Re: [WSG] Difference between applied CSS and Computed CSS

2010-02-25 Thread Felix Miata 
On 2010/02/26 12:00 (GMT+1100) Stephen Holmes (Gmail) composed:

> the computed size of the font would have been 16pt, the default in IE 6

The standards mode default font size of IE[6-8] is and always has been 12pt.
Most often that translates to 16px, but often users and laptop vendors change
the default DPI from 96, which is what results in 16px, to something higher,
most commonly 120, which results in a 20px default.

In IE[6-8] quirks mode fonts in sizes specified by keywords or relatively are
slightly larger, to match equivalent size specification results of older IE
versions, many of which are tabled on:
http://fm.no-ip.com/auth/IE/absolute-sizes-IE5.html
-- 
"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious
people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any
other."  John Adams, 2nd US President

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
***

Re: [WSG] RE: Difference between applied CSS and Computed CSS

2010-02-25 Thread David Hucklesby 

On 2/25/10 5:00 PM, Stephen Holmes (Gmail) wrote:

Hi,

Just noticed this in the WSG List:

"Removing any characters before  really does miracles,
because now the layouts is much better under IE/Safari/Chrome/FF."

This is because if the first thing a browser sees is anything BUT a
Doctype declaration it goes into Quirks mode.


Clarification: that would be in IE 6 only. All other browsers are okay
with the DOCTYPE not coming first in the source.

I'd also note that default font size is 12pt, not 16pt. 12pt defaults to
16px at 96 DPI, at 20px at 120 DPI, and so on... But only in Internet
Explorer (all versions) and Opera, as far as I am aware. Webkit and
Gecko display 12pt as 16px at default settings - on my 120 DPI laptop,
anyway.

Cordially,
David
--



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
***

[WSG] RE: Difference between applied CSS and Computed CSS

2010-02-25 Thread Stephen Holmes (Gmail) 
Hi,

Just noticed this in the WSG List:

"Removing any characters before  really does miracles, because
now the layouts is much better under IE/Safari/Chrome/FF."

This is because if the first thing a browser sees is anything BUT a Doctype 
declaration it goes into Quirks mode. That would explain why the computed size 
of the font would have been 16pt, the default in IE 6 - the reason for quirks 
mode!

More: 

good luck


Stephen Holmes
IA/UX/EIB
stephenwhol...@gmail.com
Canberra, ACT, Australia

"When you plant a tree, never plant only one. Plant three -- one for shade, one 
for fruit, and one for beauty." 
-African proverb



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
***

Re: [WSG] Difference between applied CSS and Computed CSS

2010-02-25 Thread Rateb BEN MOUSSA 
Hi,


I'm sorry because as said Tim Duffy, the render was the same and I confirm
that in (OpenSuse11.2/FF 3.6) after a cache purge.

I've tuned a specified component which insert comment " /***  filename.css
 ***/ " in the cached generated css and now I put @charset "utf-8"; in
place. This helped me to retrieve the original layout under Safari/Chrome.

Removing any characters before  really does miracles, because
now the layouts is much better under IE/Safari/Chrome/FF.

Now see the difference:

(1)
http://www.serenitude.at/margot/vmchk/spa-fontenay/soin-spa-fontenay/nos-massages/id-menu-306.html
 (Fixed)

(2)
http://www.steit.net/dev/serenitude/vmchk/spa-fontenay/soin-spa-fontenay/nos-massages/id-menu-306.html



The lesson was taken, thanks for you all.


On 25 February 2010 13:11, James Ellis  wrote:

