesires.com ~~ ---Original Message--- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 03/07/04 20:11:50 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [WSG] Bobby question Hi Jaime, A tag is read only when _javascript_ isn't present (except in Netscape 4 as I recall but may have been Netscape 3 which shows both the script and the noscript content and this was when it WAS the dominant browser! Someone may like to check that but I can't be bothered as I never use it any more). So you would have something like:
