Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Frank Murphy
On 01/03/10 00:06, Kevin Kofler wrote: (Sorry, I reordered the replies a bit so I can reply to them without referring back and forth.) It's also called political licence Frank Murphy wrote: On 02/27/2010 04:30 PM, Mail Lists wrote: an 1: I do want updates. Kernel updates, for

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Jaroslav Reznik
On Friday 26 February 2010 16:22:37 Kevin Kofler wrote: Jaroslav Reznik wrote: Maybe some package rating included in PackageKit would be nice - for stable packages it's indicator that this package is worth to install, for testing package it would mean it's working (but again - who's going

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread shmuel siegel
On 3/1/2010 10:44 AM, Jaroslav Reznik wrote: One problem of updates-testing is - it takes so much time to be pushed and then mirrored. More rawhide approach should be used here. Users who are really interested in testing usually downloads from Koji directly. It is not so simple. When I am

rpms/perl-Config-Any/F-13 perl-Config-Any.spec, 1.12, 1.13 sources, 1.8, 1.9

2010-03-01 Thread Chris Weyl
Author: cweyl Update of /cvs/extras/rpms/perl-Config-Any/F-13 In directory cvs1.fedora.phx.redhat.com:/tmp/cvs-serv26990 Modified Files: perl-Config-Any.spec sources Log Message: * Mon Mar 01 2010 Chris Weyl cw...@alumni.drew.edu 0.19-1 - update by Fedora::App::MaintainerTools 0.004 -

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Nicolas Mailhot
Le Dim 28 février 2010 17:24, Adam Williamson a écrit : On Sun, 2010-02-28 at 11:43 +0100, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: There are things only packagers can fix. Everything else should be handled by tools so packagers can focus on the parts where they add real value. If a process change puts more

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Kofler
James Antill wrote: Mike didn't say that, Mike said that if a user was intentionally not updating to Fedora 12 due to the newer KDE ... you've just removed that choice from them. And for no real gain, as anyone who wanted to the KDE update could easily move to Fedora 12 to get it. That

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Kofler
Frank Murphy wrote: It's also called political licence No, it's not really the same thing. ;-) I didn't try to distort your viewpoint, just highlight the contradictions. But this time I'm replying in order. :-) If you mean these points from Mail Lists then yes. Yes, that's what I mean.

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Kofler
Alexander Boström wrote: It could install a file in /etc/foo.d that causes something that loads /etc/foo.d/* to break. That's not automatic breakage, you'd still have to install the package (or get it installed through one of the already discussed mechanisms: Obsoletes, Provides collision,

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Frank Murphy
On 01/03/10 11:17, Kevin Kofler wrote: Frank Murphy wrote: It's also called political licence No, it's not really the same thing. ;-) I didn't try to distort your viewpoint, just highlight the contradictions. But this time I'm replying in order. :-) If you mean these points from Mail

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Matthias Clasen
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 11:47 +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote: Jon Masters wrote: One thing I would suggest being considered in an alternative proposal is a compromise policy for specific stacks or non-critical path packages. For example, if the standard policy affecting me as a GNOME user is that

rawhide report: 20100301 changes

2010-03-01 Thread Rawhide Report
Compose started at Mon Mar 1 08:15:14 UTC 2010 Broken deps for i386 -- blahtexml-0.6-5.fc12.i686 requires libxerces-c.so.28 easystroke-0.5.2-1.fc13.i686 requires libboost_serialization-mt.so.5

Fight bugs, not FESCo

2010-03-01 Thread Aaron Faanes
tl;dr version: Empower, rather than restrict, maintainers. Encourage them to test by increasing test accuracy, coverage, unique configurations, and visibility. I don't think FESCo wishes to destroy the freedom of package maintainers. I also don't think package maintainers want to release broken

dual lived modules

2010-03-01 Thread Marcela Maslanova
Hello, I'd like to ask on your opinion on dual lived modules in our distro. I knew that Mandriva has the main perl package and also provide rpms of sub-packages, which are easier to update. They are using patch that allows them override the core modules. Also debian has perl core and sub-packages