> Hi
>
> One problem might be that you have the word "paris" before your doctype,
> which shows up as the page is rendering:
>
> "
>
> paris
> 
> Which could affect the CSS somewhat (at a guess).  Try removing everything,
> including white space and line breaks before the doctype.
>
> I see the font size difference between the two different engines.
>
> Gecko - Firefox 3.5.8
> Webkit - Chrome (5.0.307.9 beta) / Arora (0.10.1)
>
> Both Chrome and Arora show a larger font size than Firefox in the text
> content under the  "Massage-modelage* 
> Dorsal"
> heading.
>
> Additionally, it's fine to serve your CSS from any file provided it's valid
> CSS of course and it sends the correct header to the browser. e.g in PHP
>  header('Content-Type: text/css');
> //stuff
> ?>
>
>  - which you are doing judging by the file headers. The file extension
> doesn't matter, it's just text.
>
>
> Cheers
> James
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 9:59 PM, Russ Weakley wrote:
>
>> Hi Rateb BEN MOUSSA
>>
>>
>>
>> The reason for this can probably be found in one of your "css files":
>>
>> /dev/serenitude/templates/serenitude/css/css-5b04215701ad544b0144a40c4c2cdd38.php
>>
>> In this "css file" you have a comment, a blank line and then an @charset:
>>
>> /*** principale.css ***/
>>
>> @charset "utf-8";
>>
>> The @charset MUST appear in the first line of a CSS file. As the canonical
>> document on @charsets states:
>>
>> "Only one @charset rule may appear in an external style sheet and it must
>> appear at the very start of the document. It must not be preceded by any
>> characters, not even comments."
>> 
>>
>> From personal experience, I can tell you that while all other browsers may
>> be forgiving, Safari will ignore an entire style sheet if the @charset does
>> not appear at the very start of the file.
>>
>> Easy to fix, profound difference (at least in Safari)  :)
>>
>> HTH
>> Russ
>>
>>
>>
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
> ***
>



-- 
Rateb BEN MOUSSA
IT - Development & Integration
S.A.R.L. STEIT - Membre du GEEIT
 | URL : www.steit.net
 | Tel : +33 970406236
 | Mob : +216 97 62 54 94
 | Gtalk : bmra...@gmail.com
 | www.linkedin.com/in/RatebBENMOUSSA
 | Linux user #486726


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
***

Re: [WSG] Difference between applied CSS and Computed CSS

2010-02-25 Thread James Ellis 
Hi

One problem might be that you have the word "paris" before your doctype,
which shows up as the page is rendering:

"

paris
"
heading.

Additionally, it's fine to serve your CSS from any file provided it's valid
CSS of course and it sends the correct header to the browser. e.g in PHP


 - which you are doing judging by the file headers. The file extension
doesn't matter, it's just text.


Cheers
James


On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 9:59 PM, Russ Weakley  wrote:

> Hi Rateb BEN MOUSSA
>
>
> The reason for this can probably be found in one of your "css files":
>
> /dev/serenitude/templates/serenitude/css/css-5b04215701ad544b0144a40c4c2cdd38.php
>
> In this "css file" you have a comment, a blank line and then an @charset:
>
> /*** principale.css ***/
>
> @charset "utf-8";
>
> The @charset MUST appear in the first line of a CSS file. As the canonical
> document on @charsets states:
>
> "Only one @charset rule may appear in an external style sheet and it must
> appear at the very start of the document. It must not be preceded by any
> characters, not even comments."
> 
>
> From personal experience, I can tell you that while all other browsers may
> be forgiving, Safari will ignore an entire style sheet if the @charset does
> not appear at the very start of the file.
>
> Easy to fix, profound difference (at least in Safari)  :)
>
> HTH
> Russ
>
>
>


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
***

Re: [WSG] Difference between applied CSS and Computed CSS

2010-02-25 Thread Russ Weakley 

Hi Rateb BEN MOUSSA

I am not seeing any difference in font size between the sites on  
either Mac/FF3.5.7 or Mac/Chrome 5.0.307.9 beta.


Looking in Firebug, I see the body has been set in two places with a  
font-size of 12px.


template.css (line 3)
body {
color:#00;
font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;
font-size:12px;
}

editor.css (line 1)
body {
font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;
font-size:12px;
}

These rules appears to be the same in both locations.

One thing I do notice is that both sites have missing CSS in Safari -  
which causes large chunks of the page to appear unstyled.


The reason for this can probably be found in one of your "css files":
/dev/serenitude/templates/serenitude/css/ 
css-5b04215701ad544b0144a40c4c2cdd38.php


In this "css file" you have a comment, a blank line and then an  
@charset:


/*** principale.css ***/

@charset "utf-8";

The @charset MUST appear in the first line of a CSS file. As the  
canonical document on @charsets states:


"Only one @charset rule may appear in an external style sheet and it  
must appear at the very start of the document. It must not be preceded  
by any characters, not even comments."



