The other page evolved with the knee jerk reaction of the other party to
hit, and the terror methods of one Chealer who believed himself master
of the wiki.
I didn't believe myself master of the wiki.
If you think that I've done something wrong on the wiki, I recommend
that you let me know
On Mon, May 28, 2007 at 11:05:00PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
On Sun, May 27, 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
I am now making this request to you as DPL, that you investigate who was
behind this action, and find out why it was done, and that it be
publicly addressed.
Sven, first of all,
Sven Luther wrote:
I am now making this request to you as DPL, that you investigate who was
behind this action, and find out why it was done, and that it be
publicly addressed.
Sven, first of all, please restrict your postings to debian-project,
Whyever should i do that ?
On Tue, May 29, 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
then so be it, debian is better off without such persons whose behaviour
will only hurt the project again one way or another, and should not be
encouraged.
These are words of pure wisdom, thank you. Empathy would be the next
step to enlightenment.
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 09:00:31AM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
I am now making this request to you as DPL, that you investigate who was
behind this action, and find out why it was done, and that it be
publicly addressed.
Sven, first of all, please restrict
On Tue, 29 May 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
i guess that the DPL position corrupts one after all :(
Sven, I really fail to understand in how far you think you will
change the situation if you blur your instance with wild guesses.
Kind regards
Andreas.
PS: This is my only posting in
On Mon, May 28, 2007 at 11:05:00PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
On Sun, May 27, 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
I am now making this request to you as DPL, that you investigate who was
behind this action, and find out why it was done, and that it be
publicly addressed.
Sven, first of all,
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:14:23AM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
then so be it, debian is better off without such persons whose behaviour
will only hurt the project again one way or another, and should not be
On Tue, May 29, 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:14:23AM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
then so be it, debian is better off without such persons whose behaviour
will only hurt the project again one way or another, and should not be
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:13:02PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
But you are not asking for justice, you are asking for revenge and
retalation. And as long as I am the project leader there shall be no
revenge or retalation, and you had better accept it. You do not undo
harm by harming even
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 12:46:00PM +0200, Marc 'HE' Brockschmidt wrote:
Debian is better off without you. Your behaviour has been a problem for
the project in the past, is one currently and will be a problem in the
future.
Mark, ...
That's not my name.
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:23:27PM +0200, Marc 'HE' Brockschmidt wrote:
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 12:46:00PM +0200, Marc 'HE' Brockschmidt wrote:
Debian is better off without you. Your behaviour has been a problem for
the project in the past, is one
Sven Luther wrote:
Partially restored, i used to be kernel team admin, but that is not the
point.
If it's not the point, don't mention it so often. Thanks.
Ok, but this was only the 'goute qui a fait deborder le vase', the
bigger problem remains as a raw wound, for me, and for debian as a
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:40:55PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, but this was only the 'goute qui a fait deborder le vase', the
bigger problem remains as a raw wound, for me, and for debian as a
The - what you call - bigger problem has been discussed enough. More
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [070529 13:58]:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:40:55PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, but this was only the 'goute qui a fait deborder le vase', the
bigger problem remains as a raw wound, for me, and for debian as a
The - what you call
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 02:07:06PM +0200, Andreas Barth wrote:
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [070529 13:58]:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:40:55PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, but this was only the 'goute qui a fait deborder le vase', the
bigger problem remains
Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:40:55PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, but this was only the 'goute qui a fait deborder le vase', the
bigger problem remains as a raw wound, for me, and for debian as a
The - what you call - bigger problem has been
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
Just leave Debian, like that, and who will give me back all those years
and uncountable hours i have sacrificed to debian ? Or the actual money
and time and equipement i have given to debian ?
Funny thing about volunteers.. They tend to give their
Sven Luther wrote:
Just leave Debian.
Why should i ? Just because debian is unable tyo recognize it has
behaved badly in this matter, and make amends ?
Yes. Obviously the Debian project isn't worthy of your contributions.
