Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Tue, 2018-02-06 at 13:37 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > I am beginning to think that in pursuit of flexibility and increased > functionality we end up making systems that are too complex and too hard > to discover. Users with cognitive or physical limitations have > increasingly harder

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 02/06/2018 11:53 AM, Howard Howell wrote: On Mon, 2018-02-05 at 16:39 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: On 02/05/2018 01:35 PM, Howard Howell wrote: My eyes hurt after a few hours trying to find the smaller and darker default cursors. Do you know that you can simply increase the size of the

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Tue, 2018-02-06 at 08:53 -0800, Howard Howell wrote: > On Mon, 2018-02-05 at 16:39 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > > On 02/05/2018 01:35 PM, Howard Howell wrote: > > > My eyes hurt > > > after a few hours trying to find the smaller and darker default > > > cursors. > > > > Do you know that

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Mon, 2018-02-05 at 16:39 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > On 02/05/2018 01:35 PM, Howard Howell wrote: > > My eyes hurt > > after a few hours trying to find the smaller and darker default > > cursors. > > Do you know that you can simply increase the size of the cursors? > > dconf write

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 02/05/2018 10:35 AM, Howard Howell wrote: So far, so good, but I really miss the gamma.gold cursors which are much easier for me to see and use. No problems so far. If it goes one week, I will again attempt the Gamma.Gold cursors because I need the visibility. My eyes hurt

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 02/05/2018 01:35 PM, Howard Howell wrote: My eyes hurt after a few hours trying to find the smaller and darker default cursors. Do you know that you can simply increase the size of the cursors? dconf write /org/gnome/desktop/interface/cursor-size 48 I swear I saw it in one of GNOME GUI

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Sat, 2018-02-03 at 22:58 -0800, Samuel Sieb wrote: > On 02/03/2018 05:58 PM, Howard Howell wrote: > > Latest finding... > > running gpartd, which I wanted to use to reformat an SD card for > > use > > with a raspberry PI, drops me out to login immediately. > > attached is the latest journalctl

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 12:13 PM, Tomasz Kłoczko wrote: > > On 1 February 2018 at 01:42, Peter Hutterer > wrote: > [..] > >> > So event4 it is in my case touch pad and event5 it is Logitech M185 >> mouse. >> > In other words: those "libinput

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 02/03/2018 05:58 PM, Howard Howell wrote: Latest finding... running gpartd, which I wanted to use to reformat an SD card for use with a raspberry PI, drops me out to login immediately. attached is the latest journalctl after the third attempt. I clicked on gpartd at 17:36:14, and ended up

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Thu, 2018-02-01 at 09:08 -0800, Howard Howell wrote: > On Wed, 2018-01-31 at 09:43 -0800, Howard Howell wrote: > > On Wed, 2018-01-31 at 14:14 +0100, Olivier Fourdan wrote: > > > Hi > > > > > > On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 1:58 PM, Olivier Fourdan > > .com> wrote: > > > > Jan 31

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Wed, 2018-01-31 at 09:43 -0800, Howard Howell wrote: > On Wed, 2018-01-31 at 14:14 +0100, Olivier Fourdan wrote: > > Hi > > > > On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 1:58 PM, Olivier Fourdan > om> wrote: > > > Jan 31 01:14:08 school gnome-session[1715]: gnome-session- > > >

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 1 February 2018 at 01:42, Peter Hutterer wrote: [..] > > So event4 it is in my case touch pad and event5 it is Logitech M185 > mouse. > > In other words: those "libinput bug" log entries looks like are not > related > > to emitting those short bursts of repeating

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 10:18:14PM +, Tomasz Kłoczko wrote: > On 31 January 2018 at 22:09, Tomasz Kłoczko > wrote: > [..] > > > Why I think that it may be related to libinput? Because in logs I see as > > well another type of entries: > > > > # journalctl -xe |

