Re: [dmarc-ietf] Tree walk is screwed up

2022-01-26 Thread John R Levine
On Wed, 26 Jan 2022, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: On Wed, Jan 26, 2022 at 9:56 AM John Levine wrote: More saliently, we had an entire working group called DBOUND that tried and failed to come up with a way to publish boundary info about the DNS: https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/dbound/about/

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Tree walk is screwed up

2022-01-26 Thread Murray S. Kucherawy
On Wed, Jan 26, 2022 at 9:56 AM John Levine wrote: > More saliently, we had an entire working group called DBOUND that tried > and failed > to come up with a way to publish boundary info about the DNS: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/dbound/about/ > DBOUND came up with two ways to deal with

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Dave Crocker
On 1/26/2022 11:11 AM, John R Levine wrote: Hm, we're addressing the same problem that DBOND did, but it's not DBOUND. Well, OK. You seem to be, but I'm not. I'm addressing a documentation issue.  I'm sorry you are having so much trouble understanding that. I've no idea how you came up

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread John R Levine
2. But since you are asking, I think it is pretty easy to specify the details of the mechanism in a way that does not require DMARC specific text.  Not because it is will or might have more general use -- that that's often a collateral benefit -- but because specs should not overspecify detail

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Dave Crocker
On 1/26/2022 10:49 AM, Scott Kitterman wrote: Or, not to put too fine a point on it, if you two want to discuss DBOUND, I thinkdbo...@ietf.org is still active. there's nothing in what I posted that has anything to do with dbound or possible derivatives.  The introduction of the reference

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Dave Crocker
On 1/26/2022 10:54 AM, John R Levine wrote: Ahh,  You are claiming I said something about a 'general method'.  I didn't. Since you think otherwise, could you explain in simple language that even I could understand how you reached that interpretation of my note? Now we're both confused. 

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread John R Levine
Ahh,  You are claiming I said something about a 'general method'.  I didn't. Since you think otherwise, could you explain in simple language that even I could understand how you reached that interpretation of my note? Now we're both confused. When you said "The method of finding the

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Scott Kitterman
On Wednesday, January 26, 2022 1:47:37 PM EST Dave Crocker wrote: > On 1/26/2022 10:38 AM, John R Levine wrote: > >>> It appears that Dave Crocker said: > The method of finding the organizational domain should be specified > outside of the base DMARC specification. I suggested this

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Dave Crocker
On 1/26/2022 10:38 AM, John R Levine wrote: It appears that Dave Crocker said: The method of finding the organizational domain should be specified outside of the base DMARC specification.  I suggested this back during the PSD discussion. That assumes that the org domain is useful on its own,

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread John R Levine
It appears that Dave Crocker said: The method of finding the organizational domain should be specified outside of the base DMARC specification.  I suggested this back during the PSD discussion. That assumes that the org domain is useful on its own, rather than just as a tool to help find

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Dave Crocker
On 1/26/2022 10:04 AM, John Levine wrote: It appears that Dave Crocker said: The method of finding the organizational domain should be specified outside of the base DMARC specification.  I suggested this back during the PSD discussion. That assumes that the org domain is useful on its own,

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Tree walk is not a heuristic, was screwed up

2022-01-26 Thread Alessandro Vesely
On Tue 25/Jan/2022 20:39:11 +0100 Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 11:26 AM John R Levine wrote: On Tue, 25 Jan 2022, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: will get the same result. It also occurs to me that in the absence of a PSL-like thing, the idea of an organizational domain is no

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Scott Kitterman
On Wednesday, January 26, 2022 12:30:01 PM EST Seth Blank wrote: > Yes, this is a core ticket that needs to be addressed: > https://trac.ietf.org/trac/dmarc/ticket/46 > > I believe right now the group is just dialing in the definition/text, but > there has been broad agreement (I don't remember

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread John Levine
It appears that Dave Crocker said: >-=-=-=-=-=- > >G'day. > >The method of finding the organizational domain should be specified >outside of the base DMARC specification.  I suggested this back during >the PSD discussion. That assumes that the org domain is useful on its own, rather than just

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Tree walk is screwed up

2022-01-26 Thread John Levine
It appears that Steve Siirila said: >-=-=-=-=-=- > >After reading this thread, I couldn't help but wonder about how the >addition of a "PSD flag" specifically targeted to DMARC might be repurposed >for other non-DMARC applications since my understanding is that the PSL is >currently being used

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Dave Crocker
On 1/26/2022 9:30 AM, Seth Blank wrote: Yes, this is a core ticket that needs to be addressed: https://trac.ietf.org/trac/dmarc/ticket/46 21 months ago?  as if I'd remember something from 21 minutes ago.  sheesh. I believe right now the group is just dialing in the definition/text, but

Re: [dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Seth Blank
Yes, this is a core ticket that needs to be addressed: https://trac.ietf.org/trac/dmarc/ticket/46 I believe right now the group is just dialing in the definition/text, but there has been broad agreement (I don't remember hearing any disagreement, but I wouldn't go so far as to call it consensus

[dmarc-ietf] tree walk is experimental

2022-01-26 Thread Dave Crocker
G'day. The method of finding the organizational domain should be specified outside of the base DMARC specification.  I suggested this back during the PSD discussion. There are a number of reasons: 1. There is already an installed base using the PSL.  While I understand the desire to move

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Tree walk is screwed up

2022-01-26 Thread Scott Kitterman
On Wednesday, January 26, 2022 10:27:04 AM EST Steve Siirila wrote: > After reading this thread, I couldn't help but wonder about how the > addition of a "PSD flag" specifically targeted to DMARC might be repurposed > for other non-DMARC applications since my understanding is that the PSL is >

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Tree walk is screwed up

2022-01-26 Thread Steve Siirila
After reading this thread, I couldn't help but wonder about how the addition of a "PSD flag" specifically targeted to DMARC might be repurposed for other non-DMARC applications since my understanding is that the PSL is currently being used for other purposes as well. Just food for thought.