Just leave Debian, like that, and who will give me back all those
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 02:12:19PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 02:07:06PM +0200, Andreas Barth wrote:
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [070529 13:58]:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:40:55PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, but this was only the
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [070529 13:57]:
So, what is the solution, i ask you, do you see some way out of this ? I
am all ears, ...
i proposed a solution to you that would let you work on what you
like and took care of the social complications. but that approach
did not fit your own
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 08:27:07AM -0400, Stephen Frost wrote:
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
Just leave Debian, like that, and who will give me back all those years
and uncountable hours i have sacrificed to debian ? Or the actual money
and time and equipement i have given to
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 02:22:29PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:40:55PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, but this was only the 'goute qui a fait deborder le vase', the
bigger problem remains as a raw wound, for me, and for
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 02:27:20PM +0200, Andreas Schuldei wrote:
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [070529 13:57]:
So, what is the solution, i ask you, do you see some way out of this ? I
am all ears, ...
i proposed a solution to you that would let you work on what you
like and took care
On Tue, May 29, 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:13:02PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
But you are not asking for justice, you are asking for revenge and
retalation. And as long as I am the project leader there shall be no
revenge or retalation, and you had better accept
Sven Luther wrote:
May i ask you why there is no other solution ? What is it that makes it
a total heresy to even propose we try to solve it fairly and honourably ?
Because what you would accept is not acceptable for Frans and what
Frans accepts is very obviously not acceptable to you.
Thus,
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 03:35:35PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
May i ask you why there is no other solution ? What is it that makes it
a total heresy to even propose we try to solve it fairly and honourably ?
Because what you would accept is not acceptable for Frans and
Sven Luther wrote:
Is this so much to ask ? I ask this not of you, but of Debian, of you
Joey, of all other readers.
Yes.
Thus, live with it and enjoy life without trying the impossible.
Why is it impossible ? This is what i don't understand. Debian has
Because what you would accept is
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:17:53PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, then we come back to the problem of Frans, right, who found it
totally unacceptable that i dared to present myself as DPL, and chose to
hurry to search expulsion supporters to punish me for it ?
Sven, could you slide back to your
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:35:01PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
Is this so much to ask ? I ask this not of you, but of Debian, of you
Joey, of all other readers.
Yes.
How sad, ...
but it isd because of this, that the problem is still present after over
a year, and that
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:29:50PM +0200, Mike Hommey wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:17:53PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, then we come back to the problem of Frans, right, who found it
totally unacceptable that i dared to present myself as DPL, and chose to
hurry to search expulsion
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:52:03PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:29:50PM +0200, Mike Hommey wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:17:53PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, then we come back to the problem of Frans, right, who found it
totally unacceptable that i dared to
Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, then we come back to the problem of Frans, right, who found it
totally unacceptable that i dared to present myself as DPL, and chose to
hurry to search expulsion supporters to punish me for it ? Even though
my DPL candidacy had nothing to do with him, but rather because
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 11:13:11AM -0400, Kevin Mark wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:52:03PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:29:50PM +0200, Mike Hommey wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:17:53PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, then we come back to the problem of
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 05:14:20PM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, then we come back to the problem of Frans, right, who found it
totally unacceptable that i dared to present myself as DPL, and chose to
hurry to search expulsion supporters to punish me for it ? Even
Le mardi 29 mai 2007 à 17:32 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
Sven, let me ask you something. Do you really feel you stood a single
chance to be elected as DPL?
Nope
Good. Now will you stop arguing your expulsion was requested because of
your candidacy?
Now, it is my turn to ask you
Sven Luther dijo [Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:21:20PM +0200]:
without a reason. This is justice: the harm was undone, you have aquired
an additional level of protection, and no measures were taken against
your disruptive behaviour.
Ok, but this was only the 'goute qui a fait deborder le
Le mardi 29 mai 2007 à 17:44 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
Can you tell me a single other reason which justified that my expulsion
was requested on february 7 or so ?
For example, that could be because of the fourth report of the IPCC -
delivered on February 2 - which confirmed the human cause
Sven Luther dijo [Tue, May 29, 2007 at 02:12:19PM +0200]:
Then what will change it ?
Just leave Debian.
Why should i ? Just because debian is unable tyo recognize it has
behaved badly in this matter, and make amends ?
Because you cannot work in it anymore. Because your co-workers are
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 05:41:44PM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le mardi 29 mai 2007 à 17:32 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
Sven, let me ask you something. Do you really feel you stood a single
chance to be elected as DPL?
Nope
Good. Now will you stop arguing your expulsion was
Sven Luther dijo [Tue, May 29, 2007 at 02:52:22PM +0200]:
Funny thing about volunteers.. They tend to give their time willingly
without getting things in return. That's kind of the point. If you're
I actually did get something in return, pain and hurt and rejection. If
i had gotten
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:29:35AM -0500, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
Sven Luther dijo [Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:21:20PM +0200]:
without a reason. This is justice: the harm was undone, you have aquired
an additional level of protection, and no measures were taken against
your disruptive behaviour.
