I agree. The current ways to debug FPC/Lazarus programs are not up to
the standards even compared to 10-15 years ago Delphi debugging.
Most developers does not want to start digging the underlying
RTL/Component, etc. source codes to figure out what they should enter
into the watch window expre
On Wednesday 11 March 2009 15:14:27 Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 3:55 PM, Graeme Geldenhuys
>
> wrote:
> > http://opensoft.homeip.net/~graemeg/gdb_issues_with_fpc.png
>
> And then the same think under Kylix 3. As I said, with Delphi and
> Kylix such trivial things is a no-br
Michael Schnell wrote on wo, 11 mrt 2009:
To make FPC generate DWARF3 debug info, use the -gw3 command line
switch. Note that this is not yet very well tested, and may still
contain a lot of bugs (with things working with -g and/or -gw2 not
working with -gw3)
But it seems the way FP goe
To make FPC generate DWARF3 debug info, use the -gw3 command line
switch. Note that this is not yet very well tested, and may still
contain a lot of bugs (with things working with -g and/or -gw2 not
working with -gw3)
But it seems the way FP goes is already defined and seems like appropriat
Graeme Geldenhuys wrote on wo, 11 mrt 2009:
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 4:12 PM, Jonas Maebe
wrote:
With DWARF3, this should also be quite doable.
So is DWARF3 only supported in the newest (not really released yet)
GDB?
Yes.
Something like the one that apparently comes with Fedora 11?
T
Delphi/Kylix also does not have 'absolute', so FPC requires even more
features in debugging format also than even K/D.
Not true. (Turbo) Delphi does have "absolute".
-Michael
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Micha Nelissen wrote:
Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
And then the same think under Kylix 3. As I said, with Delphi and
Kylix such trivial things is a no-brainer. Debugging just works.
http://opensoft.homeip.net/~graemeg/kylix_debuging.png
Delphi/Kylix also does not have 'absolute', so FPC requires
Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
And then the same think under Kylix 3. As I said, with Delphi and
Kylix such trivial things is a no-brainer. Debugging just works.
http://opensoft.homeip.net/~graemeg/kylix_debuging.png
Delphi/Kylix also does not have 'absolute', so FPC requires even more
features in
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 4:12 PM, Jonas Maebe wrote:
>
> With DWARF3, this should also be quite doable.
So is DWARF3 only supported in the newest (not really released yet)
GDB? Something like the one that apparently comes with Fedora 11?
I'm currently using GDB that came with Ubuntu 7.10.
grae.
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 3:55 PM, Graeme Geldenhuys
wrote:
>
> http://opensoft.homeip.net/~graemeg/gdb_issues_with_fpc.png
And then the same think under Kylix 3. As I said, with Delphi and
Kylix such trivial things is a no-brainer. Debugging just works.
http://opensoft.homeip.net/~graemeg/kylix
Graeme Geldenhuys wrote on wo, 11 mrt 2009:
Continuing with the debugging issues on how do I debug something as
simple as the global variable 'ShortDateFormat'? This just shows how
broken debugging is in FPC. With Kylix or Delphi this is a no-brainer!
See the URL below for a screenshot of the i
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:24 AM, Graeme Geldenhuys
wrote:
>
> Simple things that worked in Delphi IDE and even Kylix IDE, but not in
> FPC/Lazarus IDE:
>
> * Breakpoints do not always break
> * Tooltip evaluation of highlighted code gives "no such symbol in
> context" errors
> * Properties on obj
Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
Like I said, I am not very knowledgeable with debugger internals, but
I am willing to learn and help. Not having decent debugger support is
killing me - and I am clearly not alone, as the thread in the Lazarus
The problem is not so much the debugging itself. That is eas
Paul Ishenin wrote on wo, 11 mrt 2009:
Jonas Maebe wrote:
Just like FPC development, GDB development does not stand still.
The above no longer is true (full, or nearly full, DWARF3 support
is in the GDB Archer branch, and I have already fixed bugs in FPC's
DWARF3 information so that e.g
Jonas Maebe wrote:
Just like FPC development, GDB development does not stand still. The
above no longer is true (full, or nearly full, DWARF3 support is in
the GDB Archer branch, and I have already fixed bugs in FPC's DWARF3
information so that e.g. dynamic arrays work perfectly in that version
Marc Weustink wrote on wo, 11 mrt 2009:
I'm not really sure about this. IIRC the internal design of gdb is
modeled after the STABS debug format. This means that even for DWARF,
it internally is translated to STABS, meaning that not all contstucts
possible in DWARF are supported. Given this I hav
Graeme Geldenhuys wrote on wo, 11 mrt 2009:
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Jonas Maebe
wrote:
GDB is designed for any language it has maintainers for (just like FPC is
"designed" for all platforms that have active maintainers, and languishes or
Probably true, but it's leans a lot more
O/H Dave Parsons έγραψε:
On Wed, 11 Mar 2009 10:24:53 +0200, Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
I am willing to learn and help. Not having decent debugger support is
killing me - and I am clearly not alone, as the thread in the Lazarus
mailing list proves. The problem as far as I can see, is that the
I don't see myself relearning C language again! I left C/C++ for a reason.
