RE: FW: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Well... TEMPEST as I heard of it, means only intelligible information (none to be found). The device can interfere such that nothing else works, but as long as nothing intelligible can be found in that noise, then it's TEMPEST. The TEMPEST guys can set me straight on this. As for ITE products, I

RE: FW: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
In a company not really far away and only years ago, I was evaluating a computer with a (then new) CD drive. I discovered there was no bypassing on the headset line ("What for?. it's only audio!") and was able to show our Board -- then touring the EMI lab -- that we could hear on the spectrum ana

FW: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
From: Price, Edward Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 10:21 AM To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: RE: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND Bill: Same idea, but a different vulnerability. The prof was Wim Van Eck, and he demonstrated retrieving video images from monitor radiation circa 1985. Again,

FW: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
From: Price, Edward Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 10:11 AM To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: RE: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND > -Original Message- > From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Derek > Walton > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 9:30 AM > To: EMC-PSTC

Re: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Thomas, > I remember talking to some CIA type folks who said power lines were > being monitored back in the 1960's because electric typewriters > created distinctive voltage spikes marking the stroke of the keyboard > and when the key actually hit the ribbon, and the time delay between > the two s

Re: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
I remember talking to some CIA type folks who said power lines were being monitored back in the 1960's because electric typewriters created distinctive voltage spikes marking the stroke of the keyboard and when the key actually hit the ribbon, and the time delay between the two spikes determined wh

RE: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Those of us who have TEMPEST experience knows this is nothing new. I saw a demonstration back in the 80’s where display images were reproduced from radiated emissions given off by a monitor 10 meters away. This really freaked out the US government and prompted a lot of TEMPEST PC and peripheral co

RE: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Bill: Same idea, but a different vulnerability. The prof was Wim Van Eck, and he demonstrated retrieving video images from monitor radiation circa 1985. Again, this was common knowledge among security guys, but he introduced the phenomenon to the public. Ed Price ed.pr...@cubic.com mailto:ed.

RE: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
> -Original Message- > From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf > Of Derek Walton > Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 9:30 AM > To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG > Subject: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND > > >http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8147534.stm Derek: "

RE: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
There are very few PS2 keyboards made and sold these days. Most keyboard data goes over a USB or wireless connection. There is a link to an October 2008 article that includes snooping on USB keyboards by looking at the radiated emissions. I do like the description as a “Hotel attack” if only

Re: WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Around 1980 a guest professor demonstrated that technique using radiated emissions. The receiving equipment fit into a large briefcase. - Bill Indecision may or may not be the problem. --- On Mon, 7/13/09, Derek Walton wrote: From: Derek Walton Subject: WHAT GOES AROUND COME

WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8147534.stm - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.or

RE: UL Wire Styles

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Hello Ian, UL makes their full library of wire styles available on-line through their “UL iQ” system. It requires a free registration. For those already registered with UL’s “MyHome” system, you can access the iQ databases >from there. http://my.home1.ul.com/portal/page/portal/ULIQ/UL_iQ_Hom

RE: Settings for DTS & UNII Power Measurement per FCC

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Grace: The first part, requesting "Trace Average" is easy. It's the average of 100 traces, in whatever amplitude you are using. If you were to take the average of two traces, displayed in units of dBm, and saw -32 dBm on the first trace and -40 dBm on the second trace, then the Trace Average woul

RE: UL Wire Style Information

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Hello Ian, For UL wire style information, go to the UL web site, WWW.UL.com, and go to the UL iQ pages. This page has several different data bases that you can access, one of which covers AWM wiring materials and wire styles. You'll first need to register, then log-in. You'll be able to view descr

Settings for DTS & UNII Power Measurement per FCC

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Dear Members, Could members please help me to interprete " Trace average 100 traces in power averaging mode " under Method #1 of FCC DTS measurement procedure (http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/oetcf/kdb/for s/FTSSearchResultPage.cfm?id=21124&switch=P) and UNII's (http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/

[no subject]

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
All Can anyone tell me the difference between the following UL cable style numbers? AWM Cable: UL Style Number 1015 AWM Cable: UL Style Number 1430 And is there a definitive list of the UL styles available anywhere? Ian Gordon --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- The co

Need production tools a CE mark

2009-07-13 Thread emc-p...@ieee.org
Dear newsgroup readers. Till now we verify the internally developed / produced and used production tools (they will be used in our factories within Europe and service and repairs centres) according to EMC and Safety as required for a CE marking. But we have an discussion now if CE marking of p