In a message dated 06/28/2001 12:23:24 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> > Personally I don't care much about BSD vs. GPL and am
> > annoyed by Microsoft's hypocricy (sp?). The fact that
> > they're using open source software is great.
>
> That was the point I was trying
anyone seen this yet or am I slow as usual?
http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/dotnet/2001/06/27/dotnet.html
Ak
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Rik van Riel wrote:
>
> On Tue, 26 Jun 2001, Wes Peters wrote:
> > Rik van Riel wrote:
> > > On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
> > > > Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
> > > > > > Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
> > > > > > Of course, they s
On Tue, 26 Jun 2001, Wes Peters wrote:
> Rik van Riel wrote:
> > On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
> > > Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
> > > > > Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
> > > > > Of course, they say it's all meant only for "legacy
Rik van Riel wrote:
>
> On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
> > Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
> > > > Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
> > > > Of course, they say it's all meant only for "legacy Unix" stuff.
> > >
> > > Can you substantiate
In mailinglist.freebsd.hackers, you wrote:
> This is a good reference, but sadly it only really refers to "the
> sockets paradigm as first popularized by BSD", which means they could
> have followed the API without touching a single line of BSD code.
>
> To reiterate: What I'm looking for is some
> > http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/interixinc.asp
> > Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
> > Of course, they say it's all meant only for "legacy Unix" stuff.
>
> Can you substantiate your claim there is "plenty of GNU stuff" in
> Interix, or are you just
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Wes Peters writes:
>Mark Valentine wrote:
>>
>> No. The core SpiderTCP protocol implementation is _not_ derived
>> from BSD. [...]
>
>> (NOTE: this was never sockets over TLI like the stuff some UNIX
>> vendors bought from a Spider competitor!)
>
>*Cough*Lachman*
Mark Valentine wrote:
>
> No. The core SpiderTCP protocol implementation is _not_ derived
> from BSD. Some of the utilities which were added as the product
> was developed came from Net/1 or Net/2 (hence the FTP.EXE copyright
> string), but others such as route and netstat were written from
> s
Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/interixinc.asp
> Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
> Of course, they say it's all meant only for "legacy Unix" stuff.
Can you substantiate your claim there is "plenty of GNU stuff" in
Interix,
>> Can you substantiate your claim there is "plenty of GNU stuff" in
>> Interix, or are you just talking out your ass as usual?
Substantiate? Look at the component list:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp
>Why should I substantiate it? Do it yourself if it bothers you.
On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
> Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
> > > Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
> > > Of course, they say it's all meant only for "legacy Unix" stuff.
> >
> > Can you substantiate your claim there is "plenty of GNU
Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
> > Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
> > Of course, they say it's all meant only for "legacy Unix" stuff.
>
> Can you substantiate your claim there is "plenty of GNU stuff" in
> Interix, or are you just talking out your a
Rahul Siddharthan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> types:
> http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/interixinc.asp
> Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
> Of course, they say it's all meant only for "legacy Unix" stuff.
"Legacy" being industry jargon for "working".
On 21 Jun 2001, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote:
> "Andy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> > http://linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2001-06-20-018-20-NW-MS-SW
>
> Doesn't this mean software developed with Microsoft's SDK is viral?
> And doesn't *that* mean you're not allowed to develop it with
> Micros
"Andy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> http://linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2001-06-20-018-20-NW-MS-SW
Doesn't this mean software developed with Microsoft's SDK is viral?
And doesn't *that* mean you're not allowed to develop it with
Microsoft's SDK? And doesn't this sound a bit circular?
DE
OOPs ;)
check
http://linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2001-06-20-018-20-NW-MS-SW
Ak
> Koster, K.J. said on Jun 21, 2001 at 10:24:24:
> > Perhaps Lee can consider tracking down how much GLP lisenced software is
> > used in companies in close proximity to Microsoft. While
> Microsoft is not
>
Koster, K.J. said on Jun 21, 2001 at 10:24:24:
> Perhaps Lee can consider tracking down how much GLP lisenced software is
> used in companies in close proximity to Microsoft. While Microsoft is not
> going to be caught dead using it,
http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/interixinc.asp
Pl
Dear Jordan,
Bill Gates has jumped in to clarify "OS vs. GPL" surprisingly quickly after
the publication in WSJ. Lee is my hero.
>
> Sort of the other way around. We were the "several FreeBSD
> volunteers" referenced in the article. Lee's my press contact at the
> WSJ and he's done a number o
Peter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> GPL is great for simple things, that don't create any standard, but
> work upon one. But as even RMS [I think it was RMS] agreed, BSD
> license is much better for 'standards'. -- ie the oog format was BSD
> licensed and the GPL people endorsed it because this w
Peter wrote:
> However, Gates said, "there are problems for commercial users relative to the
> (GNU General Public License), and we are just making sure people understand the
> GPL."
