Re: [AFMUG] underground footage expectations

2022-02-09 Thread Chuck McCown via AF
Test spools prior to construction. We do a slack loop every 3000’ or less. If you have damage you can shift slack to add the splice. Only splice where you have to. I like 30,000’ reels when going long distances. Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 8, 2022, at 10:18 PM, Steve Jones wrote: > >  >

Re: [AFMUG] Horizon 5G millimeter repeater

2022-02-09 Thread dmmoffett
Yeah, someone needed to put a leash on the marketing people on that one. Mmwave just lets them opportunistically offload traffic from other bands. They’re putting a lot of money into that because growth in consumption isn’t going to stop, so the alternative is congestion and stagnation. -Ad

Re: [AFMUG] underground footage expectations

2022-02-09 Thread Josh Luthman
We also tested every spool after delivery and before the contractor could touch it. We know it's 100% good when we gave it to them, so if something is screwed in the field it was between when we handed it off and now. On Wed, Feb 9, 2022 at 4:08 AM Chuck McCown via AF wrote: > Test spools prior

Re: [AFMUG] underground footage expectations

2022-02-09 Thread Steve Jones
what is the normal tolerance on damage splices for that 30k feet. I assume tolerances is contract base, but if you wanted that 30k uncut, at what point would you consider the contract terms not met? If a cut necessitates an unplanned vault, who is normally responsible to provide the splice case and

Re: [AFMUG] underground footage expectations

2022-02-09 Thread Steve Jones
Anybody have an example contractor contract/PO they could share? Im not specifically concerned with actual rates as much as terms of the contract On Wed, Feb 9, 2022 at 9:03 AM Josh Luthman wrote: > We also tested every spool after delivery and before the contractor could > touch it. We know it

Re: [AFMUG] underground footage expectations

2022-02-09 Thread Chuck McCown via AF
With duct, it never happens. I would probably make them buy a spool of fiber and blow it in without splices if for some reason it needed to be cut. At the very least they would be on the hook for vault and splicing. From: Steve Jones Sent: Wednesday, February 9, 2022 8:05 AM To: AnimalFarm

[AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Nate Burke
Here in the Chicago suburbs, a 250k sqft document storage warehouse just burned down. It took them a week to put out the fire. 30' Racks stacked with banker boxes, when the building sprinklers hit it, the paper got waterlogged and got too heavy for the racks to support and came down, taking r

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Chuck McCown via AF
Wow, I am sure there are lots of irreplaceable documents. So if you were to build one, I wonder how to prevent this same problem? I guess structural engineering needs to presume all the racks are full of water. -Original Message- From: Nate Burke Sent: Wednesday, February 9, 2022 10:

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Bill Prince
I suspect maybe a lot of government documents? I know that our county lost a bunch of property records in a fire many, many years ago. Some of our property records can not be retrieved. bp On 2/9/2022 9:36 AM, Nate Burke wrote: Here in the Chicago suburbs, a 250k sqft document storage wareho

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Zach Underwood
Automate the whole racking system so that you can purge oxygen out of the whole room? On Wed, Feb 9, 2022 at 12:42 PM Chuck McCown via AF wrote: > Wow, I am sure there are lots of irreplaceable documents. So if you were > to > build one, I wonder how to prevent this same problem? > I guess stru

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Seth Mattinen
On 2/9/22 9:41 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote: Wow, I am sure there are lots of irreplaceable documents.  So if you were to build one, I wonder how to prevent this same problem? I guess structural engineering needs to presume all the racks are full of water. I'd say the easy answer is smaller

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Bill Prince
In my former years, data centers often had halon systems which would displace air in the entire data center. They were phased out because no air is just as bad for humans as it is for fires. bp On 2/9/2022 10:03 AM, Zach Underwood wrote:

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Chuck McCown via AF
I visited one of those once. Before going in we had to have a training session about the alarms and the controls. Not sure if we were supposed to do something other than leave if the alarm went off. Maybe there was a delay to allow us to exit before releasing the gas. It was a serious deal.

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Brian Webster
In the Navy we had very large Halon system to combat fires in the main engineering spaces. If you worked in that space you actually wore a person sized breathing device that would last you long enough to get out of that space if Halon was activated. And you can bet we had a lot of training about

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Zach Underwood
Scanning them into digital form brings up new problems like file format, Are we sure we will be able to still open pdf,docx or png files in 250 years like we can still do with paper? Also even if we are sure we can open the file format, are we sure we can still read the media it is stored on, will

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Steve Jones
we got a hold of some halon fire extinguishers in my helmet days and used them to fill balloons to inhale. some mental retardation later i realize that may have not been the best choice. I did watch a buddy stepping off my porch legs just go their own way. he thought he was falling into a void til

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Brian Webster
Yes those are all very real issues no doubt. Different issues than having the only physical copy and then trying to figure out how to store them and solve all of those issues as well. With storage space so cheap digital copies distributed all over the place helps. Physical media and file fo

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Robert
The issue with digital storage is the duration of the digital copies.  Even laser discs decay over time, magnetic images decay faster.   Tape images done in the 60s are being retranscribed with serious errors because of decay of the magnetic poles... On 2/9/22 11:13 AM, Brian Webster wrote:

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Chuck McCown via AF
Do we trust the cloud? I have read of holographic crystal storage that is supposed to last forever. From: Robert Sent: Wednesday, February 9, 2022 2:30 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage The issue with digital storage is the duration of the digital copies. Even

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Bill Prince
Most, if not all, of the cloud storage systems have multiple copies that are regularly moved around. I even think they have stuff in triplicate. bp On 2/9/2022 1:53 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote: Do we trust the clou

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Josh Luthman
Multiple copies. On Wed, Feb 9, 2022 at 4:31 PM Robert wrote: > The issue with digital storage is the duration of the digital copies. > Even laser discs decay over time, magnetic images decay faster. Tape > images done in the 60s are being retranscribed with serious errors because > of decay o

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Document Storage

2022-02-09 Thread Robert
If you make multiple copies on the same media at the same time, they will decay at the same rate...  And cloud storage has no actual guaranties as to the backups working or terms of storage, as a bunch of photographers found when their cloud storage company went broke.  Luckily another photo st

Re: [AFMUG] underground footage expectations

2022-02-09 Thread Steve Jones
when you contract, at the rates discussed, this is preengineered, thats not engineered rate? these are PO with a work order rates? On Wed, Feb 9, 2022 at 10:10 AM Chuck McCown via AF wrote: > With duct, it never happens. I would probably make them buy a spool of > fiber and blow it in without s