Where is the problem with C ? Of course it's by far less "nice" than
Object-Pascal, but I don't suppose with doing a Debugger the "Object"
feature does not help that much, and for low-level stuff C seems quite
appr
Everybody keeps hammering on this point. Delphi has supported property
access methods since forever and I have not heard of a single Delphi
developer complaining about the "possible side effects". For me the
pros far outweigh the cons!
I suppose thy to check if a read function is "pure". I se
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 12:03 PM, dmitry boyarintsev
wrote:
> debugger can be found at: {$lazdir}/debugger/fpdebug
> i've already started fp-debugger developing (personally i need it for
> OSX), and helped Marc to remove some Windows-only bounds.
Well, I guess you guys didn't get very far with re
And of course "Also remember that it would be dangerous to call the
function from the debugger (outside the normal flow of the
application). This can modify the state of the application (a function
may change other objects)" cannot be solved by any debugger (even if
you'd take a complete sn
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 12:48 PM, Martin Schreiber wrote:
>
> I think it would be better to extend gdb for better FPC support.
I don't see myself relearning C language again! I left C/C++ for a reason.
Regards,
- Graeme -
___
fpGUI - a cross-plat
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Jonas Maebe wrote:
>
> GDB is designed for any language it has maintainers for (just like FPC is
> "designed" for all platforms that have active maintainers, and languishes or
Probably true, but it's leans a lot more to C/C++ support than any
other language.
>
On Wednesday 11 March 2009 11:23:00 Michael Schnell wrote:
> > GDB can switch the stackframe which Delphi 7 cant.
>
> This allows for taking a look at the local variable of a ancestor
> procedure ?
>
Yes, don't forget to compile with -O-.
[...]
> > There are some issues with debuginfo of dynamic a
On Wednesday 11 March 2009 11:28:27 Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
> Well writing a new compiler is just such a big task and it didn't
> prevent Florian from starting FPC. Having a 100% working debugger (no
> matter if it takes a while to get there) is still much better in the
> long run - for the devel
On Wednesday 11 March 2009 11:26:07 Florian Klaempfl wrote:
> My main problem (if they really work) with all gdb gui frontends is that
> they are dog slow compared with a good debugger like Visual Studio.
Agreed. MSEide has a button to disable the watches for fast stepping.
On a modern computer g
Michael Schnell wrote:
Switch the stackframe if you want to examine variables of a caller.
Better than Delphi :). Can Lazarus do this, too ? Should it be extended
appropriately ?
Lazarus can.
Best regards,
Paul Ishenin.
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On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:59 AM, Martin Schreiber wrote:
>
> For me GDB with the MSEide frontend is better than the integrated debugger in
> Delphi 7.
I can't comment on GDB+MSEide, but for me and many others Delphi
debugger is *much* better that GDB+Lazarus.
> It is almost impossible to develo
Martin Schreiber schrieb:
> Using gdb has the *big* advantage to have a working environment on many
> platforms with working remote debugging. I suspect the work for developping
> an own debugger will be very big, have a look into the gdb sources and you
> know what I mean...
> The main problem
>>> Finally getting rid of GDB: This is VERY good news indeed :-)
>
> I quite agree !
it was not my words :)
> Not really, there is low-level debugging support inside the OS. This is true
> for Windows as well as for UNIX-like operating systems.
gdb is always based on system debugging API (DebugAP
Martin Schreiber wrote:
...
Martin, I was sure that you would jump in here :) Great !
For me GDB with the MSEide frontend is better than the integrated debugger in
Delphi 7.
And supposedly better than the Lazarus' one...
Could you take a look at the Wiki page mentioned and comment on if the
Graeme Geldenhuys wrote on wo, 11 mrt 2009:
About GDB - this seems to be the debugger of choice for the Free
Pascal project.
It is the only debugger I know of that supports pretty much every
single platform out there. In fact, there are simply very few other
free (even as in beer) debugger
dmitry boyarintsev wrote:
sorry! unfinished note:
2) gdb can be extended to support FPC syntax, if enougth information
is provided with GDB. And ofcause, some C-programmer might be required.
I'm not really sure about this. IIRC the internal design of gdb is
modeled after the STABS debug format
Hi Florian
Thanks for the info. Regarding binutils, can I use arm-none-eabi-*
from codesourcery to compile on Linux / FreeBSD? I don't get to use a
Windows machine. My fpc svn is on a Linux machine.
regards
Nataraj
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 3:31 PM, Florian Klaempfl
wrote:
> Nataraj S Narayan
On Wednesday 11 March 2009 11:06:38 Florian Klaempfl wrote:
>
> GDB is ported for >10 years to windows and it's behaviour is still
> *very* poor.
MinGW gdb 6.8-3 works well for me.