>
> end Quote.
But the issue is that wasn't the end of the quotation. Later on, Bubba says,
"And so peop
http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-6322264.html?tag=tp_pr
Gates talks about GPL and being against it. ---Quote:
In an interview Tuesday with CNET News.com at the TechEd 2001 conference,
Gates observed that Microsoft routinely shares the source code for its Windows
operating system with its
* Dave McKay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [010620 15:26] wrote:
> Jordan Hubbard ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> > From: "Jeroen Massar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Subject: RE: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
> > Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 13:
Jordan Hubbard ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> From: "Jeroen Massar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: RE: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
> Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 13:16:20 +0200
>
> > It all sounds really odd to me but alas a cat does stupi
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Adam)
> Date: Tue 19 Jun, 2001
> Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
> An article over on www.Kuro5hin.org by a someone who claims
> to be a former MS employee describes the stack used in NT back
> in the early 90&#
An article over on www.Kuro5hin.org by a someone who claims
to be a former MS employee describes the stack used in NT back
in the early 90's as code which was liscensed from a company
called 'Spider'. In the comp.unix.admin archives I found a post
which references Spider QNIX as a *nix variant so
Dan Nelson wrote:
>
> In the last episode (Jun 15), Jordan Hubbard said:
> > Thanks, that represents the first "hard hit" I've seen yet:
> >
> > root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California"
> > @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California.
>
> But this p
Jordan Hubbard wrote:
>
> I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
> to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
> utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the
> community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I f
On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 10:55:06PM -0400, Sergey Babkin wrote:
> Josef Karthauser wrote:
> >
> > On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 01:16:28PM -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS would pay BSDI
> > > for it, particularly at a time when BSDI was
Josef Karthauser wrote:
>
> On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 01:16:28PM -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS would pay BSDI
> > for it, particularly at a time when BSDI was trying to compete with MS in the
> > server market? Seems like something
+ Adam wrote:
| I'm not sure if this will help or not but Winsock.h, Winsock2.h, and Ws2spi.h
| which are shipped with visual studio 6 include the following in the header:
|
| * This file includes parts which are Copyright (c) 1982-1986 Regents
| * of the University of California. All righ
[Tecc Nops]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 15:37:44 +0100
> jeez, forgot the link to WSJ
>
> http://public.wsj.com/news/hmc/sb992819157437237260.htm
>
> If this is what started this
I'm not sure if this will help or not but Winsock.h, Winsock2.h, and Ws2spi.h
which are shipped with visual studio 6 include the following in the header:
* This file includes parts which are Copyright (c) 1982-1986 Regents
* of the University of California. All rights reserved. The
* Berkele
In a message dated 06/17/2001 2:27:59 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> 2. We're not bashing Microsoft here. We're just trying to figure
> out if their recently published comments that "Open Source is bad
> and inimical to our interests" is really just marketspeak wh
jeez, forgot the link to WSJ
http://public.wsj.com/news/hmc/sb992819157437237260.htm
If this is what started this forgive me for being
so unobservent, we're a bit slow here in the UK
sometimes (well I am that is!)
Ak
> Hmm, anyone seen this then in the Wall Street J ??
> Or is this what st
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
>
>
> On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 01:16:28PM -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS
> w
On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 01:16:28PM -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS would pay BSDI
> for it, particularly at a time when BSDI was trying to compete with MS in the
> server market? Seems like something that a bunch of BSD fanatics conj
Sergey Babkin wrote:
| Brian Wolter wrote:
| >
| > > > "microsoft is evil, we can't win it easily so let's bash it to
| >
| > microsoft /is/ evil. point in fact they're one of the most unethical
| ^^^
| > capitalist organizatio
Brian Wolter wrote:
>
> > > "microsoft is evil, we can't win it easily so let's bash it to
>
> microsoft /is/ evil. point in fact they're one of the most unethical
^^^
> capitalist organizations you could find as far as their bu
> > "microsoft is evil, we can't win it easily so let's bash it to
microsoft /is/ evil. point in fact they're one of the most unethical
capitalist organizations you could find as far as their business practices
are concerned. unfortunately, the masses are also too stupid to protect
themselves.
p
Jordan Hubbard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Jeroen Massar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > It all sounds really odd to me but alas a cat does stupid things
when it gets cornered...
> > I sincerely hope that you BSD guys&gals stay far far away from the
> > "microsoft is evil, we can't win it easily
From: "Jeroen Massar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 13:16:20 +0200
> It all sounds really odd to me but alas a cat does stupid things when it
> gets cornered...