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 31 January 2018 at 22:09, Tomasz Kłoczko wrote: [..] > Why I think that it may be related to libinput? Because in logs I see as > well another type of entries: > > # journalctl -xe | grep libinput > Jan 31 21:55:18 domek org.gnome.Shell.desktop[2153]: libinput

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 31 January 2018 at 21:00, Tomasz Torcz ️ wrote: > On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 01:37:15PM +, Tomasz Kłoczko wrote: > > After update today to latest rawhide and reboot I'v decided to change GUI > > from X11 to Wyland. > > In logs I see similar entries like above. > > > >

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 01:37:15PM +, Tomasz Kłoczko wrote: > After update today to latest rawhide and reboot I'v decided to change GUI > from X11 to Wyland. > In logs I see similar entries like above. > > Additionally what I found so far after few hours: > > 1) sometimes pressing single key

Re: Re: Wyland is a disaster

> 1) sometimes pressing single key is causing to generate many keystrokes. > Very annoying .. That can get more than annoying when it combines with the inverse effect: eating keystrokes and refusing to output them (sometimes regurgitating parts of what it ate as few seconds later in the

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Wed, 2018-01-31 at 14:14 +0100, Olivier Fourdan wrote: > Hi > > On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 1:58 PM, Olivier Fourdan > wrote: > > Jan 31 01:14:08 school gnome-session[1715]: gnome-session- > > binary[1715]: WARNING: App 'org.gnome.Shell.desktop' exited with > > > Jan 31

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Wed, 2018-01-31 at 13:58 +0100, Olivier Fourdan wrote: > Hi, > > What you logs tells is: > > On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 10:37 AM, Howard Howell > wrote: > > Jan 31 01:14:08 school evolution-alarm[2297]: Error reading events > > from display: Broken pipeJan 31 01:14:08

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 31 January 2018 at 09:37, Howard Howell wrote: [..] > Well, Journalctl shows the following. > Jan 31 00:00:00 school evolution-alarm[2297]: > /builddir/build/BUILD/evolution-3.24.6/src/calendar/alarm- > notify/alarm.c:251: > Jan 31 00:19:56 school sol.desktop[24828]:

Re: Wyland is a disaster

Hi On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 1:58 PM, Olivier Fourdan wrote: > Jan 31 01:14:08 school gnome-session[1715]: gnome-session-binary[1715]: > WARNING: App 'org.gnome.Shell.desktop' exited with > >> Jan 31 01:14:08 school org.gnome.Shell.desktop[1785]: Window manager >> error:

Re: Wyland is a disaster

Hi, What you logs tells is: On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 10:37 AM, Howard Howell wrote: > Jan 31 01:14:08 school evolution-alarm[2297]: Error reading events from > display: Broken pipe > Jan 31 01:14:08 school gnome-software[2301]: Error reading events from > display: Broken

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Wed, 2018-01-31 at 01:28 -0800, Howard Howell wrote: > On Tue, 2018-01-30 at 10:15 -0800, Howard Howell wrote: > > On Tue, 2018-01-30 at 10:49 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > > > On 01/29/2018 09:33 PM, mcatanz...@gnome.org wrote: > > > > Please see my earlier post in this thread regarding

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Tue, 2018-01-30 at 10:15 -0800, Howard Howell wrote: > On Tue, 2018-01-30 at 10:49 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > > On 01/29/2018 09:33 PM, mcatanz...@gnome.org wrote: > > > Please see my earlier post in this thread regarding how to get a > > > stacktrace out of coredumpctl > > > > This is

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Tue, 2018-01-30 at 10:49 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > On 01/29/2018 09:33 PM, mcatanz...@gnome.org wrote: > > Please see my earlier post in this thread regarding how to get a > > stacktrace out of coredumpctl > > This is a great debugging harness; thanks for pointing it out as I >

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Tue, 2018-01-30 at 10:49 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > On 01/29/2018 09:33 PM, mcatanz...@gnome.org wrote: > > Please see my earlier post in this thread regarding how to get a > > stacktrace out of coredumpctl > > This is a great debugging harness; thanks for pointing it out as I >