Re: Impasse on packaging JOGL and Gluegen

2010-03-01 Thread Adam Jackson
On Sun, 2010-02-28 at 15:49 +0100, Hans de Goede wrote: On 02/28/2010 03:39 PM, Henrique Junior wrote: As Chen Lei said, the fact that JOGL needs this code may mean that it will be blocked forever for packaging, but I do not particularly see a big problem. For more details, please, read

Re: Directory ownership bugs

2010-03-01 Thread Till Maas
On Mon, Mar 01, 2010 at 03:57:06PM +0100, Jaroslav Reznik wrote: see bug footer - This is autogenerated bugzilla, I'm sorry if the problem is already fixed or reported. Additionally I apologize if that directory ownership was requested earlier by some bugzilla (some directories were

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Richard W.M. Jones
On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 01:16:43PM +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote: I would like to collect feedback on this issue. If you want to disable direct stable pushes, why? Could there be a less radical solution to that problem (e.g. a policy discouraging direct stable pushes for some specific types of

Re: Fight bugs, not FESCo

2010-03-01 Thread Richard W.M. Jones
On Mon, Mar 01, 2010 at 03:48:15PM +0100, Thomas Janssen wrote: On Mon, Mar 1, 2010 at 3:22 PM, Aaron Faanes dafr...@gmail.com wrote: I agree to almost everything you wrote. snip - Allow maintainers to see number of downloads by users who have opted-in to share that data. If not number,

Re: Fight bugs, not FESCo

2010-03-01 Thread Frank Ch. Eigler
Bruno Wolff III br...@wolff.to writes: A couple of problems. Which packages are downloaded from mirrors is not currently available to Fedora. [...] Would it be crazy to reorganize the mirror system in such a way that normally download http requests come to fedoraproject.org, but are redirected

perl-Nmap-Parser license changed from GPLv2+ to MIT

2010-03-01 Thread Iain Arnell
Whilst cleaning up some recently adopted orphans, I discovered that perl-Nmap-Parser has been tagged with the wrong license since August 2008. Upstream changed the license from GPLv2+ to MIT sometime back in 2007 and I've just corrected it in rawhide (and will do on all branches too in the near

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Adam Jackson
On Sat, 2010-02-27 at 02:52 +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote: Adam Jackson wrote: By my count, that's three misrepresentations in one paragraph. I certainly hope they were not deliberate. I'm not deliberately misrepresenting anything or anyone, I just stated my perception of the facts. It may

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Thomas Janssen
On Mon, Mar 1, 2010 at 4:44 PM, Richard W.M. Jones rjo...@redhat.com wrote: On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 01:16:43PM +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote: I would like to collect feedback on this issue. If you want to disable direct stable pushes, why? Could there be a less radical solution to that problem

Re: Fight bugs, not FESCo

2010-03-01 Thread Thomas Janssen
On Mon, Mar 1, 2010 at 4:59 PM, Richard W.M. Jones rjo...@redhat.com wrote: On Mon, Mar 01, 2010 at 03:57:11PM +, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: On Mon, Mar 01, 2010 at 03:48:15PM +0100, Thomas Janssen wrote: On Mon, Mar 1, 2010 at 3:22 PM, Aaron Faanes dafr...@gmail.com wrote: I agree to

Re: perl-Nmap-Parser license changed from GPLv2+ to MIT

2010-03-01 Thread Paul Wouters
On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Iain Arnell wrote: Whilst cleaning up some recently adopted orphans, I discovered that perl-Nmap-Parser has been tagged with the wrong license since August 2008. Upstream changed the license from GPLv2+ to MIT sometime back in 2007 and I've just corrected it in rawhide

Re: perl-Nmap-Parser license changed from GPLv2+ to MIT

2010-03-01 Thread Tom spot Callaway
On 03/01/2010 11:48 AM, Paul Wouters wrote: On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Iain Arnell wrote: Whilst cleaning up some recently adopted orphans, I discovered that perl-Nmap-Parser has been tagged with the wrong license since August 2008. Upstream changed the license from GPLv2+ to MIT sometime back in

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Peter Jones
On 02/26/2010 08:55 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote: Michael Schwendt wrote: That would be a ridiculous decision. It would be much better to disable that feature only for those update submitters who really have been dilettantish enough to use it inappropriately more than once. Yeah, that's a good

