Re: [PSES] fire safety test methods for different country standards

2016-05-22 Thread John Woodgate
There isn't, almost certainly, a single reason, and we must take care that evidence that standards need to change isn't swamped by a greater body of evidence of non-compliance. For example, we recently had, in Britain, many tumble-dryer fires. The standard may allow a warning in the instruction

Re: [PSES] fire safety test methods for different country standards

2016-05-22 Thread Richard Nute
Hi John: Thanks for your additional comments. > Could it be that the scenarios which the standards > committees envisage are not "the real deal" In my opinion, this is the case. > OR that the > products which cause the fires just don't comply with the > standards? Of course, counterfeit and n

Re: [PSES] fire safety test methods for different country standards

2016-05-22 Thread John Allen
Rich. Could it be that the scenarios which the standards committees envisage are not "the real deal", OR that the products which cause the fires just don't comply with the standards? IMO (not IMHO on this occasion !) the latter may well be the actual case, because, in opinion, the number of

Re: [PSES] fire safety test methods for different country standards

2016-05-22 Thread Richard Nute
Our most common and serious safety issue is that of product electrically-caused fire. I subscribe to "In Compliance" weekly recall notices; most are fire. As Gert Gremmen has stated, no fault-testing has resulted in a product fire in the test lab, yet product fires continue to occur in the

Re: [PSES] fire safety test methods for different country standards

2016-05-22 Thread Ted Eckert
My response will be in regards to Information Technology Equipment (ITE) specifically, but it may have some applicability to other product types. IEC 62368-1 has a significantly different approach to fire enclosures than IEC 60950-1 has. IEC 62368-1 allows the designer much more flexibility in f

Re: [PSES] fire safety test methods for different country standards

2016-05-22 Thread John Allen
Gert In many instances I think you are probably on the right track - but mainly w.r.t. to 61010 kit for professional / semi-professional use, as opposed to 60950 where a lot of the kit certified (?) is low cost consumer kit of potentially "dubious" origin. So, maybe, the latter group deserves a

Re: [PSES] fire safety test methods for different country standards

2016-05-22 Thread ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen
I was wondering if these type of fire propagation tests are still of any relevance. Nowadays most electronic designs have been built with compliant (be it UL or VDE or any other reputable test house) and wiring is HAR or better. Enclosures are most standard -off-the-shelf- types with a decent f