Quoting Adam Borowski (kilob...@angband.pl):
> Well, about that... Not so long ago I helped a relative by installing
> Redmontware. It was a long, arduous process, during which I had to fetch
> and copy in drivers for six pieces of hardware. Most of those couldn't be
> even found on their manuf
On Fri, Dec 21, 2018 at 04:33:32AM +0100, Adam Borowski wrote:
>
> I forgot the details why, but during the process I resorted to a small
> Debian partition. Every piece of hardware was supported perfectly,
> including even that machine's USB wifi card.
I've found a Linux partition is essential
Quoting Clarke Sideroad via Dng (dng@lists.dyne.org):
> I think the purpose was to avoid tainting the initial installation
> with proprietary firmware, but not have the lack of it it ruin the
> party.
Proprietary firmware files divide broadly into two categories:
1. Copyright owner granted suffi
Quoting Steve Litt (sl...@troubleshooters.com):
> Ubuntu installs as easily as Windows' first boot nonsense. Devuan isn't
> far behind, on most hardware.
Interesting point about that, which I'll get to, near the end.
> What Eric objected to, and I agreed, was lack of proper handling of
> proprie
On Thu, Dec 20, 2018 at 11:29:29AM +, Simon Hobson wrote:
> In part, Linux adoption is held back by it's perceived difficulty - such
> as having to go and find drivers for your hardware.
Well, about that... Not so long ago I helped a relative by installing
Redmontware. It was a long, arduous
On 2018-12-20 6:00 p.m., Steve Litt wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 14:07:11 -0800
Rick Moen wrote:
Quoting Simon Hobson (li...@thehobsons.co.uk):
In part, Linux adoption is held back by its perceived
difficulty
Just a brief comment about this in passing, as this is an antique
debate point a
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 14:07:11 -0800
Rick Moen wrote:
> Quoting Simon Hobson (li...@thehobsons.co.uk):
>
> > In part, Linux adoption is held back by its perceived
> > difficulty
>
> Just a brief comment about this in passing, as this is an antique
> debate point ages ago stomped into the gr
Rick Moen wrote:
>> In part, Linux adoption is held back by its perceived difficulty
>
> Just a brief comment about this in passing, as this is an antique debate
> point ages ago stomped into the ground on comp.os.*.advocacy and other
> places: An operating system one must install (not pre
Quoting Simon Hobson (li...@thehobsons.co.uk):
> In part, Linux adoption is held back by its perceived difficulty
Just a brief comment about this in passing, as this is an antique debate
point ages ago stomped into the ground on comp.os.*.advocacy and other
places: An operating system one mus
Rick Moen wrote:
>> I agree. The more GNU/Linux blows off prospective users by making them
>> jump through hoops, the more Linux becomes a niche. The nichier Linux
>> becomes, the more the hardware manufacturers ignore it. Let GNU/Linux
>> get up to 25% on the desktop, and the manufacturers will
Quoting Steve Litt (sl...@troubleshooters.com):
> I agree. The more GNU/Linux blows off prospective users by making them
> jump through hoops, the more Linux becomes a niche. The nichier Linux
> becomes, the more the hardware manufacturers ignore it. Let GNU/Linux
> get up to 25% on the desktop, a
On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 14:43:38 -0800
Bruce Perens wrote:
> Eric has never been the developer of a distribution, so there will be
> things he doesn't understand. I am all for having as many users as
> possible. I understand the problem of proprietary firmware and hope
> that this is not a significan
On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 16:22:59 +0100
KatolaZ wrote:
> - netinst exist because it's the preferred way of installing minimal
> systems and servers;
And also because on tricky installations, life is easier if you can get
the computer to boot a simple OS, and then build it up with various
apt-get i
On Wed, Dec 12, 2018 at 02:43:38PM -0800, Bruce Perens wrote:
> Eric has never been the developer of a distribution, so there will be
> things he doesn't understand. I am all for having as many users as
> possible. I understand the problem of proprietary firmware and hope that
> this is not a signi
Eric has never been the developer of a distribution, so there will be
things he doesn't understand. I am all for having as many users as
possible. I understand the problem of proprietary firmware and hope that
this is not a significant blocker for most people, especially since most
distribution ins
On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 03:14:39 -0800
Rick Moen wrote:
> If you want to have more devs, you need to attract a larger
> userbase.
>
> I'm surprised to see Eric advance this non-sequitur. Open source
> projects attract developers because their needs and objectives (or the
> needs and objectives of
On 2018-12-12 09:22, KatolaZ wrote:
And please find below a more detailed explanation on the motivations
behind each image:
- netinst exist because it's the preferred way of installing minimal
systems and servers;
- the install DVD ISO exists because there are many users asking for a
singl
On 12/12/2018 15:22, KatolaZ wrote:
[snip]
>
> Please find below the stats of the actual number of downloads of each
> ASCII image according to https://files.devuan.org in the last 14 days
> (without taking into account the other 24 ISO mirrors):
>
> - netinst: 149
> - DVD ISO: 13
On Wed, Dec 12, 2018 at 02:40:11PM +, Roger Leigh wrote:
[cut]
> installation methods. Looking at
> https://mirror.netzspielplatz.de/devuan/devuan_ascii_rc/installer-iso/ for
> example. Do the separate CD and DVD images have much value given that they
> only hold the tiniest fraction of the
On 12/12/2018 11:14, Rick Moen wrote:
A key part of the basis of Eric's argument is irritatingly and obviously
untrue:
If you want to have more devs, you need to attract a larger userbase.
I'm surprised to see Eric advance this non-sequitur.
I don't think it's a non sequitur, but I do thin
A very odd thing happened on #devuan, and then an incrementally odder
thing on dev1galaxy, on the day before Pearl Harbour Day.Both
involved a whirlwind visit by Eric Raymond -- who came and went with
some quite ranty opinions. Being sleepy at the time, I good-naturedly
promised Eric I'd rai
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