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Tue, Jan 30, 2018 at 9:49 AM, Przemek Klosowski wrote: I am currently reporting my pan-crashing-Wayland crashing issue on gnome.org---but in the true Heisenbug fashion it stopped crashing, so I can't reproduce it now. It was crashing almost every time I used the

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 01/29/2018 09:33 PM, mcatanz...@gnome.org wrote: Please see my earlier post in this thread regarding how to get a stacktrace out of coredumpctl This is a great debugging harness; thanks for pointing it out as I didn't know about it. I am currently reporting my pan-crashing-Wayland

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Mon, Jan 29, 2018 at 7:39 PM, Per Bothner wrote: If any logs or monitoring tools would be helpful, I'll be happy to help. Please see my earlier post in this thread regarding how to get a stacktrace out of coredumpctl. If you post an issue report with a stacktrace at

Re: Wyland is a disaster

FWIW, I too have Wayland crashing every few days. I can't pin-point a pattern: Just now it crashed while trying to open a pdf attachment in Thunderbird (using the default Document Viewer). After rebooting, the same attachment opened with no problems. Given that the apps I use are pretty good

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 01/25/2018 12:02 PM, Howard Howell wrote: [root@school lesh]# dnf debuginfo-install glibc-2.25-12.fc26.x86_64 Package glibc-debuginfo-2.23.1-11.fc24.x86_64 is already installed, skipping. Dependencies resolved. Nothing to do. Try adding --best to the command.

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Thu, 2018-01-25 at 09:51 -0800, Howard Howell wrote: > On Wed, 2018-01-24 at 14:29 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > > On 01/23/2018 06:56 PM, Howard Howell wrote: > > > Due to that last line, issued su and password and ran it again: > > > # lshw > > > Segmentation fault (core dumped) > > > >

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Wed, 2018-01-24 at 14:29 -0500, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > On 01/23/2018 06:56 PM, Howard Howell wrote: > > Due to that last line, issued su and password and ran it again: > > # lshw > > Segmentation fault (core dumped) > > ok, great---so now do 'gdb lshw', type 'r' in gdb, and see where it >

Re: Problems debugging problems... formerly Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 24/01/18 15:06 -0700, stan wrote: On Wed, 24 Jan 2018 14:37:30 -0500 Przemek Klosowski wrote: For instance, I observed a reliable desktop session crash on exiting Pan newsreader. I don't know how to debug it because it crashes the session and I get logged out.

Re: Problems debugging problems... formerly Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Wed, 24 Jan 2018 14:37:30 -0500 Przemek Klosowski wrote: > For instance, I observed a reliable desktop session crash on exiting > Pan newsreader. I don't know how to debug it because it crashes the > session and I get logged out. I think this is because the C++

Re: Problems debugging problems... formerly Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Wed, Jan 24, 2018 at 1:37 PM, Przemek Klosowski wrote: Can anyone suggest ways of debugging this? Run coredumpctl to see what processes crashed. There should be at least a gnome-shell crash, maybe also a gnome-session crash, maybe also an XWayland crash.

Problems debugging problems... formerly Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 01/21/2018 07:23 AM, Tom Hughes wrote: Not really. It's a grab bag of different things that may or not be related to Wayland. I think this problem is compounded by the fact that Wayland and several other system features such as Gnome session setup are very integrated, and it's hard to

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 01/23/2018 06:56 PM, Howard Howell wrote: Due to that last line, issued su and password and ran it again: # lshw Segmentation fault (core dumped) ok, great---so now do 'gdb lshw', type 'r' in gdb, and see where it crashes. You may need to debuginfo-install few packages if gdb says it can't

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Tue, 2018-01-23 at 19:52 -0500, Jared K. Smith wrote: > On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 6:56 PM, Howard Howell > wrote: > > Due to that last line, issued su and password and ran it again: > > > > # lshw > > > > Segmentation fault (core dumped) > > > > # > > Due to the fact