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Tom spot Callaway
On 03/01/2010 11:52 AM, Peter Jones wrote: If you think this isn't the right way to provide a safety net for package maintainers - what is? With the understanding that you're not specifically asking me that question, I'd say that I'd prefer to first try to automate checks for the most frequent

[OFF TOPIC] Brazil may be punished due to government support to Open Software

2010-03-01 Thread Casimiro de Almeida Barreto
This is off topic, but important to open software developers supporters Brazil may be punished because government supports free software... IIPA is willing to put Brazil in the black list of copyrights because Federal State governments support free software. According to IIPA, by supporting

Re: [OFF TOPIC] Brazil may be punished due to government support to Open Software

2010-03-01 Thread Seth Vidal
On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Casimiro de Almeida Barreto wrote: This is off topic, but important to open software developers supporters Yes - this is definitely off-topic. Please do not continue this thread. Thank You. -sv -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Ralf Corsepius
On 03/01/2010 05:52 PM, Peter Jones wrote: On 02/26/2010 08:55 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote: Michael Schwendt wrote: That would be a ridiculous decision. It would be much better to disable that feature only for those update submitters who really have been dilettantish enough to use it

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Peter Jones
On 03/01/2010 11:57 AM, Tom spot Callaway wrote: On 03/01/2010 11:52 AM, Peter Jones wrote: If you think this isn't the right way to provide a safety net for package maintainers - what is? With the understanding that you're not specifically asking me that question, I'd say that I'd prefer

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Frank Ch. Eigler
Peter Jones pjo...@redhat.com writes: [...] You weren't elected FESCo Monitor; the guy who comes and tells the mailing list whenever FESCo is discussing something you think is scary. [...] One need not be elected to do that. Anyone reading the public fesco irc logs may do the same without

F-13 Branched report: 20100301 changes

2010-03-01 Thread Branched Report
Compose started at Mon Mar 1 09:15:14 UTC 2010 Broken deps for i386 -- anaconda-13.32-1.fc13.i686 requires python-urlgrabber = 0:3.9.1-5 blahtexml-0.6-5.fc12.i686 requires libxerces-c.so.28 doodle-0.6.7-5.fc12.i686

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Peter Jones
On 03/01/2010 12:52 PM, Frank Ch. Eigler wrote: Peter Jones pjo...@redhat.com writes: [...] You weren't elected FESCo Monitor; the guy who comes and tells the mailing list whenever FESCo is discussing something you think is scary. [...] One need not be elected to do that. Anyone reading

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Tom spot Callaway
On 03/01/2010 12:48 PM, Peter Jones wrote: I'd also like a policy in place to help us avoid situations like the recent dnssec unpleasantness. Sure. I'm just not at all convinced that if those packages had sit in testing for $ARBITRARY_PERIOD_OF_TIME that they would have been tested and fixed.

[Bug 569568] New: Please rev perl-RRD-Simple to latest release

2010-03-01 Thread bugzilla
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. Summary: Please rev perl-RRD-Simple to latest release https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=569568 Summary: Please rev perl-RRD-Simple to latest release

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Seth Vidal
On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Will Woods wrote: * Has ABI/API change (and is a Critical Path package) This should be handled by the current rpmguard test: https://fedorahosted.org/autoqa/wiki/rpmguard since changing the ABI/API should generally change the soname/version, thus changing the package

Re: FESCo wants a more sane updates policy (feedback requested)

2010-03-01 Thread Naheem Zaffar
Thankyou for starting all this hard work with the certainty that it *will* be blamed by some people. As an end User I extremely like that Fedora does not ban newer packages from Stable releases. At the same time I can see how direct pushes can sometimes create unforseen bugs. I however do not

Re: Fight bugs, not FESCo

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Fenzi
For anyone who wants to attempt this, there is a very basic and seemingly abandonded popcon for rpm written in perl for opensuse at: http://gitorious.org/opensuse/popcorn (although gitorious.org seems down right now from here). I agree with Mike that you would really need to figure out a

