Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Ørjan Johansen
On Sun, 24 Sep 2017, Kerim Aydin wrote: A Checkered Card is a type of Card that is appropriate for violations of the rules that directly and substantially result in a Win. When a Checkered Card has been issued and not been the subject of an open CFJ for seven days, [the win

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Ørjan Johansen
On Sun, 24 Sep 2017, Gaelan Steele wrote: It may be valuable to have some actions (voting on a Decision, for example) be automatically disqualifying for some short amount of time (2 hours or so) to help prevent timing scams. Won't work because of the time gap between end of voting and resolut

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Ørjan Johansen
On Sun, 24 Sep 2017, Kerim Aydin wrote: Proto: "losing conditions" Seems this isn't really popular, but I'll point out a couple bugs anyhow: When the Rules state that a person or persons win the game, and those persons are not Disqualified from winning as described by the Rul

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Cuddle Beam
>You can have a scam that uses a hidden, unintended loophole that is perfectly legal when pointed out/CFJd, and you can have a scam that comes from, say, an Officer violating a SHALL NOT. Well, yeah. But then we can get into if it was a violation of their officer SHALL NOTs or some other kind of c

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Aris Merchant
On Sun, Sep 24, 2017 at 5:43 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > On Mon, 25 Sep 2017, Cuddle Beam wrote: >> What constitutes a scam or not is also at times very subjective. > > The point is not what constitutes a scam. The point is what constitutes > breaking the rules. > > You can have a scam that uses

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Mon, 25 Sep 2017, Cuddle Beam wrote: > What constitutes a scam or not is also at times very subjective.  The point is not what constitutes a scam. The point is what constitutes breaking the rules. You can have a scam that uses a hidden, unintended loophole that is perfectly legal when point

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Cuddle Beam
What constitutes a scam or not is also at times very subjective. On Mon, Sep 25, 2017 at 2:25 AM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus < p.scribonius.scholasti...@googlemail.com> wrote: > Sorry, yeah, I am fine. I don't know what happened there. Maybe I dropped > something on a key and didn't notice,

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
Sorry, yeah, I am fine. I don't know what happened there. Maybe I dropped something on a key and didn't notice, but sorry. Publius Scribonius Scholasticus p.scribonius.scholasti...@gmail.com > On Sep 24, 2017, at 8:19 PM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus > wrote: > > I actually think tha

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Nicholas Evans
On Sep 24, 2017 7:19 PM, "Publius Scribonius Scholasticus" < p.scribonius.scholasti...@googlemail.com> wrote: I actually think that we should continue to allow scammed wins because it is one of the most interesting parts qqwerr of the game./ Are you qwert alright there?

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
I actually think that we should continue to allow scammed wins because it is one of the most interesting parts qqwerr of the game./ Publius Scribonius Scholasticus p.scribonius.scholasti...@gmail.com > On Sep 24, 2017, at 8:02 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > > On S

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Sun, 24 Sep 2017, Aris Merchant wrote: > The problem is that most scams happen in one message, meaning there > isn't time to card the violator before e scams a win. I might suggest > some rule that makes winning via a deliberate rule violation > automatically invalidate the win, but I don't kn

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Aris Merchant
On Sun, Sep 24, 2017 at 3:09 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > Proto: "losing conditions" > > [Right now, it's probably worth it to break the rules to win, because wins > are far more tangible and lasting than cards. Let's change the equation...] > > > Amend Rule 2449 (Winning the Game) by replacing:

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Gaelan Steele
I’m generally against mechanisms that are in theory based on violations of the rules but have no actual connection to the “actual” gamestate; In my opinion it should be IMPOSSIBLE to card someone who has not violated a SHALL. If we did that, CFJ judgement would simply happen via CFJ (and there’s

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Nicholas Evans
I don't think i feel as strongly as CB but I do feel similarly. Both issues would be fixed with a) decentralizing (my prefered format is similar to a CFJ: separate the finger pointer, referee, and judge) cards and b) allowing forgiveness without apology (perhaps as Agoran Consent). To make up for t

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Cuddle Beam
Would make tactical card-flinging (tactically exaggerating other people's wrong-doings for example) a thing and I feel very queasy about giving our subjective things that kind of power. >Until e publishes such an apology, as a penalty, the bad sport is disqualified from winning, I'm also very aga

Re: DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Gaelan Steele
It may be valuable to have some actions (voting on a Decision, for example) be automatically disqualifying for some short amount of time (2 hours or so) to help prevent timing scams. Gaelan > On Sep 24, 2017, at 3:09 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > > Proto: "losing conditions" > > [Right now

DIS: proto: losing conditions

2017-09-24 Thread Kerim Aydin
Proto: "losing conditions" [Right now, it's probably worth it to break the rules to win, because wins are far more tangible and lasting than cards. Let's change the equation...] Amend Rule 2449 (Winning the Game) by replacing: When the Rules state that a person or persons win the game,