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 6:56 PM, Howard Howell wrote: > Due to that last line, issued su and password and ran it again: > # lshw > Segmentation fault (core dumped) > # > Due to the fact that you're having segfaults in command-line programs as well, I'm tempted to say

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Tue, 2018-01-23 at 12:35 -0800, Samuel Sieb wrote: > On 01/23/2018 12:22 PM, Howard Howell wrote: > > I thought there was a tool to list installed boards, but can't > > find it. Any thoughts there, other than opening up the system and > > getting the label information? > > lshw and/or

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 01/23/2018 12:22 PM, Howard Howell wrote: I thought there was a tool to list installed boards, but can't find it. Any thoughts there, other than opening up the system and getting the label information? lshw and/or lshw-gui ___ devel

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Mon, 2018-01-22 at 19:53 +, Tom Hughes wrote: > On 22/01/18 15:58, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > I have a dual monitor setup with both monitors rotated, using an > > NVIDIA > > adapter (9600 GT). Works fine, uses Wayland. Again, you need to be > > *very specific* about graphics issues. They

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Mon, 2018-01-22 at 19:53 +, Tom Hughes wrote: > On 22/01/18 15:58, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > I have a dual monitor setup with both monitors rotated, using an NVIDIA > > adapter (9600 GT). Works fine, uses Wayland. Again, you need to be > > *very specific* about graphics issues. They are

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Mon, 2018-01-22 at 18:57 -0500, Stephen John Smoogen wrote: > On 21 January 2018 at 14:42, Stephen John Smoogen > wrote: > > On 21 January 2018 at 14:06, Howard Howell > > wrote: > > > On Sun, 2018-01-21 at 15:25 +0100, Igor Gnatenko wrote: > > > >

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 21 January 2018 at 14:42, Stephen John Smoogen wrote: > On 21 January 2018 at 14:06, Howard Howell wrote: >> On Sun, 2018-01-21 at 15:25 +0100, Igor Gnatenko wrote: >>> Folks, please move this discussion to us...@lists.fedoraproject.org. >>>

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 22/01/18 15:58, Adam Williamson wrote: I have a dual monitor setup with both monitors rotated, using an NVIDIA adapter (9600 GT). Works fine, uses Wayland. Again, you need to be *very specific* about graphics issues. They are very often very specific to the exact hardware in use - down to

Re: Wyland is a disaster

Hi On Mon, Jan 22, 2018 at 4:54 PM, Adam Williamson wrote: > On Mon, 2018-01-22 at 07:16 -0500, Christian Fredrik Schaller wrote: > > Sorry for responding to myself here, but I thought it could also be > > worthwhile to mention that one of our primary tools for

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Mon, 2018-01-22 at 15:39 +, Tom Hughes wrote: > On 22/01/18 15:34, Tom Hughes wrote: > > On 22/01/18 15:26, Jerry James wrote: > > > > > One configuration that appears to be particularly unstable is a > > > dual-monitor setup with nouveau. I experience frequent system hangs > > > with

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Mon, 2018-01-22 at 08:26 -0700, Jerry James wrote: > > One configuration that appears to be particularly unstable is a > dual-monitor setup with nouveau. I experience frequent system hangs > with that setup, and don't seem to be alone; e.g., >

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Mon, 2018-01-22 at 07:16 -0500, Christian Fredrik Schaller wrote: > Sorry for responding to myself here, but I thought it could also be > worthwhile to mention that one of our primary tools for identifying > problems is the Fedora ABRT server. Looking at the current stats it looks > to me like

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 22/01/18 15:34, Tom Hughes wrote: On 22/01/18 15:26, Jerry James wrote: One configuration that appears to be particularly unstable is a dual-monitor setup with nouveau.  I experience frequent system hangs with that setup, and don't seem to be alone; e.g.,