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Fenzi
On Fri, 26 Feb 2010 16:59:40 -0500 (EST) Paul Wouters p...@xelerance.com wrote: On Fri, 26 Feb 2010, Kevin Fenzi wrote: A quicker way of seeing if a bug report was alread made, and more quickly being able to report bugs then spending 15-30 with bugzilla would help me in reporting more

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread James Antill
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 13:01 -0500, Tom spot Callaway wrote: On 03/01/2010 12:48 PM, Peter Jones wrote: I'd also like a policy in place to help us avoid situations like the recent dnssec unpleasantness. Sure. I'm just not at all convinced that if those packages had sit in testing for

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Till Maas
On Mon, Mar 01, 2010 at 01:30:18PM -0500, Seth Vidal wrote: On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Will Woods wrote: So I think it would be shortsighted for FESCo to refuse to even discuss a policy about what manual testing is currently required, since any plan for improving the quality of the

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Fenzi
On Mon, 1 Mar 2010 12:11:20 -0600 (CST) Mike McGrath mmcgr...@redhat.com wrote: On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Tom spot Callaway wrote: On 03/01/2010 12:48 PM, Peter Jones wrote: I'd also like a policy in place to help us avoid situations like the recent dnssec unpleasantness. Sure. I'm just

Thrashing between updates-testing and updates

2010-03-01 Thread Bruno Wolff III
Currently I am following F13 and I have been noticing a lot of packages disappearing from updates-testing before showing up in the branched release (but similar things happen with normal updates, just less often). When things disappear from updates-testing it isn't immediately obvious if this is

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Fenzi
On Sat, 27 Feb 2010 22:45:12 +0100 Michael Schwendt mschwe...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, 27 Feb 2010 13:17:43 -0800, Adam wrote: On Sat, 2010-02-27 at 20:18 +0100, Michael Schwendt wrote: Three times Could. Let's talk about it when you know something definite, please, but before it

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Seth Vidal
On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Till Maas wrote: On Mon, Mar 01, 2010 at 01:30:18PM -0500, Seth Vidal wrote: On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Will Woods wrote: So I think it would be shortsighted for FESCo to refuse to even discuss a policy about what manual testing is currently required, since any plan for

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Bruno Wolff III
On Mon, Mar 01, 2010 at 13:16:09 -0500, Will Woods wwo...@redhat.com wrote: That's an interesting test case, actually. I'm not sure we currently check packages against the corresponding versions *other* releases. You'd want to also check obsoltess. Packages that are dropped without be

OT: fas-username vs. local username for fedora-cvs

2010-03-01 Thread Josephine Tannhäuser
Hi all! My username on my private pc is josephine, my username on my workstation is josephine.tannhauser, but my fas-username is tannhauser. how can I use fedora-cvs on these machines? It seems that fedora-cvs want to use the local username. How can I change this behavior with editing a

Re: OT: fas-username vs. local username for fedora-cvs

2010-03-01 Thread Josh Stone
On 03/01/2010 11:05 AM, Josephine Tannhäuser wrote: Hi all! My username on my private pc is josephine, my username on my workstation is josephine.tannhauser, but my fas-username is tannhauser. how can I use fedora-cvs on these machines? It seems that fedora-cvs want to use the local

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Bill Nottingham
Tom spot Callaway (tcall...@redhat.com) said: * Causes broken deps * Breaks clean upgrade path between releases * Has ABI/API change (and is a Critical Path package) Actually, I'd say that any ABI change should block a stable push until it's fixed, period - critical path or not. If someone

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Seth Vidal
On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Bill Nottingham wrote: Kevin Kofler (kevin.kof...@chello.at) said: For most bugfixes, the user doesn't notice at all. When a user gets a bugfix on something they've hit, they think oh, that's nice, Fedora fixed it, but they don't really care whether it cam Monday or

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Josh Stone
On 03/01/2010 11:46 AM, Seth Vidal wrote: One thing to consider: while from a psychological standpoint, a regression is indeed perceived as much worse than an unfixed bug, from a technical / practical standpoint it's actually the smaller issue: you can rollback to the version of the package

