Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Saturday 05 September 2015 11:26:42 Martin Steigerwald wrote: > The transition is challenging. From what I see the Debian Qt/KDE team does > a *marvellous* job. ... > > So members of the Debian Qt/KDE team, I am now also one, work, usually in > their free time, unpaid, on delivering a new

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

Am Donnerstag 03 September 2015, 16:37:09 schrieb Andrey Rahmatullin: > On Thu, Sep 03, 2015 at 12:43:37PM +0200, Christian Hilberg wrote: > > "It's all automatic" is the bit I missed. I was under the impression > > that this would be true for experimental->unstable only > experimental->unstable

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

Hi Brad, thanks for clarifying matters. A few more bits inline. Am Donnerstag 03 September 2015, 14:19:53 schrieb Brad Rogers: > On Thu, 03 Sep 2015 12:43:37 +0200 > Christian Hilberg wrote: > > Hello Christian, > > >> You appear to expect somebody (well, several >

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, Sep 03, 2015 at 06:30:13PM +0200, Matthias Bodenbinder wrote: > Am 03.09.2015 um 18:12 schrieb Martin Steigerwald: > >> Packages from Debian Unstable enter the next-stable testing distribution > >> automatically, when a list of requirements is fulfilled: [...] The package > >> does not

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, 03 Sep 2015 16:54:32 +0200 Christian Hilberg wrote: Hello Christian, >I might bug you with some new bug reports in the meantime. :) Not me! :-) Like you, I'm a Debian user. I don't represent Debian or KDE in any way. All opinions are my own etc, etc. It

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, 03 Sep 2015 19:06:10 +0200 Diederik de Haas wrote: Hello Diederik, >allotted time, the package transitions to testing. I was surprised to see that "allotted time" can be as little as two days. Which doesn't give unstable users a lot of time to discover any real

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, Sep 03, 2015 at 03:03:35PM -0400, Gary Dale wrote: > Sorry, but before releasing a major package to "testing", shouldn't it be > tested against the "testing" environment? No, we don't do this. -- WBR, wRAR signature.asc Description: Digital signature

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

Am Donnerstag 03 September 2015, 18:12:04 schrieb Martin Steigerwald: > Am Mittwoch, 2. September 2015, 22:46:12 schrieb Matthias Bodenbinder: > > Am 02.09.2015 um 19:50 schrieb Gary Dale: > > [...] > > > the brave souls who run sid do what they, not I, signed up for. > > I 100% support that

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

Am 03.09.2015 um 18:12 schrieb Martin Steigerwald: >> Packages from Debian Unstable enter the next-stable testing distribution >> automatically, when a list of requirements is fulfilled: [...] The package >> does not introduce new release critical bugs. > > So and now *who* reports these? > >

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, Sep 03, 2015 at 06:16:53PM +0100, Brad Rogers wrote: > >allotted time, the package transitions to testing. > I was surprised to see that "allotted time" can be as little as two > days. Which doesn't give unstable users a lot of time to discover any > real nasties. Urgencies higher than

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

Am Mittwoch, 2. September 2015, 22:46:12 schrieb Matthias Bodenbinder: > Am 02.09.2015 um 19:50 schrieb Gary Dale: > > I know I've been using Debian for a long time. That's why I'm amazed that > > something this bad is being put into testing. When KDE4 came along, it at > > least was fairly stable

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, Sep 03, 2015 at 12:03:04PM -0400, Gary Dale wrote: > I've tended to view "testing" as a rolling release That's the main misunderstanding. We had several tries to design and/or create a rolling Debian distro but there is nothing currently existing AFAIK. And it takes a lot more effort than

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thursday 03 September 2015 12:03:04 Gary Dale wrote: > I also used to think of the "testing" package maintainers as the > guardians at the gate There is no such thing. Package maintainers upload packages to unstable. When there are no Release Critical bugs reported by *users* of unstable in

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On 03/09/15 03:42 PM, Andrey Rahmatullin wrote: On Thu, Sep 03, 2015 at 03:03:35PM -0400, Gary Dale wrote: Sorry, but before releasing a major package to "testing", shouldn't it be tested against the "testing" environment? No, we don't do this. Obviously, but the question was "shouldn't