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 22/01/18 15:26, Jerry James wrote: On Mon, Jan 22, 2018 at 4:29 AM, Christian Fredrik Schaller wrote: I am sad to hear that people are having issues when using Wayland (and even the X.org session). Be aware though that we have devs dedicated at RH to look at Fedora

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Mon, Jan 22, 2018 at 4:29 AM, Christian Fredrik Schaller wrote: > I am sad to hear that people are having issues when using Wayland (and even > the X.org session). Be aware though that we have devs dedicated at RH to > look at Fedora Wayland bugs, so if you file bugs we

Re: Wyland is a disaster

; >> - Original Message - >> > From: "Stephen John Smoogen" <smo...@gmail.com> >> > To: hlhow...@pacbell.net, "Development discussions related to Fedora" < >> devel@lists.fedoraproject.org> >> > Cc: "Francesco Frassinelli"

Re: Wyland is a disaster

ts.fedoraproject.org> > > Cc: "Francesco Frassinelli" <frap...@gmail.com> > > Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2018 8:42:46 PM > > Subject: Re: Wyland is a disaster > > > > On 21 January 2018 at 14:06, Howard Howell <hlhow...@pacbell.net> wr

Re: Wyland is a disaster

t; > Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2018 8:42:46 PM > Subject: Re: Wyland is a disaster > > On 21 January 2018 at 14:06, Howard Howell <hlhow...@pacbell.net> wrote: > > On Sun, 2018-01-21 at 15:25 +0100, Igor Gnatenko wrote: > >> Folks, please move this discussion to u

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 21 January 2018 at 14:06, Howard Howell wrote: > On Sun, 2018-01-21 at 15:25 +0100, Igor Gnatenko wrote: >> Folks, please move this discussion to us...@lists.fedoraproject.org. >> ___ >> devel mailing list --

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Sun, Jan 21, 2018 at 5:06 AM, Graham Leggett <minf...@sharp.fm> wrote: > On 20 Jan 2018, at 8:24 PM, Alec Leamas <leamas.a...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>> I'm sorry, but wyland is a disaster for me. I do work on lots >>> of different software platforms,

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On Sun, 2018-01-21 at 15:25 +0100, Igor Gnatenko wrote: > Folks, please move this discussion to us...@lists.fedoraproject.org. > ___ > devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org > To unsubscribe send an email to

Re: Wyland is a disaster

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 Folks, please move this discussion to us...@lists.fedoraproject.org. - -- - -Igor Gnatenko -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEhLFO09aHZVqO+CM6aVcUvRu8X0wFAlpkotIACgkQaVcUvRu8

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 21/01/18 13:06, Graham Leggett wrote: > On 20 Jan 2018, at 8:24 PM, Alec Leamas <leamas.a...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>> I'm sorry, but wyland is a disaster for me. I do work on lots >>> of different software platforms, and things are just not working well.

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 21/01/18 12:06, Graham Leggett wrote: On 20 Jan 2018, at 8:24 PM, Alec Leamas <leamas.a...@gmail.com> wrote: I'm sorry, but wyland is a disaster for me. I do work on lots of different software platforms, and things are just not working well. They kind-of-work, which is the

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 20 Jan 2018, at 8:24 PM, Alec Leamas <leamas.a...@gmail.com> wrote: >> I'm sorry, but wyland is a disaster for me. I do work on lots >> of different software platforms, and things are just not working well. >> They kind-of-work, which is the really wors

Re: Wyland is a disaster

On 20/01/18 19:14, Howard Howell wrote: > Hi, guys, > I'm sorry, but wyland is a disaster for me. I do work on lots > of different software platforms, and things are just not working well. > They kind-of-work, which is the really worst condition one can have. For me, thi

Wyland is a disaster

Hi, guys, I'm sorry, but wyland is a disaster for me. I do work on lots of different software platforms, and things are just not working well. They kind-of-work, which is the really worst condition one can have. My new video board won't work with wyland, my pixycam software won't work