Re: OT: fas-username vs. local username for fedora-cvs

2010-03-01 Thread Alexander Boström
mån 2010-03-01 klockan 20:13 +0100 skrev Till Maas: But I wonder, how do you access CVS without this? You shouldn't need it. What happens if you don't have it? CVS records the root location in the checked out copy, so you only need to supply a CVS root when doing cvs checkout and even then

Re: OT: fas-username vs. local username for fedora-cvs

2010-03-01 Thread Till Maas
On Mon, Mar 01, 2010 at 09:09:08PM +0100, Alexander Boström wrote: mån 2010-03-01 klockan 20:13 +0100 skrev Till Maas: But I wonder, how do you access CVS without this? You shouldn't need it. What happens if you don't have it? It still seems to work. :-) CVS records the root location

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Matthew Woehlke
James Antill wrote: The current state of play is (taking a random kde example): kdeutils F11 GA 4.2.2-4.fc11 kdeutils F11 Updates 4.4.0-1.fc11 kdeutils F12 GA 4.3.2-1.fc12 kdeutils F12 Updates 4.4.0-1.fc12 ...so if someone tries to update from F11 (with updates) using an F12 GA

Plan for tomorrow's (2010-03-02) FESCo meeting

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Fenzi
Following is the list of topics that will be discussed in the FESCo meeting tomorrow at 20:00UTC (3pm EST) in #fedora-meeting on irc.freenode.net. Followups: None. New Business: #343 cloture rule/procedure for fesco meetings #344 Policy proposal: contributing to Fedora should be FUN Fedora

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Björn Persson
Kevin Kofler wrote: 1. upgrades which disrupt, regress or break things. Those can only be pushed to Rawhide, if at all. Such as KDE 4.4, just to pick a recent example. I had to log out and log in again before I could start Kmail again. That can be quite disruptive if I have long-running

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread James Antill
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 12:06 -0800, Josh Stone wrote: But for rolling back an update, yum requires that the old package is still available. We only keep the very latest version in the updates, so unless your previous version was from the initial release, you're out of luck. My last

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Seth Vidal
On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, James Antill wrote: On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 12:06 -0800, Josh Stone wrote: But for rolling back an update, yum requires that the old package is still available. We only keep the very latest version in the updates, so unless your previous version was from the initial

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Seth Vidal
On Mon, 1 Mar 2010, Bill Nottingham wrote: Seth Vidal (skvi...@fedoraproject.org) said: Given that we don't provide an easily accessible user-friendly rollback mechanism, I don't know that that's actually applicable to the general case, though. yum history undo works pretty well. Not

File Data-JavaScript-1.13.tgz uploaded to lookaside cache by eseyman

2010-03-01 Thread Emmanuel Seyman
A file has been added to the lookaside cache for perl-Data-JavaScript: 14a2e422d2a22d34749e762614b4736f Data-JavaScript-1.13.tgz -- Fedora Extras Perl SIG http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/Perl perl-devel mailing list perl-de...@lists.fedoraproject.org

Re: creating file in koji allowed?

2010-03-01 Thread Hans Ulrich Niedermann
On Thu, 25 Feb 2010 22:29:21 +0100 Thomas Spura spur...@students.uni-mainz.de wrote: Is it allowed to create a file ~/.mpd.conf, when building in koji and deleting afterwards? I need to write down a password into that file, for running a testsuite. If that file does not exist, I can't run

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Matthew Woehlke
Björn Persson wrote: Kevin Kofler wrote: 1. upgrades which disrupt, regress or break things. Those can only be pushed to Rawhide, if at all. Such as KDE 4.4, just to pick a recent example. I had to log out and log in again before I could start Kmail again. That can be quite disruptive if I

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Doug Ledford
On 02/26/2010 08:00 PM, Jesse Keating wrote: On Sat, 2010-02-27 at 01:40 +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote: Bill Nottingham wrote: While the ethos as defined on the wiki mentions staying close to upstream and getting the latest software, there's nothing that says that it's done via updates. I would

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Peter Jones
On 02/26/2010 08:52 PM, Kevin Kofler wrote: Adam Jackson wrote: By my count, that's three misrepresentations in one paragraph. I certainly hope they were not deliberate. I'm not deliberately misrepresenting anything or anyone, I just stated my perception of the facts. It may well be that

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Jesse Keating
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 16:51 -0500, Doug Ledford wrote: To be pedantic, Fedora is what it is. What the leadership has to say doesn't really matter in terms of what Fedora *is*, only in terms of what Fedora is *supposed to be*. In order to know what Fedora really is, a person would need to

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Jesse Keating
On Sat, 2010-02-27 at 10:16 -0700, Orion Poplawski wrote: On 2/27/2010 5:05 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote: Orion Poplawski wrote: There is plenty of room for something in between your vision of Fedora and CentOS. But that room is filled by other distros, such as Ubuntu. Why do we

Re: creating file in koji allowed?