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, 03 Sep 2015 10:12:52 +0200 Christian Hilberg wrote: Hello Christian, >I guess it might have been wiser to let the transitions happen in >unstable, since the massive breakage you mention was to be expected, >and have the smaller issues and oversights ironed out

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

Hi Brad, Am Mittwoch 02 September 2015, 16:16:10 schrieb Brad Rogers: > On Wed, 02 Sep 2015 10:21:47 -0400 > Gary Dale wrote: > > Hello Gary, > > >Yesterday I rebooted my computer but when it came back up and I logged > >in, Plasma was no longer usable. > > Come on

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thursday, 3 September 2015 09:20:02 UTC+1, Christian Hilberg wrote: > Hi Brad, > > Am Mittwoch 02 September 2015, 16:16:10 schrieb Brad Rogers: > > On Wed, 02 Sep 2015 10:21:47 -0400 > > Gary Dale wrote: > > > > Hello Gary, > > > > >Yesterday I rebooted my computer

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

Hi Brad, Am Donnerstag 03 September 2015, 09:40:35 schrieb Brad Rogers: > On Thu, 03 Sep 2015 10:12:52 +0200 > Christian Hilberg wrote: > > Hello Christian, > > >I guess it might have been wiser to let the transitions happen in > >unstable, since the massive breakage

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, Sep 03, 2015 at 12:43:37PM +0200, Christian Hilberg wrote: > "It's all automatic" is the bit I missed. I was under the impression > that this would be true for experimental->unstable only experimental->unstable is fully manual (even requiring a new upload). -- WBR, wRAR signature.asc

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu 03 Sep 2015 04:24:40 PM Gary Dale wrote: > On 03/09/15 03:42 PM, Andrey Rahmatullin wrote: > > On Thu, Sep 03, 2015 at 03:03:35PM -0400, Gary Dale wrote: > >> Sorry, but before releasing a major package to "testing", shouldn't it be > >> tested against the "testing" environment? > > > >

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, 03 Sep 2015 12:43:37 +0200 Christian Hilberg wrote: Hello Christian, >> You appear to expect somebody (well, several >> somebodies) to stem the tide to avoid problems. >"Expecting" is not what I meant to express, it is more like "being I wasn't sure, hence

Re: Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Thu, 3 Sep 2015 21:21:52 +0500 Andrey Rahmatullin wrote: > That's the main misunderstanding. > We had several tries to design and/or create a rolling Debian distro but > there is nothing currently existing AFAIK. > And it takes a lot more effort than is currently spent on unstable and >

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Wed, Sep 02, 2015 at 10:21:47AM -0400, Gary Dale wrote: > I thought testing was supposed to be where packages were mainly working and > the sid and experimental where were packages were tested to make sure they > actually worked. Not really. "The testing distribution is generated automatically

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On 02/09/15 11:41 AM, Andrey Rahmatullin wrote: On Wed, Sep 02, 2015 at 10:21:47AM -0400, Gary Dale wrote: I thought testing was supposed to be where packages were mainly working and the sid and experimental where were packages were tested to make sure they actually worked. Not really. "The

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

On Wed, 02 Sep 2015 10:21:47 -0400 Gary Dale wrote: Hello Gary, >Yesterday I rebooted my computer but when it came back up and I logged >in, Plasma was no longer usable. Come on Gary, you've been on this ML long enough to know that KDE is going through some *massive*

Re: Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

Am 02.09.2015 um 19:50 schrieb Gary Dale: > I know I've been using Debian for a long time. That's why I'm amazed that > something this bad is being put into testing. When KDE4 came along, it at > least was fairly stable and usable (if incomplete) before it was moved to > testing. If I wanted

Plasma desktop unusable in stretch

Yesterday I rebooted my computer but when it came back up and I logged in, Plasma was no longer usable. Specifically the window borders were gone, including the top bar. Since the top bar contains the close window button, if a window didn't provide a menu bar, I'd have to bring up the system