> I sincerely hope that y
Wes Peters wrote:
>
> Sergey Babkin wrote:
> >
> > Jordan Hubbard wrote:
> > >
> > > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
> > > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
> > > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in
On Sun, Jun 17, 2001 at 01:16:20PM +0200, Jeroen Massar wrote:
> Jordan Hubbard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
> > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
> > utilities, and though it's always been
Jordan Hubbard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
> to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
> utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the
> community that they were, when I set about
In the previous episode, Jordan Hubbard said:
> Not really, I don't have any contacts there. Sigh. I didn't think
> proving this would be quite so hard. :(
If you issue the following command on hub:
% grep "microsoft.com" freebsd-* 2>/dev/null
you may be able to find some contacts th
is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS would pay BSDI
for it, particularly at a time when BSDI was trying to compete with MS in the
server market? Seems like something that a bunch of BSD fanatics conjured up
after a few beers.
Bryan
To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL P
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jordan Hubbard)
> Date: Fri 15 Jun, 2001
> Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
> root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California"
> @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of
Hi,
I agree with Serger Babkin - strings(1) wouldn't help.
Main keywords are: ndis.vxd , vip.386 , vtcp.386 .
Any DLL's has nothing common with TCP/IP stack - at least on md 9x.
Sergey Babkin wrote:
> I know one way but it's a hard one: disassemble and manually decomiple
> the code and com
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>Doesn't any one remember Netiquette these days and trim what they are
>replying to??
No. Every month is September.
To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
nd of
> confirmation that can be cited and independently verified. I can't
> name names, but suffice it to say that it will be a small (and very
> visible) coup for us if we can help them prove this. Thanks.
>
> - Jordan
>
> From: "Joseph A. Mallett" <[EMA
Jordan Hubbard wrote:
>
> I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
> to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
> utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the
> community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I f
In the last episode (Jun 15), Jordan Hubbard said:
> Thanks, that represents the first "hard hit" I've seen yet:
>
> root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California"
> @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California.
But this probably just means that FTP.EXE is
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:47:21PM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote:
> Thanks, that represents the first "hard hit" I've seen yet:
>
> root@winston-> strings FTP.EXE |grep "University of California"
> @(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California.
Here's one more:
(echo) [syst
ubject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
> Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence
> here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks!
>
> - Jordan
>
> From: "Steve B." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Query:
From: Joseph Mallett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:50:00 -0400 (EDT)
> Well, looking through headers, a lot of stuff says "taken from the BSD
> file...", namely winsock.h and winsock2.h
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 03:05:17PM -0600, Nate Williams wrote:
> > I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
> > to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
> > utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the
> > community that
ey're looking for is the kind of
> confirmation that can be cited and independently verified. I can't
> name names, but suffice it to say that it will be a small (and very
> visible) coup for us if we can help them prove this. Thanks.
>
> - Jordan
>
> From: "Jo
..
- Jordan
From: Ollivier Robert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:30:13 +0200
> According to Jordan Hubbard:
> > Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence
> > here, no
t;[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:06:23 -0400 (EDT)
> http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/psdk/winsock/apistart_9g1e.htm mentions
> BSD, not sure if is direct enough.
>
> I'm downloading the
According to Jordan Hubbard:
> Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence
> here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks!
If you do a strings on ftp.exe (at least in win95), you should find some BSD
copyright strings.
--
Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- [
t anecdotal stuff. Thanks!
>
> - Jordan
>
> From: "Steve B." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
> Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:59:51 -0700
>
> > What I read awhile back was MS licen
http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/psdk/winsock/apistart_9g1e.htm mentions
BSD, not sure if is direct enough.
I'm downloading the SDK right now so I can grepmonkey through the latest
and greatest headers, etc.
HTH
--
[ Joseph Mallett<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ] [ http://srcsys.org ]
[ xMach
> I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
> to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
> utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the
> community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to
> be less easy
Do you happen to have any of their Winsock propoganda handy (specifically
developer materials or winsock.h header file)? I know for a fact that they
have said repetedly that some of it was taken directly from Berkely. I'm
just not sure where... I'm going to start digging through my stuff to see
if
Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence
here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks!
- Jordan
From: "Steve B." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:59:51 -0700
> What
What I read awhile back was MS licensed from BSDi their TCP/IP stack for use
in W2K.
Steve B.
- Original Message -
From: "Jordan Hubbard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 1:57 PM
Subject: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is
I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
utilities, and though it's always been "common knowledge" in the
community that they were, when I set about to "prove" it I found it to
be less easy than I'd
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