2010-03-01 Thread Thomas Spura
Am Montag, den 01.03.2010, 22:40 +0100 schrieb Hans Ulrich Niedermann: On Thu, 25 Feb 2010 22:29:21 +0100 Thomas Spura spur...@students.uni-mainz.de wrote: Is it allowed to create a file ~/.mpd.conf, when building in koji and deleting afterwards? I need to write down a password into

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Jesse Keating
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 09:44 +0100, Jaroslav Reznik wrote: One problem of updates-testing is - it takes so much time to be pushed and then mirrored. More rawhide approach should be used here. Users who are really interested in testing usually downloads from Koji directly. We do pushes

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Adam Williamson
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 01:27 +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote: Adam Williamson wrote: It seems like extra work for packagers, but in the end it kinda takes the pressure off: you only *have* to ship the important fixes to /updates, /backports is optional, That's already a bad thing, users can no

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Adam Williamson
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 08:07 +0100, Ralf Corsepius wrote: So yeah, I agree it's not a perfect system - detailed suggestions for improving it would be welcome, I'm sure. Alternatives: * Abandon it (I don't think this would change anything wrt. to QA in Fedora) Um. Hard to put this

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Adam Williamson
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 12:17 +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote: It doesn't take a mind reader to realize that an upstream BUGFIX release, well, FIXES BUGS! ;-) They also often shovel in entirely non-related changes on the basis that they're perfectly obvious and trivial and simple changes that Can't

Bodhi karma feature request

2010-03-01 Thread Doug Ledford
Split off from the stable pushes in Bodhi thread just because I'd like to see it not get lost. On 02/27/2010 11:35 AM, Mail Lists wrote: On 02/27/2010 11:27 AM, Adam Williamson wrote: On Sat, 2010-02-27 at 10:57 +0100, Ralf Corsepius wrote: Yeah, it's not perfect: there are cases where we

Re: Thrashing between updates-testing and updates

2010-03-01 Thread Jesse Keating
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 12:42 -0600, Bruno Wolff III wrote: Currently I am following F13 and I have been noticing a lot of packages disappearing from updates-testing before showing up in the branched release (but similar things happen with normal updates, just less often). When things

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Adam Williamson
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 11:57 -0500, Tom spot Callaway wrote: On 03/01/2010 11:52 AM, Peter Jones wrote: If you think this isn't the right way to provide a safety net for package maintainers - what is? With the understanding that you're not specifically asking me that question, I'd say that

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Adam Williamson
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 18:33 +0100, Ralf Corsepius wrote: Right now, the only proposal for doing so is to restrict what can be released without spending some time in testing. The issues that at least I have been trying to point out: * Is testing an adequate safety net? * Is karma an

[Bug 567120] perl-Set-Scalar: please update to v1.25 and create EPEL branches

2010-03-01 Thread bugzilla
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=567120 --- Comment #5 from Jose Pedro Oliveira j...@di.uminho.pt 2010-03-01 17:47:38 EST --- Spot, Could you build perl-Set-Scalar

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Jesse Keating
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 00:58 +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote: 1. upgrades which disrupt, regress or break things. Those can only be pushed to Rawhide, if at all. (Sometimes it might be better to not push a change even to Rawhide.) 2. upgrades which do none of the above. Those are what adds value to

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Adam Williamson
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 16:16 -0500, Seth Vidal wrote: in exchange for an arseload of diskspace. just in the interest of complete disclosure. :) Would that be 'an arseload of diskspace in /var, which everyone always forgets to make big enough'? :) -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community