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=2435&package_id=20507&release_id=594520
Martin
___
dmitry boyarintsev wrote:
Finally getting rid of GDB: This is VERY good news indeed :-)
I quite agree !
it's been getting rid of GDB for some time already... but, imho it
should not be removed!
1) because GDB supports a lot of platforms, already. So porting a fpc
program to a new platform, w
> GDB is ported for >10 years to windows and it's behaviour is still *very*
> poor.
but at least, it works.
Is there any other debugger that can be used cross-platform, rather than gdb?
yes, there should be fpc based debugger, but gdb support should not be
removed, either.
___
On Wed, 11 Mar 2009, Tomas Hajny wrote:
> On Wed, March 11, 2009 10:48, Michael Van Canneyt wrote:
> > On Wed, 11 Mar 2009, Florian Klaempfl wrote:
> >> Graeme Geldenhuys schrieb:
> >> >
> >> > That's the problem! GDB *doesn't* support all the language features
> >> > that Object Pascal offers,
dmitry boyarintsev schrieb:
>> Finally getting rid of GDB: This is VERY good news indeed :-)
>
> it's been getting rid of GDB for some time already... but, imho it
> should not be removed!
>
> 1) because GDB supports a lot of platforms, already. So porting a fpc
> program to a new platform, will
On Wed, March 11, 2009 10:48, Michael Van Canneyt wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Mar 2009, Florian Klaempfl wrote:
>> Graeme Geldenhuys schrieb:
>> >
>> > That's the problem! GDB *doesn't* support all the language features
>> > that Object Pascal offers, so some things cannot be debugged. This is
>> > not a L
sorry! unfinished note:
2) gdb can be extended to support FPC syntax, if enougth information
is provided with GDB. And ofcause, some C-programmer might be required.
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> Finally getting rid of GDB: This is VERY good news indeed :-)
it's been getting rid of GDB for some time already... but, imho it
should not be removed!
1) because GDB supports a lot of platforms, already. So porting a fpc
program to a new platform, will require a debugger. And the only
debugger
On Wednesday 11 March 2009 09:24:53 Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
For me GDB with the MSEide frontend is better than the integrated debugger in
Delphi 7. It is almost impossible to develop something like MSEide+MSEgui
with writeln and logfile approach. Manytimes bugs are hard to find in event
driven
Nataraj S Narayan schrieb:
> Hi
>
> There is file lpc21x4.pp under /rtl/embedded/arm. Does this mean
> that i can compile fpc for the Philips LPC boards?
Yes, I did so already.
>I got an LPC 2378
> stk board with me. Perhaps I may need to modify the lpc21x4.pp to
> suit my board.
>
> Can an
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 11:41 AM, Florian Klaempfl
wrote:
>
> Are you aware of the fact that Marc already started a debugger?
Now that you mention it, I vaguely remember something like that
mentioned. I think it was only for Windows, but I'll hunt it down and
see if we can use that as a starting
On Wed, 11 Mar 2009, Florian Klaempfl wrote:
> Graeme Geldenhuys schrieb:
> >
> > That's the problem! GDB *doesn't* support all the language features
> > that Object Pascal offers, so some things cannot be debugged. This is
> > not a Lazarus issue, but a limitation of GDB with the Object Pascal
Of course they only use C (no surprise) - no other programming
language exists. ;-)
In fact they do have a section about Java, Perl, Python, and Assembler
at the end of the book :).
-Michael
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Graeme Geldenhuys schrieb:
>
> That's the problem! GDB *doesn't* support all the language features
> that Object Pascal offers, so some things cannot be debugged. This is
> not a Lazarus issue, but a limitation of GDB with the Object Pascal
> language. And I have heard the comments about trying t
On Wed, 11 Mar 2009 10:24:53 +0200, Graeme Geldenhuys wrote:
> I am willing to learn and help. Not having decent debugger support is
> killing me - and I am clearly not alone, as the thread in the Lazarus
> mailing list proves. The problem as far as I can see, is that the Free
> Pascal project is
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 11:14 AM, Michael Schnell wrote:
> You might want to take a look at the great book by Maltiff & Salzmann: "The
> Art of Debugging".
That's, I'll go to Amazon and see what it's about
> They also describe the gdb frontends DDD and Eclipse Of course they only use
> C as
You might want to take a look at the great book by Maltiff & Salzmann:
"The Art of Debugging". They provide a very nice overview about what gdb
can do. They also describe the gdb frontends DDD and Eclipse Of course
they only use C as a programming language.
They say that using a debugger has a
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:24 AM, Graeme Geldenhuys
wrote:
>
> Anybody know what debug format does the Delphi compiler use? I would
> guess they have there own format, for exactly the same reasons I
> mention here.
I did a bit more research and it seems I was on the right track.
Delphi seems to u
Hi everybody,
I'm not sure where is the best place to post this message. If there is
a better location, please let me know so I can close this thread and
repost in the correct location. Recently there was a discussion about
how useless debugging is with FPC and especially inside the Lazarus
IDE. I
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