Re: [EM] Markus, 12 Mfarch, '05, 0315 GMT

2005-03-12 Thread Markus Schulze
Dear Mike, you wrote (12 Mar 2005): Majority rejected was never a criterion. Wrong. It was one of your criteria. You called this criterion Generalized Majority Criterion (GMC). Markus Schulze Election-methods mailing list - see http://electorama.com/em for list info

[EM] Re: Chain Climbing -- Chain Filling

2005-03-12 Thread Jobst Heitzig
Dear Forest! You wrote: Unfortunately, reverse TACC is not monotonic with respect to approval. If the winner moves up to the top approval slot without also becoming the CW, she will turn into a loser. That's right. You continued: However, the following chain filling method is monotonic:

[EM] Ramon Llull method = ?

2005-03-12 Thread James Green-Armytage
Hi folks. A quick question: Does anyone know how Ramon Llull's pairwise procedure worked? Was it an iterative procedure (voting between options two at a time), or did it use ranked ballots? Was the aim to select a candidate who won all of their pairwise comparisons? How did the method

Re: [EM] Ramon Llull method = ?

2005-03-12 Thread Markus Schulze
Dear James Green-Armytage, please read: http://www.math.uni-augsburg.de/stochastik/pukelsheim/2001a.html Markus Schulze Election-methods mailing list - see http://electorama.com/em for list info

[EM] Ramon Llull method = ?

2005-03-12 Thread Jobst Heitzig
Dear James! Llull designed election methods under the assumption that there is a best candidate which only has to be found. Obviously he implicitly assumed that the voters vote not in their personal interest but in the general interest to find the best candidate. As Pukelsheim writes in the text

[EM] Re: Approval cutoff AKA None of the Below

2005-03-12 Thread Jobst Heitzig
Dear Ted! You wrote: I explored TACC with some enthusiasm over the last couple of days. It's astonishing that a method that simple could give such nice results, isn't it? That was a fabulous idea by Forest to construct chains in order of approval! I still want to explore his Needle method in

[EM] Why IRV is popular

2005-03-12 Thread Russ Paielli
Eric Gorr recently posted a link to a one-page document by Jim Lindsay explaining why he and many political activists prefer IRV to Condorcet, Approval, and other methods. One of Jim's criteria was system easily explained. Surprisingly, he put somewhat for both IRV and Condorcet. IRV is much

[EM] Re: Chain Climbing -- Chain Filling

2005-03-12 Thread Ted Stern
On 12 Mar 2005 at 02:20 PST, Jobst Heitzig wrote: Dear Forest! You [Forest] wrote: Unfortunately, reverse TACC is not monotonic with respect to approval. If the winner moves up to the top approval slot without also becoming the CW, she will turn into a loser. That's right. You

[EM] Re: Approval cutoff AKA None of the Below

2005-03-12 Thread Ted Stern
On 12 Mar 2005 at 05:04 PST, Jobst Heitzig wrote: Ted wrote earlier: -- the Nash equilibrium will occur with 40: ABC 35: BCA 25: CAB which again has B winning. Why is that? Can you argue for this equilibrium in more detail? It was always my impression that in most

Re: [EM] Why IRV is popular

2005-03-12 Thread Alex Small
I mostly agree with Russ. Another reason why IRV is popular is that it's basically an expanded and automated version of an election method already used for many local elections in the US, as well as elections to some higher offices in at least 2 states (Nebraska and Louisiana): 2-step runoff.

[EM] Ted's Total Approval Beatpath

2005-03-12 Thread Forest Simmons
Dear Ted, Your TAB method is what I used to call Approval Seeded Bubble Sort. Then after a year of thinking that it was my invention I came across an article about the Kemeny Order in which the authors called our bubble sort process Local Kemenization and suggested using it as a way of refining

Re: [EM] Re: Chain Climbing -- Chain Filling

2005-03-12 Thread Russ Paielli
Ted Stern tedstern-at-mailinator.com |EMlist| wrote: Thanks to both of your responses, I have an idea now that I think will work, and it should have (my) desired quality of encouraging generous approval cutoff and ranking of candidates below the cutoff. Basically, the idea is simply Beatpath:

[EM] Approval/Condorcet Compromise

2005-03-12 Thread Forest Simmons
Kevin's Approval Runoff in which low approval candidates are eliminated until there is a Condorcet Winner, can also be described as follows: Pick the lowest approval score candidate that beats all of the candidates with greater approval scores. Proof of equivalence: Kevin's winner KW has to

[EM] sequential dropping

2005-03-12 Thread James Green-Armytage
I'd like to clarify a bit about this method. First, the rule itself: *Drop the weakest defeat that is in a cycle, until there is an unbeaten candidate.* Does that sound right? Next, I have a question about how this method compares to another method: *If there are no

Re: [EM] Why IRV is popular

2005-03-12 Thread Russ Paielli
James Green-Armytage jarmyta-at-antioch-college.edu |EMlist| wrote: Russ wrote: One of Jim's criteria was system easily explained. Surprisingly, he put somewhat for both IRV and Condorcet. IRV is much easier to explain than Condorcet, and I believe that is the primary reason that it is more