Re: Bodhi karma feature request

2010-03-01 Thread Matthew Woehlke
Doug Ledford wrote: One could argue that the current bodhi karma system is simply too simplistic for real use cases. Maybe instead of just +1 -1, there should be: Fixes my problem Works for me (someone testing that didn't necessarily have any of the problem supposedly fixed by this update

Re: Bodhi karma feature request

2010-03-01 Thread Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski
On Monday, 01 March 2010 at 23:34, Doug Ledford wrote: [...] One could argue that the current bodhi karma system is simply too simplistic for real use cases. There's nothing to argue. It's rather obvious. :) Maybe instead of just +1 -1, there should be: Fixes my problem Works for me

Re: Incompatible upgrade - Is this workaround ok? (mysql-mmm)

2010-03-01 Thread BJ Dierkes
On Feb 26, 2010, at 11:11 AM, Kevin Fenzi wrote: On Wed, 24 Feb 2010 12:36:31 -0600 BJ Dierkes wdier...@5dollarwhitebox.org wrote: Hello all, I maintain Multi-Master Replication Manager for MySQL in both Fedora and EPEL. With changes from 2.0.11 - 2.1.0 there was an incompatible

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Jesse Keating
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 14:27 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote: * Replace it by a free text comment system Well, right now you have the choice of looking at the numbers or just ignoring them and reading the text (whether to auto-push a release with a given positive karma is a decision made by

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Doug Ledford
On 03/01/2010 05:01 PM, Jesse Keating wrote: On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 16:51 -0500, Doug Ledford wrote: To be pedantic, Fedora is what it is. What the leadership has to say doesn't really matter in terms of what Fedora *is*, only in terms of what Fedora is *supposed to be*. In order to know what

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Seth Vidal
On Tue, 2 Mar 2010, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: Le lundi 01 mars 2010 à 14:46 -0500, Seth Vidal a écrit : Given that we don't provide an easily accessible user-friendly rollback mechanism, I don't know that that's actually applicable to the general case, though. yum history undo works pretty

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Tony Nelson
On 10-03-01 15:06:21, Josh Stone wrote: On 03/01/2010 11:46 AM, Seth Vidal wrote: ... yum history undo works pretty well. Not flawless, to be sure - but it's not bad for the simple-ish cases. ... But for rolling back an update, yum requires that the old package is still available. We

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Kofler
Matthias Clasen wrote: GNOME has bug-fix releases (e.g. 2.28.1, 2.28.2, etc) and we do package those as updates for Fedora releases. I know, but my question was, are there still any 2.28.x bugfix releases after 2.30.0 gets released? (With KDE, there aren't, so it's either upgrading or no more

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Kofler
Björn Persson wrote: Such as KDE 4.4, just to pick a recent example. I had to log out and log in again before I could start Kmail again. That's normal and not considered disruptive. That can be quite disruptive if I have long-running processes that shouldn't be interrupted. You should not

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Kofler
Jesse Keating wrote: And without using some sort of repository for users to test things and provide feedback, how do you propose we distinguish between the two sets of updates there? Hey, this is a strawman! I'm not saying updates-testing should go away. I'm just saying there are valid

Re: FESCo wants to ban direct stable pushes in Bodhi (urgent call for feedback)

2010-03-01 Thread Kevin Kofler
Jesse Keating wrote: Ubuntu is not the first to pick up technology in their releases either. They generally wait for Fedora to ship with it first and work out all the kinks, then they snap it run with it. So I really don't buy the but then we'd be Ubuntu argument, at all. It's true that

Re: Bodhi karma feature request

2010-03-01 Thread Adam Williamson
On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 17:34 -0500, Doug Ledford wrote: One could argue that the current bodhi karma system is simply too simplistic for real use cases. Maybe instead of just +1 -1, there should be: Fixes my problem Works for me (someone testing that didn't necessarily have any of the

File Class-Method-Modifiers-1.05.tar.gz uploaded to lookaside cache by cweyl

2010-03-01 Thread Chris Weyl
A file has been added to the lookaside cache for perl-Class-Method-Modifiers: 8f504d4a95b2994835fbe72a3790864e Class-Method-Modifiers-1.05.tar.gz -- Fedora Extras Perl SIG http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/Perl perl-devel mailing list perl-devel@lists.fedoraproject.org

