Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Everyone seems tired of this thread by now, so I'll make my final comment an observation that there is zero exposed rebar in the picture of that guy wire base that supposedly exploded because of it. I'd offer the possibility that the base exploded because there wasn't enough rebar, not

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Let me inject an experience that occurred while I was a field engineer for the phone co. working in Miami. We had a buried cable that ran diagonally across an open green area. About 1/3 of the way across was what we called a 'hand hole', a shallow pit where a splice or repair had been done.

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Gilbert Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2017 2:26 AM To: Rick Dettinger <k7m...@gmail.com> Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete You also have many thousands of ham radio towers in northwest 7 land with either Ufer grounds or embedded tower bases. You tell

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

I sure hope so Bob K3DJC On Tue, 18 Apr 2017 18:10:48 -0400 "Terry Posey" writes: > I expect that the Moderator will be ending this Off Topic soon. > > However: > > One of my clients operates a large 90 tower (all self-supported) > microwave > system here in Florida.

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Thyir’er we go! 73, Rick K7MW > On Apr 18, 2017, at 6:01 PM, Matt Zilmer wrote: > > Time to update that list of frequently misspelled words. It is very long, but > also distinguished. > > How about it's versus its? The first is a contraction, and the second is a

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Time to update that list of frequently misspelled words. It is very long, but also distinguished. How about it's versus its? The first is a contraction, and the second is a possessive. I think, from experience, that this is the single most common spelling error that I see from English-first

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

This has been bugging me for a while and I am now in a mindframe to comment. Lightening: light·en·ing ˈlītniNG/ *noun* 1. a drop in the level of the uterus during the last weeks of pregnancy as the head of the fetus engages in the pelvis. Come on !! Randy N1KWF On Tue, Apr 18, 2017 at

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

I was the first to use the term "exploding tower base" in this discussion. The term "exploding" was probably not correct. As several others have phrased it, an instant expansion of steam is more correct. Concrete is never totally "dry" in the context of this conversation. I witnessed lightening

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

some 40 years ago, maybe longer I put up a 50' rohn 25G tower. Dug the hole and set the tower base in it alone with a 12' 3/4" ground rod and poured the cement, left about 6" of ground rod protruding. I bonded to that rod and grounded the tower. 3 years later I had a huge lightning strike on my

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

I expect that the Moderator will be ending this Off Topic soon. However: One of my clients operates a large 90 tower (all self-supported) microwave system here in Florida. Florida is often regarded as the lightning capital of the world. I have helped my client with repairing damaged

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

I should preface this by saying I live on the Pacific Coast of Alaska (2 miles from salt water). I worked in two-way communications for 30 years and recall all towers having external copper lines from the top to ground rods external to the concrete base. Most of the hardlines were equipped

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

I expect that the Moderator will be ending this Off Top soon. However: One of my clients operates a large 90 tower (all self-supported) microwave system here in Florida. Florida is often regarded as the lightning capital of the world. I have helped my client with repairing damaged (cracked)

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

If you have a 50 foot tower with a tribander on it among a bunch of 70 foot or taller Trees then perhaps you will survive lightning strikes without major damage. However if you have something like my situation things change rapidly. I have three towers the tallest is 175 feet to the top

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Working on a fire line in a national forest I've seen 75 foot pine trees that had been completely exploded from a lightening strike. The sap reaches boiling point in an instant and burning parts of the tree gets distributed over the ground which leads to a fire crew being dispatched. Most

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

I'm with you, Wes. And I strongly agree with AB7E's excellent post. The cited article does NOT say that "The Broadcast industry doesn’t seem to put their faith in Uber grounding." It DOES say that a Ufer ground done improperly can be a problem structurally. Notice also that the author "is

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Part of the mental imaging problem here is that our brains, in their internal emotional response to orders of magnitude, simply cannot scale the destructive power in lightning. Lightning is quite capable of melting the leads to six properly done ground rods, AND at the same time blowing up a

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

I don't know whether I would call that "extensive" damage but whatever... I have my own photos of me standing next to this anchor, but since I can't send attachments, here is a link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KVLY-TV_mast#/media/File:KVLYPylon.jpeg I didn't see any extra grounding

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Dave is correct, just read a little on CEE or Ufer grounds, perhaps the idea of exploding bases comes from a statement about Ufer grounds, A disadvantage of Ufer grounds is that the moisture in the concrete can flash into steam during a lightning strike or similar high energy fault

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Here is an article that described a Ufer ground failure that prompted the installation of an extensive external grounding system on a 1900’ BC tower. http://www.radioworld.com/headlines/0045/proper-grounding-and-bonding-are-crucial/338510 The Broadcast industry doesn’t seem to put their faith

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

t> >> To: "'Elecraft Reflector'"<elecraft@mailman.qth.net> >> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete >> Message-ID: <191B5755E4654B65951378A9EF28A8F1@DOUG8PC> >> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="us-ascii" >>

[Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

h.net> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete Message-ID: <191B5755E4654B65951378A9EF28A8F1@DOUG8PC> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" That myth refuses to die. I have 5 concrete tower bases with ground rods partially encased

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

You also have many thousands of ham radio towers in northwest 7 land with either Ufer grounds or embedded tower bases. You tell me how many of them have exploded during lightning strikes, and how that justifies the admonition to "never encase a ground rod in a tower base". I once did an

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

A Uber ground was developed for dry areas during WW2. In damp areas, the concrete can do just what happened in the concrete pole test. Per Wikipedia article: "A disadvantage of Ufer grounds is that the moisture in the concrete can flash into steam during a lightning strike or similar high

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

Just a comment on myth controversy when dealing with Lightning and grounding topics. I know guys that are doing all the wrong things with their practices. They can't be persuaded otherwise. Yet, the odds have favored them for years. That reinforces their thinking that they are right and

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

That isn't even close to being the same condition and only serves to help perpetuate a stupid myth that refuses to die among the ill informed. Anyone that doesn't understand that a Ufer ground is essentially multiple ground rods encased in concrete is indeed ill informed. And anyone who

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

I don’t think its a myth. In the early 1970’s, the power company I worked for was testing out some hollow reinforced concrete poles. There was considerable concern by the line workers that the poles might be more dangerous to work on than wooden poles, in the event of an accident. To check

Re: [Elecraft] OT: Ground rods and concrete

That myth refuses to die. I have 5 concrete tower bases with ground rods partially encased and never a worry about an exploding base. Doug -Original Message- -NEVER- encase a ground rod in concrete ... especially a tower base. As a retired 2-way radio tech, I'm aware of two towers