Le mardi 29 mai 2007 à 17:58 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
Ok, so you have really no idea and are just trolling ?
Yes, definitely. I think Debian should remain a place of shadowy
dealings and mafioso politics. Therefore I don't want you to come and
fix that.
It highly depends on the current
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:35:21AM -0500, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
Sven Luther dijo [Tue, May 29, 2007 at 02:52:22PM +0200]:
Funny thing about volunteers.. They tend to give their time willingly
without getting things in return. That's kind of the point. If you're
I actually did get
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:31:45AM -0500, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
Sven Luther dijo [Tue, May 29, 2007 at 02:12:19PM +0200]:
Then what will change it ?
Just leave Debian.
Why should i ? Just because debian is unable tyo recognize it has
behaved badly in this matter, and make amends ?
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 06:05:53PM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le mardi 29 mai 2007 à 17:58 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
Ok, so you have really no idea and are just trolling ?
Yes, definitely. I think Debian should remain a place of shadowy
dealings and mafioso politics. Therefore I
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 05:55:07PM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le mardi 29 mai 2007 à 17:44 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
Can you tell me a single other reason which justified that my expulsion
was requested on february 7 or so ?
For example, that could be because of the fourth report
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 06:25:29PM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 18:10:41 +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
So, maybe i should publish the irc logs of the french cabal to help your
memory, right ?
TINFC.
Oh fun, MadCoder is threatening me with legal action ...
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 06:07:40PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
[snip]
Err, a handful is so many people. I guess this is the cause of all my
problem, we don't speak the same language.
So on one hand, you again and again and again say that *Debian* is
treating you badly, on the other hand you say
Sven,
You may or may not have been mistreated but the volume of your
arguments is disproportionate. There are millions of people
who are being treated far worse and on an ongoing basis and I'd
like to use what few spare cycles my brain has to worry about
them rather than skipping over arguments
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 09:36:47AM -0700, Mike Bird wrote:
Sven,
You may or may not have been mistreated but the volume of your
arguments is disproportionate. There are millions of people
who are being treated far worse and on an ongoing basis and I'd
like to use what few spare cycles my
On 11034 March 1977, Sven Luther wrote:
As an example of why this is a mess :
14:27:44 Ganneff svenl: would you *ever* consider something as
valid way out thats not 100% what you want, ie you all admit you
have been wrong?
How funny, since This is exactly the discourse that Anthyony
Sven Luther wrote:
Yes, it is only a handful of people who really have a problem with me. I
guess if you go down to it there is only a single person who really has
a problem, and a few others who also feel pretty strongly about this.
The number of people having a problem with you will
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 07:45:51PM +0200, Mike Hommey wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:52:03PM +0200, Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:29:50PM +0200, Mike Hommey wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 04:17:53PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
Ok, then we come back to
On 5/29/07, Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Yes, it is only a handful of people who really have a problem with me. I
guess if you go down to it there is only a single person who really has
a problem, and a few others who also feel pretty strongly about this.
Hi Sven. I apologize for all
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 08:35:05PM +0200, Andreas Barth wrote:
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [070529 18:17]:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:29:35AM -0500, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
Sven Luther dijo [Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:21:20PM +0200]:
without a reason. This is justice: the harm was undone,
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 09:45:59PM +0300, Teodor wrote:
On 5/29/07, Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Yes, it is only a handful of people who really have a problem with me. I
guess if you go down to it there is only a single person who really has
a problem, and a few others who also feel
On Tuesday 29 May 2007 09:59, Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 09:36:47AM -0700, Mike Bird wrote:
You might want to consider developing a web page with careful
analysis of evidence and arguments, reviewing it carefully over
a period of weeks until you are certain it stands alone
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 11:49:23AM -0700, Mike Bird wrote:
On Tuesday 29 May 2007 09:59, Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 09:36:47AM -0700, Mike Bird wrote:
You might want to consider developing a web page with careful
analysis of evidence and arguments, reviewing it carefully
On 11034 March 1977, Sven Luther wrote:
14:27:44 Ganneff svenl: would you *ever* consider something as
valid way out thats not 100% what you want, ie you all admit you
have been wrong?