[Bug 569295] New: Branch perl-Hash-Case for EPEL

2010-03-01 Thread bugzilla
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. Summary: Branch perl-Hash-Case for EPEL https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=569295 Summary: Branch perl-Hash-Case for EPEL Product: Fedora

[Bug 569295] Branch perl-Hash-Case for EPEL

2010-03-01 Thread bugzilla
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=569295 Iain Arnell iarn...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added

[Bug 569300] New: Release perl-Hash-Merge for EPEL

2010-03-01 Thread bugzilla
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. Summary: Release perl-Hash-Merge for EPEL https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=569300 Summary: Release perl-Hash-Merge for EPEL Product: Fedora

[Bug 569301] New: Branch perl-Config-IniHash for EPEL

2010-03-01 Thread bugzilla
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. Summary: Branch perl-Config-IniHash for EPEL https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=569301 Summary: Branch perl-Config-IniHash for EPEL Product: Fedora

rpms/perl-Class-Method-Modifiers/F-13 perl-Class-Method-Modifiers.spec, 1.8, 1.9 sources, 1.4, 1.5

2010-03-01 Thread Chris Weyl
Author: cweyl Update of /cvs/extras/rpms/perl-Class-Method-Modifiers/F-13 In directory cvs1.fedora.phx.redhat.com:/tmp/cvs-serv23983 Modified Files: perl-Class-Method-Modifiers.spec sources Log Message: * Mon Mar 01 2010 Chris Weyl cw...@alumni.drew.edu 1.05-1 - update by

rpms/perl-Perl-MinimumVersion/F-13 .cvsignore, 1.5, 1.6 perl-Perl-MinimumVersion.spec, 1.13, 1.14 sources, 1.5, 1.6

2010-03-01 Thread corsepiu
Author: corsepiu Update of /cvs/pkgs/rpms/perl-Perl-MinimumVersion/F-13 In directory cvs1.fedora.phx.redhat.com:/tmp/cvs-serv30658 Modified Files: .cvsignore perl-Perl-MinimumVersion.spec sources Log Message: * Mon Mar 01 2010 Ralf Corsépius corse...@fedoraproject.org - 1.24-1 -

rpms/perl-Perl-MinimumVersion/F-12 .cvsignore, 1.5, 1.6 perl-Perl-MinimumVersion.spec, 1.12, 1.13 sources, 1.5, 1.6

2010-03-01 Thread corsepiu
Author: corsepiu Update of /cvs/pkgs/rpms/perl-Perl-MinimumVersion/F-12 In directory cvs1.fedora.phx.redhat.com:/tmp/cvs-serv30948 Modified Files: .cvsignore perl-Perl-MinimumVersion.spec sources Log Message: * Mon Mar 01 2010 Ralf Corsépius corse...@fedoraproject.org - 1.24-1 -

rpms/perl-Data-JavaScript/devel import.log, NONE, 1.1 perl-Data-JavaScript.spec, NONE, 1.1 .cvsignore, 1.1, 1.2 sources, 1.1, 1.2

2010-03-01 Thread Emmanuel Seyman
Author: eseyman Update of /cvs/pkgs/rpms/perl-Data-JavaScript/devel In directory cvs1.fedora.phx.redhat.com:/tmp/cvs-serv18462/devel Modified Files: .cvsignore sources Added Files: import.log perl-Data-JavaScript.spec Log Message: Initial import. --- NEW FILE import.log ---

rpms/perl-Data-JavaScript/F-12 import.log, NONE, 1.1 perl-Data-JavaScript.spec, NONE, 1.1 .cvsignore, 1.1, 1.2 sources, 1.1, 1.2

2010-03-01 Thread Emmanuel Seyman
Author: eseyman Update of /cvs/pkgs/rpms/perl-Data-JavaScript/F-12 In directory cvs1.fedora.phx.redhat.com:/tmp/cvs-serv20552/F-12 Modified Files: .cvsignore sources Added Files: import.log perl-Data-JavaScript.spec Log Message: Initial import. --- NEW FILE import.log ---

  1   2   >