From personal experience, I can tell you that while all other  
browsers may be forgiving, Safari will ignore an entire style sheet if  
the @charset does not appear at the very start of the file.


Easy to fix, profound difference (at least in Safari)  :)

HTH
Russ




On 25/02/2010, at 9:05 PM, Rateb BEN MOUSSA wrote:


Hi all,


This is my first post here, I've a website which is hosted in two  
location and it still under development.


Here I've a correct render under FF 3.6
(1) 
http://www.serenitude.at/margot/vmchk/spa-fontenay/soin-spa-fontenay/nos-massages/id-menu-306.html

But here I noticed bigger text font under FF too
(2) 
http://www.steit.net/dev/serenitude/vmchk/spa-fontenay/soin-spa-fontenay/nos-massages/id-menu-306.html

I've tested both of those links in Chromium 5.0.335.0 (0) they show  
me the bigger font again.


Under Firebug I've noticed that there is no difference between  
applied CSS for both website (tab: Style in firebug), but the  
calculated CSS (tab: Computed in firebug) mention that (1) has "font- 
size: 12px" and (2) has "font-size: 16px".


I wonder to know how this could be happen, is it a non closed tags  
or a misconfigured CSS that caused ambiguous inheritance.


Any idea about how to figure out with this problem, how to fix the  
render of this page to become the same under different navigators.




Thanks for any help



--
Rateb BEN MOUSSA
IT - Development & Integration
S.A.R.L. STEIT - Membre du GEEIT
 | URL : www.steit.net
 | Tel : +33 970406236
 | Mob : +216 97 62 54 94
 | Gtalk : bmra...@gmail.com
 | www.linkedin.com/in/RatebBENMOUSSA
 | Linux user #486726

***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
***




***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
***

Re: [WSG] Difference between applied CSS and Computed CSS

2010-02-25 Thread Tim Duffy 
> Here I've a correct render under FF 3.6
> (1)
> http://www.serenitude.at/margot/vmchk/spa-fontenay/soin-spa-fontenay/nos-massages/id-menu-306.html
> But here I noticed bigger text font under FF too
> (2)
> http://www.steit.net/dev/serenitude/vmchk/spa-fontenay/soin-spa-fontenay/nos-massages/id-menu-306.html
> I've tested both of those links in Chromium 5.0.335.0 (0) they show me the
> bigger font again.
> --
> Rateb BEN MOUSSA


Hi Rateb BEN MOUSSA

When I look at the links provided (in FF 3.6) the pages are
identical--no difference in font size for me.

Tim


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
***

[WSG] Difference between applied CSS and Computed CSS

2010-02-25 Thread Rateb BEN MOUSSA 
Hi all,


This is my first post here, I've a website which is hosted in two location
and it still under development.

Here I've a correct render under FF 3.6
(1)
http://www.serenitude.at/margot/vmchk/spa-fontenay/soin-spa-fontenay/nos-massages/id-menu-306.html

But here I noticed bigger text font under FF too
(2)
http://www.steit.net/dev/serenitude/vmchk/spa-fontenay/soin-spa-fontenay/nos-massages/id-menu-306.html

I've tested both of those links in Chromium 5.0.335.0 (0) they show me the
bigger font again.

Under Firebug I've noticed that there is no difference between applied CSS
for both website (tab: Style in firebug), but the calculated CSS (tab:
Computed in firebug) mention that (1) has "font-size: 12px" and (2) has
"font-size: 16px".

I wonder to know how this could be happen, is it a non closed tags or a
misconfigured CSS that caused ambiguous inheritance.

Any idea about how to figure out with this problem, how to fix the render of
this page to become the same under different navigators.



Thanks for any help



-- 
Rateb BEN MOUSSA
IT - Development & Integration
S.A.R.L. STEIT - Membre du GEEIT
 | URL : www.steit.net
 | Tel : +33 970406236
 | Mob : +216 97 62 54 94
 | Gtalk : bmra...@gmail.com
 | www.linkedin.com/in/RatebBENMOUSSA
 | Linux user #486726


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
***