How funny, since This is exactly the discourse that Anthyony Towns,
Frans Pop and Raphael
Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 07:21:08PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 09:36:47AM -0700, Mike Bird wrote:
Sven,
You may or may not have been mistreated but the volume of your
arguments is disproportionate. There are
Sven Luther wrote:
Why can't i post on debian mailing lists, if it costs nothing but email
archive space and some bandwidth, which is cheap nowaday ? Just because
you don't like what i have to say i should i have less right to the use
of the mailing lists than you or others do ?
You are
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...]
because the DDs fail to aknowledge the part of responsability they have
in this mess in having it let escalate to such dramatic proportions.
I'm working on this, but I am currently suffering a denial-of-service
attack from a thread about it on
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 09:07:31PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 07:21:08PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 09:36:47AM -0700, Mike Bird wrote:
Sven,
You may or may not have been mistreated but
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 08:26:20PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...]
because the DDs fail to aknowledge the part of responsability they have
in this mess in having it let escalate to such dramatic proportions.
I'm working on this, but I am currently suffering
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [070529 22:05]:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 08:26:20PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
Please limit the number of posts per day to this thread.
Lively discussion
Lively discussion and DoS is a different thing. You do DoS.
Andi
--
http://home.arcor.de/andreas-barth/
On Tuesday 29 May 2007 11:58, Sven Luther wrote:
You are wrong, you still need a impartial judge. Tell me where in debian
i do find such ? That is the main problem, any argumentation is just
lost time without a fair hearing and an impartial judge.
If you can find an impartial judge which will
Hi,
On Tuesday 29 May 2007 22:05, Sven Luther wrote:
Lively discussion is a sign of good health in any project;
not always :-)
friendly,
Holger
pgp96oKujJmCP.pgp
Description: PGP signature
Sven Luther wrote:
Care to give me a chance ?
You've had your chances, Sven.
You're restarting with the old pattern, always.
you don't like what i have to say i should i have less right to the use
of the mailing lists than you or others do ?
Thanks for putting differnt words in my
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:16:39PM +0200, Holger Levsen wrote:
Hi,
On Tuesday 29 May 2007 22:05, Sven Luther wrote:
Lively discussion is a sign of good health in any project;
not always :-)
Well, among all those here, you are the only one who spoke with me at
debconf, and lost the
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:17:02PM +0200, Joey Schulze wrote:
Sven Luther wrote:
Care to give me a chance ?
You've had your chances, Sven.
When ?
You're restarting with the old pattern, always.
you don't like what i have to say i should i have less right to the use
of the
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 01:15:01PM -0700, Mike Bird wrote:
On Tuesday 29 May 2007 11:58, Sven Luther wrote:
You are wrong, you still need a impartial judge. Tell me where in debian
i do find such ? That is the main problem, any argumentation is just
lost time without a fair hearing and an
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:11:01PM +0200, Andreas Barth wrote:
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [070529 22:05]:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 08:26:20PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
Please limit the number of posts per day to this thread.
Lively discussion
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Openly speaking about a topic is always better than making it a taboo,
something to be hidden and ashamed of.
Oftentimes, problems magically resolve themselves of their own accord
when we ignore them for a while, and everyone forgets that they ever
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:25:10PM +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:11:01PM +0200, Andreas Barth wrote:
* Sven Luther ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [070529 22:05]:
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 08:26:20PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
Please limit the
On Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:31:07PM +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Openly speaking about a topic is always better than making it a taboo,
something to be hidden and ashamed of.
Oftentimes, problems magically resolve themselves of their own accord
when we
Le Tue, May 29, 2007 at 10:11:01PM +0200, Andreas Barth a écrit :
Lively discussion and DoS is a different thing. You do DoS.
Dear all,
Somehow, I can't help thinking that 50 % of the emails in this thread
are not written by Sven...
Have a nice day,
--
Charles Plessy
On Tue, 29 May 2007 07:30:27 +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
[...]
And if some threaten to leave the project because i am not punished,
then so be it, debian is better off without such persons whose behaviour
will only hurt the project again one way or another, and should not be
encouraged.
On Sun, May 27, 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
I am now making this request to you as DPL, that you investigate who was
behind this action, and find out why it was done, and that it be
publicly addressed.
Sven, first of all, please restrict your postings to debian-project,
ideally to specific
On Mon, May 28, 2007 at 11:05:00PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
On Sun, May 27, 2007, Sven Luther wrote:
I am now making this request to you as DPL, that you investigate who was
behind this action, and find out why it was done, and that it be
publicly addressed.
Sven, first of all,
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